| Submit your comments on this article |
| Fifth Column |
| Anti-war Medic Seeks to Stir Up Opposition |
| 2005-03-19 |
| OCEAN CITY, N.J. -- Speaking out against the war in Iraq doesn't mean you're against the troops fighting it. It's a small distinction, but an important one _ especially to Jim Talib. The 31-year-old Philadelphia man, a medic in the U.S. Naval Reserve, has been deployed to Iraq once and is scheduled to return in June. In the meantime, he speaks to church groups and clubs, using the voice of experience to stir up opposition. would you want him working on you? I suppose this is one way to try to get out of serving again. "I love my country, and I don't think we should rule the world," he said, speaking to a group of 40 people at a meeting of the Ocean City Democratic Club on Wednesday night. "I don't think it's un-American to say that." A native of New Brunswick and graduate of Rutgers University, Talib is an 11-year Navy veteran. When he's on duty, he's Petty Officer Third Class James Talib, a medical corpsman. When he's on the anti-war stump, he dresses in casual civilian clothes and urges people who oppose U.S. involvement in Iraq to get involved and to lobby congressmen to withdraw troops. Talib spent 10 months in Iraq last year, assigned to a U.S. Marine Corps infantry unit in Fallujah and tending to wounded troops. After returning last November, he joined up with Iraq Veterans Against the War, ah yes, the old Vietnam Vets Against the War has risen from the dead a small Philadelphia group formed last year to raise public awareness about opposition among those who have served. The group sends speakers out to college campuses, community groups and clubs who are interested in hearing the anti-war message. "Basically, we formed in response to the fact that you've got the Department of Defense and the government and the military putting out these pro-war troops, saying `This war's good,' but there's no opposing voice," said Michael Hoffman, national coordinator for IVAW. "That's where we came in." Some of the group's 150 members are active-duty military, some have left the service and some _ like Talib _ are in the reserves. Talib, the only IVAW public speaker who's still in the military, has some restrictions on what he can say. He cannot reveal military secrets, or appear in uniform speaking against the war, according to Hoffman; U.S. Navy officials did not respond to requests for comment made with the Navy's press office at the Pentagon. On Wednesday, he drove about an hour from his Philadelphia home to this New Jersey shore town to speak to the Democratic Club, showing up untucked and unshaved, wearing an unbuttoned shirt, blue jeans and sneakers. gettin down wi the homies His audience, a sympathetic crowd of teachers, tradesmen, Vietnam veterans, senior citizens and curious teenagers, sat quietly on folding chairs as he talked about the war. He began his 55-minute presentation with a plug for Iraq Veterans Against the War before telling the group he believes it was oil and American imperialism that drove the decision to invade, not weapons of mass destruction or links to the Sept. 11 terror attacks. "We ought to be honest about why we went there, admit we made a mistake and get out," he said. "We have to develop a culture that doesn't encourage rampant wars and militarism." Many returning GIs are unhappy with U.S. involvement in Iraq, said Talib, who withheld the gory details of his own experience, saying only that he was against the war before he went and saw nothing to change his mind. It's an occupation, not a war, he told the group. "It's not a war against a military force. The only reason there's so much bloodshed is that we're making ourselves such a huge target," he said. hey - maybe we should cower in dhimmitude - that would lower our profile a lot, no? After a question-and-answer session, the organizers of the event passed a baseball cap around the room to raise money to cover Talib's expenses, which he pays out of his own pocket, and contribute to the group. Those who heard Talib were impressed. "It's powerful," said Vietnam veteran Steve Cole, 65. "He's been there. He's got firsthand knowledge." |
| Posted by:disgusted |
| #17 Way to go, Frank. I couldn't finish the whole "More on Jim Talib, 'cuz it seems he really didn't have any interest in serving his country, he just wanted a free ride to college - he wanted to BE served. |
| Posted by: Bobby 2005-03-19 10:33:57 PM |
| #16 I agree, Barbara. In games of war, it's best to play "away" games! |
| Posted by: Bobby 2005-03-19 10:27:39 PM |
#15 #1 Anonymoose:"Why does America want anything to do with foreign nations?"We don't. But they keep bothering us anyway. So it's best to take the fight overseas, rather than wait until is comes to our shores. (See, e.g., 9/11) Since there are always going to be wars anyway, whether we want them or not, we might as well fight them on somebody else's land. Or do you want the jihadis and other assorted violent assholes knocking on your front door? |
