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Shi'ite shrine destroyed in Samarra
Today's Headlines
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Page 1: WoT Operations
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Afghanistan
Abdullah sez al-Qaeda leaders not in Afghanistan
Afghanistan’s Foreign Minister Abdullah Abdullah has said that Al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden and Taliban leader Mullah Omar were not present in his country.

He admitted that there was a recent increase in Taliban’s operations "was a matter of concern for us". However, he told reporters that the security situation has improved taking into consideration that 90% of the country was under the control of Taliban and Al-Qaeda."

He said that discussions between President Hamid Karzai and the Pakistani leadership concentrated on ways to stop attacks from Taliban and Al-Qaeda and to put an end to the infiltration on both sides of the border. Abdullah said that the government’s priority was to form a national army that will be a beginning of a reconciliation.

On the issue of cartoons offending the Prophet Muhammad, Abdullah questioned the logic of destroying infrastructure and property during demonstrations in order to show resentment.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 00:49 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [278 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "Abdullah questioned the logic..."
Now they have to revoke his Muslim membership card.
Posted by: Glenmore || 02/22/2006 7:17 Comments || Top||


Africa Horn
New group formed to fight al-Qaeda in Somalia
Sounds like the Somali version of Los Pepes ...
No doubt it will delay the formation of a government of national unity, which we all know is the next step ...
Western intelligence analysts specializing in events around the Horn of Africa on the Red Sea say it is unclear what lays behind the forming of a new political party, which is nothing more than a group of warlords.

The new Alliance for the Restoration of Peace and Counter-Terrorism (APPCT) was formed in Mogadishu following a bloody weekend, with at least 18 people killed and close to 100 wounded. Although information from the official Somali capital is scarce sources in Djibouti, where an international counter-terror force is based, say the last round of fighting was between members of some 10 different private militias and the powerful new ultra radical militia of the Islamic Sharia court in Mogadishu.

According to one report the radicals, usually dressed in white gowns and white head covers, armed with AK-47s and machine guns mounted on pick-up trucks, are a new phenomena on the Somali scene. The Sharia court militia's main goal is to impose strict Islamic rule in all of Somalia. To do so followers of the court began to apprehend, and sometimes murder, those suspected of drug dealing, alcohol trading and prostitution. This hurts the warlords, who so far have been determining the nature of economic and social life in the capital, day-by-day business routines.

One source with connections to the Djibouti Task Force said the court militia is funded, motivated and basically related to the Jamaa Islamiah and al-Qaeda. The warlords are also preparing their men for the possible first meeting in years of a Somali parliament. This event, scheduled for February 26, will take place, if at all, in the town of Baidoa since the capital Mogadishu is still considered too dangerous for the parliament to meet in.

The latest events will have a direct influence on the activities of the Horn of Africa Task Force and the Naval Task Force patrolling the waterways leading to the Persian Gulf.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 01:04 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [290 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Perhaps the US could send some drones to clear the streets of the Mog of any 'technicles' they may encounter. After all, our enemy's enemy and all that, not to mention good drone training grounds.
Posted by: wxjames || 02/22/2006 9:23 Comments || Top||


Khartoum allies launching deadly raids in Chad
Janjaweed militias and Chadian rebel groups backed by the Sudanese government are launching deadly cross-border raids on villages in eastern Chad, Human Rights Watch (HRW) said Tuesday. Based on a January-February investigation in eastern Chad, the 15-page report, "Darfur Bleeds: Recent Cross-Border Violence in Chad," documents a sharp increase in attacks against civilians in Chad by Sudanese government-backed Janjaweed militias and Chadian rebel groups. "The government of Sudan is actively exporting the Darfur crisis to its neighbor by providing material support to Janjaweed militias and by failing to disarm or control them," said Peter Takirambudde, HRW's Africa director. "The Janjaweed are doing in Chad what they have done in Darfur since 2003: killing civilians, burning villages and looting cattle in attacks that show signs of ethnic bias," he added.

The report quoted dozens of interviews with some of the tens of thousands of Chadians who have fled their homes. "I was sleeping and then I heard the guns and the screaming. I got up and my son was bleeding. I ran to him and I saw that he was dead," the report quoted one 35-year-old Chadian woman from a non-Arab tribe as saying. "I ran back and that was when I was shot ... I just saw blood," said the woman whose leg was later amputated. She said seven were killed in that attack, including her son and her husband.

Chad, which is under threat from its own insurgents, withdrew its border troops to protect its main frontier towns. HRW said Janjaweed militias have taken advantage of the vacuum and are raiding deeper into Chadian territory, unchecked by either Chadian or Sudanese armed forces. HRW said it had evidence of Sudanese Army involvement in the militia attacks and had documented at least four attacks by Sudanese armed forces on eastern Chadian villages. "Witness accounts and physical evidence indicated that government of Sudan troops and helicopter gunships participated directly in attacks, while many people reported seeing Antonov aircraft approach from Sudan, circle overhead, then return to Sudan in advance of Janjaweed raids," the report said. Sudan denies its troops are involved in cross-border operations and say they do not coordinate attacks with Janjaweed.
Posted by: Fred || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [255 views] Top|| File under:


Somali fighting toll climbs to 33
At least 15 people were killed and 23 wounded Tuesday in fighting between gunmen loyal to warlords controlling the Somali capital and Islamic court security militia, witnesses and medical sources said. This brings the death toll to 33 and dozens wounded since the clashes erupted on Saturday, pitting gunmen backed by the Alliance for the Restoration of Peace and Counter-Terrorism (ARPCT) — a coalition of warlords — against Islamic court militia along a road in southern Mogadishu's Daynile district, they said.

"The fighting intensfied afternoon killing 13 people. The wounded are more than 23," Mohammad Daud, former militia commander, told AFP. Two other civilians, including a child, were killed by stray rounds earlier in the day, according to a witness, who asked to remain unnamed for security reasons. Eight of the 15 dead were fighters from rival sides, according to militia sources. Residents of the bullet-charred capital described the fighting as the heaviest in five years and a witness said the battlefield was "full of blood and it is very scary."

Tuesday's fighting, in which militiamen deployed rocket-propelled grenade launchers, heavy machineguns, small caliber guns and mortars, forcing several hundreds of terrified town-dwellers to flee the battlezone to relatively peaceful areas. Eighteen people have been killed in the last three days at least six flatbed trucks mounted with anti-aircraft and machineguns destroyed. The rival camps are fighting over the control of the 21 October Road, named after the day when dictator Mohammad Siad Barre came to power in 1969, where a massive military barracks, academy and garage are located. "Artillery guns of 85 mm and 105 mm are being used seriously used. The main target of the bombardment was the military academy, military barracks," Daud added.
Posted by: Fred || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [290 views] Top|| File under:

#1  One still has to wonder. Just WTF is worth fighting over in Somalia? Enquiring minds want to know.
Posted by: Cheaderhead || 02/22/2006 17:28 Comments || Top||

#2  Some folks don't need a reason. The absence of one is probably an indication that there isn't much in the way of entertaining alternatives for yoots.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 02/22/2006 17:34 Comments || Top||

#3  "you're on my side of the bed" - Bill Cosby
Posted by: Frank G || 02/22/2006 18:30 Comments || Top||


Africa Subsaharan
Nigerian Christians kill Muslims
details on the pushback


AN enraged mob of Nigerian Christian youths has slaughtered dozens of Muslims in two days of rioting in the southern city of Onitsha.

Rioting broke out in the lawless trading town on the banks of the Niger River yesterday when members of the Igbo tribe launched revenge attacks in response to an earlier massacre of Christians in the north of the country.

Nineteen corpses were seen scattered by the side of the main road into the city across the Niger River bridge, where a contingent of soldiers had set up a roadblock to hold back hundreds of rioters armed with clubs and machetes.

The bodies had been beaten, slashed and in some cases burnt. Around the bloodied corpses lay scattered the caps and Islamic prayer beads associated with the northern Hausa tribe.

A police official had earlier said five more Hausas had been killed in the neighbouring city of Asaba, across the bridge, to where thousands of Muslims fled to escape the mayhem in Onitsha.

Frank Nweke, a magazine editor who ran the gauntlet of the mob to escape Onitsha and made it to the bridge, said he had seen 15 more corpses lying in the streets of the city.

"Some of them had been beheaded, others had had their genitals removed. I saw one boy holding a severed head with blood dripping from it," he said.

Army officers at the scene could not confirm a total death toll in the city, where control has not yet been restored, but said thousands of Muslims had taken shelter in barracks and police stations.
ugly, ugly ... and building to this for a very long time
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 20:17 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [449 views] Top|| File under:

#1  sometimes you get what you asked for
Posted by: Frank G || 02/22/2006 20:23 Comments || Top||

#2  same thing i was thinking frank
Posted by: Elmiting Gluger1772 || 02/22/2006 20:25 Comments || Top||

#3  Damn.

Nobody will remember muslim violence, but trumpet this from the housetops.

And Liberalhawk will lead the chorus.
Posted by: Ptah || 02/22/2006 21:22 Comments || Top||

#4  This is good. Like Australian riots/US first reaction to 9/11, shows thier is limits to our restraint.

The moderate Muslims will never risk their lives to confront and check the Radical Muslims until they realize the alternative is worse.

I still believe the majority of Muslims are not radical or western they are center and could go either way.

We need to help force that choice by making it clear its either coexistence to western leaning or allow the Radical to ring in total decimation of all they know and more, until no radicals left, maybe even no Muslims left.

It should be clear our current campaign is not our last gasp for victory, its the Muslim ideology’s last chance to either join the world or face the consequence others who could not coexist faced example: Nazi ideology.

Simply we don’t need them to love us or even like us just simply respect and mainly fear us. Will work just fine for now in time they can learn to like us.



Posted by: C-Low || 02/22/2006 22:10 Comments || Top||

#5  No doubt the MSM will trumpted this from the rooftops for weeks after ignoring the muslim murders and church burnings which prompted it.

Same as their 'coverage' of the Crusades....
Posted by: CrazyFool || 02/22/2006 22:14 Comments || Top||

#6  So, what's the score?

Christans 5 Islamofascists Lions 2
Posted by: Captain America || 02/22/2006 22:23 Comments || Top||

#7  Its looking like Biafra II

from wikipedia:

The Republic of Biafra was a short-lived secessionist state in southeastern Nigeria. It existed from May 30, 1967 to January 15, 1970. The military's Chief of Staff formally announced capitulation on January 12. The country was named after the Bight of Biafra, the bay of the Atlantic to its south.

Biafra was recognized by a small number of countries during its existence: Gabon, Haiti, Ivory Coast, Tanzania, and Zambia. Despite lack of official recognition, other nations provided assistance to Biafra. France, Rhodesia and South Africa provided covert military assistance. The aid of Portugal proved to be crucial to the republic's survival. Portugal's São Tomé and Príncipe became a centre of humanitarian relief efforts; Biafran currency was printed in Lisbon, which was also the location of Biafra's major overseas office. Israel also gave Biafra the arms that it captured in the 1967 Six-Day War, but that same conflict ruled out further assistance.

In January 1966, a coup in the Nigerian government was attempted, which was bloody and short-lived. Since mostly Igbo officers in the Nigerian army survived, it was assumed that they had initiated the coup, and in the months of May and September of 1966, Igbo migrants living in northern Nigeria were the targets of mass killings. Most of Nigeria's Igbo people, who were then estimated at 11 million, lived in what was then the Eastern Region of Nigeria, which had as military governor the Igbo Lieutenant Colonel Chukwuemeka Odumegwu Ojukwu. He declared the region an independent state with a capital at Enugu, and his troops began seizing federal resources such as inbound postal vehicles.
Nigeria responded initially with an economic blockade and brought military force to bear starting on July 6, 1967. In the ensuing civil war, raids were made by Biafran troops west into Nigeria in July and August. Nigerian troops soon recovered, however, advancing into Biafra and forcing the repeated transfer of the Biafran capital from Enugu to Aba and then Umuahia by the end of the year, and to Owerri in 1969.

By 1970, Biafra had been ravaged by war and was in great need of food supplies. Amid economic and military collapse, Ojukwu fled the country and the rest of the republic's territory was re-incorporated into Nigeria. Around a million people are thought to have died in the conflict, mostly through starvation and illness.

Biafra's national anthem used the Finlandia tune by Jean Sibelius.

This conflict inspired musician/artist/activist Jello Biafra in his choice of name.

Nigeria later renamed the Bight of Biafra as the Bight of Bonny.


Biafria was Christian and Animist and the then government of Nigeria was Islamic. The UK supported Nigeria.

The Movement for the Actualization of the Sovereign State of Biafra (MASSOB) is an organization of about 2,000 people scattered all over Nigeria with the aim of securing the resurgence of the defunct state of Biafra. It is led by an Indian-trained lawyer, Ralph Uwazurike, with headquarters in Okwe, in the Okigwe district of Imo state, Nigeria. The group has appropriated all the trappings of State of the former Republic of Biafra, and is determined to bring the Republic's independence back.

Animated by the perceived disadvantaged position of the Igbo ethnic group, who comprise the bulk of the population of Nigeria's eastern region (briefly independent as Biafra), MASSOB is hopeful that it will succeed in its efforts. This hope is buoyed on the possibility that the Oodua Republic of the Yorubas (southwest Nigeria) may be a reality one day, and so would their own group.

MASSOB has had many conflicts with Nigerian police who accuse the leadership and its many young supporters of treason and felony, but this has not deterred their activities. Economics, rather than patriotic zeal for Biafra, has perhaps been the main factor behind support for MASSOB. While it has not approximated the activities of the Biafran Organisation of Freedom Fighters (BOFF) during the Biafran War, it has however kept Biafran issues alive and has consistently placed them on the Nigerian national agenda.

"The Biafran flag is hoisted over and flies throughout the enclave formerly known as Biafra and, for members, this is a symbol that Biafra 'of the mind' lives as its former chief of state," Chukwuemeka Odumegwu Ojukwu says. The struggle, the group says, continues and only time will tell if Biafra, or at least the Bight of Biafra after which it is named, re-emerges.


Biafra is mentioned in Warren Zevon's song "Roland the Headless Thompson Gunner"
(I got it on vinyl somewhere....)


Excerpt from last wartime speech of Chukwuemeka Odumegwu Ojukwu Head of Biafran state.

"In the three years of the war necessity gave birth to invention. During those three years of heroic bound, we leapt across the great chasm that separates knowledge from know-how. We built rocket, and we designed and built our own delivery systems. We guided our rockets. We guided them far; we guided them accurately. For three years, blockaded without hope of import, we maintained all our vehicles. The state extracted and refined petrol, individuals refined petrol in their back gardens. We built and maintained our airports, maintained them under heavy bombardment. Despite the heavy bombardment, we recovered so quickly after each raid that we were able to maintain the record for the busiest airport in the continent of Africa. We spoke to the world through telecommunication system engineered by local ingenuity; the world heard us and spoke back to us! We built armored cars and tanks. We modified aircraft from trainer to fighters, from passenger aircraft to bombers. In the three years of freedom we had broken the technological barrier. In the three years we became the most civilized, the most technologically advanced black people on earth."


On 29 May 2000, the Guardian of Lagos newspaper reported that President Olusegun Obasanjo commuted to retirement the dismissal of all military persons who fought for the breakaway state of Biafra during Nigeria's 1967–1970 civil war. In a national broadcast, he said the decision was based on the belief that "justice must at all times be tempered with mercy". It is also thought, that during the previous year, there had been a public resurgence of pro-Biafra sentiment among a section of the Igbo, who claimed that in the Nigerian federation, they have been marginalised.




Posted by: 3dc || 02/22/2006 22:38 Comments || Top||

#8  Everything you never wanted to know about Biafra is here: http://www.biafraland.com
Posted by: 3dc || 02/22/2006 22:47 Comments || Top||

#9  even old history like this:

The United Nations Genocide Convention particularly mentions acts committed "with intent to destroy" a human group, and Lord Stonham speaks of "the deliberate destruction" of such a group. For nearly a quarter of a century Northern Nigerians have publicly expressed their intense hatred of Biafrans and, on the slightest excuse, have physically demonstrated their intention to destroy them. Several outbreaks of Nigerian hostility to Biafrans occurred from time to time even during the British colonial era. In 1945 Northern Nigerians set upon Biafrans resident at Jos and massacred them. But the British Administration did not take the matter seriously and did not even conduct an inquiry into the gruesome episode.

In Western Nigeria, in Yorubaland, there has always been the outcry at various times for the "repatriation" of Biafrans. In 1953, again, Northern Nigerians with a "universally unexpected degree of violence", attacked and massacred Biafrans living in Kano. This time the British were constrained by the nature and degree of the holocaust to order an inquiry. The official Report, compiled by a British administrative officer, produced incontestable evidence of intention, deliberation and organisation on the part of the Northern Nigerian authorities.

There was evidence that leading functionaries of the Northern Nigerian Native Administration (N.A.) - an agency which the British themselves described as "an integral part of the machinery of government" - were deeply involved in the planning of the massacres of 1953. According to the Report, two days before the massacre began on Thursday, 14th May 1953, Mallam (afterwards Alhaji) Inua Wade, then Secretary of the Northern Peoples' Congress (N.P.C.) and later Federal Minister of Works, convened a meeting of the N.A. sectional heads at the Works Depot in Kano during which he made "a very ill-advised and provocative speech." Inua Wada said, inter alia:

"We have organised about 1,000 men ready in the City to meet force with force ... the Northern Peoples' Congress has declared a strike in all Native Administration Offices for Saturday, 16.5.53 ... we shall post sufficient number of men at the entrance of every office and business place ... we are prepared to face anything that comes out of this business ... " In the outcome, so claimed the official estimate, 52 persons were killed and 245 wounded, most of the casualties being Biafrans. But the Report itself admits that "there is still a possibility that more were killed than have been recorded in view of conflicting statements by ambulance and lorry drivers" (who carted off the dead bodies to their mass graves).

In point of fact it was widely known at the time that over 200 Biafrans had been killed and over 500 wounded. The occasion of this pogrom was that a Yoruba leader had made a speech in Kano attacking the Northern Government - Biafrans on the whole were not supporters of the politician in question. The Report however perceived the depth of the hatred and bitterness which Northern Nigerians nursed against Biafrans and concluded on a prophetic note of warning: "No amount of provocation, short-term or long-term, can in any way justify their behaviour ... The seeds of the trouble which broke out in Kano on May 16 (1953)have their counterparts still in the ground. It could happen again, and only a realisation and acceptance of the under-lying causes can remove the danger of recurrence". An acceptance of the fact of there having been genocide.

Posted by: 3dc || 02/22/2006 22:58 Comments || Top||


Arabia
Yemenis spring al-Qaeda cell leader
Yemeni authorities have released 11 Muslim fundamentalists, including the suspected leader of an al-Qaida cell, who were detained in east Yemen.
Why do they even bother getting dirty trying to escape?
Daily al-Shura, mouthpiece of the opposition Popular Forces Union Party, Tuesday quoted well-informed sources as saying Abdel Rauf Nassib, who is accused of leading an al-Qaida cell whose members were convicted of planning terrorist activities and forging official documents, was among the released prisoners. Nassib, a former Yemeni intelligence officer, was tried and acquitted in the case of the bombing of the USS Cole in the port of Aden in October 2000 in which 17 U.S. servicemen were killed. He was also accused of planning attacks against U.S. interests in the poor Arab Gulf country. There was no information about the reason for the release of Nassib, who was among Yemenis who had fought in Afghanistan against the Soviet occupation.

In another development, a Yemeni court which specializes in terror cases Tuesday ordered the release of Hadi Mohammed Saleh al-Waeli, who was accused of selling arms and ammunition to the bombers of the USS Cole. The public prosecution accused al-Waeli of selling arms without a license and asked for the highest punishment provided by law in such cases. But the court ruled that the three years that he had spent in prison were sufficient and ordered his release.

The releases of Nassib and al-Waeli come a few weeks after 23 al-Qaida prisoners, described as the most dangerous, escaped from the central intelligence prison in Sanaa. Among the escapees are 13 convicted in the bombing of the USS Cole. The incident sparked anger in Washington and accusations that Yemeni security officials were involved in the escape.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 01:32 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [268 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Sounds like an ally isn't
Posted by: 3dc || 02/22/2006 3:02 Comments || Top||

#2  Did not escape and was not released in Yemen:

11/5/2002: "Al-Harethi's car was struck by a Hellfire air-to-ground missile. The CIA launches Hellfires from pilotless Predator aircraft. Five other people, believed low-level al-Qaeda operatives, also were killed."
Posted by: Glenmore || 02/22/2006 7:14 Comments || Top||


Al-Qaeda's view of the UAE
From the translated al-Qaeda documents from the HARMONY database, circa May-June 2002. The letter is addressed to al-Qaeda contacts in the UAE, specifically Abu Dhabi and Dubai, and gives us some window into how the Bad Guys regard them.
In the Name of Allah the Most Compassionate and Merciful
Number (blank) Date 14/ May/June/2002
Al-Jihad Qaida’s [TC: Qaida: also means base in Arabic]
{Get the idolaters out of Arab Island} [TC: Gulf Countries]
To: Officials in the United Arab Emirates and especially the two emirates of Abu-Dhabi and Dubai:

We have come to know definitely that the Emirate country is committing acts of injustice against the striving youth of the Emirates and others who sympathize with us in order to appease the Americans’ wishes which include: spying, persecution, and detainments. The United Emirates authorities have recently detained a number of Mujahideen and handed them over to suppressive organizations in their country in addition to having a number of them still in its custody. Undoubtedly, these practices bring the country into a fighting ring in which it cannot endure or escape from its consequences especially since the Emirates’ social composition is the most productive, and very explosive.

You are well aware that we have infiltrated your security, censorship, and monetary agencies along with other agencies that should not be mentioned. Therefore, we warn of the continuation of practicing such policies, which do not serve your interests and will only cost you many problems that will place you in an embarrassing state before your citizens. In addition, it will prove your agencies’ immobility and failure. Also, we are confident that you are fully aware that your agencies will not get to the same high level of your American Lords. Furthermore, your intelligence will not be cleverer than theirs, and your censorship capabilities are not worth much against what they have reached. In spite of all this Allah has granted us success to get even with them and harm them.

However, you are an easier target than them; your homeland is exposed to us. There are many vital interests that will hurt you if we decided to harm them, especially, since you rely on shameless tourism in your economical income!! Finally, our policies are not to operate in your homeland and/or tamper with your security because we are occupied with others which we consider are enemies of this nation. If you compel us to do so, we are prepared to postpone our program for a short period and allocate some time for you.

Therefore, we ask you to release all the Mujahideen detainees since September incidents and anyone who was detained and suspected of having a connection with these incidents; otherwise, we will be compelled, with no regret, to change our policies towards you.

