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"We′re not sure exactly who′s in charge"
Today's Headlines
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Afghanistan
Afghan forces kill 150 Taliban in Afghanistan: official
Afghan forces killed 150 suspected Taliban fighters in northwest Afghanistan in an operation in late March and captured the ousted hardline militia's former governor of Badghis province, an official has revealed. The extremists had planned to takeover Badghis as part of a coordinated spring offensive across the country, Hajji Abdul Wahid Tawakoli, deputy intelligence director of neighbouring Herat province, the official said. "Ten days ago a big group of well-organised Taliban had planned to take over control of Badghis province and then spread their territory towards Herat and other provinces," Tawakoli said by telephone from Herat city. "In this attempt they attacked some military posts in Badghis province and the Badghis mujahedin (militia) asked for some help from Herat. Lots of mujahedin went from Herat to help them. This clean-up operation lasted two days in Bala Murghab district as a result of which around 150 Taliban got killed."
Golly. The cockles of my heart are all warm and toasty.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 01:45 pm || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  This can't be right, the Taliban have regrouped and are retaking Afghanistan because we got distracted by Iraq which has nothing to do with the war on terror it's because of the oil. It sez so right here in the paper so it has to be true! Right? Huh?
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 13:56 Comments || Top||

#2  It's all part of the quagmire that will trap and humiliate America, just like the Soviet defeat, creating a thousand Bin Ladens, because the U.S. doesn't have staying power and we can't do "nation building" and...and....did I miss anything ?
Posted by: Dixie Normus || 04/08/2003 15:26 Comments || Top||

#3  the Zionist enemy?
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 18:07 Comments || Top||

#4  I just shaved, I'm not growing that beard again!
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/08/2003 18:44 Comments || Top||

#5  Huzzah!

now what was that sqeaky, whiney little voice demanding the UN be allowed to dictate terms in post-Saddam Iraq, after doing NONE of the hard work to liberate?
Posted by: anon1 || 04/08/2003 19:03 Comments || Top||


Afghan Troops Capture 20 Taliban Fighters
American troops began a search for suspected Taliban fighters in a remote southern corner of Afghanistan on Tuesday, while Afghan government soldiers arrested 20 Taliban suspects in separate raids, officials said. The U.S. soldiers were conducting house-to-house searches in Sangeen district of Helmand province, said Dad Mohammed Khan, head of the province's intelligence department. He did not say how many U.S. troops were involved in the operation. Khan said the American troops may be looking for former Taliban commanders Mullah Dadullah and Mullah Akhtar Mohammed. The two were reported in the area some time ago, according to the intelligence official. Mullah Akhtar Mohammed and his brother, Abul Hassan, were in Sangeen district recently and distributed satellite phones and money among their supporters in several villages in the district, Khan said.
Satellite phones? How nice, we'll be sure to listen in.
Separately, three Afghan government troops were wounded in a gun fight with suspected Taliban fighters in Zabul province, the region's governor, Hamidullah Khan, said Tuesday. The soldiers were injured Sunday when nearly 50 Taliban fighters attacked a government checkpost in the Shingai district of Zabul province, Khan said. The Taliban fled after a brief gun battle, but government troops captured 20 of them on Monday during raids on several villages in the region.
50 attacked, only 3 Afghan troops wounded and they bagged 20 bad guys after the attack failed. Not bad, not bad at all.
The chief of the international peacekeeping force in the capital Kabul said Tuesday it appeared attacks outside the city were on the rise, but stressed the capital itself is still secure. Lt. Gen. Norbert van Heyst, the German commander of the International Security Assistance Force known as ISAF, said patrols and inspections had been stepped up in Kabul after five fuel tankers rigged with explosives were found in the city. "I feel there are an increasing number of incidents in the provinces outside of Kabul, but Kabul itself seems to be relatively calm," van Heyst said.
Good thing you found those tankers, that would have disturbed your calm.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 08:05 am || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  GOod to see the Afghan government troops strike a win.

The more professional, cohesive, strong and proud they are the better for the country. Get them stronger than the warlords!