| Posted by: Barbara Skolaut 2005-03-19 4:11:25 PM |
| #14 Frank.. "He's an asshat" Lucidity counts the most!!! Thanks. |
| Posted by: R 2005-03-19 2:44:20 PM |
| #13 Good research, Frank - there's why he's still at E-4 over 10. He's not just an asshat, he's a not-very-KEEN asshat. ALL male USN Hospital Corpsmen are sent to USMC combat training & carry the secondary NEC (USN version of MOS) for combat field medic. With > 10 years' service, he should have known this, switched to ANG or USCGR and (1) spared his tender widdle "conscience" and (2) denied the MSM another fucking "Peace Now" poster child. |
| Posted by: Ricky bin Ricardo (Abu Babaloo) 2005-03-19 2:37:24 PM |
| #12 More on Jim Talib Seidman: When and why did you enlist? Talib: "I originally enlisted in the Army National Guard back around 1993. A lot of the people in my family had been in, and I knew it was the only way for me to get money for college. The reserve GI Bill as well as the tuition waiver for state schools that is offered through the National Guard in New Jersey was an offer that was hard to refuse. When I joined I don't think I, or anybody at the time, would have imagined that we would be involved in an occupation where nearly half of the deployed force was reservists and national guard (OIF3 rotation will be 43%). So I figured, for one weekend a month, it's not a bad deal. I also wanted to get out of my neighborhood, and make a little money, so the chance to go away for training and travel while getting paid was a plus. In the winter of 2002, I transferred from the Army National Guard into the Navy Reserves, where I am still serving as a Corpsman. I switched over to get out of my former position as an 'Infantryman' because I could not do that job anymore. I had grown too much personally and politically in the time since I had first enlisted, I could not see myself carrying a rifle and being an occupier. I did not want to guard checkpoints, search homes and shoot at people. My plan did not work out. Since I was an EMT and had been through the Army's Medic course as well, I was able to come into the Navy as a Hospital Corpsman. But, perhaps because of my Infantry background and other training, I was immediately assigned to work with the Marines. In the end, I found myself not in a hospital somewhere, but on the frontlines of an occupation doing exactly what I had tried to avoid." RTWT - He's an asshat |
| Posted by: Frank G 2005-03-19 2:25:48 PM |
| #11 Cyber Sarge #3: I used to be USN and USNR-R (weekend warrior) at various times in my life. There are a number of possible legitimate, non-disciplinary reasons why this guy's still a PO3 with 11 years' service. (1) He might have "broken service." Maybe he did several years' USN &/or USNR, got out for awhile, then came back in to the USNR. After a certain amount of time out, I think you start losing paygrades when you come back. In the early 1980's, I drilled on a tin can in Long Beach, CA. There was a Radioman 3rd Class (RM3) in our reserve detachment who had campaign ribbons from Korea. He'd been in and out several times, IIRC. (2) Possibly complementing (1) above, he may have come back in and switched specialties. Not unusual for recruiters to tell guys they could come back w/same paygrade for same specialty, or lose a paygrade (or sometimes more) if they wanted to switch. Example: there was an ex-Army guy at the USN Fire Control Tech school in 1974. Former SSG communications tech, offered PO1 to go in USN in similar specialty. He wanted to do something different, so they made him go all the way back to E-3. (3) It's been a long time since I've been USNR, but I can tell you that in some enlisted specialties, it's hard as hell for reservists to get promoted. They compete only against other reservists for what might be an EXTREMELY limited batch of vacancies at the next paygrade. Example: in my own rating of Fire Controlman (FC) it was-at least in the mid to late '80's-almost impossible to for a Reservist to get beyond E-5. This had to do with the fact that a lot of guys decided to leave active duty and go USNR after having already made E-5 or E-6. This happened in many of the specialties that happened to have quick promotion opportunities on the Regular Navy side. I don't know if Hospital Corpsman is one of them, but it's one more possibility. |
| Posted by: Ricky bin Ricardo (Abu Babaloo) 2005-03-19 2:12:57 PM |