Al-Jihad Qaida Organization
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 00:57 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [275 views] Top|| File under:

#1  A great reason to support the PORT thing? Thoughts, anyone?
Posted by: ex-lib || 02/22/2006 11:22 Comments || Top||

#2  Al-Qaeda's real thoughts on the UAE: financiers of terror.
Posted by: Hardliner || 02/22/2006 13:49 Comments || Top||

#3  The more layers come off the onion, the better the ports deal looks. The more foolish the grandstanders look (Donks and quasi-Reps alike).

It was a PR blunter the way the information came out, but rationality will restored and the deal will go through.
Posted by: Captain America || 02/22/2006 14:06 Comments || Top||


Kuwait releases all prisoners from military jail
Interior Undersecretary Naser al Othman issued an order Tuesday to release all prisoners locked up in the military jail on the occasion of the national and liberation day anniversaries. The statement said, the order was based on instructions from the First Deputy Premier and Interior and Defense Minister Sheikh Jaber Mubarak al Sabah. The ministerial order is to take effect next Friday.
"What's up with the prison release, Sarge?"
"Zarkawi called. He sez he needs a new batch of Number Threes."
Posted by: Seafarious || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [267 views] Top|| File under:

#1  This isn't unusual for the Middle East. They frequently have prison releases on national days and such. I'm surprised it included ALL prisoners. Usually the really hard cases are not released, no matter what they do. Of course, those prisoners may have been moved out of the military prison before the release, and we wouldn't know. I doubt anyone who was a threat to the al Sabah family was released.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 02/22/2006 16:25 Comments || Top||


Bangladesh
JMB leaders sheltered suicide bombers
Two local leaders of Jamaat-e-Islami sheltered the JMB suicide squad members who blasted bombs in front of Udichi office at Azahar Road in Netrakona town on December 8 last year. Eight people were killed and about 50 including 10 policemen were injured in the blasts. This was disclosed by JMB (Jamaatul Mujahideen Bangladesh) 'operations commander' Ataur Rahman Sunny during interrogation in Dhaka by the investigation officer (IO) of the two cases filed in connection with the blasts. A murder case and another case under the Explosives Act were filed after the blasts.

Sub-Inspector Mohammad Alauddin of Netrakona police station is the Investigation Officer (IO) of the two cases. SI Alauddin told this correspondent that he and the Officer-in-Charge of Netrakona thana went to Dhaka recently to interrogate arrested JMB 'commander' Sunny in connection with the blasts. Asked why charge sheets were not filed even after two and a half months of the incident, Alauddin said he is awaiting orders from higher authorities.

Sunny told Alauddin that the suicide bombers came to Netrakona about 15 days before of the (December 8) blasts and stayed under the shelter and protection of the two Jamaat leaders. One of them is a front ranking leader of Netrakona district Jamaat and the other is a teacher of a madsasa in the Sadar upazila, Alauddin said quoting Sunny. The suicide bombers also took the help of local Islami Chhatra Shibir activists in making preparations for the attack. Sunny also told Alauddin that the suicide squad was sent to Netrakona on orders from JMB chief Abdur Rahman and JMJB (Jagrata Muslim Janata Bangladesh) chief Siddikur Rahman alias Bangla Bhai .

Alauddin said he got some other 'important information' from Sunny during interrogation, which will be very helpful in the investigation. A high official of Netrakona police said investigations may have a new turn following Sunnay's confessions. "Sunny gave sufficient information about the bomb blast", the police official said. When contacted, Netrakona thana Officer-in-Charge Samiul Alam said, "We got important clues from Sunny and investigation is going on as per his statement of Sunny." He however said submission of charge sheets may be delayed.

Earlier press reports said that before the December 8 blasts, JMB threatened the Netrakona Police Superintendent of bomb attack on his office and residence in case of action against Islamist militants. The threats were made over phone and the SP had also acknowledged the threat.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 01:35 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [274 views] Top|| File under:


Britain
Gitmo detainees tied to 7/7
Inmates at Guantanamo Bay who are campaigning for their release at the High Court in London had contact with the terrorist cell responsible for carrying out last July's London bombings, interrogation officials at the detention camp have revealed.

U.S. officials responsible for running the camp say "dozens" of the 500 detainees currently being held at Guantanamo had previously lived or worked in Britain before their capture in Afghanistan in 2001, but are not British citizens.

Three of the detainees -- who describe themselves as residents, but not citizens, in papers served at the London court -- were last week given permission to seek an order for British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw to campaign for their release.

But U.S. officials responsible for interrogating the suspects say the detainees had knowledge of the cell responsible for carrying out the bomb attacks on three London subway trains and a bus that killed 52 persons and wounded more than 700 others.

"After the London bombings, we got a request from British intelligence to check whether these people had any knowledge of those responsible for carrying out the attacks," said a senior U.S. official. "We interviewed them and they were able to provide a great deal of information about the bombings, which we passed back to London."

American officials refused to give specific details of the intelligence provided by the inmates, but said it related to the "training and organizational structure" of the terror cells responsible for carrying out the July 7 attack.

Army Maj. Gen. Jay Hood, the U.S. officer responsible for running the Guantanamo prison camp, confirmed that the British intelligence agency MI6 has made repeated requests for information about the terror attacks from Guantanamo inmates.

"We have passed the information they have provided about the London bombings to the British authorities. I believe this information has helped to prevent further attacks in [Britain]," Gen. Hood said.

U.S. officials said interrogation of the detainees continues to provide valuable information about al Qaeda's international network. Apart from preventing attacks in London, recent intelligence has led to active al Qaeda cells being broken up in Italy and Germany in the past year.

Although human rights groups say detainees are not in a position to provide current intelligence four years after capture, Gen. Hood insists they are still providing high quality intelligence.

"It is like doing a giant mosaic, and every piece of information helps to give us a clearer picture of the threat we face in the global war on terror," he said.

In recent weeks some of the captured al Qaeda fighters, who were in charge of Osama bin Laden's training camps in Afghanistan, have begun cooperating with U.S. officials and revealing details of the terror network.

"This is a really significant breakthrough," said a senior U.S. official at the base.

U.S. officials insist no torture methods have been used to persuade the inmates to cooperate.

"The most common method used to interrogate detainees is to sit down with them, watch a movie and eat pizza," said the official. "You build up a relationship with them and eventually they cooperate."
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 01:02 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [278 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Pizza? How barbaric!
Posted by: doc || 02/22/2006 8:20 Comments || Top||

#2  They had their choice of pepperoni, sausage or Canadian bacon.
Posted by: ed || 02/22/2006 8:50 Comments || Top||

#3  "The most common method used to interrogate detainees is to sit down with them, watch a movie and eat pizza

I suggest to sit down with them, watch a movie and eat garlic. Lots of garlic.
Posted by: JFM || 02/22/2006 11:17 Comments || Top||

#4  What was the movie title? And what about the cartoon shorts before the movie. I could think of a rather rotund and stuttering character that would bring up their boiler pressure.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 02/22/2006 12:10 Comments || Top||

#5  Infidel NY pizza, the very best.

This also was in the London Times yesterday. I wonder how eager the Brits are now to shut down the evil Gitmo.
Posted by: Captain America || 02/22/2006 14:01 Comments || Top||


Caucasus/Russia/Central Asia
Plot to poison Grozny water supply thwarted
Servicemen of the Zapad (West) battalion have clashed with a group of militants who are suspected of plotting a major terrorist attack in Grozny and of planning to poison drinking water in parts of the Chechen capital. Weapons and two kilograms of mercury were confiscated from the militants. "One of the militants is believed to have been killed in the armed clash," battalion commander Said-Magomed Kakiyev told Interfax. "It has been established that the group included at least three people," he said. A Shmel flame-thrower, three anti-tank grenade launchers, a Kalashnikov assault rifle and grenades were confiscated from the scene, he said. None of the servicemen were injured in the clash.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 01:52 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [279 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Would mercury be an effective poison in this situation? I would have thought it would be too heavy, and thus would sink to the bottom in a mass, rather than being dissolved and dispersing throughout the water.
Posted by: trailing wife || 02/22/2006 8:13 Comments || Top||

#2  Both mercury and its salts are insoluable in water.
Posted by: ed || 02/22/2006 8:47 Comments || Top||

#3  Mercury sure would clog up the initial filters pretty well, though. Not to mention all the scare tactics used on the entire world about "mercury in fish" and all the other problems associated with "toxic" chemicals. It may not be very effective at killing people, but it would spread panic.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 02/22/2006 16:30 Comments || Top||


Europe
Update on the Halimi murder investigation
After the initial denials, France seems to be investigating all aspects of the case.
French investigators were due to head to Ivory Coast on Tuesday to hunt the leader of a gang that tortured and murdered a young Jewish man near Paris, a crime now suspected to have been motivated by anti-Semitism. According to police, the alleged ringleader, a 25-year-old of Ivorian origin who styles himself — in English — as the "brain of barbarians", is believed to have fled to the west African country. Two French officers were to travel to Abidjan to track down the suspect, who has been on the run with two accomplices since last week.

A magistrate investigating his death has extended her inquiries to include the possibility that the crime was motivated by religious hatred, sources said Monday. Halimi went missing after agreeing to a date with an unknown woman who approached him at his workplace, a telephone store in central Paris. Halimi's mother Ruth told an Israeli newspaper that her son would not have died had he not been Jewish, accusing police of downplaying a possible anti-Semitic motive to avoid alienating France's five-million strong Muslim community. Six people, under investigation for kidnapping and sequestration, could now face aggravated charges of being motivated by religious hatred. A total of 10 people have been placed under investigation — the first step to indictment — over the crime, following a raid on a housing estate south of Paris on Friday. Two more were to be brought before a judge later Tuesday.

Investigators last week traced the crime to a gang on a housing estate in the southern suburbs of Paris, after a young woman who served as a lure in several attempted kidnappings turned herself in and led them to the gang. She has been detained and faces charges of failure to report a crime.

French officials, who still believe the gang's primary aim was extortion, said on Monday that anti-Semitism may also have played a part in the crime, based on statements made by several of the 13 suspects arrested late last week. According to a judicial official, at least one said Halimi had been targeted because "Jews have money and they are a close-knit community," while another said he had been burned on the face with a cigarette because of his religion.

Several French newspapers devoted their front pages on Tuesday to the case, focusing on the distress of the Jewish community. Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy was to receive Halimi's brother-in-law as well as a delegation from the French Council of Jewish Institutions (CRIF) on Tuesday afternoon. Prime Minister Dominique de Villepin told Jewish leaders on Monday that "all light has to be shed" on the murder.
Posted by: Seafarious || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [272 views] Top|| File under:

#1  perhaps they'll finally own up to their minimizing and rationalizing entrenched antisemitism in france.

doubtful, though. too culturally threatening.
Posted by: PlanetDan || 02/22/2006 9:02 Comments || Top||

#2  According to a study by the Rg (police intelligence), only 7% of the antisemite acts comitted in France lately have emanated from the (ethnic french) rightwingers.

That leaves us with 93%, and IMHO with the most violent (assaults against persons, arsons,...), which are coming from the large zen buddhist community in France, as it was already suspected....

France is in denial, but while there probably is an antisemitic streak in the opinion, you've got to understand french are not antisemite by nature; as JFM often points out, french jews had the largest survival rate among all of occupied Europe, because of the complicity of the french people, despite traditional "maurrassien" catholic prejudice against jews.

Current antisemitism takes two main forms which are closely merged :

- the "judéophobie", judeophobia, IE left-wing antisemitism rationalized as antizionism, and based on the 'jews = nazis' equation.
Check PA Taguieff's work for this :
Rising From the Muck : The New Anti-Semitism in Europe

I don't know if it's a new book specially written in english, or an adaptation of his french work, but you'll get a great view of this new "progressist" antisemitism, Taguieff is a great scholar on that subject.

- arab/muslim "traditional" religious racism against jews, worsened by nazi-inspired ethnic antisemitism (see Bernard Lewis post elsewhere for that) and leftwing judeophobia.
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 02/22/2006 9:30 Comments || Top||


Home Front: WoT
FBI Raids Middle Eastern Owned Service Stations
Link goes to a TV station's website.

TV 8 News has learned the FBI and local law enforcement authorities are conducting a statewide raid of service stations and businesses owned by Middle Easterners. Agents executed search warrants today at businesses from Tallulah to Ruston and in Monroe. The FBI says the raids are part of "an ongoing criminal investigation." Police sources tell TV 8 News the raids target possible money laundering and counterfeiting in connection with suspected domestic terrorist activity and homeland security. TV 8 News will have details at 5, 6,and 10.

The recent Ohio arrests and now this... coincidence? Related?
Posted by: Laurence of the Rats || 02/22/2006 14:36 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [570 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Damn! Most of the stations in my area seem to be run by "Middle Easterners".
Posted by: Spot || 02/22/2006 14:46 Comments || Top||

#2  Perhaps coincidence, perhaps linked... possibly executed successively to keep the targets from bolting at the news of the other arrests. (Yes, I'm not even guessing here). I wonder how much of the information on which the arrests were based came from military/NSA intelligence? That would be the true triumph of the whole thing -- Bush's people forcing the various services to share information and work together to achieve results.
Posted by: trailing wife || 02/22/2006 15:26 Comments || Top||

#3  all the stations in my area are run by middle easterners
Posted by: Elmiting Gluger1772 || 02/22/2006 15:38 Comments || Top||

#4  Link is down (Rantburger'ed?).

I wonder if the targets are really all 'middle eastern' owned or if they are 'muslim' owned...

I can will imagine the MSM wanting to turn this into a 'racial profiling' issue...
Posted by: CrazyFool || 02/22/2006 16:02 Comments || Top||

#5  Well, sure it's a profiling issue, but raised by all the ruckus about the port thingy!
Posted by: Bobby || 02/22/2006 17:50 Comments || Top||

#6  Now that you mention it, all the gas stations around Mobile are also manned by swarthy, middle easterners (Who seem to be decent folks)

Gawd, I never even thought of the Gas Stations as a counterfitting ring, but what a perfect distribution system, you'd have to stick to counterfiting 20's, but what a system
Posted by: Redneck Jim || 02/22/2006 20:31 Comments || Top||

#7  who are you calling swarthy middle eaterner?
Posted by: Apu || 02/22/2006 20:33 Comments || Top||

#8  7-11's tomorrow?
Posted by: Raj || 02/22/2006 20:45 Comments || Top||

#9  Tricky one to call, overall. Cash business = opportunity for tax evasion and a lot of other stuff.

OTOH, service businesses that need long hours but not necessarily high skills are also a classic way for many honest immigrants to build equity and join the middle class here. Mom, pop, kids work for very low hourly wages and slowly build ownership. When they've paid off their loans they help someone else in their community / family with starting capital.

It's the American dream / opportunity in action. But for sure it could also be a cover for money laundering etc. on the part of some.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 20:45 Comments || Top||

#10  apparently the ultimate cash cow: pole dancing, isn't paying off for our burqa-clad beauties..wonder why?
Posted by: Frank G || 02/22/2006 21:11 Comments || Top||

#11  Update from the same site:

The FBI is conducting a large scale investigation into north Louisiana convenience stores with ties to the Middle East. As TV8's Gina Swanson reports the Department of Homeland Security is in on the sting operation involving stores in at least four parishes.

They seized evidence by the box full. The FBI on Wednesday searched at least a half dozen convenience stores in North Louisiana. All with ties to the Middle East. The probe led agents to stores in Tallulah, Lake Providence, Monroe and Ruston. Law enforcement sources confirm that the stores are suspected of involvement in money laundering or counterfeiting. The Department of Homeland Security has sent agents from Immigration and Customs Enforcement, or Ice, to work the case. At each station, agents seized boxes of evidence and retrieved at least one weapon. Police sources say at least some of the gas station operators are from Yemen. ...The investigation reaches beyond Louisiana. TV8 news has confirmed the FBI and department of homeland security Wednesday also raided stores in Buffalo, New York.
Posted by: trailing wife || 02/22/2006 21:18 Comments || Top||

#12  We should burn the Buffalo Embassy!
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 21:20 Comments || Top||

#13  I've searched the Buffalo News website, as well as one of the local tv stations, and can't find anything about this.
Posted by: trailing wife || 02/22/2006 21:22 Comments || Top||

#14  we've electronically redacted this for security
Posted by: FBI guy || 02/22/2006 21:35 Comments || Top||

#15  Watch out, .com, yer due for a fatwa. LOL!
Posted by: Al-Aska Paul || 02/22/2006 21:37 Comments || Top||

#16  Lol, I know, al AP! I'm trying to project the new me, kinder and gentler and all that shit, but I dunno if anyone's buying. Might be too late, after 3 years, lol.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 21:38 Comments || Top||

#17  I believe you, .com. But then I'm innocent and gullible, and even corrected my vision isn't quite 20/20. Feel better yet? ;-)
Posted by: trailing wife || 02/22/2006 22:16 Comments || Top||

#18  Nobody's buying it.
Posted by: Jack Bauer || 02/22/2006 22:16 Comments || Top||

#19  #7: who are you calling swarthy middle eaterner?

MMMM, ok "Swarthy Esquamaux of Asian descent"
Will that do?
Posted by: Redneck Jim || 02/22/2006 22:16 Comments || Top||

#20  fine - make fun of the lisp
Posted by: Apu || 02/22/2006 22:38 Comments || Top||

#21  "I try to get out, but they drag me back in!"

/channeling Michael Corleone

Thanks, tw, sniff. Actually, I am in flux. I've said most all I feel I need to say about the bad road ahead and who we should be focused upon.

BTW, I have a personal message for you:

You post your own thoughts, you contribute relevant facts and some terrific bits that I'd never hear anywhere else, you can soothe or mock with equally devastating dexterity (lol), you nail pretenders to the wall as well as give generously - when there is nothing to gain from it, and you aren't afraid of anyone, heh. That's class!

I hope you never tire of the 'Burg - it needs you!

I'm glad I've "met" you. :-)
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 22:41 Comments || Top||

#22 
Will someone please get .com a tissue?

Posted by: Nuck Fozzle2168 || 02/22/2006 23:28 Comments || Top||

#23  Heh, You really did pick the right nym, y'know?
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 23:29 Comments || Top||

#24  lol! gives us insight into his self-image.

Nuck off, loser.
Posted by: 2b || 02/22/2006 23:36 Comments || Top||

#25  A guy can't even pay another person an honest complement these days, lol. Sheesh.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 23:42 Comments || Top||

#26  Lets not be having any talk of "swarthy middle eterners" here this evening. Rascist overtunes, etc.
Posted by: Besoeker TROLL || 02/22/2006 20:50 Comments || Top||


Arrested Memphis university student was a jihadi
A University of Memphis student arrested last September with a pilot's uniform and other flight-training materials in his apartment was preparing for a terrorist attack on the United States, new documents in the case allege. Mahmoud Maawad was charged with wire fraud and using a false Social Security number, but authorities now say he was visiting online chatrooms and Web sites supporting radical Sunni Muslim organizations and Al Queda leaders in Iraq.

They said an examination of his computer also showed Maawad had searched the Internet for how guns and bombs could be smuggled through airport magnetometers and had used key words such as "car bomb" in other searches. "It is the United States' position that Mr. Maawad's motivation for fraudulent obtaining the flight training materials is because he was either planning or participating in a potential terrorist event inside the United States," Asst. U.S. Atty. Steve Parker wrote.

Parker declined comment Tuesday. Maawad, who is being held without bond, is scheduled for trial next month.

FBI agents raided the Egyptian student's campus apartment at 3557 Mynders No. 5 last Sept. 9, and found a pilot's uniform, a chart of Memphis International Airport, documents of Western Union transfers to and from Maawad, and instructional DVDs such as "Ups and Downs of Takeoffs and Landings" and "How an Airline Captain Should Look and Act."
Good gawd, don't tell me that manuals with those titles actually exist!
He has been in the United States illegally since 1999 and has used a phony Social Security number to open bank accounts and enroll in schools, Parker said soon after the arrest.

According to the indictment, between June 24 and Aug. 6 last year Maawad made 12 purchases totaling $3,544.78 via the Internet from Sporty's U.S.A., a pilot shop just east of Cincinnati. Newly disclosed evidence in the case includes printouts of chatroom discussions on a Web site with an opening message that thanks Allah "for all your Jihad" and says Iraq is "standing alone in the face of the Zionist crusader aggression." An entry posted by Mahmoud Maawad reads, "i union with you and i completely agree."

Also included are e-mails in which the Transportation Security Administration denied permission for Maawad to receive flight training and told him it would be a criminal offense to seek training without TSA approval. Authorities said Maawad replied with an "angry response stating he would violate the law."
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 02:28 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [371 views] Top|| File under:

#1  If we can't kill him outright, put this boyo in Gitmo and melt the key.
Posted by: mac || 02/22/2006 5:28 Comments || Top||

#2  Just thinkin' about the search terms on *my* computer...
Posted by: Seafarious || 02/22/2006 9:41 Comments || Top||

#3  Just thinkin' about the search terms on *my* computer...

Well, I got the same problem, but it's not exactly WOT-related, if you get my drift...
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 02/22/2006 9:44 Comments || Top||

#4  And what's worse is that they don't need our computers to find them, just cooperation from Google or whomever.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 9:46 Comments || Top||

#5  A little touchy, Besoeker?
Posted by: too true || 02/22/2006 10:13 Comments || Top||

#6  Maawad needs to be forced to lead point in an IED detection team in Iraq, handcuffed and shackled with a transmitter/trigger on his belt
Posted by: Frank G || 02/22/2006 10:23 Comments || Top||

#7  Another case of an ILLEGAL immigrant here in the States plotting against us. That's the main difference in wiretapping to me. Here ILLEGALLY? NSA can tap away, in my book.
Posted by: BA || 02/22/2006 11:07 Comments || Top||

#8  Well, Berserk has a point. Without Maawad's access to the internet, they wouldn't have caught him, but B: no one's griping about it, so what's your problem?
Posted by: ex-lib || 02/22/2006 11:13 Comments || Top||

#9  Mine was posted toward Sea's #2, ex-lib. No problem here, but I see these cases being USED against us by the MSM on the NSA/wiretapping brewhaha. Just makin' a note, is all!
Posted by: BA || 02/22/2006 13:17 Comments || Top||

#10  Google is your friend and should be available to everyone, regardless of nationality, and should stay that way. Amendment 1, etc. Strike me dood, or "poopie list me" or whatever sophmoric measures deemed appropriate.
Posted by: Besoeker || 02/22/2006 10:05 Comments || Top||


Yet more on the Ohio arrests
The men pleaded "Not Guilty" today in federal court. Some details from Toledo's WTOL (tip to reporter Alan Baker):

In count 1 of the indictment, prosecutors say the three met together many times, going back as far as November 2005. The three reportedly conspired to recruit and train others for a violent jihad against United States forces and US allies in Iraq. They also reportedly put together the funding needed for the operation, and collected the equipment needed. Prosecutors also say the three communicated by computer with an individual in the Middle East, passing information about potential attacks and terrorist training materials back and forth, as well as communication about potential weapons and targets.

