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| Fifth Column | |
| Illegal trip protests Guantanamo prison | |
| 2005-12-06 | |
| EFL. Warning: Blood Presure Alert. Baltimore activists will join others in march through Cuba to U.S. base More than two dozen activists from Baltimore and elsewhere have arrived in Cuba to protest the U.S. detention-and-interrogation operation at Guantanamo Bay. The activists, most of them Christian, have broken U.S. law by traveling to the communist nation. So bust them when they get back. Even better, throw them in Gitmo with their buddies. They were planning to set out this morning for the Navy base in southeastern Cuba where the United States is holding about 500 foreign terror suspects without prisoner-of-war status or criminal charges. So we can see where this story's going. They expect the 50-mile march from the city of Santiago to take four or five days. If they reach the installation - which is guarded by U.S. and Cuban checkpoints and surrounded by a minefield - they will demand to see the detainees. Sure. Just walk through the minefields and we'll set it all up. "There is in our faith the tradition of the corporal works of mercy," the Rev. Steve Kelly, a Jesuit priest, said before leaving for Cuba. "It's only Christian of us to comfort those who are imprisoned." Thanks, fadda. Just for that, we'll kill you last. The activists, many of whom have been imprisoned themselves for protesting at U.S. military and defense contractor sites, have been meeting at Jonah House, the Catholic Worker community in West Baltimore that was co-founded in 1973 by war resisters Philip F. Berrigan and Liz McAlister. Berrigan gained national prominence in 1968 as a leader of the Catonsville Nine Vietnam War draft protest. Ah. The usual suspects...
Their daughter Frida Berrigan is an organizer of the Cuba trip. The activists include veterans of inner-city poverty work and pacifist actions in Iraq and Israel, and they oppose U.S. military policy generally. They have seized on claims of prisoner abuse at Guantanamo Bay, where a U.S. joint task force has been holding and interrogating foreigners captured in Afghanistan and the region after the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001. A free trip to Cuba in December? Kumbaya! Count me in! Interrogators there have used cold, heat, loud music and sleep deprivation on their subjects, according to a military investigation this year. In one case, a female interrogator smeared what she described as menstrual blood - it was fake - on a prisoner. In another, a Navy officer threatened to harm the family of a detainee, in violation of U.S. military law. The investigation followed allegations by FBI agents who said they had seen interrogators insert lit cigarettes into prisoners' ears and chain prisoners to the floor in the fetal position for extended periods. Detainees who have been released have spoken of being forced to look at pornographic images, menaced with dogs and beaten. Like I said, we knew where this story was heading. "I think it's important for the world to know that there's not a consensus in this country that torture is OK," said Susan Crane, a resident of Jonah House. At Guantanamo Bay, the activists plan to confront one of the U.S. military's most sensitive installations during a time of war. Even as opposition to U.S. policy in Iraq grows, there has been little call to close what's known as Joint Task Force Guantanamo. Nor is the activists' opposition to military action universal among Christians. Many Christians support U.S. military policy in Iraq and elsewhere as a righteous response to the problem of evil."I would not reject out of hand the present administration's attempts to liberate a particular people," said J. Daryl Charles, the author of Between Pacifism and Jihad: Just War and Christian Tradition. "We use force morally," said Charles, a professor of religion and ethics at Union University in Jackson, Tenn. "We apply it in order to prevent the greater evil." There's also that "They're trying to kill us" thing. A small point, but I thought I'd mention it. Crane called Christian support for war "very sad." "The early Christians knew you couldn't be Christian and serve in the military," she said. "You had to make a choice. Jesus was talking about loving your enemies." Your enemies talk about eating you for dinner. Crane said the group has informed Cuban officials of its plans but has neither sought nor received Cuban permission or support. If the activists reach the base, Crane said, they will demand to see the detainees. If unable to proceed, they will attempt to hold a prayer vigil. Did the bring the Big Giant Puppets? "You'll have to check that, sir." "I've been in prison when people outside were holding a vigil," said Crane, who has been arrested for demonstrating at U.S. military bases. "I could feel the encouragement - not just me, but the other women, that people were praying for me. It brings hope." Hopefully, you'll get that chance again. Jonah House resident Gary Ashbeck traveled through Iraq before the U.S.-led invasion in 2003. He spoke of the need for accountability at Guantanamo Bay. Oh, wow! A "Human Shield" alumnus! "This idea of just holding people, taking them prisoners, and just the sketchiness of how they're getting these prisoners ... everything about it just really needs oversight," he said. "What [U.S. officials have] done is they've created a location that completely has no oversight." What's this guy, running for congress?The Pentagon has allowed teams from the International Committee of the Red Cross to visit the prisoners, but the committee does not report its findings publicly. Crane said the U.S. war on terror would not bring security. She said the only way the country can protect itself is by changing its attitudes and actions toward the rest of the world. I definitely think they ought to let this twit meet "the boys". "Jesus brought a new commandment: to love one another," she said. "To me, nonviolence is the only thing that's going to work." Who says the sixties are dead? | |
