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| Top Israeli rabbi says Jews should vote for Bush | |
| 2004-10-27 | |
The rabbi does not usually rule on political matters, especially those that don't directly concern Israel. But Elyashiv decided that the US is a "kingdom of grace," or great friend to Israel, and thus the elections there can directly influence the Jewish state, Cohen said. About 140,000 American Orthodox Jews will probably abide by Elyashiv's decision, said Sam Heilman, an expert on American Jews at Queens College in New York. But Elyashiv is just confirming the theories of many analysts who believe most haredi Jews in the US vote Republican, Heilman said in a telephone interview from his office. "What's extraordinary is that the rabbi is addressing non-Israelis in a sense," Heilman said. "This confirms that the Orthodox community, by and large, is supporting Bush more than Kerry." | |
| Posted by:Mark Espinola |
| #9 an internet search finds NO references to "kingdom of grace" in english from any Jewish source - all references are Christian, and are theological ones, not to earthly states. There is a tradition of noting some states as good for the Jews, of which the oldest such tradition is the admiration for Cyrus, King of Persia. One says of a worthy gentile king, that he is like Cyrus. I presume that it is in this tradition that the rabbi is operating, but i dont know. I cant state authoritatively if it has any theological content at all - i think it has some (IE G-d willed that Cyrus should do what he did) but not comparable to what Christians mean. |
| Posted by: Liberalhawk 2004-10-27 5:03:02 PM |
| #8 an internet search finds NO references to "kingdom of grace" in english from any Jewish source - all references are Christian, and are theological ones, not to earthly states. There is a tradition of noting some states as good for the Jews, of which the oldest such tradition is the admiration for Cyrus, King of Persia. One says of a worthy gentile king, that he is like Cyrus. I presume that it is in this tradition that the rabbi is operating, but i dont know. I cant state authoritatively if it has any theological content at all - i think it has some (IE G-d willed that Cyrus should do what he did) but not comparable to what Christians mean. |
| Posted by: Liberalhawk 2004-10-27 5:03:02 PM |
| #7 Grace is THE thing in Evangelical Christianity. Heck, the issue of Grace and Salvation WAS the spark of the Reformation. Ya said it, Jules! It's way too little in supply! And you're not kidding about the ultraorthodox part, LH. The guy made an allusion to sin being an uncurable cancer, and everyone panics thinking that he said that Cancer came from God and was uncurable. He also delivered an opinion on the use of hair in wigs that came from Hindu temples, and people are burning their wigs and asking about "kosher" wigs. There are at least two Knesset members who ask "how high?" when he tells them to jump. I should probably amend my comment: One could expect maybe liberal or moderate Rabbis to say something like this as an ecumenical sop, but for an UltraOrthodox Rabbi to say this is significant: This is as close to a blessing of our nation that we're ever gonna get. I still don't know if he deliberately chose words that he knew would resonate with the biggest Block of Christian supporters of Israel, or the translator did the deed. |
| Posted by: Ptah 2004-10-27 9:52:48 PM |
| #6 Perhaps not a central theological concept, but surely something in great shortage in our times. |
| Posted by: Jules 187 2004-10-27 4:59:08 PM |
| #5 I wonder what he said in Hebrew - malchut chen? "grace", though an attribute of G-d is not AFAIK a central theological concept in any part of Judaism, though there may be historical references. |
| Posted by: Liberalhawk 2004-10-27 4:55:42 PM |
| #4 the said rabbi is apparently a leader among Ultraorthodox Jews of Litvish (northeastern Europe, not Chassidic) descent. |
| Posted by: Liberalhawk 2004-10-27 4:54:26 PM |
| #3 Rabbi Shalom Yosef Elyashiv, responding to queries from Americans residing in Israel, has decided that Bush is better for Israel than his competitor, John Kerry, said an assistant to the rabbi, Haim Cohen. Read SLOWLY. Someone who respected him and held him in high regard asked him a question, he gave an answer. Someone else asked him the same question, he gave the same answer. After about 5 or 6 of these, he SHOULD publicise his answer so he can get back to what he believes is more important work. This is not a neo-Al-Guardian move where shitheads we despise organize a drive of like-minded shitheads to send what amounts to personalized junk mail that says, in effect, "You vote in a way that pleases us, and we will have a good opinion of you, because we think you were stupid to elect a moron last time." The rabbi does not usually rule on political matters, especially those that don’t directly concern Israel. But Elyashiv decided that the US is a "kingdom of grace," or great friend to Israel, and thus the elections there can directly influence the Jewish state, Cohen said. To a true Evangelical Christian, that phrase, "kingdom of grace" is a jaw-dropper. I've NEVER heard a Rabbi say anything that so precisely pushed the right theological buttons for a key group of Israeli supporters. I'm still trying to sort out what the heck happened inside my head when he said that. |
| Posted by: Ptah 2004-10-27 10:31:58 AM |
| #2 Another Furner who thinks he gets to tell us how to vote. Maybe we should start having the CIA influence elections again, only more openly. |
| Posted by: Mrs. Davis 2004-10-27 9:40:58 AM |
| #1 Just to be fair if this guy is not a U.S. citizen, he needs to butt out. That being said, I still hope Bush wins. Im afraid though that the LLL is going to pull all the stops, and short of a clear majority, this is going to be tied up in the courts for a while. |
| Posted by: N Guard 2004-10-27 9:32:34 AM |