In count 2, the grand jury found that the three had similar plans to kill US citizens abroad in addition to service members.

The last two counts in the indictment dealt specifically with Mohammad Zaki Amawi. One count said Amawi distributed information on bomb-making, which in itself is a federal crime.

The final two counts of the indictment say that on or about October 14, 2004, and March 15, 2005, Mohammad Zaki Amawi knowingly and willingly verbally threatened President Bush to another person.

AG Gonzales at a press conference today (see DOJ release of his prepared remarks here): The defendants learned to use plastic and nitro explosives. They sent money to Iraq and used a business and a charity to further support co-conspirators in Iraq and cover their travel overseas. FBI Deputy Director John Pistole credited "improved information sharing and intel-gathering techniques." AG Gonzales would not state whether the NSA surveillance program was responsible for indictment information and didn't name the Iraqi terrorist group(s) which the defendants allegedly supported. AG Gonzales also refused to state whether one defendant was arrested in Jordan or even where they were arrested. This last tidbit is definitely worth pursuing.

Evan Kohlmann emailed me that the indictment mentions "a specific suicide bomb vest video that these folks were using to prepare themselves... I have excerpts of the video posted on my website from last year" - see here on his site.

Fox News reports that "respected member of the Muslim community" was responsible for assistance in this case. The Assistant U.S. Attorney for the Northern District confirmed only that information came from the area, including the person referred to as the "trainer" in the area (whom Fox News credited as the "respected Muslim").
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 01:37 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [306 views] Top|| File under:

#1  These were American citizens or legal residents, and therefor cannot be wiretapped without warrant. NSA eavesdropping program will be on trial here at least as much as the three Muslims. I hope they had FISA warrants, with all the t's crossed and i's dotted. It's a tricky thing to balance protection of freedom with loss of freedom to the protectors.
Posted by: Glenmore || 02/22/2006 7:55 Comments || Top||

#2  Actually, I'm hoping the judge throws the cases out of court. Maybe having gotten some real, live jihadis released by their foolishness will convince some of our kneejerk libertarian buddies that their positions hold real-world consequences.

Of course, I wouldn't bet on it.
Posted by: DaveP. || 02/22/2006 10:34 Comments || Top||

#3  Did they do any "overt acts", that's the question. Computer searches won't put a traitor's noose around their necks.
Posted by: mojo || 02/22/2006 12:24 Comments || Top||

#4  FISA and the NSA Surveillance Progs, includ any evidence gathered from same, may be a non-issue - as long as the Feds have written evidences/
testimonies from "the Trainer" as informant, and supporting collaborative evidences which can independently verified, FISA and NSA Wiretapping may not be needed. As American citizens or legal residents, they have already been found guilty by grand jury for conspiracies to kill US soldiers and citizens abroad - depending on severity, and formal indictment, their citizenship or legal residency may/can be unilater revoked upon formal request by the Feds and Court approval of same. IFF THE THREE ARE LUCKY, THEY'LL GET SENT TO GITMO AND GLAZE-GATE, INSTEAD OF FORT LEAVENWORTH, MAKING LITTLE ROCKS FROM BIG ROCKS 24-7!?
Posted by: JosephMendiola || 02/22/2006 21:30 Comments || Top||

#5  Joe---that little rocks from big rocks thingie at Leavenworth is known in the trade as Rock Hockey.
Posted by: Al-Aska Paul || 02/22/2006 21:39 Comments || Top||

#6  they have testimony and tapes (assumed legally obtained via grand jury or better) by "The Trainer". Smoke em and let the gallows sing
Posted by: Frank G || 02/22/2006 21:43 Comments || Top||


Ohio arrests redux
A federal grand jury on Tuesday indicted three Ohio men for their role in assisting terrorism on U.S. targets overseas, specifically American military personnel and their allies in Iraq.

The indictment, which was unsealed Monday, said the men plotted to kill U.S. and coalition military personnel in Iraq and other countries. On at least two separate occasions, among other charges, at least one of the men verbally threatened to kill or inflict bodily harm on President Bush, the indictment says.

Attorney General Alberto Gonzales announced the five-count indictment during a press conference Tuesday.

"These defendants have been living in the United States, where they have been engaging in weapons training and seeking help in order to kill people abroad, including our troops," Gonzales said.

"Individuals who aid terrorists within our borders threaten the safety of all Americans," he continued. "We are committed to protecting Americans, here and overseas, particularly the brave men and women of the U.S. armed forces who are serving our country and striving valiantly to preserve democracy and the rule of law in Iraq."

The men named in the indictment are: Mohammad Zaki Amawi, 26, who was a citizen of Jordan and the United States who lived in Toledo until August 2005; Marwan Othman El-Hindi, a 42-year-old naturalized U.S. citizen born in Amman, Jordan who lives in Toledo; and Wassim Mazloum, a 24-year-old legal U.S. resident who operated a car business with his brother in Toledo after entering the United States from Lebanon.

The three pleaded not guilty in federal courts in Cleveland and Toledo. The most serious charges could bring life in prison.

The indictment also notes that a fourth person, referred to as "the trainer," was a U.S. citizen but was not named as a conspirator. One official told FOX News that law enforcement was tipped to the activities of these three men by this informant, who is an ex-U.S. military man who fought overseas and was living in Toledo. He is described as "a respected member of the Muslim community" who came forward and gave information to the authorities.

The Justice Department said "the trainer" was working on behalf of the government and was cooperating from the beginning of the investigation.

The three men were arrested over the weekend and are currently in custody, said Assistant U.S. Attorney David Bauer in Toledo.

"This is classic treason — waging war in the United States," said FOX News senior judicial analyst Andrew Napolitano. "Ohio is Middle America ... it's just not the place you'd expect something like this to be hatched."

The charges outlined in the five-count indictment include: conspiracy to kill, kidnap, maim, or injure people outside of the United States; conspiring to provide material support to terrorists, distributing information regarding explosives and making threats against the president of the United States. The most serious count that carries a maximum penalty of life in prison if prosecutors prove intent to kill.

Amawi is accused of twice threatening in conversations to kill or injure Bush. He also is charged with distributing information about the making and use of an explosive device.

The indictment accuses Mazloum of offering to use his car dealership as a cover for traveling to and from Iraq so that he could learn how to build small explosives using household materials.

El-Hindi is accused of trying to get "the trainer" to travel with him in November 2004 to the Middle East as part of the suspects' plan to establish a terrorism training center.

Officials told FOX News that the three men went as far as identifying a trip Bush was planning to Toledo and talked about ways of trying to get to him, including ramming his motorcade. But they eventually decided that security was too tight and that they were likely to get caught or killed and not be able to kill the president in the process.

The indictment says that from at least as early as November 2004 until the present, the defendants and others got together in Ohio to hatch a plan to kill people, including U.S. military personnel serving in Iraq. It says the men knowingly provided material support for this terror mission. They even tried to set up a non-profit organization through which to funnel money for their mission.

Amawi traveled to Jordan in October 2003 and returned to the United States in March 2004 after an unsuccessful attempt to enter Iraq and wage jihad, the charges state. He returned to Jordan in August 2005.

But in 2004 and 2005, the suspects recruited others to train for a violent holy war against the United States and its allies in Iraq, the indictment said. The group traveled together to a shooting range to practice shooting guns and studied how to make explosives, the indictment said. Around Jan. 27, 2005, Amawi communicated by computer with individuals in the Middle East, who told him some of the "brothers" were preparing to enter Iraq, according to the charges.

In 2002, "the trainer" was solicited by El-Hindi to assist in providing security and bodyguard training, and too travel with the suspects to the Middle East for firearms training and to help coordinate jihad training activities. The "trainer" also instructed the men on how to make improvised explosive devices and was asked if he knew how to procure chemical explosives for individuals in the Middle East.

"As we know, one of the greatest dangers to our men and women fighting in Iraq is the IED," Gonzales said.

On or around Feb. 16, 2005, Mazloum, Amawi and El-Hindi debated what the insurgents in Iraq needed most — money, weapons or manpower, and discussed the effectiveness of snipers against U.S. military personnel, the charges state.

Two of the men discussed plans to practice setting off explosives on July 4, 2005, so that the bombs would not be noticed, the indictment says.

"This is not the end, this is the tip of the iceberg. There are many other cells that are being looked at, I can assure you," said former CIA operative Wayne Simmons.

One interesting aspect of the case is that officials seem to have intercepted e-mail communications from the suspects to their jihadist brethren in the Middle East. The indictment shows the nature of the e-mails, including a concern the men needed to use code words to conceal what they were talking about.

One official told FOX News that this investigation used all the tools, including FISA warrants.

"A lot of FISAs," one source said, referring to the warrants obtained under the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act.

Law enforcement officials also told FOX News that if it were not for the Patriot Act, authorities would not have been able to bring the charge of conspiracy to provide material support to terrorists.

The issue of warrantless wiretaps has been a controversial one after information regarding such a program being conducted by the National Security Agency was leaked to the New York Times. Since then, a firestorm of criticism has been heaped upon the administration, which argues that the president has the authority to allow warrantless wiretaps in a time of war if it is in the national security interest of the United States.

When asked during the Tuesday press conference whether any of the information obtained to make the case against the three men presented, Gonzales said all law enforcement and legal officials are very concerned about not jeopardizing any investigation or case by using faulty intelligence-gathering means.

"We feel very, very strongly about this case, otherwise, we would not have brought forth the indictment," he added.

Amawi was assigned a public defender. Mazloum's attorney, Chuck Sallah, said he knew very little about his client or the charges.

Earlier this week, the U.S. government ordered a freeze on the asssets of KindHearts, a Toledo-based group suspected of funneling money to the militant organization Hamas. Law enforcement officials, speaking of condition of anonymity, said the arrests of the three men spurred the decision to freeze KindHearts' assets.

"Some aspects of them do overlap," an official said.

KindHearts has denied any terrorist connections and has said it is a humanitarian organization.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 01:36 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [265 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "This is classic treason — waging war in the United States," said FOX News senior judicial analyst Andrew Napolitano. "Ohio is Middle America ... it's just not the place you'd expect something like this to be hatched."

Toledo has a large Muslim population. It's exactly where you'd expect this to come from. Napolitano needs to pull his head out of his ass; Muslims in the Midwest are not the same as other Midwesterners.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 02/22/2006 7:49 Comments || Top||

#2  Really ? You mean there are people in America that don't support America ? Other than the donks and the MSM, I mean. And, they are Muslims ?
Who'd a thunk it ?
I see in other headlines, muzzies are freely killing Christians now. Must be phase 2.
How long do we non-muzzies wait before we point fingers at muzzies, phase 3 ?
Posted by: wxjames || 02/22/2006 9:17 Comments || Top||

#3  Toledo is the closest Ohio city to....Detroit!. I wonder if the AG is looking there too?
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 02/22/2006 9:49 Comments || Top||

#4  The most serious count that carries a maximum penalty of life in prison if prosecutors prove intent to kill.


Er...why not death?
Posted by: Elmeamble Wheash5484 || 02/22/2006 10:32 Comments || Top||

#5  The men named in the indictment are:

Mohammad Zaki Amawi, 26, who was a citizen of Jordan and the United States who lived in Toledo until August 2005

Marwan Othman El-Hindi, a 42-year-old naturalized U.S. citizen born in Amman, Jordan who lives in Toledo

Wassim Mazloum, a 24-year-old legal U.S. resident who operated a car business with his brother in Toledo after entering the United States from Lebanon.

Hmmm . . . not exactly Bill, John , or Frank, huh? I say, flush 'em.
Posted by: ex-lib || 02/22/2006 11:08 Comments || Top||


Hayat's video confession
The 23-year-old man Lodi man charged with attending a terrorist training camp in Pakistan appears nervous and frequently contradicts himself during a videotaped interrogation that was played to jurors on Tuesday.

In clips of his roughly 10-hour interview with the FBI last June, Hamid Hayat couldn't seem to give straight answers about the al-Qaeda camp where prosecutors said he trained in 2003.

Jurors saw Hayat being questioned by a series of FBI agents who rotated in and out of the room at regional FBI headquarters in Sacramento. Responding to their questions, Hayat gave sometimes conflicting answers.

For example, he said houses in the camp were mud huts, then later changed that to multistory buildings. He said trainees shot at targets marked with a bull's eye, then said they aimed at dummies made to look like American leaders.

He even gave varying accounts about the number of trainees at the camp – from 200 to about 35 – and about whether they spoke only Urdu or also Pashto and English.

Federal prosecutors continued to play the videotape they first started showing to jurors last Thursday, the first full day of testimony in Hamid Hayat's trial in U.S. District Court.

He is charged with three counts of making false statements to the FBI about attending the camp and providing material support to terrorists. If convicted, he faces up to 39 years in prison.

His father, Umer Hayat, 48, is charged with lying about whether his son attended the camp. His portion of the trial is scheduled to begin next week. Both have been in federal custody since their arrests in June.

Prosecutors say Hamid Hayat returned to the U.S. in May 2005 and was awaiting orders to carry out attacks. Government documents filed in Washington, D.C., say supermarkets and hospitals were possible targets.

His attorney claims the soft-spoken young man was tired and just trying to tell the FBI agents questioning him what they wanted to hear when he confessed to attending the camp. On the videotape, Hamid Hayat appears nervous, jiggling his knees and tucking his hands between tightly crossed legs.

Defense attorney Wazhma Mojaddidi said during her opening statements last week that her client might have bragged about attending the camp to a paid FBI informant and might even have made unbelievable statements to agents during his interrogation. But she said the government has no proof that Hamid Hayat actually attended any camps.

His family has said he returned to Pakistan to find direction in his life and get married.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 01:20 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [271 views] Top|| File under:


Hayat planned to hit CA supermarkets, hospitals
Hospitals, supermarkets and other large buildings in California were among the possible terrorist targets of a man charged with attending an Al-Qaeda training camp in Pakistan, according to a videotaped interview played for jurors. Hamid Hayat told FBI agents he was awaiting orders to strike buildings in Los Angeles and perhaps San Francisco after he returned to the US in 2005.

He said the targets might include "big buildings, like finance buildings, banks, stores." When asked to be specific, Hayat, 23, told the agent he meant food stores. "Why would you hit a food store?" the agent asks on the videotape which was played in court on Tuesday. "I think just to hurt people," Hayat responded.

The roughly 10 hours of interrogation were videotaped last June and seemed to support the government's allegations that Hayat attended the camp in 2003, returned to the US to carry out attacks and then lied to the FBI. He faces up to 39 years in prison if convicted of three counts of making false statements and providing material support to terrorists.

Hayat, however, contradicted himself throughout the FBI questioning and at times struggled to explain his involvement in the camp. That could help his defence lawyers, who claim he is prone to exaggeration and never actually underwent terrorist training.
"He's just a tad confused, yer honor! Musta gotten hit in the head as a child!"
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 01:11 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [357 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Nuthin says "PRIDE OF ISLAM/MOHAMMED" and "DESERT SAMURAI" than wiping out the sick, and food stores filled mostly with hosfraus and kiddies - you know, MANO-A-MANO.
Posted by: JosephMendiola || 02/22/2006 23:54 Comments || Top||

#2  ROFL!!!

Boot to the head!

Nice shot, Joe!
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 23:55 Comments || Top||

#3  Go Joe!
Posted by: 11A5S || 02/22/2006 23:57 Comments || Top||


India-Pakistan
Now a bounty on muslim artist for blasphemy against hindus
It mus be something about the water in Uttar Pradesh

LUCKNOW/INDORE: The Hindu Personal Law Board on Wednesday announced a Rs 51 crore reward for eliminating artist M F Hussain and others while a Congress minority cell leader offered Rs 11 lakh to any "patriot" chopping off the painter's hands for hurting Hindu sentiments.

"Anyone who kills Hussain for making obscene paintings of goddess Saraswati and Bharat Mata, the Danish cartoonist, those in the German company printing pictures of Ram and Krishna on tissue paper and the French filmmaker desecrating Lord Shiva will be given Rs 51 crore in cash by the Board," its president Ashok Pandey said in a statement in Lucknow.

If Uttar Pradesh Haj Minister Yaqoob Qureshi undertook the job "he will be given Rs 101 crore", it added cryptically.

"Peace will not prevail on earth unless such people are eliminated," he said and urged Qureshi to set out on the mission.

Madhya Pradesh Congress Committee Minority Cell vice- chairman Akthar Baig in a statement in Indore said the painter had "played with the sentiments of the people and tried to disrupt communal harmony in the past by painting nude pictures of Hindu gods and goddess and now of Bharat Mata".

It would be in the "interest of the nation if a patriot will chop off his hands. I will give that person Rs 11 lakh", he said.

The Congress leader asked the government to take back all the honours bestowed on the noted painter and declare him a "traitor".

Baig had earlier filed a petition in an Indore court against Bollywood actor Dharmendra's purported second marriage to Hema Malini.
Posted by: john || 02/22/2006 14:52 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [377 views] Top|| File under:

#1 
Saraswati


Bharat Mata


Lord Shiva

What is it with the 4-arms?

Posted by: BigEd || 02/22/2006 16:09 Comments || Top||

#2  Symbolism for more-than-human abilities. Not expected to be taken literally.
Posted by: anon || 02/22/2006 16:16 Comments || Top||

#3  Hmmmm? What goes around comes around.
Posted by: GK || 02/22/2006 16:17 Comments || Top||

#4  Or reaches around, lol. ;-)
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 16:24 Comments || Top||

#5  Big bucks offered here. A lakh is 100,000 and a crore is 10,000,000 so more or less:
Rs 11 Lakh = $24,663
Rs 51 Crore = $11,434,977
Rs 101 Crore = $22,645,739
Posted by: RWV || 02/22/2006 16:58 Comments || Top||

#6  OT: Hey .com...that picture you posted last week...the uh..."muslim" babe with the white veil...you...uh... got any more from where that came from?
Posted by: Mark Z || 02/22/2006 17:03 Comments || Top||

#7  Heh... I'm watching the US Men's Curling match... Check back in a few hours on this thread and I'll offer links to what I have - I need to rummage around a bit. Surprisingly, there isn't much, lol.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 17:39 Comments || Top||

#8  Surprisingly, there isn't much, lol.

Now, that I doubt.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 02/22/2006 18:06 Comments || Top||

#9  I read a short story a while back about some ordinary American guy who was chosen by the goddess Kali to be her high priest. As in "boyfriend". And unlike her traditional appearance, she decided to look like a 16-17 year old blonde, jail-bait pop-tart, with tank top, short skirts and all the wickedness of a teen girl who knows she's got it. Which ended up with him getting in lots of trouble.

He was amazed that nobody else noticed the bluish highlights of her otherwise perfect skin, nor the fact that she had six arms. He couldn't even figure out how her six arms were attached, all at the shoulder, but without looking odd. It was like her arms at the could occupy the same space at the same time. And nobody noticed.

On the downside, she had very earthy tastes, in fact, she was downright trashy, enjoying motorcycles, billiards, and getting guys to fight over her. To make things worse, she could take over any girl or woman she wanted to, and use them as an avatar, like puppets, to make mischief.

Being the goddess of death, she was also very into homicide, something her boyfriend didn't much care for so endlessly tried to get her to take up a hobby other than guns, knives, explosives, etc.

Eventually, her hectic lifestyle began to take its toll on him, so he took off to Hawaii. And being involved with one god sort of puts you in their social circle, so he soon met up with the goddess Pele's ex-boyfriend, Kamapuaa, the wild pig god, and moved into his bungalow as his guest.

Unfortunately, Kamapuaa was a real pig. He had fallen into lots of bad habits since breaking up, and no longer had his buff, surfer looks. Most of his time was spent watching ESPN and drinking beer.

And then he was discovered by Pele's younger sister, Hi'iaka, who was just as slutty as Kali, but tanner. Figuring to seduce him with food, she then whips up a big time luau for him, and is just about to launch into a dance when a very jealous Kali shows up.

Fortunately, the girls take it outside, and to the sound of earthquakes, volcanoes, tidal waves, etc., our hero just slumps down into an easy chair next to Kamapuaa and asks him if it was always like this. "Always", he replied. So he
asked him who was playing on teevee.

"Arkansas vs. Ohio State", said Kamapuaa.

"Go Hogs."
Posted by: Anonymoose || 02/22/2006 18:35 Comments || Top||

#10  LOL, Moose! That's the best story I've read in a long time.
Posted by: Scooter McGruder || 02/22/2006 20:18 Comments || Top||

#11  So he sez as he walks out the door with his rare, rare forks....
Ober Nockerty Only Tune Once.
Posted by: 6 || 02/22/2006 20:27 Comments || Top||

#12  ah now i get it, they've got spares
Posted by: Gleanter Gravith9762 || 02/22/2006 20:29 Comments || Top||

#13  Speaking of blasphemy... Consider all of the NSFW, lol.
The image I believe Mark Z was referring to is this one...

In that spirit, lol, I dug up this paltry offering...
dancer
generations
lil_kim
under_the_burqas
towelheadsi
world_cups
and...
Joana_Prado_1
Joana_Praco_2

As I said, pretty slim pickins... I hope you find something in there to suit, Mark.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 21:05 Comments || Top||

#14  Mark - try this link and browse around - there are quite a few from movies, so you may run across some harem girls, heh. :-)
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 21:36 Comments || Top||

#15  Com and Mark..
Just do searches on "odalisque"
Posted by: 3dc || 02/22/2006 23:06 Comments || Top||

#16  Cool, thanks 3dc... I hope Mark comes back by...
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 23:20 Comments || Top||


11 Jundallah members sentenced to death
A Pakistani anti-terrorism court yesterday sentenced 11 members of an Al Qaeda-linked radical group to death for a 2004 attack on a top general in Karachi that killed 11 people.

The extremists from Jund Allah, or Army of God, were found guilty of firing on the car of General Ahsan Saleem Hayat, the then corps commander of Karachi, as he drove through the southern city in his motorcade on June 10, 2004.

Saleem survived the shooting and later became deputy chief of the Pakistani army, but at least seven soldiers, three policemen and a passerby died in the hail of bullets.

“The prosecution has produced witnesses, the charges against you have been proven and you are hereby sentenced to death,” Judge Feroz Muhammad Bhatti told the men as he announced the verdict to the court in Karachi.

The bearded convicts wearing traditional smocks and tunics shouted “Allahu Akbar” (God is Great) and “We will accept death punishment even if it is awarded 10 times” as Bhatti finished reading the judgement.

The group’s ringleader, Atta-ur-Rehman, said after the verdict that the men would appeal against the verdict of the “kangaroo court”.

“Tell Musharraf so that he can tell Bush that such punishments cannot block our way,” he added.

