Well al-Sadr does resemble a Marmoset.
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| Iraq-Jordan | ||
| Holiest Shi’ite Shrine Seen Damaged After Battle | ||
| 2004-05-14 | ||
| The absolute, bar none, quintessential, one and only holiest of holies holed. Aides to militant Iraqi cleric Moqtada al-Sadr blamed U.S. tank fire on Friday for three small holes that appeared in the vast gilded dome of Shi’ite Islam’s holiest shrine, the Imam Ali mosque in Najaf. If they were small holes, it couldn’t have been our tanks. Qais al-Khazali, Sadr’s chief spokesman, showed the damage to journalists after six hours of heavy fighting in which U.S. armor advanced for the first time onto sacred ground in its confrontation with Sadr’s Mehdi Army militia. The holes, high above the ground, were on the side of the dome facing Najaf’s vast cemetery, where U.S. tanks stormed in to attack guerrilla positions hidden among the tombs. Were the holes caused by projectiles inbound or outbound? But it was not possible for Reuters correspondents at the scene to determine when or how the damage was caused. Coulda been vermin
Good. Let’s hope CJTF 7 feels the same way.
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| Posted by:Mr. Davis |
| #41 "Are you guys sure that this place is #1, numero uno, the ne plus ultra Shi'ite shrine? 'Cause I seem to remember last week it was a bus-stop in Basra where Big Mo caught a camel one time, or some shit like that..." |
| Posted by: mojo 2004-05-14 10:42:58 PM |
#40 Gen. Kimmett said ... "The coalition does not yet have ammunition that can shoot to the north and then turn around and head south.""But we're working on it. Hopefully it will be ready by Christmas." |
| Posted by: Barbara Skolaut 2004-05-14 10:00:44 PM |
| #39 I live in yellow jacket heaven. I give 'em one chance to convert (and they never do) then it's Mr.Fire the weed killer. I've been bad stung more than once.... but I so do enjoy killing those bastards. Opps! Don't tell. |
| Posted by: Shipman 2004-05-14 4:59:20 PM |
| #38 Yeah, I didn't see the thing about the eight by twelve inch holes until after I made that comment. "Happy fire" isn't likely to make holes that big, unless some burly, jolly guy is doing it with a 12.7mm heavy machine gun. The size of the holes make me more suspicious that it might have been one of our guys. 50mm can carry a good long distance, and I could easily see somebody a few miles off accidentally letting off a burst in the wrong direction in an ambush or a fluid firefight. |
| Posted by: Mitch H. 2004-05-14 4:39:33 PM |
| #37 Big ed, im not usually a grammar cop, you just gave me this image of GIs using construction equipment and materials to fix up the Grand Ayatollah. Good thing I wasnt drinking coffee at the time. |
| Posted by: Liberalhawk 2004-05-14 4:09:09 PM |
| #36 1258: Mongols sack Baghdad. Abbasid Caliphate ends. That's when Islamic physics became different than normal physics. It was the fault of Kublai Khan (1215-1294), buddy of Marco Polo. See : Conspiracy Thoery. |
| Posted by: BigEd 2004-05-14 4:01:28 PM |
| #35 Tibor: We'll be getting the reverse-course ammunition soon, in a shipment that includes the first Zionist(R) Death Rays(TM). Watch CAIR make a big deal about this, complaining that we don't respect Islam and all that . . . when THEY were firing on US and hit their own damn building. On the other hand, maybe Islamic physics are different than normal physics . . . |
| Posted by: The Doctor 2004-05-14 3:45:14 PM |
| #34 Gen. Kimmett said "If our forces were coming down this road and were being shot at from the cemetery from north to south, ... go ask Muqtada who put that hole in the shrine." "The coalition does not YET have ammunition that can shoot to the north and then turn around and head south." I love the use of "yet." |
| Posted by: Tibor 2004-05-14 3:34:20 PM |
| #33 I was just thinking of the imagery of wacking a nest and loosening all that hostile anger bottled up inside. I was well clothed and covered, taped up with duct tape and did it once when I was in high school. I did not know that those yellojackets were shi'ite! No injuries, but after that little stunt, I learned to use RAID. |
| Posted by: Alaska Paul 2004-05-14 3:31:43 PM |
| #32 AMATEURS. I think a 2-gallon of gasoline + match would work wonders against a hive like that. That, or a pound of semtex. |
| Posted by: Anonymous4021 2004-05-14 3:27:59 PM |
| #31 Liberalhawk found my misplaced modifier. Ouch. |
| Posted by: BigEd 2004-05-14 3:27:33 PM |
| #30 Liberalhawk found my misplaced modifier. Ouch. |
| Posted by: BigEd 2004-05-14 3:27:33 PM |
| #29 Frank & Paul...according to my Mom it's also good to wait until dusk when all the And Paul, I'd like an extra pair of binocs, a lawn chair, and a bowl of popcorn, please. |
| Posted by: Seafarious 2004-05-14 3:20:24 PM |
