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| The Problem with Ivy-League Schools |
| 2014-08-11 |
| Read the whole thing. It's long, but compelling. I should say that this subject is very personal for me. Like so many kids today, I went off to college like a sleepwalker. You chose the most prestigious place that let you in; up ahead were vaguely understood objectives: status, wealth -- success. What it meant to actually get an education and why you might want one -- all this was off the table. It was only after 24 years in the Ivy League -- college and a Ph.D. at Columbia, 10 years on the faculty at Yale -- that I started to think about what this system does to kids and how they can escape from it, what it does to our society and how we can dismantle it. Dismantle it? Not with our current crop of Congress Critters. This system is exacerbating inequality, retarding social mobility, perpetuating privilege, and creating an elite that is isolated from the society that it's supposed to lead. He says that like it's a bad thing! And who says they are "supposed to" lead us peons? The numbers are undeniable. In 1985, 46 percent of incoming freshmen at the 250 most selective colleges came from the top quarter of the income distribution. By 2000, it was 55 percent. As of 2006, only about 15 percent of students at the most competitive schools came from the bottom half. The more prestigious the school, the more unequal its student body is apt to be. And yet, the Smartest Man in the Room managed to get in. And out. The major reason is clear. Not increasing tuition, though that is a factor, but the ever-growing cost of manufacturing children who are fit to compete in the college admissions game. The more hurdles there are, the more expensive it is to catapult your kid across them. Wealthy families start buying their children's way into elite colleges almost from the moment they are born: music lessons, sports equipment, foreign travel (enrichment programs, to use the all-too-perfect term) -- most important, of course, private-school tuition or the costs of living in a place with top-tier public schools. And in the case of our current Secretary of State, Military "service". The problem isn't that there aren't more qualified lower-income kids from which to choose. Elite private colleges will never allow their students' economic profile to mirror that of society as a whole. They can't afford to -- they need a critical mass of full payers and they need to tend to their donor base -- and it's not even clear that they'd want to. And so it is hardly a coincidence that income inequality is higher than it has been since before the Great Depression, or that social mobility is lower in the United States than in almost every other developed country. Elite colleges are not just powerless to reverse the movement toward a more unequal society; their policies actively promote it. Is there anything that I can do, a lot of young people have written to ask me, to avoid becoming out of touch and entitled? Get off the government dole? I don't have a satisfying answer, short of telling them to transfer to a public university. You cannot cogitate your way to sympathy with people of different backgrounds. You need to interact with them directly, and it has to be on an equal footing: not in the context of service, and not in the spirit of making an effort, either -- swooping down on a member of the college support staff and offering to "buy them a coffee," as a former Yalie once suggested, in order to "ask them about themselves." Just another chore for the enlightened - to interact with their inferiors. Instead of service, how about service work? That'll really give you insight into other people. How about waiting tables so that you can see how hard it is, physically and mentally? You really aren't as smart as everyone has been telling you; you're only smarter in a certain way. The education system has to act to mitigate the class system, not reproduce it. Affirmative action should be based on class instead of race, a change that many have been advocating for years. Preferences for legacies and athletes ought to be discarded. SAT scores should be weighted to account for socioeconomic factors. Colleges should put an end to résumé-stuffing by imposing a limit on the number of extracurriculars that kids can list on their applications. They ought to place more value on the kind of service jobs that lower-income students often take in high school and that high achievers almost never do. They should refuse to be impressed by any opportunity that was enabled by parental wealth. The changes must go deeper, though, than reforming the admissions process. The problem is the Ivy League itself. We have contracted the training of our leadership class to a set of private institutions. However much they claim to act for the common good, they will always place their interests first. The arrangement is great for the schools, but is Harvard's desire