“One Atta-ur-Rehman will die and another will be born.” Like other militant groups, Jund Allah was enraged by Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf’s close ties with his US counterpart George W Bush and by Islamabad’s crackdown on Islamic extremism.

Members of Jund Allah were trained in camps run by Al Qaeda in the rugged tribal area of South Waziristan near the Afghan border, where Pakistan’s military is engaged in an ongoing hunt for militants.

Prosecutor Maula Bakhsh Bhatti said the militants had confessed to carrying out the attack. “The prosecution has proved its case and they themselves have confessed and declared that it is jihad (holy war),” he said.

The judge also ordered them to pay fines of Rs50,000 ($833) each and pay twice as much to the relatives of those killed. Five other members of the group have been declared absconders in the case but were not sentenced.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 01:06 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [301 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "...trained in camps run by Al Qaeda in the rugged tribal area of South Waziristan..." More problem childern of allen from Waziristan with a direct AQ connection.

Pakistan wake up a deal with the problem, please.
Posted by: Sock Puppet O' Doom || 02/22/2006 1:27 Comments || Top||

#2  Jund Allah, Bund Allah. One letter difference between labels for people with no other discernable difference.
Posted by: Ptah || 02/22/2006 8:11 Comments || Top||


Police clueless about Dr Khawaja’s killers
It has been seven days since Dr Ahmad Javed Khawaja’s murder and Lahore Police has yet to find any clues on the identity of the murderers.
"We asked around and everything!"
Investigators have ruled out enmity being the cause of murder and are investigating the victim’s religious activities including his affiliation with Jamaatud Dawa. Police sources told Daily Times on Tuesday that investigators had ruled out enmity because Dr Khawaja had forgiven several people who had robbed his house about 10 years ago. Four of the robbers had been caught and were sentenced to jail. Sources also said investigators had found that Dr Khawaja was a member of Jamaatud Dawa, but had never attended regular meetings of the organisation. They said investigations had revealed that the murderers had shot Dr Khawaja once in the head from point blank range with a .30 calibre pistol. Two unidentified motorcyclists shot dead 68-year-old Dr Khawaja in Lahore on February 13, 2006. Dr Khawaja was alleged to have strong links to Al Qaeda and the Taliban.
"But we're sure that didn't have anything to do with it..."
Intelligence personnel had arrested Dr Khawaja, his brothers Ahmad Naveed and Ahmad Nadeem, sons Asghar Karar and Khizar Hayat and nephew Usman on December 19, 2002, for being linked to Al Qaeda and the Taliban.
"Nope. Not a clue. It's uncanny!"
Posted by: Fred || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [254 views] Top|| File under:


Danish NGOs, volunteers fleeing Pak
Danish non-government organisations and volunteers engaged in relief activities in earthquake-hit areas have started wrapping up their projects after the angry Pakistani reaction to caricatures of Prophet Muhammad (PTUI peace be upon him), a United Nations official told Daily Times. Asking not to be named, the UN official said that several Danish NGOs working in collaboration with the UN in earthquake-affected areas had indicated that they would discontinue their projects amid fears of being attacked.

More than 50 Danish volunteers were working here and over half have left, he said. “I know five Danish volunteers working in Mansehra who left last week and five others are preparing to fly back in a few days,” he added. The official said the remaining volunteers would also leave soon, adding that their departure would be a huge setback to relief activities in Pakistan. The volunteers would have stayed if the protests here had been peaceful, he said. “Already, European volunteers in NWFP and Azad Kashmir were working under fear of jihadi organisations – and the cartoons issue has added fuel to the fire.”
Posted by: Fred || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [288 views] Top|| File under:

#1  It all gets so wearying after a while. It's been the same pattern since Armenian genocide: demonize, persecute, expel/murder. One could go back to the 630's I guess, but then at least one had the option to convert or become a dhimmi. Of course, that was the era of Islam triumphant. Now it's just cultural implosion; the shame/honor dialectic demands that everything that reminds you of you and your culture's failure be destroyed.
Posted by: 11A5S || 02/22/2006 0:37 Comments || Top||

#2  I gave nothing to either the tsunami or the Pak earthquake relief efforts. Muslims have a real bad habit of biting the hand that feeds them. Let their coreligionists swimming in oil money take care of their unfortunate brethren--or not. It's as allan wills, right? This Westerner will keep his donations in the hands of sane people, thanks.
Posted by: mac || 02/22/2006 5:34 Comments || Top||

#3  "Muslims have a real bad habit of biting the hand that feeds them."

Some will call you prejudiced but sometimes such well learned 'prejudice' is a good pointer not to throw pearls before swines.
Posted by: Duh! || 02/22/2006 7:00 Comments || Top||

#4  Prejudice comes from previous judgement. It used to mean having an informed opinion.
Posted by: gromgoru || 02/22/2006 7:49 Comments || Top||

#5  When it comes to giving, it pays to be wise as serpents as well as innocent as doves.
Posted by: Ptah || 02/22/2006 8:13 Comments || Top||

#6  When it comes to surprises, it's better to give than to receive. Vlad Taltos
Posted by: gromgoru || 02/22/2006 9:21 Comments || Top||

#7  When it comes to giving there is only one charity I trust
They haven't been corrupted by political correctness.
Posted by: tipper || 02/22/2006 10:16 Comments || Top||

#8  Actually, the tsunami aid to Indonesia made a huge impact on the Aceh and others there. Don't blame the Danes for leaving.
Posted by: ex-lib || 02/22/2006 11:24 Comments || Top||


Landmine kills 3, gas line blown up in Balochistan
A land mine exploded beneath a bullock cart on Tuesday, killing three villagers in the Lehri area, 200km off Quetta, while another gas pipeline exploded in Dera Bugti, suspending gas supply to the town. Government spokesman Raziq Bugti said that three villagers travelling on the bull cart hit a landmine.

Meanwhile, Dera Bugti DCO Abdul Samad Lasi said that a gas pipeline exploded in the eastern residential colony on Tuesday. The pipeline was one of the primary lines supplying gas to Dera Bugti. As a result, gas supply to the town had been disconnecting. The pipe caught fire after the explosion, but it was brought under control. Dera Bugti Nazim Kazim Bugti said that he did not believe locals were responsible for the explosion.
Posted by: Fred || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [272 views] Top|| File under:


Eleven Pakistani Islamists sentenced to death
A Pakistani anti-terrorism court sentenced 11 members of an al Qaeda-linked Islamic group to death on Tuesday after finding them guilty of killing 10 people in an attack on a top military commander in 2004, lawyers said. All the convicts belonged to Jundullah, a shadowy group analysts say has ties with al Qaeda and foreign militants. Judge Feroz Mehmood Bhatti said all those accused were found guilty of masterminding attacks on a convoy escorting then Lieutenant-General Ahsan Saleem Hayat in June 2004.

Hayat, now a full General, escaped unharmed, but 10 people, including six soldiers, were killed and 12 other people wounded. The ambush was in response to a security force operation in South Waziristan, where hundreds of people have died in clashes between the Pakistani army and militants in the past two years.

Atta-ur Rehman, the ring-leader of the group, said they would appeal to a higher court. "That court was fake, it had no power," he told reporters after the verdict. "We will appeal at the high court within seven days."

Witnesses said all the convicts chanted "Allahu Akbar" -- God is Greatest -- after hearing the judgement. Mullah Bux Bhatti, a state lawyer said he was satisfied with the verdict and the conviction was based on the confession made by the convicts.
Posted by: Fred || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [265 views] Top|| File under:

#1  that's a start, Perv...
Posted by: Frank G || 02/22/2006 0:07 Comments || Top||

#2  '...sentenced 11 members of an al Qaeda-linked Islamic group to death..."
Sentence to be carried out under the supervision of licensed anaesthesiologists, in no less than 20 years from now.
Posted by: Glenmore || 02/22/2006 7:21 Comments || Top||

#3  finding them guilty of killing 10 people in an attack on a top military commander in 2004

They attacked one of their patrons and were turned over.
Posted by: Robert Crawford || 02/22/2006 7:46 Comments || Top||

#4  It is a start, but I gotta wonder if this (now) General hadn't been involved if the case would've even been filed? I think we all know the answer to that one.
Posted by: BA || 02/22/2006 10:41 Comments || Top||


Pak provides Karzai proof of RAW’s involvement in Baloch crisis
Islamabad: Pakistan has apparently provided Afghanistan with proof of Indian Intelligence, RAW’s involvement in affairs of Balochistan. Officials said, Islamabad gave concrete evidence of RAW’s involvement in Balochistan and the other tribal areas to Afghan President Hamid Karzai during his visit to Pakistan and demanded that RAW’s anti-Pakistan activities through India’s consulates in Afghanistan be contained.

RAW, they said was carrying out anti-Pakistan activities through its consulates in Mazar-e- Sharif, Jalalabad, Kandahar and Herat. The agency was helping Baloch Sardars in waging war against the federal government in places like Dera Bugti, Sui and Kohlu. Training camps established by Mari and Bugti warlords were being given large cache of weapons, which included Kalashnikovs, PRG-7s, land mines and hand grenades by RAW agents based in Afghanistan, they said. The cache were loaded on mules and transported to Naushki and later shifted to training camps in double cabin. They said that while the situation gradually returned to normal in Waziristan in NWFP, Baloch sardars started mounting attacks on gas pipelines and other installations in Sui, reports Online News.

When the federal government started a crackdown on the insurgency, the Indian government expressed concern over the grave situation, they said. The secular Baloch sardars had started joining hands with the religious Taliban and al-Qaeda and RAW agents operating from consulates in Afghanistan, they said.
Posted by: john || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [271 views] Top|| File under:


Case against minister who offered bounty for Danish cartoonist
Lucknow: A court in Uttar Pradesh will Thursday hear a case against state minister Haji Yaqoob Quereshi for offering a bounty of Rs.510 million to anyone who beheaded the cartoonist responsible for the caricatures of Prophet Mohammed. The case has been filed in the court of Additional Chief Judicial Magistrate Narendra Singh at Ghaziabad, 20 km from New Delhi, by advocate Ajay Veer Singh, who alleged the police had refused to take note of Quereshi's "unlawful" utterances.

Quereshi, the minister of state for Haj and minorities welfare, has said he will pay Rs.510 million to anyone who kills the Danish cartoonist. He has also claimed that women in Uttar Pradesh will donate gold jewellery equivalent to the weight of the assassin. In the court petition, Quereshi has been accused of making statements amounting to contract killing. Advocate Singh also expressed apprehension that Quereshi's remarks could incite violence and provoke people to commit murder.
Posted by: john || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [426 views] Top|| File under:

#1  could incite violence and provoke people to commit murder??
Posted by: Frank G || 02/22/2006 0:08 Comments || Top||

#2  I'm surprised that this has even been brought to court. Even if it's a whitewash, at least the authorities didn't give him a medal and a parade. My opinion of Pakland (at least the semi-civilized parts) has just gone up a few ticks.
Posted by: Monsieur Moonbat || 02/22/2006 0:25 Comments || Top||

#3  MM - I believe this is in India, not Pakland.
Posted by: PBMcL || 02/22/2006 0:46 Comments || Top||

#4  Possibly a second criminal case.. and pressure is building for his sacking....


Ghaziabad

A criminal case was filed in a local court here against UP Haj Minister Yaqoob Qureshi for his inflammatory and criminal speech where in he announced a reward of Rs 51 crore for anybody beaheading the Danish cartoonist who caricatured the Prophet. The case was filed in the court of Additional Chief Judicial Magistrate Narendra Singh on Monday. The hearing of the case will be held on February 24. Meanwhile, in Ludhiana, the Bahujan Samaj Party has demanded registration of a criminal case and sacking of the Minister for allegedly resorting to criminal and communal act.
Posted by: john || 02/22/2006 6:01 Comments || Top||

#5  good.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 7:55 Comments || Top||

#6  The case has been filed in the court of Additional Chief Judicial Magistrate Narendra Singh at Ghaziabad, 20 km from New Delhi, by advocate Ajay Veer Singh, who alleged the police had refused to take note of Quereshi's "unlawful" utterances.

Yep. India. Good work.
Posted by: Ptah || 02/22/2006 8:16 Comments || Top||

#7  is there a suprise meter that works?
Posted by: 2b || 02/22/2006 10:28 Comments || Top||

#8  It's in the shop. We thought it was broken, but it kept reading zero all the time.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 02/22/2006 12:20 Comments || Top||

#9  I had hoped India would show the courage to do this. For once, I am pleasantly surprised. Bravo for the sub-continent!
Posted by: Zenster || 02/22/2006 12:26 Comments || Top||

#10  Got a Sikh judge, too. Kiss it goodbye, pal.
Posted by: mojo || 02/22/2006 12:26 Comments || Top||

#11  the minister of state for Haj and minorities welfare

The next question the people of Uttar Pradesh need to ask themselves is why their state cabinet has a post of "Haj and Minority Welfare".

Minority welfare in India's most populous state?
UP and Bihar, the Indian "cow belt" hold the greatest number of people living in poverty, in perhaps the entire world.

He is not the minister for welfare, but the minister for minority (read muslim) welfare.

What abouts the tens of millions of poor hindus, poor christians etc?

He is also minister for Haj.

No other religious group in India has the state providing for their religious obligations.
The Hindu pilgrims who journey to the Anantnag cave in Kashmir, and Mount Kailash in Tibet, don't have a minister looking after them. Hell, they face bullets from the jihadis as they walk on foot on the trail to the cave. Many have died.

State support for Haj is also a violation of Sharia.
Muslims are supposed to pay for Haj from their own pocket, not state largesse.

Then the people of UP need to ask themselves why scum like this are in their cabinet.


Posted by: john || 02/22/2006 14:26 Comments || Top||

#12  Indeed.
Posted by: Seafarious || 02/22/2006 15:20 Comments || Top||

#13 
Redacted by moderator. Comments may be redacted for trolling, violation of standards of good manners, or plain stupidity. Please correct the condition that applies and try again. Contents may be viewed in the
sinktrap. Further violations may result in
banning.
Posted by: Hardliner || 02/22/2006 16:25 Comments || Top||

#14  Warning #1.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 16:27 Comments || Top||

#15 
"Then the people of UP need to ask themselves why scum like this are in their cabinet. "


They already know why. It is because Moslems are a "protected class" in India, much like certain ethnic minorities and special interest groups are here.

Posted by: Nuck Fozzle2168 || 02/22/2006 18:42 Comments || Top||

#16  Be aware that India is saddled with a Constitution that recognizes Sharia. Tens of millions of State funds go to sending carpet humpers to Mecca during the Hajj moronic conversion. Hindus tell me that it would be worth it if they stayed there.

Percentage of population of Hindus in Pakistan at Partition = 18% And now = 1%

Percentage of population of Muslims in India at Partition = 8% And now = 13%

One Muslim is too many.

Posted by: Hardliner || 02/22/2006 16:25 Comments || Top||

#17  Hardliner: I have taken the privilege of editing your post, only very slightly however. I think all we still be able to capture the essense of your insightful contribution. Best to you mate. Besoeker.


Be aware that India is saddled with a Constitution that recognizes Sharia. Tens of millions of State funds go to sending carpet humpers to Mecca during the Hajj moronic conversion. Hindus tell me that it would be worth it if they stayed there. Percentage of population of Hindus in Pakistan at Partition = 18% And now = 1% Percentage of population of Muslims in India at Partition = 8% And now = 13% One lotp is too many.
Posted by: Besoeker || 02/22/2006 17:23 Comments || Top||

#18  No nonsense from the Nuck! Hi-5 mate.
Posted by: Besoeker || 02/22/2006 18:46 Comments || Top||


International-UN-NGOs
Cartoon violence calming down?
Denmark said on Tuesday weeks of sometimes violent protests against Danish cartoons of the Prophet Mohammad appeared to be calming down, and world political and religious leaders appealed for tolerance.

But with a decrease in the number and intensity of protests in the past few days, Danish Prime Minister Anders Fog Rasmussen expressed hope that his country, where the cartoons where first published in September, had weathered the worst of the storm.

"It is my impression that the development during the last few days has gone in the direction of more subdued demonstrations and statements in large parts of the Muslim world," said Rasmussen.

But he said: "It's clear that in several countries … there is (still) a lot of turbulence and I want to warn against believing that the solution to these problems will be quick or easy."

Angry Muslims have set fire to the Danish embassies in Syria and Lebanon and violent protests have rocked cities from Morocco to Malaysia. Hundreds of Afghan students shouted support on Monday for Osama bin Laden and threatened to join al Qaeda.

The head of the world's largest Muslim grouping said on Tuesday violence would not help the Muslims' cause and denounced calls to kill the cartoonists who lampooned the Prophet Mohammad.

Last week, a Pakistani Muslim cleric and his followers offered rewards amounting to more than $1 million for anyone who killed the Danish cartoonists.

Ekmelettin Ihsanoglu, secretary-general of the 57-member Organization of Islamic Conference (OIC), condemned the caricatures as "blasphemous, ugly and uncivilized" but said any call to kill the cartoonists was against the teachings of Islam.

"You have no authority to kill anybody," he told a news conference after talks with Pakistani leaders.

"Nobody is entitled to do this in the name of Islam and who does it in the name of Islam is harming Islam … Violence weakens us. Violence works against us. Anything except violence is helpful," he said.

U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan is to address a meeting in Qatar this week in an effort to help end the violence.

"He hopes on that occasion to meet with a number of leaders from Europe and from the Islamic world and to discuss with them ways of calming the situation," said U.N. spokesman Stephane Dujarric.

While European leaders have expressed regret for the offence caused by the cartoons, most have refused to apologize on grounds that the press has the freedom to express itself providing it does not contravene the law.

But a Norwegian Muslim, Khalid Mohammah, said the editor of the Magazinet newspaper which reprinted the cartoons had broken the law and reported him to the police.

"There are limits for what expressions are acceptable, even in a democracy. This is a case for the police, it cannot be solved by the masses," Mohammah told the Aftenposten newspaper.

"We will have to see what happens as this law has not been used since 1933," Magazinet editor Verbjoern Selbekk told Reuters by telephone from Spain, where he was on holiday.

Paragraph 142 of Norway's criminal code states a person can be prosecuted if he or she "in word or action publicly insults or in a demeaning or hurtful way displays scorn for any religious belief that is permitted in the country."

Saudi Arabia suspended the Shams youth daily that carried the cartoons, journalists from the newspaper said on Tuesday.

"The paper is for the youth and its editors are young, so they didn't realize how dangerous this is," said Suleiman al-Bathi, Saudi spokesman for a U.S.-based lobby group, the International Committee for the Support of the Final Prophet.

Saudi preachers have kept the issue alive with angry sermons, but there have been no public protests, which are frowned upon by authorities in the conservative kingdom.

"In the Gulf region the reaction is still controlled," Bathi said.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 01:17 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [267 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Ekmelettin Ihsanoglu, secretary-general of the 57-member Organization of Islamic Conference (OIC), condemned the caricatures as "blasphemous, ugly and uncivilized" but said any call to kill the cartoonists was against the teachings of Islam.

"You have no authority to kill anybody," he told a news conference after talks with Pakistani leaders.

"Nobody is entitled to do this in the name of Islam and who does it in the name of Islam is harming Islam … Violence weakens us. Violence works against us. Anything except violence is helpful," he said.


"Ya gotta declare jihad first! THEN it's okay!"
Posted by: Ptah || 02/22/2006 8:17 Comments || Top||

#2  "Norway's criminal code states a person can be prosecuted if he or she "in word or action publicly insults or in a demeaning or hurtful way displays scorn for any religious belief that is permitted in the country."

It gets bit confusing, though, when a religion is in actuality a political entity with clear political aims, right? Interesting tactic that the Moslems are using. The cartoons did not denigrate religion at all--only politics, but by saying anything and everything Moslem is merely "religious" and therefore protected, the Moslems can get away with whatever they want.

Free speech and law are concepts the Moslems try to use, but don't understand. For them it's: "can't say this or that, and law is what we decide by force of arms."

They are so like stupid little monkeys (no offense to monkeys intended) attempting to imitate true culture.
Posted by: ex-lib || 02/22/2006 11:20 Comments || Top||

#3  After 70 plus deaths, you'd think so. But wait ... here comes the bikini riots
Posted by: Happy 88mm || 02/22/2006 14:14 Comments || Top||

#4  70 plus deaths and for what??? WHAT GOOD DID IT DO???? These protests are indicative of whats wrong with the muslim world right now.
Posted by: bgrebel || 02/22/2006 16:27 Comments || Top||

#5  What happened? Did they realize that their ACME-brand IEDs were too dangerous to use?
Posted by: Eric Jablow || 02/22/2006 21:07 Comments || Top||


Iraq
DEBKA: 97 Sunni mosques attacked in Iraq
salt to taste ... Debka ranges from having solid info to ... less than solid info
More than 97 Sunni mosques were attacked and a dozen or more Sunnis killed by vengeful Shiites across the country, as word spread of the destruction of the famous dome that capped the 1,200 Askariya shrine in Samarra, where the last of the Shiite imams, Mohammed al-Mahdi, known as the "hidden imam" and his son are buried. The shrine draws millions of pilgrims from around the Shiite world. Wednesday, Feb. 22, millions of outraged protesters marched and fought in all of Iraq's Shiite centers.

Some 500 soldiers were sent to Baghdad's Sunni neighborhoods in an unsuccessful effort to prevent Shiite-Sunni clashes. In Basra, Shiite protesters traded rifle and rocket-propelled grenade fire with Sunni Iraqi Islamic Party guards, then set fire to a Sunni shrine. Police found 11 bodies of Sunni Muslims shot dead in the southern city.

Senior Shiite cleric, Ayatollah Ali Sistani, earlier ordered 7 days of mourning. But the appeal to his flock to refrain from retribution against Sunnis went unheeded.

DEBKAfile's sources: The bombing was carried out by a small squad trained by Abu Musab al Zarqawi especially for the operation. Four-to-six men entered the Askariya mosque Tuesday night and placed explosive charges around the interior of the gold dome so as to bring it crashing down on the sacred tombs below.

Samarra police have made 10 arrests, among them foreigners, as would be typical of al Qaeda.

Iraqi leaders and US officials realize that, unless the furious Shiite-Sunni clashes which erupted Wednesday are quelled, Iraq will quickly descend into sectarian warfare with US forces stranded between the warring camps. This eruption will sunder the country into three warring entities – Shiite, Sunni and Kurdish. The current effort by their politicians to form a national unity government will be relegated to the past.

Such a conflict will resonate across the region. Shortly after the disaster in Samarra, Iran's spiritual leader ayatollah Ali Khamenei in Tehran, in contrast to the US president's effort to calm the flames, accused "US forces and Israeli intelligence" of responsibility.

The Islamic republic is quite willing to exploit the destruction of a Shiite shrine to fuel the fire of sectarian conflict, in the hope of expediting the US forces' exit from Iraq. The thousands of Iranian agents operating clandestinely in Iraq can be expected to aggravate civil strife in Iraq by agitation and leading attacks on Sunnis.