| #10 Anti-War-Medic: Watch the usual suspects>> CNN,networks,etc. giving ass-heavy coverage to this, their favorite type/mascot. too true>>"I wonder if America has the fortitude, discipline and foresight to win through the next 20 years. I personally doubt it, to my great sorrow. " 30 years ago I would agree..but now we have measurably more staying power. Not only has our power increased (aggregate) but we're able to force/multiply that power with focus IE: On the morale front alone, on any given day the best of us lead with insight, or inspire, or share direct experience and knowledge so that if I for instance, grow weary of battling the AssHats, someone better will join the fray and rip 'em a new one. The late 60s and most of the 70s were pretty sad in allot of ways (not all).And because I lived thru that period it's self-evident to me anyway that "America's fortitude,discipline,and foresight" is way stronger than 30 years ago. Does national morale translate into action? Kids joining up and serving? Support from the home front? I'll leave those questions to the thread. BTW, if the guy really served as a medic in combat..you have to give him some credit for that service.(Can't stand what he's doing now though). |
| Posted by: R 2005-03-19 1:43:41 PM |
| #9 "I love my country, and I don’t think we should rule the world," he said,.. That's not our objective, Dumbass. |
| Posted by: Bomb-a-rama 2005-03-19 1:38:32 PM |
| #8 "Basically, we formed in response to the fact that you’ve got the Department of Defense and the government and the military putting out these pro-war troops, saying `This war’s good,’ but there’s no opposing voice," said Michael Hoffman, national coordinator for IVAW. "That’s where we came in." A quick slight of hand there boy. The MSM has been burying the good news for over a year and have sought to display every insignificant event into another disaster. The good news isn't being effectively broadcast by the administration or the pentagon. It's been getting through by far more of your comrades coming back from Iraq and by Iraqi citizens now free to communicate. Like the troops returning from Vietnam who said the government wasn't telling the straight story, this generation of servicemembers are by far saying the MSM is the one not telling the straight story. If your media of communication is the old MSM, then your message is going to suffer with their loss in credibility. |
| Posted by: Spavimble Hupeart2664 2005-03-19 12:46:46 PM |
| #7 Didn't know you had a son serving, Bobby. Salute! |
| Posted by: Seafarious 2005-03-19 12:45:35 PM |
| #6 Jim Talib? |
| Posted by: Frank G 2005-03-19 12:13:39 PM |
| #5 too true - Spot on. The isolationists were born in the wrong century - and their inability to grasp the current reality threatens us all. Same can be said for the socialists, communists, fascists, Maoists - the lot of obviously failed wanker ideologies and their intellectually-challenged tools. You might even say the same for the Islamists, if you change century to millennium. |
| Posted by: .com 2005-03-19 11:48:23 AM |
| #4 I wonder if America has the fortitude, discipline and foresight to win through the next 20 years. I personally doubt it, to my great sorrow. It will be bad before I die, but much worse for my daughter, who is 28. Those unwilling to fight for their culture and civilization when it is under attack, and those who think we can roll up our borders and be fine inside them, will get what they ask for - even if it's not what they think they are choosing. |
| Posted by: too true 2005-03-19 11:23:12 AM |
| #3 I love the logic leapo the left makes, from destroying Islamofacism to U.S. World domination. If the George Bush Truely wanted 'World Domination' then he would have started closer to home (like Canada or Mexico). Given that he is an 11 year Navy vet and still a P03 I have to wonder about his service record. I know promotions are slow sometimes but shouldn't he be at least a P02 and probably a P01? You Navy vets let me know. |
| Posted by: Cyber Sarge 2005-03-19 11:13:58 AM |
| #2 Not runnin' for office, izzhe? And I didn't see any "war criminal" charges, or sensationalism. My son got back to the US yesterday from Al Qaim, in the "Wild West," of Anbar and is less sure about staying in the Marines than when he left. I hope he'll talk about it when we get to see him..... |
| Posted by: Bobby 2005-03-19 10:55:09 AM |
| #1 I think this young man is going about things the right way, even if I do not agree with him. His opposition is philosophical, much like if he was a c.o. on religious grounds. He does not attack the military, or military leaders. In a way, he is like the old American argument for isolationism. "Why should we be caught up in yet another European war?" Pat Buchanan would understand completely, making similar arguments himself. In the final analysis, his argument goes beyond this war, to ask the question "Why does America want anything to do with foreign nations?", which is not a totally ridiculous question. It goes hand-in-hand with stopping illegal immigration, taking a laissez-faire approach to international economics as long as they don't step on our toes, and ignoring those places filled with strife and lacking the will to change their own lives for the better. Isolationists want no international authority over anything American, no reduction in our rights by treaty, and look distrustfully at those who do. And they certainly don't want to shed American blood unless we are attacked. |
| Posted by: Anonymoose 2005-03-19 10:38:38 AM |