It would be good, too, if they can mix up the tribes in the units, so that they break down the tribal barriers and bond as a cohesive army: that would do a lot for the country, too.
Posted by: anon1 || 04/08/2003 8:33 Comments || Top||


Arabia
Soddies demand Iraq war be stopped
Saudi Arabia asked for halting the US war against Iraq once more on Monday. Saudi King Fahd said at the beginning of a cabinet session here, according to Saudi Arabia's SPA news agency, that all efforts on the part of the Arab and Islamic world leaders should be focussed on ending the US-led war against Iraq. At the end of the said meeting, a communique was issued, in which the Saudi government's serious concern over the need to respect the international laws, and to try to save the lives of the the innocent civilians are emphatically stressed. The communique reads in part, "Baghdad is known as the Peace City in the Islamic world, and has a significant place in the Arab world history, therefore, both its civilian residents, and its historical heritage should be safeguarded and preserved painstakingly, and that is not possible amid such heavy bombardments." The communique further stresses that it is high time for the United Nations, as the representative of the global community, to become more dynamically involved in securing the future and territorial integrity of one of its independent members, the Arabic Republic of Iraq."
Yup. Baghdad: City of Peace. Hand me a tissue, wouldja?
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 09:37 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Aw, gee. I'm gettin' all misty here...
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 10:08 Comments || Top||

#2  PPPHHHHHHHTTTTTT!!!!!!! I emit the gas of elderberries in your general direction!
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 10:34 Comments || Top||

#3  Memo to King Fahd: you're next, baby! Be sure YOUR bunker has enough whiskey and Moroccan hookers to hold you until the bunker busters send you to Virginland.
Posted by: Ned || 04/08/2003 10:35 Comments || Top||

#4  An editorial from Dar al-Hayat (Lebanon, UK) proves that at least some Arabs are capable of sober thoughts:
http://english.daralhayat.com/column/08-04-2003/Article-20030408-6cacb636-c0a8-01fc-000b-bb6198bc4ab9/story.html
Posted by: Anonon || 04/08/2003 12:19 Comments || Top||

#5  Guys, don't listen to the words, watch the hands. The Soddis want a ceasefire, but they're letting us use some of the military facilities, and we have overflight rights for our missiles fired from the Red Sea. This communique was for domestic consumption, pure and simple. No worries.
Posted by: Steve White || 04/08/2003 12:38 Comments || Top||

#6  Ptah- And your father was a hamster. ;-)
Posted by: Craig || 04/08/2003 14:05 Comments || Top||

#7  King Fahd, don't worry. Just mopping up around here. We'll be done soon. We're kinda busy reading these files Sammy left at the palace, so we'll get back to you once we're done.
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 14:32 Comments || Top||

#8  Dear Faud,
We will be pulling out of those Saudi airbases shortly. We are moving to some new facilities we recently acquired. We do get our security deposit back, right?
Posted by: Capsu78 || 04/08/2003 14:56 Comments || Top||

#9  Saudi Arabia has: 17,000,000 citizens; 7,000,000 literates; 700,000 polygamists (much more horney poor males who are out of the wife' pool); 5,000 members of the House of Saud; 1 US President. Bush is a born Wahabi ass-kisser, and he will die one.
Posted by: Anonon || 04/08/2003 17:18 Comments || Top||

#10  Bush personally nominated Daniel Pipes for some strategic board of peace studies or something: he is NOT a wahhabi arse-kisser. He just plays politics smart-like.

He'll get around to them, don't worry.

The Wahhabis will be crushed, not by America but by their own beloved house of Saud.