| #28 Four holes, each about 12 inches long and 8 inches wide, were visible on the golden dome of the Imam Ali mosque. They appeared to have been caused by machine gun fire. Militia members blamed American forces for the damage, but Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt (search), the chief U.S. military spokesman in Iraq, said al-Sadr's men were probably responsible: "I can just tell you by the looks of where we were firing and where Muqtada's militia was firing, I would put my money that Muqtada caused it." At a news conference in Baghdad, Kimmitt pointed to a map of Najaf and said that a U.S. convoy might have been fired on from a cemetery as it moved near the shrine. If so, those rounds could have hit the shrine, he said. "If our forces were coming down this road and were being shot at from the cemetery from north to south, ... go ask Muqtada who put that hole in the shrine," Kimmitt said. "The coalition does not yet have ammunition that can shoot to the north and then turn around and head south." |
| Posted by: RWV 2004-05-14 3:13:47 PM |
| #27 "Holy"? Says who? |
| Posted by: Army of Satan 2004-05-14 3:13:09 PM |
| #26 Four holes, each approximately 30 centimeters (12 inches) long and 20 centimeters (8 inches) could be seen on the golden dome of the Imam Ali mosque, burial place of Imam Ali Ibn Abu Talib, the Prophet Muhammad's cousin and son-in-law and Shiites' most revered saint. Militia members blamed the Americans for the damage, but Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt, the chief U.S. military spokesman in Iraq, said al-Sadr's men were probably responsible: "I can just tell you by the looks of where we were firing and where Muqtada's militia was firing, I would put my money that Muqtada caused it." |
| Posted by: RWV 2004-05-14 2:58:50 PM |
| #25 Paul - I'd suggest you gas the yellowjackets before doing anything else - the Russians say it works, almost too good, sometimes |
| Posted by: Frank G 2004-05-14 2:55:15 PM |
| #24 Important that we offer any special construction material and equipment needed for repairs to Sistani as well - That would be good PR too. theyve shot holes in Sistani? hmmm. |
| Posted by: Liberalhawk 2004-05-14 2:52:53 PM |
| #23 Now, people don't get me wrong. I do not advocate blowing up a Mosque that is Holy^6 power. But suppose for a moment that we model the event, you know, conduct a scientific experiment to see what would happen in real life. Here is what I am going to do. First I get a stick. Lesse, oh here is one in the yard. A nice 2x4 3 ft long. Next I will go out and give that big yellojacket nest across the street under the eave a big wack with the aforementioned 2x4. My trusted surveyor will have his yellow notebook ready, along with binoculars to take notes. Be back in a while and will report the results and the aftermath. Don't go away. |
| Posted by: Alaska Paul 2004-05-14 2:49:00 PM |
| #22 The Pete Rose analogy is mine. |
| Posted by: Zenster 2004-05-14 2:48:55 PM |
| #21 Sadr's lads are famous for firing their guns into the air, maybe that's where the holes came from. The only reason these structures are still standing is due to exceptional restraint shown by American troops. If we were going to "hole" their sacred mosques, it would be as in "smoking hole in the ground" and not some minor rooftop damage. For Sadr to whinge about damage to the Imam Ali mosque while he continues to desecrate it on a daily basis though his military occupation is like Pete Rose complaining about his lifetime ban from baseball management. Both are delusional. |
| Posted by: Anonymous4842 2004-05-14 2:40:24 PM |
| #20 oooooo.... A Day in PD's Life |
| Posted by: Frank G 2004-05-14 2:16:51 PM |
| #19 Hmmmm. I find myself wondering if it takes more or fewer holes to fill Imam Ali moskkk compared with Albert Hall... |
| Posted by: .com 2004-05-14 2:12:56 PM |
| #18 Important that we offer any special construction material and equipment needed for repairs to Sistani as well - That would be good PR too. |
| Posted by: BigEd 2004-05-14 2:12:16 PM |
| #17 I wonder if this is a Duke of Glouchester situation - "See how I am bewitch'd; behold mine arm is, like a blasted sapling, wither'd up", where the damage has been there for a while. If it has to be pointed out to people standing at street level, it might have occurred from all sorts of things - "happy fire" damage, for instance. I just noticed the other day that somebody put a rock or a bullet through a stained glass window in the church across the street from my apartment. I couldn't tell you when it happened. |
| Posted by: Mitch H. 2004-05-14 2:06:55 PM |
| #16 MHW: The AP said the holes were small. They would take a hole the size of a softball and say " The US has blown a hole right through the Imam Ali Mosque ". Can you imagine how small these holes would have to be for the AP to call them small? |
| Posted by: Charles 2004-05-14 1:57:00 PM |
