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| -Lurid Crime Tales- |
| Betrayal Behind Israeli Attack On USS Liberty |
| 2006-07-30 |
| [Text redacted] |
| Posted by:Mike |
| #40 Muslims are not our enemies we unfortunately have made them our enemies. I disagree. Islam advocates war against non-belevers - it is the highest calling of the muslim. Muslims are duty bound to war agains the infidels - Jihad. Islam has been at war against all non-belevers since its founding. The crusades were a defensive war against almost 600 years of militaristic expansion by Islam. Syria, Jordan, Iran, etc.. used to be all christian lands - until Islam converted them by the sword. In islam the unbeliever has three choices: 1) Pay a tax *in humiliation* Worship their god in secret - you cannot display your cross, cannot discuss your religion outside of your church - no evangalising(I know I spelled that wrong). Churches cannot be build nor maintained. This is intended to be a *temprary* measure until the unbelever chooses one of the other two options. And by humiliation I mean you are third-class citizens - have no legal rights (even less then those of women) and must *always* defer to a muslim in all things. 2) Convert to Islam. Of course once in Islam you can never leave. To leave carries with it a death sentence. 3) Death. Look at the globe. On just about every border of the Islamic world Islam is at war with the infidels. Indonesia. Tailand. India, Russia, China, Africa. They all have problems with 'Islamic extreamist'. In indonesia they openly attack and burn churches while the islamic governemt gives 'lip service' to justice. |
| Posted by: CrazyFool 2006-07-30 23:57 |
| #39 MO: Muslims are not our enemies we unfortunately have made them our enemies. Americans are not the enemies of Islam. But Islam does consider the non-Muslim world its enemy. And has done so for over a thousand years. MO: The Saudis were instrumental in ending the cold war. Reagan asked them to over produce oil in the 80's (at their own detrement) to crash the oil market so the USSR's economie would crash. Actually, Americans were instrumental in ending the Cold War. We kept communism from advancing unchecked across the globe by aiding anti-Communist governments and fighting two land wars in Asia. We prevented the Soviets from annexing Iran and kept the Gulf States (including Saudi Arabia) protected against all of their potential enemies, including the Soviets, Iran and Iraq. We don't owe Saudi Arabia anything. They owe us their very existence. The oil glut in the '80's was the result of over-exploration after the record prices of late '70's, not Saudi cooperation. The Soviet economy imploded for the same reason that the North Korean and Cuban economies are imploding - communist economics don't work. MO: Although, Churchhill said "We have no permanent Allies." That's right. Cooperating with a slimy terrorist-sponsoring theocracy like Saudi Arabia was necessary during the Cold War, just as dealing with the Soviets was necessary during WWII. I'm not sure it's necessary to quite the same extent today. However, it's probably just as necessary to prevent Saudi oil from falling into somebody else's hands. Which is why we remain their ally. But we are allies - which is to say that we have a relationship stemming from a common interest in their continued national independence. We are not friends, which would require shared values. |
| Posted by: Zhang Fei 2006-07-30 23:42 |
| #38 Liberty was actually attacked by a fully-cloaked Romulan "Bird of Prey"... _________________________ Ignore the antisemitic yokels who bring up the "Liberty" incident every chance they get. |
| Posted by: borgboy 2006-07-30 23:23 |
| #37 My GGG was a Lieutenant under Lee. He surrendered at Appomattox courthouse. My grandmother told me he was very proud to be an American. He relocated to Philadelphia after the war because everything he had in the south was completely destroyed. He was from Charleston. Muslims are not our enemies we unfortunately have made them our enemies. The Saudis were instrumental in ending the cold war. Reagan asked them to over produce oil in the 80's (at their own detrement) to crash the oil market so the USSR's economie would crash. Although, Churchhill said "We have no permanent Allies." I do like Rantburg and many thing on this page provide food for thought. I guess from my GGG I hold some Rebel veiws, but I am every bit American. The Rebel Yell "EEEYA" |
| Posted by: Mike oilman 2006-07-30 23:22 |
| #36 Bottom line is that the only way to catch up with the Axis powers would have been the total mobilization of the US economy - as was done after Japan attacked Pearl Harbor - during which 50% of national output (compared to about 5% today) was devoted to defense. Politically it's impossible - because of the hardships - to undertake that kind of economic mobilization without being at war. This is why Roosevelt never proposed it. After Pearl Harbor, America Firsters got behind the flag and supported the war. Meanwhile, Mike Oilman is out there cheering the enemy on. |