Posted by: anon1 || 04/08/2003 19:14 Comments || Top||


German Arrested in Riyadh for Alleged Al-Qaeda Link
The German Foreign Office has confirmed the detention of a German national in Saudi Arabia. He was allegedly involved in a terrorist attack on a Tunisian synagogue last year which killed 21 people, including 14 German tourists. The German national has been identified as Christian Ganczarski, a Muslim sometimes known as Abu Ibrahim. Ganczarski, 36, who is also wanted in the US, was arrested in the Kingdom after Germany provided information to the Saudi government. Germany and Saudi Arabia currently have no extradition treaty, but local sources said that the Kingdom and Germany were cooperating on this issue. The German federal prosecutor’s office said it did not have sufficient evidence to hold the suspect. It also said that it had no legal grounds to block him from going to Saudi Arabia.
If I remember correctly, Abu skipped town after the Germans had to let him go. Nice to know where he is.
In the meantime, US authorities are said to be interested in seeking Ganczarski’s extradition to the United States for interrogation about his knowledge of Osama Bin Laden. Ganczarski is believed to have been a frequent guest of Bin Laden at a residential complex of the Al-Qaeda ringleader in Afghanistan.
Is there anyone that Binny didn't meet? You must have had to take a number and wait in line.
In another development, Interior Minister Prince Naif disclosed yesterday that Syria had handed over to the Kingdom 10 Saudis who fought in Afghanistan. “The men are currently in the Kingdom and have been allowed to meet with their relatives,” Prince Naif told reporters. He did not say when they were handed over, why they had been in Syria or if they were being detained.
"No comment"
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 08:55 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Abu got out of Germany because it's a country where individual rights mean something. It's a wonderful irony that the Muslim Saudis can hold him because they operate a totalitarian state...
Posted by: Dan H. || 04/08/2003 11:45 Comments || Top||


Europe
France, Germany, Russia announce weekend summit
France, Germany and Russia have taken swift action on the heels of today's summit meeting between US President George Bush and British Prime Minister Tony Blair, announcing that they will be holding their own summit in Russia this weekend.
"So there! An' you can't come, so don't even ask! Nyeh!"
France’s Chirac and UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan will be joining Russian President Vladimir Putin and German Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder in Saint Petersburg. The Kremlin press service announced Tuesday that French President Jacques Chirac is to make a two-day working visit to Saint Petersburg on Friday for talks with his Russian counterpart Vladimir Putin. The visit in Russia's second city will coincide with a two-day Russo-German summit at which Putin is scheduled to hold talks with Chancellor Gerhard Schroeder.
"What shall we do now, Jacques?"
"I don't know. What do we do now, Gerhard?"
"I know nossing! Vhat do ve do now, Vladimir?"
"I don't know. What do we do now, Stanley?"
"I don't know. What do we do now, Ollie?"

Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 02:09 pm || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Target of opportunity....load up the GBU's.
Posted by: Rex Mundi || 04/08/2003 14:16 Comments || Top||

#2  "I don't know. What do we do now, Kofi?"

"Vladimir - any expensive five-star restaurants we can go to? I'm buying!"
Posted by: Raj || 04/08/2003 14:16 Comments || Top||

#3  The "Irrevelant Gang of Four" meets. Why? To commiserate? Not! Rather to plan a strategy to get back in the game. This should be interesting.
Posted by: jc || 04/08/2003 14:21 Comments || Top||

#4  Here's another fine mess you got us into!
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 04/08/2003 14:34 Comments || Top||

#5  The Axis of Losers.
Posted by: El Id || 04/08/2003 14:39 Comments || Top||

#6  Hey, where's Belgium? Guess they are stuck in Brussels looking at Mannekin Pis.
That should be a lesson in French gratitude to the other three.
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 14:50 Comments || Top||

#7  Jeez you guys are good... Great comments!

Y'know, this might be an interview for Kofi to try to keep his job when they try to reconstitute the UN in Paris...
Posted by: PD || 04/08/2003 15:12 Comments || Top||

#8  Vlad: wanna trade your basket-case economy for mine?

Jack: sacre bleu dude, I wouldn't trade the Ivory Coast for your economy. enough of your sick ruskie humor

Jerry: amen brother. vlad, we only invited you because W likes you. we need cover. but don't bring us your domestic gloom. we got our own issues right now, and we're seasoned veterans when it comes to dealing with criminal economies, and your dark talk is killing our buzz.
Posted by: defscribe || 04/08/2003 15:14 Comments || Top||

#9  President Bush needs to Make a Speech on the u n. He needs to state an intention to Start Over with a new governing body, call it a NewN or something else. In doing so we as a country need to reaffirm to the World that our core principles of Individual Liberty, Private Property and Justice according to law will not take a back seat to u n proclaimations. If he wants my vote he needs to nip these fools and their subversion in the bud.
Posted by: AnonymousLy yours || 04/08/2003 15:50 Comments || Top||