Iranian leaders are proving once again how willing they are to sacrifice fellow-Shiites to terror for the sake of the strategic interests which they share with al Qaeda.

Some Shiite leaders blamed the United States for not protecting their shrine and are demanding a bigger security role for religious militias. But voices were also raised in an attempt to pull the country back from the brink: US ambassador Zalmay Khalilzad warned the bombings were a deliberate provocation to foment sectarian tension and civil war. Key Sunni groups condemned the destruction of the Shiite mosque's dome. The Sunni clerical association of Muslim Scholars called the bombing a criminal act.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 20:32 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [269 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Good, now sneak them some nukes (get our guys out first of course) and let them go at it.
Posted by: Ebbump Cheaper3760 || 02/22/2006 22:24 Comments || Top||

#2  What is it with the fascination with nukes?
Posted by: djohn66 || 02/22/2006 22:57 Comments || Top||

#3  Heh, d66!
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 22:58 Comments || Top||


Gunmen strike 27 Baghdad mosques, kill 3 Sunni imams
Gunmen targeted 27 Baghdad mosques and killed three Sunni imams Wednesday in the wake of a bomb attack at one of the holiest Shiite sites.

The wave of attacks followed an early morning bombing at the Al-Askariya "Golden Mosque" in Samarra. The strikes, involving small arms, rocket-propelled grenades and mortar rounds, all happened between 11 a.m. and 5 p.m., police said.

A CNN crew was also caught up in the violence, and in Basra, southern Iraq, a local official said jail inmates were abducted.

Twelve inmates were snatched from the main prison in Basra by gunmen carrying Iraqi government identification cards, a member of the Basra provisional council said. Around midnight, 10 bodies were found and taken to a hospital where officials were trying to determine if they were among the prisoners, who were of Egyptian, Tunisians, Libyan, Turkish, Saudi Arabian and Iraqi descent.

Also, at least three members of a CNN crew, all Iraqis, were beaten and briefly kidnapped Wednesday afternoon while shooting video at a roadblock on the outskirts of Sadr City, Baghdad, where a mob was protesting the bombing of the Shiite mosque.

The journalists were separated and roughly interrogated before being released. They then returned to the Baghdad bureau, where they were treated for their injuries.

Three of the mosques attacked in Baghdad were burned down, and in addition to the imams, three guards also were killed. One imam was kidnapped.

Security was beefed up around all mosques in Baghdad, police said, and Iraqi security forces across the country were placed on high alert. Officers on vacation or leave have been told to report for duty, police said.

The Iraqi Islamic Party, the largest Sunni party in Iraq, condemned all the violence and said Shiites had taken over Sunni mosques in the southern town of Diwaniya and arrested worshippers. Meanwhile, gunmen stormed the party's southern Baghdad office, evacuated its employees and torched the building.

The largely Sunni insurgency has periodically targeted Shiite Arabs. Over the past year, Sunnis have accused the Shiite-led government of targeting them in raids.

Iraqi and U.S. leaders urged people to remain calm and united amid fears the sectarian violence could escalate into civil war, but a U.S. State Department spokesman said he believes the threat of civil war is overstated.

"There are forces seeking to prevent democracy and obstruct the peaceful political and economic development of Iraq," Adam Ereli said Wednesday at a news conference. "They seek to achieve their goals in a number of ways. But, as I said before, promoting sectarian violence is one of them. There's nothing new here."

Meanwhile, the top half of the golden dome that once towered above the Al-Askariya Mosque collapsed in the blast. Minarets flanking the dome remained standing amid mounds of debris. (Watch how the blast is intensifying tension -- 1:51)

The Samarra attack happened at 7 a.m., when gunmen dressed as Iraqi police commandos bombed the site, which has deep historical significance in Shiite Islam.

Shiites believe Imam al-Mehdi, the 12th and final awaited imam, will reappear at the Al-Askariya Mosque to bring them salvation.

Al-Mehdi is the son of Imam Hassan al-Askari, the 11th imam, who is buried in the shrine. His grandfather, the 10th imam, is also buried there.

Al-Mehdi is said to have disappeared in the eighth century during the funeral of his father and is believed by Shiites to have been withdrawn by God from the eyes of the people, until his return.

Salaheddin province, where the shrine is located, is home to a large Sunni population.

Residents of Baghdad said members of a militia loyal to Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr were going door-to-door asking heads of household to swear they had nothing to do with the Samarra attack. Samarra is 70 miles (113 kilometers) north of Baghdad.

There were no immediate reports of injuries in the bombing, and 10 people -- all dressed as Iraqi police commandos -- have been arrested, according to Iraqi National Security Adviser Mowaffaq al-Rubaie.

Foreign fighters were likely responsible, and the attack bore the hallmarks of al Qaeda in Iraq, al-Rubaie said. "They are really testing the patience of the Iraqi people," he said, calling on Muslims around the world to condemn "this act of terrorism."

The attack occurred as Kurdish, Shiite and Sunni leaders are working to form a national unity government. Both Iraqi Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari, a Shiite, and President Jalal Talabani, a Kurd, said the attack was an effort to incite sectarian violence.

In a taped address on Iraqiya TV, al-Jaafari called on all Iraqi political parties to condemn the mosque attack and asked Sunni and Shiite Iraqis to demonstrate in Samarra. Al-Jaafari also declared a three-day period of mourning and ordered the ministries of Defense and of Housing and Reconstruction to assess damage and begin rebuilding the shrine.

Talabani condemned the "horrendous crime," saying, "The perpetrators' aim is to start a civil war between Iraqis."

Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani, Iraq's most powerful Shiite cleric, called for a week of mourning and is expected to call for businesses to close in protest for three days, a spokesman said.

President Bush condemned the "brutal bombing of the Golden Mosque," promising help to rebuild it and asking Iraqis to exercise restraint.

"The terrorists in Iraq have again proven that they are enemies of all faiths and of all humanity," he said in a statement. "This senseless crime is an affront to people of faith throughout the world."

Peaceful protests, not violence, urged
Demonstrations against the bombing of the Al-Askariya Mosque were held across the country.

Following noon prayers, 4,000 demonstrators in Baghdad walked from al-Sadr's office toward a nearby mosque, a spokesman for his office said. By the time the march ended, the number of people had swelled to 10,000, the spokesperson said. It was one of several protests in Baghdad neighborhoods, according to Iraqi Emergency Police.

Al-Sadr cut short a visit to Lebanon and was returning to Iraq, where he was planning to make a televised statement. A senior spokesman for al-Sadr's movement urged "calm and patience" and said maintaining national unity is Iraq's priority.

In Samarra, several hundred people gathered at the mosque and at the mayor's office, denouncing the Iraqi government and the U.S. military, authorities said. Thousands of protesters also took to the streets in Najaf, Kut and Karbala, police said.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 18:41 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [271 views] Top|| File under:

#1  stepping up the violence to take the heat off Syria and Iran. I'd send a couple JDAMs to each as a reply
Posted by: Frank G || 02/22/2006 20:32 Comments || Top||


U.S. Says Will Help Rebuild Bombed Shrine
BAGHDAD, Iraq - Top U.S. officials strongly condemned the bombing of a revered Shiite shrine Wednesday, calling it a desperate and despicable act designed to foment sectarian strife.

"Given the historic, cultural and religious importance of this shrine, this attack is a crime against humanity," the U.S. ambassador and the commander of U.S. forces in Iraq said in a joint statement. "The Shrine should be rebuilt and the United States will contribute to its reconstruction."

Is it just me thinking that we DON'T want to get involved in this? I understand and agree with the sentiment, but this strikes me as something that could very easily be misunderstood as an admission of guilt.
Posted by: Chinter Flarong9283 || 02/22/2006 13:21 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [620 views] Top|| File under:

#1  As disinclined as I am to lend any assistance whatsoever to these terrorist wingnuts, if America can pull off this sort of gesture of respect for a prized Iraqi shrine, it may well be a good thing.
Posted by: Zenster || 02/22/2006 13:48 Comments || Top||

#2  Infidel $$....redeemable with a free radio
Posted by: Captain America || 02/22/2006 13:58 Comments || Top||

#3  We'll get involved just as soon as the Arabs help rebuild the WTC ... and don't throw that Bin Alaweed's snarky initial contribution that Rudy told me to shove up his orifice.
Posted by: Happy 88mm || 02/22/2006 14:08 Comments || Top||

#4  Opps ...

and don't throw that Bin Alaweed's snarky initial contribution that Rudy told *he* (i.e., The Prince) to shove up his orifice.
Posted by: Happy 88mm || 02/22/2006 14:10 Comments || Top||

#5  It's not going to be seen as an admission of guilt--the majority of the Shi'a in Iraq are friendlies, and they've overall done a pretty damned good job of standing with us. They, and everyone else on the ground there, know that the bombing was perpetrated by the Sunni "insurgency."

This is just one of those things that you do for your friends.
Posted by: Mike || 02/22/2006 14:12 Comments || Top||

#6  F*ck that. Build yer own goddam mosques. Or take up a collection. If Americans want to donate voluntarily, that's fine But don't assume I want to join in.
Posted by: BH || 02/22/2006 14:16 Comments || Top||

#7  I guess Mosque insurance isnt big in Irag
Posted by: sundown || 02/22/2006 14:36 Comments || Top||

#8  No way we should be involved in promoting any sect or religion regardless of the facts on the ground.
Posted by: Sock Puppet O' Doom || 02/22/2006 14:36 Comments || Top||

#9  Anyone going to hold their breath waiting for the ACLU to sue to prevent this obvious voilation of the separation of church and state?

Thought not....
Posted by: CrazyFool || 02/22/2006 14:55 Comments || Top||

#10  We should rebuild the Dome and make it even bigger and grander - to rival the Dome of the Rock. Al-Q is up to its old tricks and we need to turn the mindf*ck back around on them. Make this Dome the Shia holy of holies, with marble walkways, its own power plant, AC, water and sewer treatment plants, the whole nine yards. Include some Western standard hotels in the area for all the pilgrims. You want to defeat the ideology, make the alternative much more attractive. Make the Shias think, "The Sunnis broke it, but the Americans rebuilt it even better". Since we are in a nation-building phase, it only makes sense to get the 60% majority of the population fully on our side. Also, a little disinformation about Tater Tot helping Al-Q damage the Shrine due to his fight with Sistani wouldn't hurt at all. Tater Tot might get whacked by his brethren over this, and he has enough enemies in the Shia hierarchy to push the black propaganda Iraq-wide.
Posted by: Shieldwolf || 02/22/2006 15:27 Comments || Top||

#11  I like how you think, Shieldwolf.

Turbans would be in a knot over in Qom.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 15:28 Comments || Top||

#12  I guess Mosque insurance isnt big in Irag
All insurance policies in Iraq have the usual Act 'O Allan Clause and since all acts are somehow allen related insurance there is pretty much a scam. Money is collected in other ways, insallah
Posted by: 6 || 02/22/2006 15:31 Comments || Top||

#13  'Wolf, I like the cut of your jib!

The Tater Tot disinformation might not even be disinformation at that.
Posted by: Mike || 02/22/2006 15:32 Comments || Top||

#14  maybe the US contribution can be the hidden microphones and cameras
Posted by: mhw || 02/22/2006 15:36 Comments || Top||

#15  Heh. Combining Wolf's excellent idea with mhw's devilishly pragmatic suggestion would be awesome. I'd donate a buck to the idea, lol.

I'm not gonna play poker with either of 'em, though, lol.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 15:39 Comments || Top||

#16  I think it's a splendid idea, and if we could pay for the entire thing to be rebuilt, it would be money well spent. Why? Because it would drive the wingnuts absolutely bonkers.

In over a thousand years of history, nothing would come close to the utter humiliation the fanatics would feel if infidels helped to rebuild one of their prize mosques. It wouldn't matter if they were Sunni or Shiite, it would be a mindf*ck like no other.

There would be seething worse than if we set up a free ham sandwitch for pilgrims stand in Mecca.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 02/22/2006 16:02 Comments || Top||

#17  Lol, Moose - so true, heh.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 16:23 Comments || Top||

#18  If the federal government proposed to rebuild a church [burned, destroyed, etc] how long before the ACLU would have an injunction?
Posted by: Hupuque Angulet4210 || 02/22/2006 17:46 Comments || Top||

#19   I think its a splendid idea, and if we could pay for the entire thing to be rebuilt, it would be money well spent. Why? Because it would drive the wingnuts absolutely bonkers.


This was my approach as well, moose. Bonkered out wingnuts are a personal favorite. This is a, literally, golden opportunity to neutralize all this war on Muslims crap and show that we will help those who want peace. Now, it's the Shiites turn to uphold their end and not go rampaging off into the ozone.

Shieldwolf's angle works real well for me too. Sorta Disney-fy the whole d@mn thing into Prayland by the Beach.
Posted by: Zenster || 02/22/2006 20:22 Comments || Top||

#20  "HEARTS and MINDS"

oh wait..they have neither!
Posted by: Gleanter Gravith9762 || 02/22/2006 20:27 Comments || Top||

#21 
Instead of replacing the Shiite mosque, I propose that we destroy a Suni mosque of their choosing.
Posted by: Master of Obvious || 02/22/2006 21:08 Comments || Top||

#22  Lol, MoO!

I swear, there are some horrifically devious people hereabouts, lol. I am in awe, lol!
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 21:16 Comments || Top||

#23  preferably one in Syria or Saudi
Posted by: Frank G || 02/22/2006 21:29 Comments || Top||

#24  Update from Omar at the "Iraq the Model" blog:

-President Talabani promises to make rebuilding the shrine his personal responsibility and to donate the required money from his own.

-Head of the Sunni endowment sheikh Ahmed al-Samarra'I announces that he will allocate 2 billion dinars (~1.4 million $) for the rebuilding of the shrine from the treasury of the Sunni endowment.
Posted by: Mike || 02/22/2006 23:36 Comments || Top||

#25  I'm sure the Governor of Alabama and a number of good Baptists will be delighted to see this venue.
Posted by: Besoeker TROLL || 02/22/2006 21:11 Comments || Top||


8 Sunni mosques attacked after Shiite shrine bombing
Groups of armed men attacked eight Sunni Muslim mosques in Baghdad on Wednesday as sectarian tension ran high between Shiite and Sunni Muslims after the bombing of a holy Shiite shrine in Samarra, an Interior Ministry source told Xinhua.

"Gunmen attacked the Hamza Sunni mosque in the Ghazaliyah district in western Baghdad before noon, setting the building ablaze," The source said on condition of anonymity.

Another mosque in the al-Elam district in southern Baghdad was also attacked by groups of angry armed men, who attacked six other Sunni mosques in different parts of the capital, causing damage,the source said.

The attacks caused no casualties as the mosques were empty at the time, he added.

Tens of thousands of the Shiites took to the streets in Baghdad,Samarra, Najaf and Karbala and other Iraqi cities, waving greenflags and Iraq's national flag and vowing to avenge those responsible for the attack at one of the most celebrated Shiite shrine.

U.S. and Iraqi forces cordoned off Samarra city, some 120 km north of Baghdad, preventing people from entering or leaving the troubled city.

Angry protestors rocked local police, accusing them of collaboration with the attackers on the shrine, a source from Salahudin provincial police said.

Iraqi security forces were urgently deployed near mosques and districts shared by Shiite and Sunni Muslims to prevent conflicts between the two sects, the Interior Ministry source said.

Earlier Wednesday, the holy shrine of Ali al-Hadi in Samarra was attacked with its golden dome badly damaged.

The shrine of Ali al-Hadi, or the al-Hadhrah al-Askariyah,contains two tombs of Ali al-Hadi, who died in 868 A.D., and hisson Hassan al-Askari who died in 874 A.D.. The two are the 10th and 11th of the Shiite's twelve most revered Imams. Shiite pilgrims visited the shrine from all over the world.
Posted by: tipper || 02/22/2006 08:59 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [447 views] Top|| File under:

#1  There is only one solution to the ongoing civil war between the Sunnis and the Shiites in Iraq...
Posted by: Sonia Belle || 02/22/2006 9:28 Comments || Top||

#2  I'm in luuuuuve
But:
I did but see her passing bye, and I shall love her till I die.
Or something like that.
And yes I agree with your argument.
Posted by: tipper || 02/22/2006 9:34 Comments || Top||

#3  wow! Brilliant marketing.

It is a rare woman indeed who both walks naked, writes poetry, is an expert in the details in the war on terror - and looks like that. Far be it from me to spoil the fantasy, you go girl! (that is if you really are one :-) The downside is that it could become a bit of a liability as the war drags on. I'd develop a second character as well.

So far, a good site, so one really can go just for the articles ......
Posted by: 2b || 02/22/2006 9:47 Comments || Top||

#4  Get the popcorn ready, break out the soda or beer and enjoy the show ...

ummm ... errr ..... huh ... I'm referring to the upcoming Mosque vs. Mosque Show in Iraq, not the Sonia Belle site. You pervs, whadduya thinking? This is a family show!
Posted by: Happy 88mm || 02/22/2006 12:00 Comments || Top||

#5  Sonia Wow your husband is really really lucky.

But on these bombings it has Irans fingerprints all over it. Zark in the East now Davila area being backed by Iran, Iran on the ropes speeding to clash with the west even the EU/UN sees it this time. The cartoon riots didn’t quiet pan out so plan B.

Zark hits Shia mosque then Sadr running around blaming the US calling for sectarian war (on the US and Gov thou). This is a win win for Iran lessens the Iraqi Shia religious clout, radicalizes them, puts Sadr up as credible, pulls the US into defense and mediator between the Shia & Sunni.

I think right now we should have SOF moving to take Sadr out preferable with a bomb (that way we can blame it on Zark). Sadr is an Iranian pawn and can whip up a lot of trouble. Take him down now blame it on Zark and it will be easier to calm things back down without the Sadr’s firebrand.

This is going to be real interesting in the next couple of weeks. This could turn into 04’ again real quick. Very dangerous
Posted by: C-Low || 02/22/2006 12:11 Comments || Top||

#6  Yup, A-Q playing mind games would be my bet. Keep a close eye on Tater-tot, he'll be in this up to his fat neck.

Posted by: mojo || 02/22/2006 12:21 Comments || Top||

#7  Can we draw cartoons of the mosque bombings, or is that politically incorrect?
Posted by: plainslow || 02/22/2006 12:35 Comments || Top||

#8  PL,

No, but I think it's safe to make a cartoon of the photo of the video of the mosque bombing.

If a mob shows up and burns down your house, please accept my apology in advance.
Posted by: Dreadnought || 02/22/2006 13:21 Comments || Top||

#9  Angry protestors rocked local police, accusing them of collaboration with the attackers on the shrine, a source from Salahudin provincial police said.

Wouldn't suprise me in the least. The damage from photos seem to indicate a good amount of explosives. It takes time and info to set something like this up.
Posted by: Charles || 02/22/2006 14:19 Comments || Top||

#10  I agree w/ Sonia. Iraq should be split up. The Kurds definately deserve it, the Shia sorta deserve it and the Sunni should get the leftovers. The think that does concern me though about that is what would the Shia do? Would they be tempted to be annexed by Iran? Also, what would Turkey do if Kurdistan was created? All big questions but I really think these people are too tribal to be forced together.
Posted by: Yosemite Sam || 02/22/2006 14:51 Comments || Top||

#11  I agree, YS. The Kurds have done so much more with their lot in life - since way back in the No Fly Zones era and right on through the war - that they've completely won me over.

I do not pretend to know what to do with the Arabs. That they can't seem to move forward is beyond disheartening. As I said the other day, the US had to try, had to give them a shot at liberal democracy. That they are still playing sectarian games, no change since Day One of the Shi'a sect's birth, is a huge disappointment. But they, not the US, are about to fail - by flushing the golden opportunity of a lifetime - rather many lifetimes - handed to them on a silver platter. Wow, what many people on the planet would give for such an opportunity... or so I presume. Perhaps that's a foolish statement, hard to tell. I do know enough about Arabs not to be surprised, however... just disappointed by Sistani & Co and the Sunni Sheikhs. A bridge too far.

The Kurds, on the other hand, have made the most of it. Bravo!
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 15:47 Comments || Top||

#12  Could be indeed that the experiment in Iraq will fail. Doesn't look all shiny and golden success at the moment - although I rather suspect that the violence is directly correlated to progress towards a directly elected government.

so yeah, we may see Iraq splinter.

Not an outcome I'm sanguine about, though, for several reasons. As I mentioned a day or two ago, I think that would immediately result in Iran controlling (de facto at first) southern Iraq, and thereby menacing the smaller Gulf states more directly. I also think it would lead to more, not less, violence because the Sunni are NOT going to let go of Kirkuk and Mosul without a fight.

And landlocked Kurdistan will draw the opposition of the Turks, the Iranians and Syria. That oil has to get out to the ports if it is to finance all the progress the Kurds have made and can make.

I sure hope we don't see partitioning, because I think it will lead to much bigger problems in the area.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 15:59 Comments || Top||

#13  Lol, lotp. Well, since you've reiterated your thoughts, I'll do the same...

I think Iranian influence in the South becomes moot if we act against them. I do not believe we would simply go after the nuke sites - and leave the MM regime intact to try again. That would be demonstrably stupid, IMHO. So I see their influence waning dramatically in Iraq. Especially if phil_b's observations are accurate and Iraq may disintegrate as an entity. That wouldn't bother me much, lol.

I also expect to see Syria collapse with a short time frame - or pulling a Libya if pencilneck can survive the fallout and has his Daddy's survival sense.

Regards Kirkuk and Mosul... IIRC, Kirkuk was definitely a Kurdish city - pre purge. Not sure about Mosul - do you know?

Regards Turkey and Kurdistan... They keys are wiping out the PKK and preventing a nice chunk of Turkey from trying to join, no? If the Iraqi Kurds helped in the first effort - and absorbed those Kurds from Turkey that want to go there, doesn;t Turkey have a much easier time swallowing Kurdistan? And add in that the Northern pipeline benefits them... that should help, too.

I think a Syrian collapse might open up a path to the Med, lol, but then I still have a little dreamer deep inside...

There sure will be a lot of changes over the next decade. I doubt we could anticipate all of them, but it's interesting to work through what we can see...

Peace. ;-)
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 16:17 Comments || Top||

#14  .com, I agree but I suspect it could happen very quickly. Pencilneck falls when Iran gets put in its place. The Kurds get told to end the PKK nonsense in exchange for a route to the sea via northern Syria. The Turks are left in a position to close it off if the PKK renege on the deal.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 02/22/2006 16:45 Comments || Top||

#15  Fingers crossed here, NS...
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 16:50 Comments || Top||

#16  The Turks have shown a lack of good sense in regards to the Kurds and Iraq. Iran will not sit by either nor will AQ. We would have to stay in "Kurdistan" for a long time into the future.
Posted by: Sock Puppet O' Doom || 02/22/2006 22:46 Comments || Top||

#17  Amen, SPo'D. I think the Kurds would be happy to host us, too, lol.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 22:50 Comments || Top||


Anger over Samarra bombing now fanning out to rest of Iraq
Bombs wrecked the dome of a major Shi'ite shrine in the Iraqi city of Samarra on Wednesday in an apparent sectarian attack that sparked demonstrations and calls for revenge by angry crowds.