| Posted by: Zhang Fei 2006-07-30 23:20 |
| #35 RC: Much like the "America First" asshats who kept us from re-arming in the lead-up to Pearl Harbor. The same nutjobs who led the Japanese to think a sudden blow would scare us out of the fight. Yes, loyalty to America is important. But the world is bigger than our borders. I'm afraid that's wrong. America Firsters were for a strong defense. They just wanted the US out of the aid business, which did weaken America's defenses, leading to the US starting WWII without sufficient weaponry to defend its assets in the Pacific. No amount of peacetime "rearming" would have prepped the US for WWII. The Axis powers were using up huge amounts of their economies to get their war machines going. Lindbergh participated in combat missions against the Japanese and came up with new ways to improve the combat effectiveness of US military aviation. That's not something you're going to see Mike Oilman do. |
| Posted by: Zhang Fei 2006-07-30 23:16 |
| #34 MO: And you're right I am America 1st. My Great Great Grandfather fought in the seige at Petersburg, VA. On which side? Let's it even if it was on the Union side, you don't rate. Benedict Arnold was a bona fide American war hero. Until he betrayed America to the enemy. Your *great grandfather* fought during the Civil War. I assume he honored whichever side he fought on - at least both were American. You are advocating American submission to a bunch of heathen scum from Arabia - a people who have been Christendom's greatest threat for a thousand years. MO: Unlike AIPAC, I don't share my allegence to a foreign power (Israel). You mean like CAIR, you devote your allegiance exclusively to the Muslim enemies of America? |
| Posted by: Zhang Fei 2006-07-30 23:00 |
| #33 And you're right I am America 1st. Much like the "America First" asshats who kept us from re-arming in the lead-up to Pearl Harbor. The same nutjobs who led the Japanese to think a sudden blow would scare us out of the fight. Yes, loyalty to America is important. But the world is bigger than our borders. |
| Posted by: Robert Crawford 2006-07-30 22:57 |
| #32 MO: "It is well that war is so terrible - we should grow too fond of it," states Lee during the fighting at Fredricksburg. When Muslims learn this lesson, then we won't have to fight them any more. |
| Posted by: Zhang Fei 2006-07-30 22:51 |
| #31 And you're right I am America 1st. My Great Great Grandfather fought in the seige at Petersburg, VA. Unlike AIPAC, I don't share my allegence to a foreign power (Israel). |
| Posted by: Mike oilman 2006-07-30 22:51 |
| #30 "It is well that war is so terrible - we should grow too fond of it," states Lee during the fighting at Fredricksburg. |
| Posted by: Mike oilman 2006-07-30 22:32 |
| #29 Mike Oilman: History will show the US is backing the wrong horse. Our interest are USA, not some quasi-religious regime. Where in the constitution did Jefferson write we will arm a religious state to the teeth against our best interest. Our interest is to get the oil not alienate our allies with our energy source. Complete Stupidity!!! I think you are putting your personal financial interests ahead of the national interest. Muslims killed hundreds of Americans prior to 9/11. For people who say that it's our fault for supplying Israel, we need to understand that is what countries do - they support their allies and fight their enemies. Allies include countries that don't deliberately attack them. Enemies include those that do. Allies include Britain and China pre-WWII. Enemies include Imperial Japan and Nazi Germany. Note that there's nothing in the constitution that says we should support fully religious enemy states (that's almost all of the Muslim states) against our friends. We can get the oil from enemy Muslim states without selling our friends down the river. |
| Posted by: Zhang Fei 2006-07-30 21:38 |
| #28 Uh...I'm confused. America Frist? Well we've had worse in Congress; at least he's a Repub and thoracic surgeon to boot. Keep up the great work #26 (Double Happy Hour over in 10 minutes) Right On! Asymmetrical Triangulation (at) |
| Posted by: at 2006-07-30 20:51 |
| #27 To Oilman: Jefferson didn't write the constitution, Madison did. Just thought you'd like to know. |
| Posted by: The hoo 2006-07-30 20:41 |
| #26 You bastards I sense a less than America frist attitude! |
| Posted by: Roy Cohn Esq 2006-07-30 19:53 |
| #25 hey i calledd it on his use of proper english was made out a fool that the 'OTHER' didn 't know it too well and was told engineers didn't know english guess this honkey was right huh |
| Posted by: honkey 2006-07-30 19:29 |
| #24 we know - I posted that pic on purpose to show that...Jeesh. I'd hoped I wouldn't have to explain that... |
| Posted by: Frank G 2006-07-30 19:25 |
| #23 Yes, it is conspiracy crap. BEWARE, the site www.rense.com which is writing this nonsense is a well-known antisemitic and negationist site. On its Frontpage, it is supporting Ernst Zundel, a negationist now on trial in Germany for denial of the Holocaust. Wake up, guys. |