| Posted by:tu3031 |
| #25 "kick Islamofascist ass" Frank, that is also Verse 7734 of Imam Al-Aska Paul's Big Book of Quotable Quotes and Holy Sayingsâ¢, available on Amazoon.con |
| Posted by: Alaska Paul 2005-12-06 23:34 |
| #24 "kick Islamofascist ass" My own personal Jesus 1:10 |
| Posted by: Frank G 2005-12-06 21:47 |
| #23 John 2:15 for the whip incident Matthew 22:19-21 for the Caesarâs comment Luke 7:1-10 about the Roman officerâs servant |
| Posted by: Shieldwolf 2005-12-06 21:38 |
| #22 He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.â Luke 22:35-37 |
| Posted by: Shieldwolf 2005-12-06 21:25 |
| #21 Thanks DB. Wasn't disbuting you - just didn't remember seeing it. Great Comments! I think its often the case for the authorites in countries like Cuba (and N. Korea) to staple a seperate piece of paper into your passport and then stamp that - that way you can easily 'remove' it after you leave. |
| Posted by: CrazyFool 2005-12-06 19:30 |
| #20 At Guantanamo Bay, the activists plan to confront one of the U.S. military's most sensitive installations during a time of war. Authorize the Marines to shoot them full of holes as soon as they touch the wire. |
| Posted by: Besoeker 2005-12-06 19:01 |
| #19 Perhaps this one, 2b? I'm not sure where they're physically located... but I might be interested, myself... |
| Posted by: .com 2005-12-06 19:01 |
| #18 The left is embracing Christianity. As I am in the process of looking for a new church, it is surprising to me how many of the big name Protestant churches seem to have sermons that link spirituality and banning the boyscouts, or the promised land and the plight of the Palestinians. They have discovered that the CHURCH it to be a perfect place to collect money, preach and lead the sheep to get votes. It's not the first time that this has been done. Throughout history this has been done. I don't know how I feel about this, I can't help but to think that in the end, God is having a good laugh at the liberals who think that they are brining the sheep into the Christian pews to become their wards. For some reason, it reminds me of the parable - if you teach a man to fish. |
| Posted by: 2b 2005-12-06 18:53 |
| #17 :> Boats only for day trips tho, don't check in. |
| Posted by: Shipman 2005-12-06 18:43 |
| #16 and the Cuban prostitutes consider it professional courtesy not to rat out these "clergy and supporters" for any activities |
| Posted by: Frank G 2005-12-06 17:13 |
| #15 Mojo it's not all that difficult to go to Cuba legally, church based groups do it frequently. And um you can also um, go by boat, the Cuban authorities don't necessarily stamp your passport if you look like an outstanding (safe and with dough) tourist. |
| Posted by: Shipman 2005-12-06 16:50 |
| #14 2321 The prohibition of murder does not abrogate the right to render an unjust aggressor unable to inflict harm. Legitimate defense is a grave duty for whoever is responsible for the lives of others or the common good. - Catechism of the Catholic Church |
| Posted by: Rafael 2005-12-06 16:41 |
| #13 CrazyFool, Luke 22:36 |
| Posted by: Deacon Blues 2005-12-06 16:12 |
| #12 The clearest words Jesus spoke about government versus God was "Give unto Ceaser that which is Ceaser's, and unto God that which is God's". He understood that service to Ceaser could be worthwhile, even honorable, but that in all things, our souls belonged to God, not Ceaser. I've been through this before. That's why I served as one of God's warriors. Go through the Bible and find how many places it refers to shepherds. This isn't just accidental. What God is saying is that there must be shepherds to watch over those who are weak - shepherds who are willing to kill lions and wolves, to protect against the thief as well as the storm. These people are frauds, whether they are willing to admit it to themselves or not. |
| Posted by: Old Patriot 2005-12-06 15:53 |
| #11 Or in other words, it says When someone strikes you, you turn the other cheek (personally). It does NOT say When someone strikes your wife, kid or even country, you turn the other cheek. |
| Posted by: BA 2005-12-06 15:48 |
| #10 "The early Christians knew you couldn't be Christian and serve in the military," she said. "You had to make a choice. Jesus was talking about loving your enemies." DB and WJ beat me to it with their comments, but I'd like to expand upon this issue (and fallacy of this kind of so-called Christian thinking) a bit further. We see in the Bible many instances wherein God Himself is said to have His own army and His own hosts of armed and capable warrior angels. At one point Adam & Eve were driven from the Garden of Eden and an armed warrior angel with a fiery sword was posted to guard against their return. Jesus Christ was not above the use of physical violence when He thought it necessary - as the moneylenders at the temple learned to their dismay. Jesus repeatedly instructed His followers to respect authority, to pay their taxes, and to guard their persons against violence upon them. He instructed His Disciples and those who were going forth to spread His teachings to carry a sword with them in order that they could defend themselves. The myth that Christians must constantly turn the other cheek and disavow themselves from defending their persons or property purportedly arises from the early centuries of Christian martyrdom by the Romans. When faced by being tortured to death or eaten by wild animals or killed in the most horrible of fashions many martyrs are reported to have met their fates on their knees and in prayer. We don;t hear about those who met their fates standing up and fighting back. So, this myth of Christian meekness has arisen through the centuries. Christians aren't supposed to take up weapons. Christians aren't supposed to defend themselves of their property. But Christ never said that nor did He teach that nor did his Disciples and followers. Leftist, liberal, purportedly Christian revisionists teach this just as they teach a multitude of other heresies. |