for alumni donations a sufficient reason to perpetuate the class system? I used to think that we needed to create a world where every child had an equal chance to get to the Ivy League. I've come to see that what we really need is to create one where you don't have to go to the Ivy League, or any private college, to get a first-rate education. Perhaps the Ivy-League educated author forgets that not everyone needs or wants a collage education? William Deresiewicz is the author of "Excellent Sheep: The Miseducation of the American Elite and the Way to a Meaningful Life", coming out Aug. 19. He taught at Yale from 1998 to 2008. He is also the winner of the Dallas Institute. A longer version of this essay was originally published in The New Republic. |
| Posted by:Bobby |
| #22 I can't help but thinking if Ebola had taken out Harvard Biz school back in the 60s the world would be a much better place today. |
| Posted by: 3dc 2014-08-11 22:55 |
| #21 Shuffling along in the middle of the pack with a faded name tag "Don't be first. Don't be last. And never volunteer". |
| Posted by: SteveS 2014-08-11 22:52 |
| #20 Something, something Roman Haruska, G. Harold Carswell. |
| Posted by: Shipman 2014-08-11 19:41 |
| #19 At #18. Shuffling along in the middle of the pack with a faded name tag, I've long believed mediocrity has it's rewards. |
| Posted by: Besoeker 2014-08-11 17:58 |
| #18 One thing I have learned from my readings of history -- how many of the "leading class", the best and the brightest, wind up failing their followers and leading the whole kit and kaboodle right off cliffs to their mutual destruction. If it weren't such a regular and tragic occurrence, it would be -- almost humorous. |
| Posted by: Anguper Hupomosing9418 2014-08-11 17:17 |
| #17 Through an unfortunate series of events, I escaped, Besoeker. Not entirely unscathed by the experience, but it was a close-run thing. ;-) |
| Posted by: Sgt. Mom 2014-08-11 16:44 |
| #16 I can't recall ever feeling intellectually unequal in any company or social occasion ever since - on-line or in meatspace. Sometimes it's not what you know, but who you know. This explains a lot about our "leadership class". |
| Posted by: Anguper Hupomosing9418 2014-08-11 16:28 |
| #15 I can't recall ever feeling intellectually unequal in any company or social occasion ever since - on-line or in meatspace. Never married eh ? |
| Posted by: Besoeker 2014-08-11 16:01 |
| #14 Really, this is news to the poor benighted author? It's about what my parents were telling me when I was looking at going to college. All the Ivies and their west-coast equivalents were good for was the prestige of having gone to them, and access to the grad network. You'd have a better change of getting a solid education at a community college and a state school, assuming you were going to seriously apply yourself. And they were right - I had a couple of wonderful teachers at the local community college. One was so riveting a lecturer that people who weren't actually in the class sat outside his classroom (which was always jammed) just to listen. And for Cal State Northridge, IIRC, every class was taught by a full professor, and none of them stand out for being one of those huge lecture hall affairs with a body count in the hundreds. Nope, the classes that I remember best usually had about about 20-35 students, day to day. (More at midterms and finals, though.)I certainly can't claim to have had a prestigious education, but it certainly served me well, AND without a smidgeon of student debt. I can't recall ever feeling intellectually unequal in any company or social occasion ever since - on-line or in meatspace. |
| Posted by: Sgt. Mom 2014-08-11 15:53 |
| #13 Whatever real benefit may be from graduating from an Ivy League school, IMNSHO, would mostly be from networking with others of that "class". |
| Posted by: Anguper Hupomosing9418 2014-08-11 13:37 |
| #12 Perhaps the author is unaware that a first-rate education can be gotten at a good many state schools and other non-Ivies, just by getting into the school's honours program. Many of the professors teaching those classes are Ivy-credentialed, just as he is, and many are leaders in their fields, which he may or may not be. And many of the students in the honours program are on partial or full academic scholarship, so that first rate education may actually be free to the student. Finally, these are the students who could have gone to Ivy schools, with high school and college resumes about as interesting as their Ivy competitors. See ya at HBS, suckas! |
| Posted by: trailing wife 2014-08-11 12:44 |
| #11 "a lot of young people have written to ask me, to avoid becoming out of touch and entitled? " Seriously?? College students who are concerned about becoming "out of touch and entitled" - why would they bother applying to Ivies anyway? Are they that clueless? |
| Posted by: Anguper Hupomosing9418 2014-08-11 12:32 |