| Posted by: leroidavid 2006-07-30 19:23 |
| #22 C'mon, folks, we ALL know there's never been an accident in the entire HISTORY of warfare! The only way something like this could happen is on purpose!!! And, yeah, I'd bet that in this case, "oilman" means "Saudi whore". |
| Posted by: Robert Crawford 2006-07-30 19:16 |
| #21 Oh Ye who bash Bush, faked pictures and all, the Head Honcho at the time was LBJ, a definate Democrat. Spin that if you can. |
| Posted by: Redneck Jim 2006-07-30 19:01 |
| #20 The only thing that shocks me here is that it took a couple of weeks of Israel defending itself before somebody trotted out this conspiracy crap. It was an accident, get over it you freaking wackos. |
| Posted by: Laurence of the Rats 2006-07-30 18:55 |
| #19 Mike, you've been warned once before at least about using someone else's nym. There won't be a third warning. Rantburg is for current news related to the War on Terror. Historical articles are appreciated when they're germane. Trolling isn't. Maybe you'd be happier visiting another site? Try Democratic Underground. We're not big on conspiracy theories around here. |
| Posted by: Fred 2006-07-30 18:53 |
| #18 How banal. He trolls here one day, gets his ass handed to him, and the next day he brings up the Liberty, like we don't even know about it. When are we going to get more original trolls? |
| Posted by: Penguin 2006-07-30 18:52 |
| #17 Michael Oren's punctured that myth |
| Posted by: Frank G 2006-07-30 18:48 |
| #16 Um--who attacks ships with napalm? I'm finding that bit a little hard to believe. |
| Posted by: Dar 2006-07-30 18:48 |
| #15 Did I miss a meeting? I never got one of those sanppy uniforms to wear. Every time the LLL Mo0b@+ fever swamp thinks Israel is getting too much good press they dredge up the USS Liberty. Yes it was a terribe ACCIDENT, doesn't bring back the dead or quelch the flames of conspiracy but it is as simple as that. That is unless the moonbats can come up with a really good reason Israel would attack it's staunch ally on purpose? (crickets) It's just like a fratricide only it was our ship that got hit. |
| Posted by: Cyber Sarge 2006-07-30 18:44 |
| #14 history will show mike the oilman is an idiot |
| Posted by: legolas 2006-07-30 18:43 |
| #13 oilman = oil = saudi money ? :) Fog of war. When in Second World War US invaded one of the Northern Islands in Pacific real fog appeared and in the end almost 100 US soldiers were dead in the fight. There werent any Japanese in the Island. Only Americans... |
| Posted by: Clerert Uneamp2772 2006-07-30 18:42 |
| #12 Admiral Moorer's version is not accepted by any of the dozen official committees and task forces that have investigated the incident. One of the key pieces of information is that on June 4, 67, Israel asked the US if they had anything in the eastern Med. The US said 'no'. The Liberty at the time was transiting the western med headding east and was in the eastern Med when it was attacked. |
| Posted by: mhw 2006-07-30 18:41 |
| #11 Mike "the oilman's" wallet outsizes his soul. We support the only democracy in the mideast. I'd guess, that, not only is he not an "oilman", he's also not American in thought or deed.... |
| Posted by: Frank G 2006-07-30 18:33 |
| #10 yep - love the W and Republican emblems.....guess he's a GOP voter? |
| Posted by: Frank G 2006-07-30 18:30 |
| #9 By the way, he had smuggled pictures, I saw them. |
| Posted by: Redneck Jim 2006-07-30 18:27 |
| #8 Did you look at that pic carefully, Frank? |
| Posted by: Angie Schultz 2006-07-30 18:26 |
| #7 History will show the US is backing the wrong horse. Our interest are USA, not some quasi-religious regime. Where in the constitution did Jefferson write we will arm a religious state to the teeth against our best interest. Our interest is to get the oil not alienate our allies with our energy source. Complete Stupidity!!! |
| Posted by: Mike oilman 2006-07-30 18:25 |
| #6 nice pic from Jeff Rense's page: |
| Posted by: Frank G 2006-07-30 18:20 |
| #5 When in the Navy I had a friend who was on the Liberty, he said that when the first wave of fighters came over the Mast at supersonic and climbed for an attack run the hostilities abruptly ceased, from wanting to sink them to "How can we help" an abrupt change due simply to available firepower. That the fighters were recalled is a fact found out much later, simply their presence ended the fight. |
| Posted by: Redneck Jim 2006-07-30 18:20 |
| #4 thanks Mike - look for the IP and name snatch, Mods? |
| Posted by: Frank G 2006-07-30 18:18 |
| #3 With its massive radio antennae, including a large satellite dish, it looked like a large lobster ... I thought shellfish were considered trafe? |
| Posted by: Zenster 2006-07-30 18:15 |
| #2 I didn't post this--I'll bet it was our petroleum engineer troll from the other day. |
| Posted by: Mike 2006-07-30 18:13 |
| #1 oh brother - read the account in the book the secret War Against the Jews and you will get a very different account of what happened - take the storm trooper patch off your arm |
| Posted by: legolas 2006-07-30 18:12 |