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| Gov't Guranteed Retirement Accounts - Here they come | |
| 2008-11-19 | |
Triggered by the financial crisis the past two months, the hearings reportedly were meant to stem losses incurred by many workers and retirees whose 401(k) and IRA balances have been shrinking rapidly. The testimony of Teresa Ghilarducci, professor of economic policy analysis at the New School for Social Research in New York, in hearings Oct. 7 drew the most attention and criticism. Testifying for the House Committee on Education and Labor, Ghilarducci proposed that the government eliminate tax breaks for 401(k) and similar retirement accounts, such as IRAs, and confiscate workers' retirement plan accounts and convert them to universal Guaranteed Retirement Accounts (GRAs) managed by the Social Security Administration. | |
| Posted by:Besoeker |
| #18 One small step for man, one giant step for Gulag-kind. |
| Posted by: Hammerhead 2008-11-19 23:15 |
| #17 Bambi and Puff Daschle want to get the Teddy Kennedy Memorial Socialized Medicine Plan passed a whole lot more than this. After all, Hillary couldn't. This takes a real back seat to that. I'd be a lot more concerned about the probability of that. |
| Posted by: Nimble Spemble 2008-11-19 19:07 |
| #16 So if I take all the money out of my 401K will they take the debt and spread it around? We can all become bailout participants. The suggestion of confiscating peoples 401K's is the most vile thing I've heard in a long time. And the most vile from an American politician every that I can think of. |
| Posted by: rjschwarz 2008-11-19 19:07 |
| #15 Executive Order 6102 is an Executive Order signed on April 5, 1933 by U.S. President Franklin D. Roosevelt "forbidding the Hoarding of Gold Coin, Gold Bullion, and Gold Certificates." It required all persons to deliver on or before May 1, 1933 all gold coin, gold bullion, and gold certificates owned by them to the Federal Reserve. Under the Trading With the Enemy Act of October 6, 1917, as amended on March 9, 1933, violation of Executive Order 6102 was punishable by fine up to $10,000 ($166,640 if adjusted for inflation as of 2008) or up to ten years in prison, or both. Because of this forced immediate sale of gold to the Federal Reserve at the government set price of $20.67 per ounce, this Executive Order is often referred to as the Gold Confiscation of 1933. Shortly after this forced sale, the price of gold from the treasury for international transactions was raised to $35 an ounce; the U.S. government thereby devalued the U.S. dollar by 41%. But, but, but The One would never do anything like that.... would he? |
| Posted by: Besoeker 2008-11-19 19:05 |
| #14 It would be especially stupid for Congress to do this, which is why the Democrats might try to do this. I haven't seen much in the way of wisdom from that party in a while. If they try it, part of the law would be to set a date at which the money is considered transferred to the new GRAs -- that would be the date on which the bill is introduced to the House (for example). Thus, you have no warning, and if you move your money out of your IRA/401k/403b, the Feds will just take it. Assuming you can move your money, since the brokerage houses, to avoid potential Federal misery, would likely freeze all IRA/401k/403b accounts as of that date. So you'd be well and truly stuck. And it would indeed induce the Mother of All Market Meltdowns. |
| Posted by: Steve White 2008-11-19 18:27 |
| #13 Still old news and nothing has happened in the mean time. Save your blood pressure for something closer to reality. Let's see what Bambi can do when he gets hold of the reins of power instead of people's imaginations. |
| Posted by: Nimble Spemble 2008-11-19 18:21 |
| #12 Democrats in the U.S. House have been conducting hearings on proposals to confiscate workers' personal retirement accounts -- including 401(k)s and IRAs -- and convert them to accounts managed by the Social Security Administration. Let's start with the Congressional retirement program and move all those on and those working towards it into SSA just like the rest of the Americans they've stuck it with. |
| Posted by: Procopius2k 2008-11-19 17:19 |
| #11 a government strong enough to take away a 401k is strong enough to suspend trading of such investments. There are some inherent limits to government power. "suspend trading of such investments" is equivalent to "close the stock markets." Shares which cannot be traded are worth $0. |
| Posted by: Anguper Hupomosing9418 2008-11-19 17:19 |
| #10 They pull this crap, they'd better bring home the ENTIRE U.S. Army and Marine Corps from wherever the Hell they are and second the lot of them to the Secret Service. It won't be people gunning just for Bama, there won't be a Senator or Representative without snipers looking for him. They have NO IDEA how angry this is going to make people. |
| Posted by: Jolutch Mussolini7800 2008-11-19 17:14 |
| #9 The recent "meltdown" of the stock market will look like a small hiccup. The market will crash and may stay down for a LONG time --- That problem is inherent in the existing 401(K) system. --- Many stocks once paid substantial dividends to stockholders who were thus able to benefit from stockownership while continuing to hold the stocks. For years, stock dividends have been inconsequential. --- Lacking dividend income, retirees are obliged to sell their stock in order to get money to live on, and the sheer volume of baby boomers liquidating their stocks has long been expected to push the market down. |
| Posted by: Anguper Hupomosing9418 2008-11-19 17:12 |
| #8 a government strong enough to take away a 401k is strong enough to suspend trading of such investments. |
| Posted by: bman 2008-11-19 16:50 |
| #7 The congresscritters on that committee must have gotten an earful from the public. George Miller (the committee chair) issued a press release stating that they aren't going to mess with retirement savings. It's not time to take that huge 40% (or more) hit yet, guys, simply because some lone nut testifies in Washington.... |
| Posted by: Cornsilk Blondie 2008-11-19 16:40 |
| #6 I don't think they have thought this through. As someone pointed out, if they try this, people will have warning. Some short time before the seizure date, EVERYONE will pull all their money out of their 401Ks. Since much of the money in these funds is in the stock market, this will require massive sales of stock all at once. The recent "meltdown" of the stock market will look like a small hiccup. The market will crash and may stay down for a LONG time. Storing cash in your mattress may turn out to be the best thing to do. |
| Posted by: Rambler in Virginia 2008-11-19 16:33 |
| #5 Of course they want to force this money into special 3% govt bonds. Now how much is THAT going to add to the national debt? Are gov't bonds going to become taxable? |
| Posted by: AlanC 2008-11-19 16:07 |
| #4 So instead of being able to retire and draw out my money at 52, I presume it would be locked up until I was 67. Wouldn't that be nice, its time to start loading up your muskets if they try to make a grab for your retirement account. Take the 40% hit and cash out if they are going to do this. What would be the point of actually saving for retirement if you were going to be on the dole anyway. |
| Posted by: bigjim-ky 2008-11-19 15:32 |
| #3 hey where's the good news i saw this morning about the dems couldn't even get together on the auto bailout. They already bitchin and moanin at each other |
| Posted by: chris 2008-11-19 15:20 |
| #2 Always a pipe dream about the great government and all it does for us. So, now that you bankrupted the government, you want to take our personal savings too? So when government checks start to bounce, no one will have anything. Thanks but no democrats. Forget the idea. |
| Posted by: newc 2008-11-19 15:16 |
| #1 The young folks that don't ever expect to see a SS check should REALLY feel spooked about this idea. Democratic financial theory: Since we've screwed up SS let's take over private retirement moneys to make SS healthy (?) and say we are going to "protect" the new money. |
| Posted by: tipover 2008-11-19 14:28 |