You have commented 339 times on Rantburg.

Your Name
Your e-mail (optional)
Website (optional)
My Original Nic        Pic-a-Nic        Sorry. Comments have been closed on this article.
Bold Italic Underline Strike Bullet Blockquote Small Big Link Squish Foto Photo
China-Japan-Koreas
DefenseTech.org -- NORK Nuclear Test: It's A Dud
2006-10-09
HA HA HA HA.

I -- Jeffrey Lewis, crossposting from Arms Control Wonk -- love the US Geological Survey. They've published lat/long (41.294 N, 129.134 E) and Mb estimates (4.2) for the North Korean test.

There is lots of data floating around: The CTBTO called it 4.0; The South Koreans report 3.58-3.7. You're thinking, 3.6, 4.2, in that neighborhood. Seismic scales, like the Richter, are logarithmic, so that neighborhood can be pretty big. But even at 4.2, the test was probablya dud.

Estimating the yield is tricky business, because it depends on the geology of the test site. The South Koreans called the yield half a kiloton (550 tons), which is more or less -- a factor of two -- consistent with the relationship for tests in that yield range at the Soviet Shagan test site:

Mb = 4.262 + .973LogW

Where Mb is the magnitude of the body wave, and W is the yield.

3.58-3.7 gives you a couple hundred tons (not kilotons), which is pretty close in this business unless you're really math positive. The same equation, given the US estimate of 4.2, yields (pun intended) around a kiloton.

A plutonium device should produce a yield in the range of the 20 kilotons, like the one we dropped on Nagasaki. No one has ever dudded their first test of a simple fission device. North Korean nuclear scientists are now officially the worst ever. Of course, I want to see what the US IC says. If/when the test vents, we could have some radionuclide data -- maybe in the next 72 hours or so.

But, from the initial data, I'd say someone with no workable nuclear weapons (Kim Jong Il, I am looking at you) should be crapping his pants right now.

First the missile, then the bomb. Got anything else you wanna try out there, chief?
Posted by:Steve White

#10  The resultant slaughter among the Nork generals and scientists should set both them and Iran back a decade.

Yup. I also hope Kim is just stupid enough to march his nuclear team to the wall. Tends to make the learning curve very steep indeed.

Very raughable, Zenster.

Clam it, Deal Leadel.
Posted by: Zenster   2006-10-09 19:15  

#9  Thinker of the difference in waver speed thru granite and sandstone. Rock gottem Convergence Zones too...
Posted by: HalfEmpty   2006-10-09 18:36  

#8  Mb = 4.262 + .973LogW

The constants coem from Soviet test site, not NoKO.

Without knowledge of the geology, this is quite suspect

the strength of the seismic signal is determined by the way the explosive energy couples into the geological medium, and there are strong regional differences. In fact, each seismic station has to be calibrated, and this is obvious from the range of seismic magnitudes reported by various global seismic stations. A small difference in body wave magnitude of a little over 0.2 corresponds to a halving of the yield estimate. And for any underground nuclear explosion, seismic body wave magnitudes are known to range over 1.0 or even more, which indicates the pitfalls in yield estimates from seismic signals, unless they are done carefully and correctly.

Posted by: john   2006-10-09 18:14  

#7  A "high ranking administration official" should make a comment that with the design they're using, they should have gotten at least 5 times the yield. The resultant slaughter among the Nork generals and scientists should set both them and Iran back a decade.
Posted by: Rob Crawford   2006-10-09 17:26  

#6  "We really need to go in, kick ass and take names"
Very raughable, Zenster. You come first.
Posted by: Dear Reader   2006-10-09 17:25  

#5  Bah! North Korea is now at its most vulnerable.
Posted by: Zenster   2006-10-09 15:36  

#4  North Korean nuclear scientists are now officially the worst ever.

Probably too hungry to properly concentrate.

But, from the initial data, I'd say someone with no workable nuclear weapons (Kim Jong Il, I am looking at you) should be crapping his pants right now.

North Korea is not at its most vulnerable. We really need to go in, kick ass and take names before they can perfect their designs.
Posted by: Zenster   2006-10-09 15:35  

#3  Where was the Kaboom? There was supposed to be an Earth-shattering Kaboom!
Posted by: Tibor   2006-10-09 15:18  

#2  Hey. They said there'd be... NO MATH!
Posted by: tu3031   2006-10-09 15:18  

#1  So Kim came up a little short! hahaha
Posted by: 49 Pan   2006-10-09 15:05  

00:00