| #10 Student debt in the Ivies isn't much of an issue: Despite the hefty sticker price associated with all Ivy League institutions, estimated yearly costs are actually quite affordable. In fact, Ivy Leaguers graduate with less debt than their peers who attended less prestigious schools. How? Turns out healthy endowment funds play a huge role in aiding low-income, middle-income and even upper-income students with tuition costs. Score! According to statistics from U.S. News & World Report, many of the best colleges in the county are relative steals for the lucky few who earn admission. For example, Princeton University students graduate with about $5,096 of debt for all four years – the lowest sum for alumni leaving a national university with debt. Amy Laitinen, a former White House education adviser now at the New America Foundation, said, "Folks look at the sticker price and assume that's what everyone is paying. The truth is that the more elite schools have more resources." Resources -- i.e, scholarship funds and outright grants to students who don't have their own access to funds. |
| Posted by: Anguper Hupomosing9418 2014-08-11 12:28 |
| #9 The basic problem here is the notion that this nation has a "leadership class" at all. Those who like to fancy themselves as the "best and the brightest" tend to cluster together & now they are self-perpetuating. The entire world is now in the process of learning that the "best and the brightest" -- ain't. |
| Posted by: Anguper Hupomosing9418 2014-08-11 12:22 |
| #8 How much influence do you have over your child at 2? At 5? At 11? At 17? So why do these ivory tower toffs think they have any lasting influence over an 18 year old? By the time they are 30, exposure to the real world has erased whatever influence the toffs had. I speak from personal knowledge. |
| Posted by: Nimble Spemble 2014-08-11 11:58 |
| #7 So g(r)omgoru, you are saying Americans have reached a point of Marination. We have been soaking in a seasoned, often acidic, liquid before being cooked by the likes of a William Deresiewicz. Well us regular folks know we are cooked the only problem is William Deresiewicz is over cooked. You could say he's like Well.... Done ! |
| Posted by: Omoluter Stalin3979 2014-08-11 11:45 |
| #6 Congratulation Americans, you have achieved Mandarinate. |
| Posted by: g(r)omgoru 2014-08-11 11:30 |
| #5 Poor Professor, socialist drinking his own kool aid. Ivy League College is not a right. It is a luxury, and with most luxuries it is expensive. It is reserved for those that can pay, life is not fair, again, we are not socialist. In an attempt to make college level education available to those that are willing to work hard for it, our nation built land grant schools in every state. For undergraduate degrees some state provide a much better education. For example: your kid is a top 5% brain and you can afford to get him into MIT. Compare the education. At MIT he will be a middle of the road student, he will go so far in debt he will not be able to afford a masters. He will graduate with an MIT degree, that's prestigious, and his education will be all that he puts into it. His classes will be taught by grad students, not professors. He will be, for MIT, an average student. Or, send him to a good Land grant school, ASU for example. He will go to the Advanced Placement school called Barret college. He will have a personal adviser, he will take AP classes, get special attention, and a far better education. He will also be able to afford, or his parents will, to go after his masters. This is my view on undergraduate degrees. Masters and PHD are another story. |
| Posted by: 49 Pan 2014-08-11 11:13 |
| #4 Over rated. Running on their name. Only current currency is the 'good old boy' network they offer. If the collapse of the 'ruling' caste occurs, will be a deficit rather than an asset on a resume. how we can dismantle it Ask GM. In the 50s, how would 'I was an executive at GM' play versus the 10s 'I was an executive at GM' as value in the job market? Let an open market place do its job. The problem ultimately isn't the institution as much as the 'good old boy' network. |
| Posted by: Procopius2k 2014-08-11 10:37 |
| #3 We have contracted the training of our leadership class to a set of private institutions Which is not a whole lot different than the French, Japanese, or the Germans. Unfortunately, we have ended up with the efficiency of the first, the group-think of the second, and the mentality of the third. |
| Posted by: Pappy 2014-08-11 10:31 |
| #2 Most people don't send their kids to an Ivy League school because it takes too long to de-program them after they get out? And it's a waste of good money? |
| Posted by: JohnQC 2014-08-11 10:01 |
| #1 Don't worry, All is well, the problem is going away.... White Students Majority Ends; Minority Enrollment More Than Half Aprender a hablar español, es la lengua del futuro en los Estados Unidos de América. |
| Posted by: Don Vito Bucket1902 2014-08-11 09:17 |