The country's top Shi'ite cleric, Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani, called for protests against the attack, and Prime Minister Ibrahim al-Jaafari, a Shi'ite Islamist, went live on television to declare three days of mourning.

Jaafari, under pressure from the United States to bring Sunni minority leaders into a coalition government to avert a sectarian civil war, called for unity, describing the blasts as an attack on all Muslims.

But protesters gathering in the Shi'ite holy city of Najaf vowed revenge for the attack, and National Security Adviser Mowaffaq al-Rubaie, a Shi'ite, blamed the blast on Arab Sunni militants inspired by al Qaeda.

Local officials said there were no reports of casualties after gunmen entered the Golden Mosque at dawn and set off charges that destroyed the celebrated dome of one of the four holiest Shi'ite sites in Iraq. The shrine is dedicated to the Imam Ali al-Hadi and his son Hassan al-Askari.

Witnesses in the town and television footage showed the top of the dome blown off and shattered masonry framed by two slender minarets. A U.S. military spokeswoman described the damage to the roof as "catastrophic".

Samarra, 100 km (60 miles) north of Baghdad, has been a seat of the Sunni Arab insurgency against a U.S.-backed government dominated by Shi'ite parties. Few Shi'ites live in the Sunni city.

Sectarian tensions are already running high in Iraq as Jaafari tries to form a unity government following Shi'ite Islamist successes in a parliamentary election in December.

Rubaie blamed Arab Sunni militants inspired by al Qaeda for the explosion, but appealed for calm: "They will fail to draw the Iraqi people into civil war as they have failed in the past," he told the Al Arabiya Arabic television channel.

He was later quoted by state television Iraqiya as saying 10 suspects had been arrested in Samarra. Police in the city said officers fired over the heads of hundreds of demonstrators who took to the streets after the explosion.

The Sunni Endowment, which oversees religious activity for Sunni Muslims in Iraq, condemned the attack and called for calm. It demanded that the perpetrators be punished.

In the holy city of Najaf, Sistani's office issued a statement in which he declared seven days of mourning and urged his followers to protest against the attack.

The aged Sistani has been credited by many Shi'ite political leaders with restraining the religious majority, long oppressed under Saddam Hussein, from responding with violence to repeated attacks that have killed thousands of civilians.

But about 2,000 Shi'ites who began demonstrating in the southern city of Najaf, the holiest site for Shi'ite Muslims, were thirsting for revenge. "Rise up Shi'ites. Shi'ites take revenge. Rise up Shi'ites. Rise up Shi'ites," they shouted.

Abdullah al-Jubaara, the deputy governor of Salahaddin province which includes Samarra, told Reuters gunmen entered the shrine at dawn, planted bombs and then blew it up.

"We demand that the Iraqi government takes the most extreme measures against these terrorists. Forgiving these people would be totally rejected," Salah al-Haidari, head of Shi'ite endowments in charge of Shi'ite mosques and shrines, told Iraqi television.

About 1,000 protesters took to the streets in the mostly Shi'ite town of Kut, southeast of Baghdad, and protesters began to gather in Iraq's second city of Basra.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 06:11 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [460 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Blowback in 3,2,1.
Posted by: phil_b || 02/22/2006 6:39 Comments || Top||

#2 
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1583299/posts

AP: At least 5 Sunni Mosques under attack in Baghdad in retaliation to Shia shrine blast.
Posted by: doc || 02/22/2006 6:48 Comments || Top||

#3  Go go Shia! Go go Sunni!
Posted by: gromgoru || 02/22/2006 7:04 Comments || Top||

#4  "It's a pity they can't both lose".
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 02/22/2006 7:17 Comments || Top||

#5  anonymous5089 "It's a pity they can't both lose".
We'll help
Posted by: gromgoru || 02/22/2006 7:46 Comments || Top||

#6  Did it before between Iran and Iraq. Not that hard to do.

Part of the insurgency is due to interference by neighboring Arab Sunni nations who insist that Shiiaism is not Islam. The turnaround in which Iraq went from minority Sunni hands to majority Shia control was an earthquake to the region. Shia are treated as Kuffir at best, heretics and apostates at worst. The reference to the US being Crusaders is an inadvertent admission that the Crusades were a war of liberation for the Christians living in Palestine.

The next front should be Darfur.
Posted by: Ptah || 02/22/2006 8:23 Comments || Top||

#7  A few cartoons and the protests all over the world, for weeks were all over the news. Let's see if when one of thier own desicrate a Holy place, the rest of the Muslim world is as upset. Or if they are as two faced as Bin Laden who sends people off to die for glory but he considers death to "be bitter" for him.
Posted by: plainslow || 02/22/2006 8:43 Comments || Top||

#8  Isn't this part of the Zman's fall back plan, if he can't win, then to institute a civil war between the factions?
Posted by: Flaigum Thoque6606 || 02/22/2006 9:24 Comments || Top||

#9  Dome meets Doom. Sign of the times. Holely Communion follows among brothers. Not getting to be so unusual.
Posted by: Duh! || 02/22/2006 9:39 Comments || Top||

#10  hey guys, i know y'all love popcorn and all, but like weve still got over 130000 US troops on the ground in Iraq. And a fair amount of prestige invested in getting at least a halfway decent outcome. If you think massacres and counter massacres in Iraq are in the US interest, youre losing it.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 02/22/2006 9:55 Comments || Top||

#11  "The reference to the US being Crusaders is an inadvertent admission that the Crusades were a war of liberation for the Christians living in Palestine. "

"Over the course of that afternoon, evening and next morning, the crusaders murdered almost every inhabitant of Jerusalem. Muslims, Jews, and even eastern Christians were all massacred. "


Posted by: liberalhawk || 02/22/2006 9:57 Comments || Top||

#12  If Zman gets his civil war, he wins: the western world has staked its reputatation on its plan impose order and bring peace. LH is right. I'll skip the popcorn, thanks.
Posted by: mom || 02/22/2006 10:06 Comments || Top||

#13  I agree with LH and find the support for a civil war on this forum incompatible with the gloating and schadenfreude that is everpresent at the inability of the Left to mount a position on our war in terror (a reaction I find entirely justifiable, and engage in myself, regularly). If we celebrate a violent failure in Iraq, we are no better than our portrayal at the hands of the liberals, and the perception of Americans in the Arab world.
Posted by: mjh || 02/22/2006 10:15 Comments || Top||

#14  The Crusades WERE meant for the protection of oppressed Christians in the Holy Land. Unfortunately, the leaders of the Crusades were not particularly competent or godly themselves.

Pope Urban II was trying simultaneously to deal with political hassles with kings, clean out some of the corruption in the church, mend fences with the Eastern Orthodox church, and protect Christians in the Holy land. Part of the reason he called for the Crusades was to get the bickering politicians and violent nobility to focus on a real need--protection for Christians--and to get them to quit fighting among themselves. Didn't work.
Posted by: mom || 02/22/2006 10:17 Comments || Top||

#15  Appreciate what LH said, but I think people are getting sick of Moslems who just want to fight, fight, fight. I read that in many demonstrations over the mosque, they're carrying and burning US and Israeli flags and chanting anti-US slogans. One has to wonder what would happen if our troops left. They don't seem to be able to understand anything regarding political complexities/actualities.

One good sign, though, is that the leaders of both sects are calling for calm and order, and are placing blame against the men who want to cause a civil war in Iraq by stirring up strife by actions such as this one.
Posted by: ex-lib || 02/22/2006 11:04 Comments || Top||

#16 
""Over the course of that afternoon, evening and next morning, the crusaders murdered almost every inhabitant of Jerusalem. Muslims, Jews, and even eastern Christians were all massacred. ""

Sound military doctrine when you cannot tell friend from foe. Kill them all and let their respective g-ds sort them out.

This does NOT mean that I support the doctrine, but I understand it. And, I think a time will come when Western civilization will be forced out of survival, to do the same thing.

Posted by: Nuck Fozzle2168 || 02/22/2006 11:38 Comments || Top||

#17  I need a shower after reading Nozzle.
Posted by: 2b || 02/22/2006 11:44 Comments || Top||

#18  "Over the course of that afternoon, evening and next morning, the crusaders murdered almost every inhabitant of Jerusalem. Muslims, Jews, and even eastern Christians were all massacred. "

Let' have a refresher course on about medieval war. It went like this: taking a city by storm was very costly so teh tacit rule followed by everyone was to dissuade them from resisting. The usual thing was:

1) City didn't resist. Peaceful occupation. Eg Jerusalem in first Muslim invasion.

2) City resisted but ended capitulating to starvation. Then you could expect such things the entire city being deported (eg Harfleur during Hundred Years War) or city notabilities being sentenced to death (Calais same war)

3) City was taken by storm and then it was massacre. BTW when Muslims took Caesarea they exterminated the population and danced in teh streets wearing teh guts of their victims. Oh and a couple years before the Crusaders taking Jerusalem teh Egyptians took it and exterminated the entire Turkish (ie Muslim ) garrison.
Posted by: JFM || 02/22/2006 12:07 Comments || Top||

#19  The good old days.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 02/22/2006 12:14 Comments || Top||

#20  Indeed it will get ugly before it's settled - they insist upon it. There you have two salient facts - war is ugly shit that, historically, has ended in ugly acts --and-- we will not be given the choice.

I am hopeful that technology will continue to reduce the ugly side by making the actives die via remote control without killing the passives. We are not (yet) at the point where taking the passives out before they become actives is palatable. I predict that will change - because we will learn that the difference is something on the order of which side of the bed they happended to get up from on any given day. I would love to be wrong. Honest. I fear I am not.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 12:15 Comments || Top||

#21  Anyone remember mullah Omar saying how the destruction of those mountain Buddhas in Afghanistan was just Islamists, "breaking stones"?

All we have is more Sunni Wahabbists "breaking stones." The Shiias need to realize this callous attitude by the Wahabbists is wrong. If all of this escalates, who knows? Maybe one day, some party or another will be forced to drop by Mecca and "break" that big black "stone" of theirs.

A huge line is forming to break Islam's balls stones. I wonder when they'll catch on to the danger they're in.
Posted by: Zenster || 02/22/2006 12:16 Comments || Top||

#22  I am dismayed at your reactions, but not surprised. Do you not realize these are human beings as well?

They have held back for such a long time, and the Sunni people, mostly, have come forward to join the political pursuit.

al Qaeda wants a civil war to prove democracy will never work in the ME. I disagree firmly. Iran and Syria are both culpable in this. Now Iran has declared they are even going to take over the PA! Please think more clearly. We need all the allies in the ME we may have!

Do you not agree with our Military men and women? This is whom I will listen to, not the dinosaur news.

This is a very sad day but just like here, the creeps will try to take advantage of it by fanning the flames of anger and fear.

Please do not join them. Your moment of satisfaction is not worth the long term disaster. Thank you.
Posted by: Rosemary || 02/22/2006 12:17 Comments || Top||

#23  Hulugai Khan at Damascus. No survivors.
Posted by: mojo || 02/22/2006 12:36 Comments || Top||

#24  JFM

i dont disagree with you on the general qualities of medieval war. I was taking issue with Ptah, claiming that the Crusades WERE "a war of liberation for the Christians living in Palestine." Thats an anachronism. They were an attempt to carve out feudal kingdoms, gain adventure, save holy sites, and get plenary indulgences. They were NOT about liberating anyone. There simply were no wars for "liberation" prior to 1775. Its a reading of modern political concepts into medieval events.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 02/22/2006 12:54 Comments || Top||

#25  The title is misleading. Al-Anbar has been relatively quiet. Most of the duress is in Baghdad and down south in Najaf & Basra (2,000 protestors?). Habbaniya which is where I'm next to was also fairly quiet today. That's not to say the natives might not get restless over the next couple days. Our relationships w/the locals here are actually quite good. Where were the American flag burnings at? Sounds like a Tater photo op.

All in all this smells like an Al Q op to me. As a parent I feel terrible when I see children get hurt. However, my sympathy meter for most of the rest of the culture doesn't want to budge. If the Iraqi's were serious about protecting their children and coming together as a country they could do it. The western mind has still not wrapped itself around the fact that we are a long way off from pulling these folks out of their early A.D. mindset. The cognitive dissonance associated w/the peculiar mixture of tribalism and islam has made me extremely cynical and desensitized to the attrocities that befall most of these people. More to the point, if two assholes are so busy shooting at each other & wasting each other's holy sites that they don't have the time to plant an IED then that's more than fine w/me. Let Darwinism play out and exploit the fissures.

All men are created equal but all cultures do not progress equally. I.E. the cartoon fiasco - enough said. Fairly sad commentary on my view of them but there you go.
Posted by: Broadhead6 || 02/22/2006 12:58 Comments || Top||

#26  Thanks for the insight and calming words, BH6! Godspeed, my friend.
Posted by: BA || 02/22/2006 13:23 Comments || Top||

#27  LH, it wasn't as if there WASN'T dhimminitude in that region. However, your point that I'm reading modern ideology into past events is correct, and I retract the use of the term "war of liberation." However, it WAS BILLED THAT WAY AT THAT TIME, however, meaning that the appeal to what would we would later term "waging a war of liberation" existed.

However, the ATTEMPT was to free Christians and the holy places from Muslim domination: didn't work out very well in practice, especially during the later Crusades, as mom well pointed out. The order to spare Jews was definitely not heeded.

Then again, the Crusades took place in the 11th century, 300 years after the invasion of France by the Muslims, and punctuated by invasions of Italy by the muslims, especially of Rome. A counterstrike was WAY overdue.

In a sense, Aris was right when he said Christianity's pacifism is stupid and dopey, especially in light of the disappearance of North African Christianity shortly after the death of Mohammed.
Posted by: Ptah || 02/22/2006 13:25 Comments || Top||

#28  Bah. I forgot to add that I DO agree with LiberalHawk's observation that we, the United States, do not view a civil war as being a favorable outcome in Iraq. I was merely pointing out that we (the USA) HAVE arranged that outcome.

It should also be pointed out that the Cartoon bourhaha has not yielded any violent protests in Iraq, although that may be due to the possiblity that the provincial government and the coalition would break heads if that happened. Still, its an improvement of sorts.
Posted by: Ptah || 02/22/2006 13:29 Comments || Top||

#29  " especially during the later Crusades, "

yeah,like the fourth, where they "liberated" constantinople from the Orthodox Christians :) And paved the way for the Ottoman conquest. Cant allow those Greeks to make you a dhimmi, ya know. :)
Posted by: liberalhawk || 02/22/2006 13:35 Comments || Top||

#30  Those of you wanting to breakout the popcorn while hoping for a civil war are both shortsighted and ignorant of the situation in Iraq & the war as a whole. A civil war is a victory for al-Qaeda, Iran and Syria, and a defeat for the United States and the people of Iraq. I watched the people of Iraq vote in Barwana in the Haditha Triad - the heart of the Sunnni triangle & former "Islamic Republic" of Zarqawi. The people want this conflict to end, and they risked their lives to vote. The Sunni citizens respected the Shiite soldiers & U.S. Marines in their midst.

Only the small minded view all of the Shiites as tools of the Iranians and all of the Sunnis as tools of al-Qaeda. It isn't that simple, the fact is most of the people just want to move forward and very small but very violent subsets of these groups want a civil war.

You want more Americans to die, both here and in Iraq? By all means, root for a civil war.
Posted by: Bill Roggio || 02/22/2006 13:54 Comments || Top||

#31  Bill's absolutely correct on this one IMO.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 14:03 Comments || Top||

#32  I see precisely ONE poster who seems pleased. The frustration with both sides is what I see, mostly.

Other than that, you had my attention Bill... for awhile...

Your final sentence is asinine, however, since the support you imply you see is, simply put, not there. Manufactured outrage, geeeeee - where else have I seen that recently...
Posted by: Whoper Ebbolulet9339 || 02/22/2006 14:05 Comments || Top||

#33  Yeah, but wasn't the fourth the crusade that was excommunicated by the Pope?

Posted by: Phil || 02/22/2006 14:06 Comments || Top||

#34  #3 and #4 both seemed pleased #1 was unclear, and #9 was incomprehensible.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 02/22/2006 14:09 Comments || Top||

#35  Oh, and ps: I agree with Bill.

Some days I wish I had time to do the "morning 'burg patrol" but I have a lot of work to do. The spice must flow and all that stuff.

But it irritates me to come in in the afternoon or at lunch break or in the evening and find out that the civil-war-in-Iraq-advocates have already marked the thread by excreting bodily substances all over it.
Posted by: Phil || 02/22/2006 14:14 Comments || Top||

#36  While I am not generally a violent individual, I am glad that at least SOMEBODY had their Bullsh1t meter peg at Muzzie acts and decided to do something. To state that this is the opening act in a civil war is a bit of a stretch, IMHO. I think that there are eyes slowing being opened all over regarding Muzzie , er, Islamofascists violence. Don't be surprised if similiar things don't appear in other parts of the world ( I am surprised that there has not been anything of significance in the US of A).
Posted by: USN, ret. || 02/22/2006 14:14 Comments || Top||

#37  Say what, USN?????

Attacks on Shiites by other Moslems has been going on in Iraq for the last 3 years. And Shiite attacks on Sunnis have been going on for at least the last 2 years as well.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 14:18 Comments || Top||

#38  I gotta check the weather report. It's starting to seem like a full moon.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 02/22/2006 14:20 Comments || Top||

#39  Mr. Spemble: This stuff seems to happen most often when a front is coming through or when a front isn't coming through.
Posted by: Phil || 02/22/2006 14:23 Comments || Top||

#40  Whoper,

Like I said, I went there, talked to the Iraqi people, and gained a lot of respect for them as they have a very difficult lot in life. They face danger every day. I have sympathy for them. They are people just like us, who want to work, send their kids to school and put food on their tables. Rooting for a civil war is just plain uncivilized in my opinion, and I will stand up to that.

I also saw how our troops live in close proximity to the Iraqi people. If you don't think a civil war would endanger their lives, you're wrong. And if a civil war does break out, it will give al-Qaeda the opportunity to establish enclaves in Iraq to further attack American troops in country, and Americans in the region and here at home. That is their plan, after all, all you have to do is read the words of Saif al-Adel and Ayman al-Zawahiri. I'll gladly point you to the information if you like. My words aren't "manufactured outrage", they accurately reflect the reality of the situation.
Posted by: Bill Roggio || 02/22/2006 14:26 Comments || Top||

#41  That's because the Catholics had chosen to view the Orthodox as schismatics -- therefore not proper Christians -- because their Latin didn't contain terms to properly translate the original Greek. The Crusades weren't meant to free the Christians from Muslim rule, but Christian lands from Muslim rule. Catholic treatment of religious dissidents in the Middle Ages is amply illustrated by French handling of the Albigensian (spelling?) heretics, who were beseiged, then the entire population massacred. As I recall, we don't even know exactly what it was the Albigensians believed. The Orthodox were no better, but we in the West don't have as much in the way of the details from the Byzantine Empire (or at least I don't, but it's not something I've studied properly, either).

Separately, early A.D. mindset. Sheer poetry, Broadhead6. Consider it stolen! :-) And you and your Marines stay well. Are y'all still at the breaking things stage? Or have you moved on to training Iraqis and building schools?
Posted by: trailing wife || 02/22/2006 14:31 Comments || Top||

#42  You've just killed a strawman, Bill.

You clearly imply that there are more than a few loonies here advocating Civil War. That's preposterous and the evidence is there for you to see that's so. Point them out. I see the same induhvidual, in #3 and #5, advocating. I see some frustration and incomprehensible posts. I see more than those combined clearly posting comments that do not support Civil War. I don't look forward to it - and, as I said clearly, I saw only ONE who did. You have, indeed, manufactured a position which is easily defended. I could do it for you, in fact.

And now you've sacrificed a strawman on that altar.

The post above yours, from Broadhead6, is from a man on the ground there now. A very smart Jarine, to be precise. His words tell the story.

As I said, only your concluding statement - as a smear of those here who did not do what you implied - was at issue for me. It was, indeed, asinine. I appreciate your opinion, but the contentious last statement doesn't wash.
Posted by: Whoper Ebbolulet9339 || 02/22/2006 14:37 Comments || Top||

#43  Dear tw,

It's delightful to read your contributions. I hope you won't mind a slight correct to this one, tho.

The Orthodox were no better

The Orthodox churches have always had a somewhat different emphasis theologically and doctrinally than the Catholics. Catholicism echoes a Roman emphasis on law. Orthodoxy echoes a Platonic and organic interest in wholeness and inner life.

There's considerable overlap on the basics, of course, but in general the Eastern churches have had other things to do than to pursue inquisitions or crusades against those who don't adopt a single liturgy form or specific canon law.


Oh, there were various zealous monks, but the whole tone of the churches - and their practical impact on dissenters - was somewhat different than in the western church.

Best regards,

Obac
Posted by: Orthodox by birth and chrismation || 02/22/2006 14:42 Comments || Top||

#44  Bill, thanks for stopping by, and we appreciate your appearance here at our humble little 'Burg.

I'm just frustrated, is all. I am still trying to have high hopes for the Iraqi people (indeed for the whole Middle East), but then the Bad Guyz go and blow up school kiddies with a bobbytrapped backpack, or detonate a bomb in one of the holiest of shrines, or blow up a humvee full of America's finest men and women. I'm tired of the temper tantrums, I'm tired of the poor impulse control, I'm absolutely horrified by the carnage.

For the record, the official editorial policy of Rantburg does not hope for, call for, or endorse civil war in Iraq, and we have been trying lately to cut down on the 'kill/nuke 'em all' commentary. But we are all losing patience.
Posted by: Seafarious || 02/22/2006 14:44 Comments || Top||

#45  chrismation - Word of the Day! Well, I had to look it up. ;)
Posted by: Whoper Ebbolulet9339 || 02/22/2006 14:45 Comments || Top||

#46  Whoper,

The comments weren't directed at you or anyone else except those looking forward to a civil war. Plain and simple. Who is setting up the strawman now?

For the life of me I cannot understand what you are so hypersensitive about. I've seen the popcorn threads here at Rantburg and decided to voice my opinion. This thread had a few, and I felt it was a few too many, just as mom, liberhawk, rosemary and others did before me. You don't like it, so be it.

I didn't build any strawman here. al-Qaeda wants to kill more Americans and believes inciting a civil war in Iraq is a good way of going about it. I gave you two al-Qaeda strategists that stated as much.

