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| Iraq-Jordan | ||||
| U.S. Marines Rally Round Iraq Probe Comrade | ||||
| 2004-11-16 | ||||
| U.S. Marines rallied round a comrade under investigation for killing a wounded Iraqi during the offensive in Falluja, saying he was probably under combat stress in unpredictable, hair-trigger circumstances. Marines interviewed on Tuesday said they didn't see the shooting as a scandal, rather the act of a comrade who faced intense pressure during the effort to quell the insurgency in the city. "I can see why he would do it. He was probably running around being shot at for days on end in Falluja. There should be an investigation but they should look into the circumstances," said Lance Corporal Christopher Hanson. "I would have shot the insurgent too. Two shots to the head," said Sergeant Nicholas Graham, 24, of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. "You can't trust these people. He should not be investigated. He did nothing wrong." ----snip, info on shooting--- The Marine commander in Falluja, Lieutenant General John Sattler, said his men followed the law of conflict and held themselves to a high standard of accountability. "The facts of this case will be thoroughly pursued to make an informed decision and to protect the rights of all persons involved," he said. Marines have repeatedly described the rebels they fought against in Falluja as ruthless fighters who didn't play by the rules. They say the investigation is politically motivated. "It's all political. This Marine has been under attack for days. It has nothing to do with what he did," said Corporal Keith Hoy, 23.
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| Posted by:Steve |
| #31 The one word I haven't seen in any of the MSM is the dread V word: when you destroy or rout a dug-in enemy force by superior firepower combined with sheer guts, the applicable word is victory. |
| Posted by: Matt 2004-11-16 5:51:58 PM |
| #30 Instapundit is calling this "pulling a Kerry". Let's see if that meme takes off for the MSM. |
| Posted by: Mrs. Davis 2004-11-16 5:46:11 PM |
| #29 OTOH - just saw Sites' broadcast update and he explained all the extenuating factors including the Jihadi tricks (fake surrender, booby-trapped dead, including the one the day before)... Either he's had a change of heart, someone told him how the MSM was abusing his report, or he just remembered who's watching his back over there. He picked himself up in my book, for whatever reason he did it |
| Posted by: Frank G 2004-11-16 5:31:47 PM |
| #28 Reuters TV has a 3 minute clip of the incident here. I can't make out all of what is being said. It does look confusing. The last bit of the tape is a statement by a Marine general. |
| Posted by: Doug 2004-11-16 5:17:22 PM |
| #27 This is just another MSM distraction from the real story. First the MSM Meme du Jour was that we couldn't take back Fallujah because the tide was favoring the "insurgents." Then when it became obvious that we would crush the fascists in Fallujah, the Meme became Fallujah = Stalingrad. When that fizzled, the next Meme to emerge was Ha-ha, Zaraqawi Got Away! When our determination to carry the fight to Mosul and every other fascist holdout until they're crushed, the Meme became Son of My Lai. The next Meme will be Iraqi Elections Are Illegitimate. |
| Posted by: lex 2004-11-16 4:28:01 PM |
| #26 RWV, Roasted pig is making my mouth water. |
| Posted by: Poison Reverse 2004-11-16 4:14:29 PM |
| #25 In the fine tradition of the Marines in WWII, he should have used a flame thrower to turn everyone in the room into a crispy critter. |
| Posted by: RWV 2004-11-16 4:02:33 PM |
| #24 Bullshit. The terrorist was pretending he was dead - lying there probably with his eyes open acting dead while breathing. He was attempting to deceive the marines for some purpose. Perhaps to draw them closer to explode a hidden explosive. Perhaps to pull a gun on them. In short the marine did not know they terrorist was not a threat. He did know that the terrorst was attempting a ruse - a deception for some unknown reason. That in itself is reason enough to shoot first and ask questions later. What was the marine supposed to do? Kneel beside the 'body' and ask kindly 'Why are you pretending'? |