| #15 It isn't easy to tell what kind of ordinance made a hole; however by getting outside and inside dimensions, substance traces, its easy to rule out certain types of ordinance. |
| Posted by: mhw 2004-05-14 12:59:26 PM |
| #14 Next thing ya' know, Muqta will be "humiliated" and say so on TV to get to our Congress' heartstrings! Sorry ya goon, once you fire from a place of worship, it becomes a target. In fact, I can't believe that Rummy and Bush have fought such a PC war to this point. |
| Posted by: BA 2004-05-14 1:22:10 PM |
| #13 Gotta be RPG fire that hit the dome, since for a tank to hit it the barrel would have to be aimed UP. I'm not even sure that tanks would be far enough back for a shot from where they were fighting. And since it is close, quarter fighting with buildings obstructing a clean line of sight to the Mosque, this means Sadr harmed the shrine. Afterall, a Depleted Uranium shell makes more than a tiny hole. Remember when the Baghdad hotel was hit? That wasn't a small hole. Even more questionable is the journalist having to be shown the damage. If the US had caused the damage wouldn't the Iraqi's, not loyal to Sadr, have already said so? |
| Posted by: Charles 2004-05-14 1:21:14 PM |
| #12 Intelligence sources indicate large weapon caches under the Wall of Solomon. I'm keeping my eyes on this price. We need to raze it to the ground. |
| Posted by: Faisal the Goyem 2004-05-14 1:16:14 PM |
| #11 We've only hit mosques when there were hostiles in them - in Karbala we pretty much demolished one, apparently. Ive seen nothing indicating that Muqtys boyz are inside the shrine of Ali, and if they were i think the coalition would be letting us know. And our guys tend to be rather more accurate with their fire than the hostiles. So my a priori, without knowing anything about the dimensions of the hole, etc is that the hole was made by muqtys boyz. And it doestn matter a WHOLE lot - i think at this point most Shiites will blame Muqty for starting the whole thing. But it would certainly help if this is Muqtys fault and not ours. |
| Posted by: Liberalhawk 2004-05-14 1:13:49 PM |
| #10 Time for CSI:Najaf to get the ballistics info. |
| Posted by: eLarson 2004-05-14 1:11:47 PM |
| #9 Aides to militant Iraqi cleric Moqtada al-Sadr blamed U.S. tank fire on Friday for three small holes that appeared in the vast gilded dome of Shi’ite Islam’s holiest shrine, the Imam Ali mosque in Najaf. Is there any specific reason that infidels should actually give a rat's ass about holes in a mosque's roof? |
| Posted by: Bomb-a-rama 2004-05-14 1:07:30 PM |
| #8 I frankly don't give a rat's ass if it was us or not |
| Posted by: Frank G 2004-05-14 1:06:51 PM |
| #7 Looks like Muqty's boyz hit the shrine, while firing at a US convoy in the cemetary. Muqty is now taunting Hakim's Badr Brigades for not helping him, while there are reports (denied by Sadr spokesmen) that local Shiite militias are firing on Mahdi army positions. Meanwhile US troops are doing their jobs decisively. Looks like we are seeing the culmination of our strategy - cut a deal in Fallujah, to put pressure on Sistani, while slowly building up force near Najaf to give Sistani room to maneuver. Then Sistani denounced Muqty, and has so far winked at aggresive US military action. Which is now taking place. |
| Posted by: Liberalhawk 2004-05-14 12:30:13 PM |
| #6 The problem is that Sadr is the one who violated the mosque. Did they show the reporters the stockpiles of arms and ammuniations they stored in the 'Holy Shrine'? About 250 Sadr fighters paraded before the Imam Ali mosque during a lull in Friday’s battle chanting "Long live, Moqtada!." Sounds like one of those Carny 'target shoot' games. "Step right up folks! Hit three and get a stuffed toy!" |
| Posted by: CrazyFool 2004-05-14 12:27:42 PM |
| #5 The mood I'm in...I'd love to see every mosque in the Middle East blown to pieces just on the principle that they're breeding grounds of hate and murder. |
| Posted by: Jen 2004-05-14 12:20:56 PM |
| #4 DG - Actually the Iraqi Boxing coach for the Olympics is an American named, Maurice "Termite" Watkins. Punching holes is not as far fetched as you think. Yeah-off topic, but an amusing coincidence to the remark. Coach Termite |
| Posted by: BigEd 2004-05-14 12:19:24 PM |
| #3 About 250 Sadr fighters paraded before the Imam Ali mosque during a lull in Friday’s battle chanting "Long live, Moqtada!." That's right, boys. I'll bet he lives longer then you. You'll realize that when it's too late. |
| Posted by: tu3031 2004-05-14 12:12:57 PM |
| #2 Probably termites, the 105mm type. Their tough on those old buildings. Should have been condemned by the authorities a year ago. |
| Posted by: DG 2004-05-14 12:07:37 PM |
| #1 Coulda been vermin Well al-Sadr does resemble a Marmoset.
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| Posted by: BigEd 2004-05-14 11:52:08 AM |