Do I disagree with Broadhead6? Can the Iraq people do more to protect themselves? Yes. But then again, none of us lived in a totalitarian hellhole for 30+ years, then started having suicide bombers and murderers targeting them either.
Posted by: Bill Roggio || 02/22/2006 14:51 Comments || Top||

#47  Obac, I am always pleased to be educated by those who know more than I. Thank you.

Oh, and perhaps it will please you to know that I am an Orthodox godmother. I stood up at my goddaughter's christening, swore to help teach her the ways of her religion (fortunately I've been able to lean on her mother for that! even after downloading reams of info.), and look forward to standing up again at the young lady's wedding.
Posted by: trailing wife || 02/22/2006 14:57 Comments || Top||

#48  And I simply must go in search of my missing apostrophes. They were around here earlier today... ;-)
Posted by: trailing wife || 02/22/2006 15:00 Comments || Top||

#49  Seafarious,

I am a daily 'lurker' & an advid reader of the Burg.

We all get frustrated by what is happening in Iraq. Don't think I don't have my moments of doubt & frustration. But that is exactly what al-Qaeda wants - for us to become frustrated, then despair, then give up. Once we reach that point, they've won. They think they can outlast us. If we mistakenly attribute the actions of the terrorists with the motivations of the people of Iraq, we have played into AQ's hands. Let me be clear that it is one thing to be frustrated, and another to advocate a civil war. My comments are directed at the latter.
Posted by: Bill Roggio || 02/22/2006 15:01 Comments || Top||

#50  The problem hit a tipping point with most American with the cartoon crap, when they saw what muslims would do over a cartoon most Americans went F**kem let them die, I know it is wrong, but most people I talk to have this attitude now. I want Iraq to work out, but people are getting fed up.
Posted by: djohn66 || 02/22/2006 15:05 Comments || Top||

#51  Good grief! This could've been so simple. But nope, your ego won't allow it. Fine... your choice.

What a disingenuous pair of non-responses to a direct and factual challenge of a single aspect of your post. You can't support it, and haven't the intellectual honesty to admit you stumbled there, so you change the venue to include other days and threads. Beautiful work. And plaudits for the attempt to turn it back on me! How perfectly commonplace, nowadays.

I guess the suckups will want your autograph, next. How sad.
Posted by: Whoper Ebbolulet9339 || 02/22/2006 15:06 Comments || Top||

#52  The apostrophes seem to come and go. I'll ask AutoBartender to check behind the pool table at the O-Club, just in case.

Thanks, Bill. Most of us here recognize that Al-Q was behind this bombing and that it was an act calculated to provoke just the response we are seeing even in microcosm here.
Posted by: Seafarious || 02/22/2006 15:08 Comments || Top||

#53  Let me clarify that I both agree & disagree with Broadhead6... His depiction of Anbar is as I saw in Nov-Dec 2005, and remains to this day according to the officers and enlisted I speak to. The Iraqi culture is definitely not like American culture and they have much to learn.

I just don't think the interests of the Iraqi or American people are served by "wasting each other's holy sites" or letting "Darwinism play out and exploit the fissures." I certainly do understand his frustrations (see above post), I just don't think its good policy.
Posted by: Bill Roggio || 02/22/2006 15:09 Comments || Top||

#54  "Theres considerable overlap on the basics, of course, but in general the Eastern churches have had other things to do than to pursue inquisitions or crusades against those who dont adopt a single liturgy form or specific canon law."

well except for the monophysites. Who were so fed up they welcomed the muslims.

And lets not begin on the Orthodox and the Jews.

But of course that says nothing about Orthodoxy today. Religions do change.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 02/22/2006 15:21 Comments || Top||

#55  Since you insist, here's the two obvious ones. Are they enough for you? Was it not so obvious that I should have been required to point it out?

#3 Go go Shia! Go go Sunni!
Posted by gromgoru 2006-02-22 07:04|| Front Page|| ||Comments Top

#4 "Its a pity they cant both lose".
Posted by anonymous5089 2006-02-22 07:17|| Front Page|| ||Comments Top

Now am I required to go get all of the references to "popcorn" in Rantburg's messages?

You directly challanged my last statement, which was "You want more Americans to die, both here and in Iraq? By all means, root for a civil war." Now, I don't know how you interpretted that, but I was saying that more Americans will die as a result of a civil war in Iraq. Not the "?" in the snetence. I wasn't imlying these commentors advocated more Americans to die. Are we clear?

I am not so sure why you have to take such an insulting tone. That seems all to commonplace, which is why I stay away from comments. Invariably someone has to resort to insults to make their points, which is quite sad.
Posted by: Bill Roggio || 02/22/2006 15:21 Comments || Top||

#56  guess the suckups will want your autograph, next. How sad.

Don't need it - although I've met Bill. ;-)

Whoper, it's you who are being somewhat disingenuous. There's been a whole lot of what looks like cheering for an Iraqi civil war here at the Burg, including in this thread:

"Go go Shia! Go go Sunni!""It's a pity they can't both lose".

I understand the frustration -- we're all feeling it. But Bill isn't exactly the only one here to note that an Iraqi civil war is JUST what Zarqawi has been trying to provoke for two years now.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 15:22 Comments || Top||

#57  Hmm ... could have SWORN I typed apostrophes in that one.

Gremlins, I suppose.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 15:25 Comments || Top||

#58  it wast just 3 and 5, it was also for. Plus some incomprehensible or neutral posts that appeared to assent.

Nothing in the other direction till mine.

Though I hope its clear to Bill that most at RB are not taking that stand. (though it does point up the dangers of letting our frustration cause us to lose our cool)

BTW, Bill, my question to you as always - we see indications of more and more takeover by Iraqi troops - i saw a quote of 25% of ops being done purely by Iraqi forces - when will we see a significant decline in US casualties as a (presumed) consequence? Or am i not seeing the strategic reality?

Oh, and I want you to know i admire your trip to Anbar. I think you have alot more credibility now. I wonder if Belgravia Dispatch would appreciate taking another look at your posts? :)
Posted by: liberalhawk || 02/22/2006 15:25 Comments || Top||

#59  LH,

Thanks for the kind words. I do realize that the majority of 'Burgers do not advocate a civil war. If I gave the impression otherwise then my apologies.

RE: your question on reductions in U.S. casualties. This may seem overly simplistic or obvious, but in honesty I think that is the reality. Since most of the casualties are taken by IEDs directed at patrols & supply convoys, I don't see the rates going down until the Iraqi Army/police can provide the bulk of the logistical support for their units as well as conduct a larger majority of patrols. I can't say what the tipping point figure would be, and it is probably more related to region than straight numbers (getting the Iraqis to patrol/support Baghdad, Anbar and Diyala as opposed to more stable areas). But U.S. MTT teams will still be embedded in Iraqi units for some time and I expect them to become even bigger targets. Their vehicles and uniforms are noticeably different than that of the Iraqis and that will put a bullseye on them.
Posted by: Bill Roggio || 02/22/2006 15:40 Comments || Top||

#60  Bill:

Great to have you stop by the Burg. I hope that the Iraqis will figure out what they have to do to put the lid on their most violent citizens/residents. I believe most here do as well. But I can certainly understand Broadhead6's frustration/cynicism. When you are there long-term, on a daily basis, you get worn down by the slow pace of change.
Posted by: remoteman || 02/22/2006 15:46 Comments || Top||

#61  Wow.

I agree with .com and BH6, heh.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 15:49 Comments || Top||

#62  The Apostrophe Gremlin seems to have struck my postings as well, along with his buddy the Spelling Gremlin...
Posted by: Bill Roggio || 02/22/2006 16:09 Comments || Top||

#63  Side note to trouble some of the Christians here.

I have always had a bad feeling about the "Nicene Creed" repeated before communion in most Christian sects.


The Nicene Creed was formulated at the First Ecumenical Council at Nicea in AD 325 to combat Arianism, and it was expanded at the Second Ecumenical Council at Constantinople in AD 381 to balance its coverage of the Trinity by including the Holy Spirit. It is the only creed that was promulgated by any of the seven ecumenical councils and thus it is the only creed that is truly ecumenical and universal. In the Orthodox Church, it is the only creed.


Enough of the offical line. If you were an "acceptable" Christian you could recite the creed as what you believed in and avoid death. If you were a Nestorian or some other variant... DEATH BE UNTO YOU!

Millions were killed based on the "creed" and when you repeat it before communion - besides stating your belief - you are accepting common guilt for the extermination of those who belived a tad differently. In other words, you accept the "sin" of exterminating of the other.

Posted by: 3dc || 02/22/2006 16:21 Comments || Top||

#64  Interesting troll to add here.
Posted by: Orthodox by birth and chrismation || 02/22/2006 16:27 Comments || Top||

#65  I had been an ITM (Iraq The Model) regular for some time. I like the Fadhil brothers and believe that they are more modern in their thinking and perhaps even a bit agnostic in their beliefs. I am sad that Iraq appears to be teetering, and I am at a new level of disgust with the attacks on Christians and churches in the Muslim world.
The general direction of this activity is toward hot war. That will mark the Iraqi war as a failure of degree, and the attempts to draw moderate Muslims to take a stand, an action which times out. I can't see any reversal which can force peace to break out. The only things on the horizon are more dead, and more blame. Islam just doesn't support peaceful coexistence, and there's no change in sight.
Flaming lunatics led by egocentric madmen charging off shooting and slashing in every direction. Islam, 2006 !
Posted by: wxjames || 02/22/2006 16:39 Comments || Top||

#66  The problem is, the West moved on from the crusades. They're still living them.
Posted by: plainslow || 02/22/2006 16:53 Comments || Top||

#67  Living in San Diego, I know too many Marines and the families of Marines to take any enjoyment in any sort of explosions in Iraq. My youngest son's reserve unit expects to go back late this year or early next. Nothing would make me happier than a massive outbreak of brotherly love over there.
Posted by: RWV || 02/22/2006 17:12 Comments || Top||

#68  Liberalhawk

It is you who are being anachronistsic or more exactly are repeating what your history teachers (people who trained alongside Ward Curchill told you).

Unlike Pizarro or Cortez most Crusaders were quite rich and didn't go to Crusade for money or riches (do you really think Judea was rich enough for attracting people from as far as England)? In fact going to Crusade was one of the surest ways to empoverish: it was teh huge sums spent in teh Crusades who forced the nobility to start dismantling serfdom by selling freedom to teh serfs and also to sell many lands to the bourgeois.

Also I remind you that after the successful first Crusader mozst Crusaders didn't remain to collect fiefs like Conquisatdores did: they called mission accomplished and went back home and this was one of the main motive for the ultimate failure of the Crusades: the fact that Crusaders didn't care for remaining in Judea.

But you are right they didn't go for liberating Oriental Christains. They went for the tomb of the Christ not for the sake of (for them) heretic Christians.. If their goal had been to liberate Christians they would have gone to Spain who was nearer to them (cheaper and shorter travel, less logistical problems) and farther of Muslim power centers than Judea. And in addition Spaniards were fellow Catholics like them unlike Oriental Christians.
Posted by: JFM || 02/22/2006 17:28 Comments || Top||

#69  "Unlike Pizarro or Cortez most Crusaders were quite rich and didnt go to Crusade for money or riches (do you really think Judea was rich enough for attracting people from as far as England)? In fact going to Crusade was one of the surest ways to empoverish: it was teh huge sums spent in teh Crusades who forced the nobility to start dismantling serfdom by selling freedom to teh serfs and also to sell many lands to the bourgeois. "

They werent looking for gold but for feudal estates. If youre a second son, who wont inherit but will be knight errant/merc, going for an estate in the east isnt a bad deal. One reason the Popes encourage the crusades was to get rid of folks like that. And of course they didnt go only for Judea, but conquered the entire coastal plain from Antioch south, and considerable parts of Syria as well. Much richer than Judea, IIUC. Of course it didnt work out well for all of them, but at least for a few it did.

In any case i consider the motives to have been mixed.

Posted by: liberalhawk || 02/22/2006 17:39 Comments || Top||

#70  "If their goal had been to liberate Christians they would have gone to Spain who was nearer to them"

actually quite a few french and english knights DID go to Spain, IIUC.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 02/22/2006 17:40 Comments || Top||

#71  actually quite a few french and english knights DID go to Spain, IIUC.

I know it. But not that many and when they went...

Take as example the crucial battle of Navas de Tolosa. Ten years before the Spanish knights had been anihilated at Alarcos so the nobility lacked in numbers to meet the Moors, so they called for reinforcement from city bourgeois but since those were low quality they got the Pope declaring Crusade (or at least sin exemptions) for those going to fight in Spain. A few thousand French knights went to Spain. These were far better quality than city militias but had the bad habit of attacking Jews on sight. The Spaniards reacted by lodging the French in tents outside the cities and the French ended leaving in disgust.

Aftermath: The Spaniards went to battle alone. It was a close battle who could have gone for the Muslims but it ended with the Muslim army was practically anihilated. After it Muslims would never be able to threaten Christian Spain.
Posted by: JFM || 02/22/2006 18:30 Comments || Top||

#72  They werent looking for gold but for feudal estates.

If they had been looking for feudal estates they would have remained. It was what Conquistadores did in Mexico or Peru. Most of Crusaders returned to Europe.
Posted by: JFM || 02/22/2006 18:35 Comments || Top||

#73  Rantburg U rocks...
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 21:25 Comments || Top||

#74  RWV - agreed
Posted by: Frank G || 02/22/2006 21:40 Comments || Top||

#75  Jeeze Louise! I fly around and burn jet fuel for a few hours and come back and realize I just missed a big seminar! All kidding aside, great thread, helps everyone to sort out the issues and get beyond venting frustrations at how f*cked up things can be in the ME. Thanks for the postings.
Posted by: Al-Aska Paul || 02/22/2006 21:59 Comments || Top||

#76  I've got to get a new job that doesn't block Rantburg.

Playing one side against another, while certainly amoral, is not necessarily a a losing strategy. The British played the Spanish off the French off the Germans for centuries and the it worked for them. How do you think that they conquered India with so few men? They were constantly playing the princes and tribes off each other.

So Bill, I don't necessarily agree with you. Playing the Sunnis off the Shias could be a force multiplier and not the threat to our troops that many here seem to think it is. It could in fact save American lives.

Of course some might try to counter with the argument that it is important for the US to have a "principled foreign policy" in order for it to maintain its moral authority. My comeback to that would be is it is precisely those elected governments that have pursued a principled foreign policy that have suffered the worst foreign policy disasters. The Asquith and Chamberlain governments in the UK and the Wilson, Carter, and Clinton presidencies all come to mind.
Posted by: 11A5S || 02/22/2006 23:10 Comments || Top||

#77  Arguments have been made that the Portuguese started exploring around Africa in order to attack Mecca from the south but got sidetracked by the money to be made by hijacking the spice trade from the Muslims.

They did get as far as a huge naval battle in the Red Sea with Egypt.
Posted by: 3dc || 02/22/2006 23:23 Comments || Top||

#78  I think that Albuquerque was planning to raze Mecca just before his untimely death. Now there was a soldier. There's not much history out there on him, though.
Posted by: 11A5S || 02/22/2006 23:48 Comments || Top||


Samarra residents furious over destruction of Askaria mosque
A large explosion Wednesday heavily damaged the golden dome of one of Iraq's most famous Shiite religious shrines, sending protesters pouring into the streets. It was the third major attack against Shiite targets in as many days.

Police believed some people may be buried under the debris after the 6:55 a.m. explosion at the Askariya mosque but there were no confirmed figures. The shrine contains the tombs of two revered Shiite imams, both descendants of the Prophet Muhammad.

Tradition says the shrine, which draws Shiite pilgrims from throughout the Islamic world, is near the place where the last of the 12 Shiite imams, Mohammed al-Mahdi, disappeared. Al-Mahdi, known as the "hidden imam," was the son and grandson of the two imams buried in the Askariya shrine.

Shiites believe he is still alive and will return to restore justice to humanity. An attack at such an important religious shrine would constitute a grave assault on Shiite Islam at a time of rising sectarian tensions in Iraq.

A police officer who declined to give his name because he is not authorized to speak to media said armed men, with at least one wearing a uniform, broke inside the shrine before sunrise and seized the five policemen responsible for guarding the site.

The gunmen planted explosives and fled the area, the officer said.

Following the blast, U.S. and Iraqi forces surrounded the shrine and began searching houses in the area. The Sunni Endowments, a government organization that cares for Sunni mosques and shrines, also condemned the blast and said it was sending a delegation to Samarra to investigate what happened.

Thousands of demonstrators gathered near the shrine, waving Iraqi flags, Shiite religious banners and copies of the Muslim holy book, Quran. Shiite leaders in Baghdad's Sadr City neighborhood called for demonstrations against the blast.

"This criminal act aims at igniting civil strife," said Mahmoud al-Samarie, 28-year-old builder who was among the crowd in this city 60 miles north of Baghdad. "We demand an investigation so that the criminals who did this be punished. If the government fails to do so, then we will take arm and chase the people behind this attack."

Religious leaders at other mosques and shrines throughout the city denounced the attack in statements read over loudspeakers from minarets.

The shrine contains the tombs of the 10th and 11th imams, Ali al-Hadi who died in 868 A.D. and his son Hassan al-Askari who died in 874 A.D and was the father of the hidden imam.

The golden dome was completed in 1905.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 03:19 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [395 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Just guessing it's prolly AQ. No one else it that nuts.I wouldn't give you 10 cents to be a Sunni in Iraq right now. Look for Tater to try and gain some political points from this as well.
Posted by: Sock Puppet O' Doom || 02/22/2006 5:00 Comments || Top||

#2  Speaking of Tater, Juan Cole (Yes I know he's a f**kwit) has a translation of an extended interview by Tater last Saturday on Aljazeera.
He also says that due to the destruction of the Dome that Tuesday was an apocalyptic day in Iraq.
Posted by: tipper || 02/22/2006 5:46 Comments || Top||

#3  maybe this will actually finally be the tipping point that the press have been saying is days away for 3 years now, maybe if it is this mythical 'tipping point' it will mean the swift and brutal irradication of many more AQ thugs in Iraq, lets hope the Iraqis just keep the fighting between each other and leave our forces out of it. Gonna be a real interesting few days i think in Iraq - finally it seems the media's much hoped for civil war may arrive..... to be continued lol
Posted by: ShepUK || 02/22/2006 6:15 Comments || Top||

#4  Popcorn time.
Posted by: gromgoru || 02/22/2006 7:05 Comments || Top||

#5  Wonder how Ahmadisnutz and the Mad Mullahs took the news this morning?
Posted by: Seafarious || 02/22/2006 9:45 Comments || Top||

#6  SF, I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out the Iranians have a hand in this. There has been always rivalry between Iraqi shi'ite sites and Iranians', competing over who has most 'holliest' sites.

Iranians may try to use the default 'blame the sunnis' paradigm to push their agenda to reduce the influence of Iraqi shi'ite sites.

I am not saying that this is the case with the Askaria mosque, but that this angle shouln't be overlooked.
Posted by: twobyfour || 02/22/2006 10:49 Comments || Top||

#7  Before and After Pics
Posted by: NickVtx || 02/22/2006 12:06 Comments || Top||

#8  And the caption on the last pic - that the Tater mobs are saying the Americans prolly did it...

YJCMTSU. Thx, NYT & Friends.

Thx for the link, NickVtx!
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 12:10 Comments || Top||

#9  Why didn't anyone notice people taking explosives into the shrine? Seriously, is it that common to see one of your holy sites have terrorists on it?

/sarcasm
Posted by: Charles || 02/22/2006 14:16 Comments || Top||

#10  Read the details in the article.

armed men, with at least one wearing a uniform, broke inside the shrine before sunrise and seized the five policemen responsible for guarding the site.

The gunmen planted explosives and fled the area, the officer said.


The blast went off not long afterwards.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 14:20 Comments || Top||

#11  Actually, the photo of the march in Baghdad looks pretty peaceful -- no fists, no mouths open screaming imprecations, no guns or swords waving in the air, even a few veiled women around the edges, if my eyes don't deceive me. Separately, looking at the photos of the destruction, it appears to me that the mosque must have been constructed within living memory -- isn't that rebar-and-concrete, not stone? If so, reconstruction should go fairly quickly, and it's not the same, desecration-wise, as if millenium old building had been attacked.
Posted by: trailing wife || 02/22/2006 14:43 Comments || Top||

#12  Nice catch, tw!

Holiest rebar I've ever seen. Dunno its rank...
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 15:51 Comments || Top||

#13  Where'd my apostophe go?

(This is a test, actually, lol)
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 15:52 Comments || Top||

#14  Bzzzzzzzzzt!

The script that checks for troll crap is eliminating them all now, it seems. Heh.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 15:53 Comments || Top||

#15  now now, .com.

We didn't DELIBERATELY target your comments ... ;-)

That was a joke. It was only a joke. You may return to your normal ranting now.
Posted by: lotp || 02/22/2006 16:00 Comments || Top||

#16  Interesting, TW, but I'm thinking that's not modern rebar. May be wood, not metal.
Posted by: Darrell || 02/22/2006 16:07 Comments || Top||

#17  Lol, lotp. Okay, I won(apostrophe)t take it personally. ;-)
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 16:22 Comments || Top||

#18  And Pound Sign 39; is the work around I have been using it for days in the "Your Name" field.
Posted by: Sock Puppet O' Doom || 02/22/2006 16:34 Comments || Top||

#19  I really have to wonder if I'madinnerjacket had a hand in this to provoke the return of the hidden Imam. He's crazy enough to think it.
Posted by: DonM || 02/22/2006 16:41 Comments || Top||

#20  Imadinnerjacket ??? That(apostrophe)s the best laugh I(apostrophe)ve had in days.
Posted by: wxjames || 02/22/2006 17:05 Comments || Top||


Local sheikhs actively assisting US in Ramadi
If a murder or serious crime is committed in this insurgency-plagued city of 400,000, the governor of the surrounding Anbar province offers this advice: don't bother calling the police.

In Ramadi, it's local sheiks who more often get results. And with their blessing, the drive to recruit an effective police force is finally gaining steam.

Former officers and newcomers have signed up by the hundreds in the last two months, a windfall compared with similar efforts last year that produced on a handful of new police.

The sheiks "really opened the door to where we're at today," said Marine Maj. Robert Rice, who leads a U.S. team trying to rebuild the police in Anbar. "The challenge is we need to continue to engage the tribal leaders. We can't let them back off."

The police force in the Sunni-dominated city disintegrated last year in the wave of violence that has swept what many Iraqis consider the unofficial capital of the insurgency. Only the highway patrol functions, and all it does is keep tabs on the roads linking Baghdad with Jordan.

"If the person who got murdered is from a large tribe, the tribe will find justice for him. If he is from a small tribe, forget about it. Only God will help him," Anbar Gov. Maamoun Sami Rashid al-Alwani said. "The people who make the court system effective are not here. It is like a car without fuel."