| Posted by: CrazyFool 2004-11-16 3:58:17 PM |
| #23 That depends, Tom. While the terrorists have no right to be treated as lawful combatants, perhaps someone in the Pentagon gave orders that they be so treated? In that case, and if he knew that the terrorist was no threat, he would be disobeying orders. I doubt it, but the DoD bureaucracy has written stupid ROEs before and will again. But I see no need for any pro-terrorist media to be allowed in the combat zone. We didn't let Tokyo Rose interview our soldiers and sailors. |
| Posted by: jackal 2004-11-16 3:41:24 PM |
| #22 It's good to know what kind of 'freedom' you endorse fighting for. Maybe you missed the memo, but there's a war going on over there. I don't give a damn about anything other than winning it. |
| Posted by: Crusader 2004-11-16 3:36:15 PM |
| #21 "...broken the rules of war..." I think not. As I understand it, these enemies were non-uniformed terrorists who were not soldiers of any recognized nation, were not prisoners, and who associated with ambushers and suicide bombers. If anything, I'd punish whoever shot them the first time and didn't finish the job. |
| Posted by: Tom 2004-11-16 3:02:57 PM |
| #20 Keven Sites can kiss my royal Irish ass. |
| Posted by: Mac Suirtain 2004-11-16 2:31:27 PM |
| #19 Goes to show you how inconsistent 'The Brass' is. Kicked Geraldo Rivera out of the country on a slip of the rules (operational plans, etc), but Kevin Sites has no accounting...the scum bag!! |
| Posted by: smn 2004-11-16 12:58:51 PM |
| #18 True, 98Zulu: The personal safety of the Marine in question and his fellow Marine negates any contradictory argument. The "embeds" should have been shiped out after Bagdhad fell. Covering the battles and campaigns should be handed over to Combat Correspondents and photographers. Yes, the "Old Media" will scream "Bias!", but who cares about the "Old Media"? I imagine a whole lotta Blue State Elitists are going to be "Shocked & Awed" at the tremendous support this Marine will receive in the days to come! Jack. |
| Posted by: Jack Deth 2004-11-16 12:55:00 PM |
| #17 MSM isn't interested in giving you freedom to see anything, only what it wants you to see o i agree totally. I just don't think not having the option, the possibility, of getting the video evidence from the battlefrield would be a very dangerous situation for both sides. Remeber all that cut footage exists somewhere and can be obtained if needed. |
| Posted by: WingedAvenger 2004-11-16 12:43:12 PM |
| #16 Freedom? You must be writing about the freedom to run and rerun the prison video and this one while censoring broadcasts of heads being chopped off. MSM isn't interested in giving you freedom to see anything, only what it wants you to see. When we get freedom in the production process rather than not getting to see all that missing footage on the cutting room floor, then talk to me about 'freedom'. |
| Posted by: Don 2004-11-16 12:36:59 PM |
| #15 In fact, from now on, every camera in the field should have a "breakdown" of some sort. It happens y'know. It's good to know what kind of 'freedom' you endorse fighting for. |
| Posted by: WingedAvenger 2004-11-16 12:26:49 PM |
| #14 We have a roughing the passer... Five yard penalty... Repeat first down... |
| Posted by: Capsu78 2004-11-16 12:24:08 PM |
| #13 If I were Sites I would get out of the country as quick as possible, back to some very safe, very secure, very discrete place in a Blue State and wait for my Pulitzer. I don't think that it will be either particularly comfortable or particularly safe for him in Iraq. |
| Posted by: RWV 2004-11-16 12:22:01 PM |