| Posted by: LC FOTSGreg 2005-12-06 14:57 |
| #9 Very good comments, WJ4863. I was about to use the same scripture. Jesus talked with/confronted numerous soldiers during His ministry, and never did he degrade/admonish them for what they did. |
| Posted by: BA 2005-12-06 14:48 |
| #8 Got Cuban entry/exit stamps in your US passport? Say hello to Mr. Fine, he'll be with you momentarily. Then you go over to the desk marked "Passport Revocations"... |
| Posted by: mojo 2005-12-06 14:33 |
| #7 Will Castro even bother to clean up the place so they don't see anything bad or will he just trust they have on such solid blinders that they wouldn't say anything that might detract from their mission. These people are really sad and I think they should be at least seriously delayed upon their return to the US. |
| Posted by: rjschwarz 2005-12-06 14:20 |
| #6 Baltimore activists will join others in march through Cuba to U.S. base. More than two dozen activists from Baltimore and elsewhere have arrived in Cuba to protest the U.S. detention-and-interrogation operation at Guantanamo Bay. The activists, most of them Christian, have broken U.S. law by traveling to the communist nation. The model of civil disobedience, the Dr. Martin Luther King, accepted the time in jail when he knowingly broke the law. While he objected to the law, he did not seek to undermine the very nature of law. Watch these miscreants try to get out of the penalty phase of their sojourn. Depending on what book you use. Luke 2 - Some soldiers also asked him [John the Baptist], âWhat about us? What are we to do?â He said to them. âDonât take money from anyone by force or accuse anyone falsely. Be content with your pay.â Donât see where he instructed them not to be soldiers. Luke 7 - When Jesus had finished saying all these things to the people, he went to Capernaum. A Roman officer there had a servant who was very dear to him: the man was sick and about to die. When the officer heard about Jesus, he sent to him some Jewish elders to ask him to come and heal his servant. They came to Jesus and begged him earnestly. âThis man really deserves your help. He loves our people and he himself built a synagogue for us. So Jesus went with them. He was not far from the house when the officer sent a friend to tell him, âSir, donât bother yourself. I do not deserve to have you come into my house, neither do I consider myself worthy to come to you in person. Just give the order and my servant will get well. I, too, am a man placed under the authority of superior officers, and I have some soldiers under me. I order this one, âGo!â and he goes; I order that one âCome!â and he comes; and I order my slave, âDo this!â and the does it.â Jesus was surprised when he heard this; he turned around and said to the crowd following him, âI have never found such faith as this, I tell you, not even in Israel!â The messengers went back to the officerâs home and found his servant well. If you understand the historical context of the Roman occupation of Judea, that Jesus did not admonish the officer for his career as a soldier, a foreigner or a gentile, and that he praises the officerâs faith, can only be construed in the positive. You have to twist your thinking really tight to ignore all that. |
| Posted by: Whaigum Jating4863 2005-12-06 13:11 |
| #5 There were plenty of opportunities for both John the Baptist and Jesus and Paul to comment on military service and Christianity, and they consistently failed to say anything negative about it. |
| Posted by: Ptah 2005-12-06 12:35 |
| #4 DB - I've never heard that one. Got a reference? There is a simple solution - when they return deport them back to Cuba which they love so damn much. Give their citizenship to some cuban refugee who manages to convert a 57 chevy into a boat - at least they would appreciate it. |
| Posted by: CrazyFool 2005-12-06 12:35 |
| #3 "The early Christians knew you couldn't be Christian and serve in the military," she said. "You had to make a choice. Jesus was talking about loving your enemies." The early Christians knew nothing of the sort. Jesus said, "He who hath not a sword let him sell his cloak and buy one". He knew full well there are times when one must resort to violence. |
| Posted by: Deacon Blues 2005-12-06 11:40 |
| #2 ..they will demand to see the detainees. Haaahahahahahaaahahahahaa, as if. These people are not likely to be in any position to make demands. |
| Posted by: Bomb-a-rama 2005-12-06 10:47 |
| #1 Some wit should start a strong rumor in the Miami Cuban community that several of them are CIA agents, bringing secret weapons to assassinate Castro with. They are very high tech, and almost invisible. They have hidden these secret weapons in their luggage and up their persons. And if they can get even a single one of them through... Let's see how far these birds could march after two dozen deep rectal inspections. |
| Posted by: Anonymoose 2005-12-06 10:09 |