The goal is to stabilize the provincial capital by getting cops back on their beats and deploying two brigades of about 5,000 Iraqi soldiers, one of which has slowly started to patrol small, outlying city districts on its own.

By year's end, the U.S. command hopes to have most of a 4,000 member police force working as part of the overall plan to draw down the American military presence.

Insurgents have sought to undermine the recruiting drive.

After sheiks endorsed the plan at a public meeting, a three-day police recruitment session in early January drew about 1,100 people.

But a suicide bomber stepped in line on Jan. 5 and killed about 60 people, including two U.S. troops. Three sheiks also were recently assassinated.

Fears the violence would scare away recruits calmed in recent weeks as U.S. police trainers saw nearly 3,000 former officers and recruits show up to apply for spots on the new force.

Hundreds of men also continued filing into the center earlier this month after insurgent snipers shot one man in the chest and fired mortars that did not cause injuries.

"That's what I've been expecting all day," Marine Capt. John LaJennesse said as mortar shrapnel clattered about 160 feet away and recruits crouched beside vehicles.

U.S. and Iraqi officials hope to create a force of about 11,300 policemen in cities across the vast province that stretches from the western outskirts of Baghdad to the Saudi, Jordanian and Syrian borders.

At one recruiting event, one young man said a strong desire to control the violence - and find a job - prompted him to walk to the center in a defunct glass factory next to a U.S. base with several relatives for protection.

"We have no jobs. Ninety percent of us who come to join the police are unemployed. We have children and families," Abdel Latif said as he signed up for the police force.

At another drive the following week, one recruit told U.S. soldiers that thousands more would have come had it not been for the suicide attack last month.

U.S. trainers said the force, once constituted, would need strength in numbers to be effective in face of the formidable insurgent threat.

"You can't push police out in the middle of a war zone. Granted, we push the envelope out here," said LaJennesse, who trains police and helped organize the drives in Ramadi. "The police can have an effect if they come back en masse, not if they come in dribbles and drabs."

Ramadi policemen will eventually face a city that remains difficult for even thousands of U.S. and Iraqi soldiers to control. However, U.S. trainers hope the police, mostly local residents, will provide much-needed tips and local intelligence.

"I don't need the police to go defeat (roadside bombs) - the Iraqi army or we can go do that. I need them to point out where they're at in the first place," Rice said.

Officials believe residents will respond better to a force of locals instead of Iraqi soldiers, most of whom come from Shiite areas of the country. Al-Alwani, the governor, said residents frequently complain that Iraqi soldiers have abused or mistreated them.

Finding enough policemen is not the only obstacle to security in the area. Questions about police loyalty to the new government - above tribal allegiance or sympathy for what is locally known as "the resistance" - remain a serious concern.

Corruption also complicates the task: the last provincial police chief was fired in the fall amid charges he was corrupt and working with insurgents.

"I'm sure we've accepted some (infiltrators) today," said LaJennesse. "The goal is to control it, minimize it, and give police the confidence to weed it out themselves."

Officials are crosschecking the new police rolls with U.S. and Iraq suspect lists and relying on local sheiks to point out known insurgents or possible infiltrators. In other Anbar cities like Khaldiyah, U.S. soldiers have said many captured insurgents were former police officers.

The U.S. police training infrastructure recently has been bolstered. Previously, a team of just nine Marines and seven civilian police trainers were tasked with rebuilding Anbar's police force outside Fallujah, Rice said. The incoming team has about 125 people. Three Ramadi police stations also are due to reopen in two to three months.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 03:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [254 views] Top|| File under:

#1  A teeny-tiny silver lining in an enormous cloud. Yep. Associated Press.

But it IS a silver lining!
Posted by: Bobby || 02/22/2006 8:05 Comments || Top||

#2  This really is slow, methodical nation building, and it does work. Ideally the mood it creates is one of continual, never-ending improvement--if you are not getting better then you are wrong.

This attitude is a formula for success.
Posted by: Anonymoose || 02/22/2006 10:43 Comments || Top||

#3  Self-preservation is an excellent motivator.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 11:59 Comments || Top||


Car bomb kills 22, shrine of 2 Shi'ite imams destroyed in Samarra
A car bomb exploded Tuesday on a street packed with shoppers in a Shiite area of Baghdad, killing 22 people and wounding 28, police said. It was the deadliest bomb attack in the Iraqi capital in a month.

Early Wednesday, a large explosion destroyed the golden dome of one of Iraq's most famous Shiite religious shrines in Samarra, the U.S. military said, sending protesters pouring into the streets.

Police believed there were victims buried under the debris but had no immediate casualty figures.

The blast occurred about 6:55 a.m. at the Askariya Shrine, which contains the tombs of two revered Shiite imams, police Capt. Laith Mohammed said. It was the third major attack on a Shiite target in as many days after two deadly explosions in Shiite parts of Baghdad, raising fears of an escalation in sectarian violence.

Also Wednesday a roadside bomb exploded near a primary school in a mostly Shiite area in southern Iraq, killing two boys and injuring four others, police said. The incident happened at about 7:45 a.m. in the Bashrogiya area near Kut, 100 miles southeast of Baghdad, police Lt. Othman al-Rawi said.

Meanwhile, terrified children screamed and several women wailed for their dead, crying, "the terrorists, may God punish them." Shattered bits of fruits and vegetables from vendors' pushcarts lay scattered on the street amid pools of blood.

At least eight other people were killed and more than 30 injured Tuesday in bombings and shootings elsewhere in Baghdad and in attacks on beauty parlors and liquor stores — symbols of Western influence — in Baqouba northeast of the capital.

The car bombing occurred shortly before 5 p.m. in a Shiite corner of Dora, a predominantly Sunni Arab district of Baghdad and one of the most dangerous parts of the city — rocked almost daily by bombings, ambushes and assassinations.

Police Maj. Gen. Mahdi al-Gharawi said the bomb was detonated by remote control and an Iraqi suspected of triggering the device had been arrested. Claims of early arrests in bombing cases often prove premature.

Another policeman, 1st Lt. Maitham Abdul-Razaq, said the blast apparently was aimed at a police patrol but missed its target, killing and maiming shoppers strolling with their families along a street lined with appliance shops and fruit and vegetable stalls.

It was the deadliest bombing in Baghdad since Jan. 19, when a suicide attacker blew himself up in a coffee shop, killing 22 people and injuring 23.

The Dora bombing was the second major attack in as many days against a Shiite target in the capital. Twelve people died Monday when a suicide bomber detonated an explosives belt on a bus in the heavily Shiite district of Kazimiyah.

At least 969 Iraqis have been killed in war-related violence this year and at least 986 have been wounded, according to an Associated Press count.

However, large-scale attacks against civilians have declined in recent weeks amid widespread public criticism, including from Sunnis clerics and others sympathetic to the Sunni-dominated insurgency.

Some Sunni insurgent groups are believed to be holding back to give Sunni Arab politicians a chance to negotiate concessions from Shiites and Kurds during talks on a new government.

However, talks among parties that won parliamentary seats in the Dec. 15 elections have bogged down because of fundamental differences among Shiite, Sunni Arab and Kurdish politicians.

U.S. officials believe a government capable of winning the trust of all communities is essential so the United States can hand over more security responsibility to the Iraqis and begin sending the 138,000 American troops home this year.

On Tuesday, Mohammed al-Askari, a Defense Ministry spokesman, confirmed that Iraqi soldiers had detained 18 policemen who had seized two men for unknown reasons. Al-Askari added that one of the men who were held captive by the 18 was a police officer from the mostly Shiite southern city of Kut.

The Interior Ministry has denied running or sanctioning death squads. On Thursday, however, the ministry announced an investigation into alleged death squads after U.S. military officials announced the arrest last month of 22 policemen who were about to kill a Sunni Arab north of Baghdad.

Also Tuesday, British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw lent his voice to international calls for a broad-based government, telling Iraqi leaders in Baghdad that "no party, no ethnic or religious grouping can dominate" the next government.

"It is a crucial moment today for the people of Iraq," Straw told reporters after meeting President Jalal Talabani. "The international community, particularly those of us who played a part in liberating Iraq, obviously have an interest in a prosperous and stable and democratic Iraq."

Straw's comments followed a blunt warning Monday by U.S. Ambassador Zalmay Khalilzad that Iraqis risk losing international support if key ministries end up in the hands of politicians with ties to militias.

"We are not going to invest the resources of the American people and build forces that are run by people who are sectarian" and tied to the militias, Khalilzad said.

A coalition of Shiite Muslim religious parties won 130 of the 275 seats in the new parliament, and Shiite leaders insist their strong showing in the election gives them the right to control key ministries.

A Kurdish alliance won 53 seats and two Sunni Arab blocs together took 55 seats — a major increase over Sunni representation in the outgoing parliament.

Sunni Arabs have accused the Shiite-run Interior Ministry of kidnapping and murdering Sunni civilians, a charge the ministry denies. Shiites and Kurds dominate the army and police, while most of the insurgents are Sunni Arabs.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 02:06 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [575 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "Religion of Peace"
Posted by: borgboy || 02/22/2006 12:43 Comments || Top||

#2  So is destroying a muslim shrine worse than publishing cartoons depicting Mohomed? I am confused.
Posted by: JAB || 02/22/2006 12:45 Comments || Top||

#3  I guess we wouldn't understand, JAB. A subtlety that is only clear to those indoctrinated from birth, methinks.
Posted by: .com || 02/22/2006 15:55 Comments || Top||


Israel-Palestine-Jordan
Jordanian hostage in Iraq freed
Prime Minister Marouf Bakhit on Tuesday announced the release of Jordanian embassy driver in Baghdad Mahmoud Saaidat, who was held hostage for two months. “The efforts of His Majesty King Abdullah and his daily follow-up on all state agencies to secure the release of Saaidat were successful,” Bakhit was quoted by the Jordan News Agency, Petra, as saying. “I am happy to convey the news of his release to his family and the entire Jordanian people.”

Government Spokesperson Nasser Judeh later told reporters that Saaidat “was in a safe place and he was expected to return in a few hours.” Saaidat was snatched in southern Baghdad on December 20 by a group calling itself the Hawks Brigade who threatened four times to kill him, according to Agence France-Presse. The group demanded Jordan cut ties with the Iraqi government and release Sajida Al Rishawi, the female would-be suicide bomber, whose explosive belt failed to detonate in the November 9 attacks that killed 60 people at three Amman hotels.

A videotape aired recently on Al Arabiya TV showed Saaidat as saying that his captors had wrapped around him an explosive belt and had set a four-day deadline to execute him unless their demands were met. Judeh reiterated yesterday that all of the abductors' demands were rejected.
Posted by: Fred || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [276 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "Judeh reiterated yesterday that all of the abductors' demands were rejected."

So I'm guessing the boys at the weekly Hawks Brigade meeting had alittle debate, took up a vote, and decided to change their course of action. Yeah Right.
Posted by: DepotGuy || 02/22/2006 11:59 Comments || Top||


Southeast Asia
Alleged Muslim terrorists gun down 6 Christians
Victims 1st were asked if they believed in Christ, infant, teen among dead

© 2006 WorldNetDaily.com

At least six Christians have been gunned down at their homes by alleged Muslim terrorists in the Philippines, reports the Voice of the Martyrs, a leading monitor of Christian persecution.

According to the report, at least five terrorists believed to be linked to al-Qaida murdered six or more Christians by gunfire after asking them if they believed in Christ on the front doorsteps of their homes.

The incident occurred on the morning of Feb. 2 in the village of Patikul on the small Philippine island of Jolo, which is predominantly Muslim. At least one witness said a baby girl was among the casualties. Five people were injured during the door-to-door questioning.

The Islamic terrorist group Abu Sayyaf, which means "Bearer of the Sword" is assumed responsible for the attacks, as well as for a series of kidnappings, murders and bombings in the southern Philippines over the past 15 years.

According to Voice of the Martyrs, five victims fatally shot were identified as 9-month-old Melanie Patinga, Selma Patinga, 45-year-old Itting Pontilla, 16-year-old Emma Casipong and Pedro Casipong.
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 02/22/2006 04:54 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [261 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Lets see how much coverage this gets in the MSM....

A 9 month old -- what brave 'lions of islam' they are. And Islam 'honors' these sickos...
Posted by: CrazyFool || 02/22/2006 8:16 Comments || Top||

#2  Let's see if anything at all is done about this.
Posted by: wxjames || 02/22/2006 9:00 Comments || Top||

#3  another day, another brave islamist killing women and children to prove that theirs is the religion of peace.
Posted by: 2b || 02/22/2006 9:34 Comments || Top||

#4  Different continent, but same question-Muslim/Christian "interaction". I thought it worth noting:

http://www.anglicancommunion.org/acns/articles/41/00/acns4113.cfm
Posted by: Jules || 02/22/2006 10:37 Comments || Top||

#5  From Jules' link:

"Having watched with sadness and dismay the recent development in some States in the Northern part of this Country where many Christian Churches and other property have been wantonly destroyed by some Islamic fundamentalists, the Christian Association of Nigeria is compelled to issue the following statements:

1. From all indications, it is very clear now that the sacrifices of the Christians in this country for peaceful co-existence with people of other faiths has been sadly misunderstood to be weakness.


2. We have for a long time now watched helplessly the killing, maiming and destruction of Christians and their property by Muslim fanatics and fundamentalists at the slightest or no provocation at all. We are not unaware of the fact that these religious extremists have the full backup and support of some influential Muslims who are yet to appreciate the value of peaceful co-existence.


3. That an incident in far away Denmark which does not claim to be representing Christianity could elicit such an unfortunate reaction here in Nigeria, leading to the destruction of Christian Churches, is not only embarrassing, but also disturbing and unfortunate.


4. It is no longer a hidden fact that a long standing agenda to make this Nigeria an Islamic nation is being surreptitiously pursued. The willingness of Muslim Youth to descend with violence on the innocent Christians from time to time is from all intents and purposes a design to actualize their dream."
(more at link)

Well, there ya' have it, folks. There is no dealing with these Moslem idiots. There just isn't.
Posted by: ex-lib || 02/22/2006 10:57 Comments || Top||

#6  The Religion of Pieces (and Body Parts)
Posted by: Happy 88mm || 02/22/2006 13:35 Comments || Top||


Malaysian soldiers captured on Thai soil
An Islamic teacher acquitted of terrorism charges last year has called for justice, saying his time behind bars ruined his school's reputation and resulted in a big drop in student enrolments. Maisuru Haji Abdullah, the owner of Islamburana Tornor school in Muang Narathiwat district, voiced his grievance during a meeting with National Reconciliation Commission chairman Anand Panyarachun yesterday.

Mr Maisuru, 53, was arrested along with his son Muyahi, Muslim doctor Waemahadi Waedao and Samarn Waekaji on June 10, 2003 on charges of being members of the Indonesia-based Jemaah Islamiyah (JI) terror group. They were acquitted on June 11 last year due to lack of evidence.

''During my two-year imprisonment I killed time by reading the Koran more than 30 times. I prayed five times a day. Prison guards even complained because I was praying so often,'' he said.

''I had to serve two years for a crime I did not commit. I testified before the court more than 50 times before I was finally acquitted of the charges.

''I decided not to file a counter-suit just because I did not want to create any problems. All I want now is to involve myself in teaching my students, just like before,'' he said.

The school had 300 students the day he was arrested; that number gradually dropped to as low as 50. Many other Islamic teachers were also arrested, while some fled after the school was accused of being a breeding ground for terrorists.

He vowed to rehabilitate his school and rebuild its reputation. The number of students has risen to 80 now, said Mr Maisuru.

Meanwhile, six Malaysian soldiers were captured on Thai soil yesterday in Narathiwat's Sukhirin district.

The Malaysian soldiers _ two corporals, two petty officers and two privates _ denied that they were spying on Thai soil. They insisted that they became lost while on a border demarcation mission.

Fourth Army chief Lt-Gen Ongkorn Thongprasom said the intruders were sent to the Thai-Malaysian border committee, which would arrange their deportation.

In Yala, a policeman was shot dead yesterday by two men on a motorcycle while returning home from work. One of the attackers was then shot dead by another police officer.

Pol Sgt-Maj Praphon Suwankota, 40, was hit in the head and body. He was attacked shortly before 8am. The sound of gunshots brought Pol Snr Sgt-Maj Kittipas Chotchuang, an in-law who lives nearby, rushing to the scene. He opened fire on the attackers, killing Muhammad Hayi Hama, 20.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 02:09 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [263 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Not the first time that M'sian soldiers "strayed" into Thailand. Afterwards there's always no further follow up press clarification.
Posted by: Duh! || 02/22/2006 6:52 Comments || Top||

#2  Sure it wasn't just a drug smuggler in a Malaysian Army uniform? I appears we suffer the same problem over here.
Posted by: Flaigum Thoque6606 || 02/22/2006 9:21 Comments || Top||


Syria-Lebanon-Iran
Russia nuclear compromise deal fails
Hopes of a compromise deal on Iran’s nuclear programme faded yesterday as Russian and Iranian negotiators ended two days of talks with few signs of progress.

Russia wants Iran to move its uranium enrichment work to Russian soil to allay Western fears that Tehran is secretly developing a nuclear bomb. Iran refuses to accept the condition that it should reinstate the freeze on uranium enrichment on its own territory that it broke last month.

Both sides agreed to continue their discussions when Sergei Kiriyenko, Russia’s atomic chief, visits Iran tomorrow, but diplomats said that that left little time before a meeting of the International Atomic Energy Agency on March 6. That meeting could start a process leading to Iran’s punishment by the UN Security Council.

Russia is building Iran’s first nuclear power plant and stands to lose billions of dollars if sanctions are imposed on Iran. President Putin also hopes to score diplomatic points by defusing the crisis in Russia’s first year as president of the G8 group of leading industrial powers.
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 02:34 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [250 views] Top|| File under:

#1  By my Iraeli calendar, the mooks in Iran only have a week left to come up with something acceptable.
Posted by: Grusing Pheash2320 || 02/22/2006 9:57 Comments || Top||

#2  The ugly serpent twists and turn mainly to buy time. Only that dignitary clowns like El Baradei and Kofi mustn't speak ill of it.
Posted by: Duh! || 02/22/2006 14:18 Comments || Top||

#3  Is this a surprise to anybody??????? The only plan that will work for Iran is the one that assures them nuclear weapons in the end.
Posted by: bgrebel || 02/22/2006 16:25 Comments || Top||


Jamil Sayyed interrogated for five hours
Investigating Magistrate Elias Eid interrogated Jamil Sayyed, the arrested former chief of the Surete Generale, "for five-and-a-half hours Saturday," according to Lebanese judicial sources. Sayyed is one of four former top security chiefs who have been charged with planning, or executing the assassination of former Premier Rafik Hariri and of carrying out terrorist acts.

The four officers, Sayyed, Raymond Azar, former head of Army Intelligence, Ali Hajj, former head of the Internal Security Forces, and Mustafa Hamdan, former head of the Presidential Guards, have been questioned several times since their arrest last August. The sources added that Azar, Hajj and Hamdan will also be questioned "based on new information," without elaborating on what that information was. The four former security chiefs are currently detained in Roumieh prison awaiting trial, with Hamdan, Hajj and Azar's several petitions for release on bail denied by the Lebanese Judiciary.

Meanwhile, Serge Brammertz, the head of the UN probe investigating the assassination of Hariri, was flown by a helicopter to Lebanon's Southern borders where he met with Alain Pelligrini, the head of the United Nations Interim Forces in Lebanon. According to Lebanon's National News Agency, "Brammertz discussed the position of the UNIFIL forces."

Brammertz is expected to head to Syria by the end of the month, as the international community has demanded that Syria offer full cooperation to the UN probe and present officials and citizens named by Brammertz for questioning. Brammertz is expected to present the UN with his first report on the case by mid-March. The sources speculated the report would contain information about the level of Syrian cooperation in the investigations.
Posted by: Fred || 02/22/2006 00:00 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [266 views] Top|| File under:


Terror Networks
Abu Laith al-Libi resurfaces, sez al-Qaeda will restore Taliban rule
We haven't heard from him since 2002 so I sorta hoped he'd met an untimely demise. No such luck it seems, but where's Sully? I've still got my seatbelt already to go ...
THE al-Qaeda network is waging jihad (holy war) in Afghanistan to restore the Islamist Taliban regime, a senior al-Qaeda operative said in an audiotape posted today on the Internet. "We, members of the al-Qaeda organisation, ... are currently waging jihad in Afghanistan alongside our brethren from the Taliban," Abu Laith al-Libi said in the recording, whose authenticity could not be independently confirmed.

Libi, a Libyan Islamist who joined the Afghan mujahedeen (fighters) in the 1980s, said the aim was "to defeat the occupier and the government it installed in Kabul, and to reinstate the Islamic state". The war was being waged "from bases inside Afghanistan against positions located deep inside Afghan territory", said Libi, believed to be an explosives and guerrilla warfare expert. According to Libi, the joint operations are being carried out by al-Qaeda and the Taliban "under the command of Mullah Saif al-Rahman al-Mansur". He was "a renowned leader in Afghanistan who occupied (public) posts and assumed responsibilities in the Islamic emirate" declared by the Taliban, Libi said. His remarks were recorded during the Muslim fasting month of Ramadan last October. He surfaced in a recording aired on Saudi-owned MBC television in July 2002, saying at the time that al-Qaeda chief Osama bin Laden and Taliban leader Mullah Mohammed Omar were "in good health".
Posted by: Dan Darling || 02/22/2006 02:57 || Comments || Link || E-Mail|| [265 views] Top|| File under:



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Two weeks of WOT
Wed 2006-02-22
  Shi'ite shrine destroyed in Samarra
Tue 2006-02-21
  10 killed in religious clashes in Nigeria
Mon 2006-02-20
  Uttar Pradesh minister issues bounty for beheading cartoonists
Sun 2006-02-19
  Muslims Attack U.S. Embassy in Indonesia
Sat 2006-02-18
  Nigeria hard boyz threaten total war
Fri 2006-02-17
  Pak cleric rushdies cartoonist
Thu 2006-02-16
  Outbreaks along Tumen River between Nork guards and armed N Korean groups
Wed 2006-02-15
  Yemen offers reward for Al Qaeda jailbreakers
Tue 2006-02-14
  Cartoon protesters go berserk in Peshawar
Mon 2006-02-13
  Gore Bashes US In Saudi Arabia
Sun 2006-02-12
  IAEA cameras taken off Iran N-sites
Sat 2006-02-11
  Danish ambassador quits Syria
Fri 2006-02-10
  Nasrallah: Bush and Rice should 'shut up'
Thu 2006-02-09
  Taliban offer 100kg gold for killing cartoonist
Wed 2006-02-08
  Syrian Ex-VP and Muslim Brotherhood Put Past Behind Them

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