| #12 Soldier did nothing wrong. Under battle conditions he believed the wounded Iraqi was armed. A wounded person can kill you with a gun. He did the only sane normal thing This brouhaha comes from people not understanding ANYTHING about a warzone. It's not law enforcement it's a WAR. It is a battle to the death. Injured people and civilians are sometimes killed, too! People think this is hollywood where only able-bodied villains get hit? Wake up it's a war, yes it's not perfect but the alternative is a hell of a lot worse. Iraqi soldiers and civilians are going to die. That is the price of freedom and peace in the middle east. Hostages are advised to get on the floor near the centre of a room and spread their hands so they are visible and not make any sudden moves, if the building is being stormed. Same advice would have helped this guy. If they can't see your hands/or you make a sudden move the trigger will get pulled for good reason. Give that soldier a promotion, he did his job. |
| Posted by: Anon1 2004-11-16 12:07:10 PM |
| #11 Raf/BigE, damn straight gents. Some would call us duplicitous, but I'd be damned if my men and mission get compromised by some journalist trying to make a name for himself, play boyscout, or put forth a wholly speculative story. I know a couple guys who double tapped dying Iraqis in Gulf I, they had to, it was the "deal" at the time. No time for prisoners, keep moving forward, accomplish the mission. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, it's just a part of war, it is what it is. |
| Posted by: Jarhead 2004-11-16 11:56:18 AM |
| #10 Mysterious accidents - either to equipment, or the reporter, his choice! |
| Posted by: BigEd 2004-11-16 11:44:51 AM |
| #9 Sites' footage would've never made it out of that mosque intact I would have done the same. In fact, from now on, every camera in the field should have a "breakdown" of some sort. It happens y'know. |
| Posted by: Rafael 2004-11-16 11:35:31 AM |
| #8 Better to be judged by 12 then carried by 6. |
| Posted by: 98zulu 2004-11-16 11:23:11 AM |
| #7 I have just written a paragraph or two , but deleted it b4 posting as these words are more fitting than trying to explain or reason .. terminally sick dogs need to be put down , they are a liability to all around , and sap up resources . |
| Posted by: MacNails 2004-11-16 11:21:28 AM |
| #6 I told my wife last night, if this Marine had been in my company or platoon and I was on the scene - Sites' footage would've never made it out of that mosque intact. I would've put two rounds through that camera and tape and blamed it on my "itchy trigger finger" and battle fatigue. Then I'd of told Sites tough shit, go fuck yourself buddy, most Marines know to never trust the media anyways, we're still feeling the hangover from their antics in 'Nam. Fuck Sites, unless there's a black/white "my lai" incident in the making you squelch that shit. God bless Ernie Pyle, he would understand. |
| Posted by: Jarhead 2004-11-16 11:12:55 AM |
| #5 Well, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed squealed, leaddog2, and so have others ... I already posted about this yesterday. |
| Posted by: Flinesh Angonter9198 2004-11-16 11:11:59 AM |
| #4 The Marine who killed the terrorist has a standing invite for dinner and drinks in Oklahoma City. Good shooting and Semper Fi, baby. We are behind you! |
| Posted by: badanov 2004-11-16 10:55:49 AM |
| #3 So, the insurgent bastard was killed. Who really cares? NONE of the MSM or Amnesia Intl or Stalinist ANSWER people do. They are just anti-American! Another booby-trapped insurgent exploded and killed a buddy of this young Marine's on the previous day. Let him the man rest and set him free! Personally, I have NO UNDERSTANDING of why we are taking prisoners anyway. (Sure, we need intelligence, but no Muslim fascist ever tells the truth anyway). So what is the purpose. It is useless to believe the hard core Islamist fighters. They just kill. |
| Posted by: leaddog2 2004-11-16 10:50:56 AM |
| #2 Exactimundo, Justrand, couldn't have said it better!!!!!!!! |
| Posted by: BigEd 2004-11-16 10:45:26 AM |
| #1 The Marines need to conduct an incredibly swift investigation (1 day), a quick review of findings (1 hour) and LOUD re-instatement of this brave young man (15 minute Press conference). Hell...take an extra 20 minutes and PROMOTE HIM!! |
| Posted by: Justrand 2004-11-16 10:42:11 AM |