#10  Just announced on TF1, Bush is visiting Vlad in St. Petersburg. He's suppose to make a small offer to Russia in terms of the future of iraq oil. TF1 asserted that he's trying to break up the axis of idiots!
Posted by: George || 04/08/2003 16:28 Comments || Top||

#11  playing isolate Chirac? Can you see the aftermath of Bush's visit?
Jacques: "so...what did he say? did he mention me? we're still, uh, together, right? All for one, one for all and all that sh&t?
Vlad: "He was just in the neighborhood and stopped by...and it wasn't like we're going steady or nuthin, Jacques...don't be like that, I can see him if I want"
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 18:12 Comments || Top||

#12  And these Euroweenies don't even consider that fact that they wouldn't even be visiting Saint Petersburg if not for the steadfastness of the USA and President Ronald Reagan. Rotten Bastards.
Posted by: Don || 04/08/2003 18:38 Comments || Top||

#13  Now W begins to gather Frequent Flyer miles. This should be good!
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/08/2003 18:49 Comments || Top||

#14  Borscht, beer,bakedgoods bullshit, what weekend.
Posted by: Wills || 04/08/2003 20:17 Comments || Top||

#15  and the coalition barely notice...
Posted by: Reed || 04/08/2003 21:53 Comments || Top||

#16  Update via Command Post - Kofi's not going. There's a meeting on 4/17 with more UN members he's going to instead.
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/09/2003 1:01 Comments || Top||

#17  Update via Command Post - Kofi's not going. There's a meeting on 4/17 with more UN members he's going to instead.
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/09/2003 1:01 Comments || Top||


France sets up Muslim council
Amid mounting fears that the US-led war against Iraq could trigger violence among France's 5 million Muslims, French Islamic leaders voted yesterday to elect the members of a new national council aimed at giving the faith's diverse factions a unified voice and represent their views to government.
The Islamic Republic of Frogistan. It'll be here sooner then you think.
Islam is the second biggest religion in France after Roman Catholicism. One recent poll showed nearly one in three of the population as a whole did not want to see an allied victory in Iraq, while a poll of French Muslims published in Le Figaro on Saturday showed that 94% of respondents disapproved of the war and 72% wanted Saddam Hussein to win.
Sorry, to disappoint you. Well, not really...
The French Muslim council, to be known by its acronym CFCM, is seen as critical to France's efforts to satisfy the needs and expectations of its Muslim community, most of whom are relatively poor first- and second-generation immigrants from the former North African colonies of Algeria, Morocco and Tunisia. It is also seen as a potentially vital bulwark against the rise of Islamic fundamentalism.
Oh, suuuuure, it is! Christ, the war hasn't even started yet and they're surrendering. That's bad even for them.
A leading moderate, the rector of the Paris mosque, Dalil Boubakeur, is widely expected to become president of the new body after the second round of voting on April 13. Mr Boubakeur has warned that the war in Iraq risked creating "a new and far tougher breed of Islam" in France.
...and, as the old TV show used to say, " And, remember. You Asked For It."
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 12:01 pm || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  That's funny when radicals in the USA have power like the KKK the USA divides and conquers them. In France the idea is to give them structure and power. Vous Faites beaucoup du sens? Now I know why I want to escape this country.
Posted by: George || 04/08/2003 12:34 Comments || Top||

#2  Next step: Shari'a. Enjoy.
Posted by: Rex Mundi || 04/08/2003 12:35 Comments || Top||

#3  If the Frogs do a competent job, they'll get rapprochement with the sane Muslims and marginalize the much smaller wacky cohorts. I view this with (heavily guarded) optimism.
Posted by: Sade || 04/08/2003 13:03 Comments || Top||

#4  "The French Muslim council, to be known by its acronym CFCM..."

C F--k 'Em. That is a hell of an acronym
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 04/08/2003 13:06 Comments || Top||

#5  France wants to decline into the 3rd World. Frog-logic sees this as the best way to avoid terror attacks, and the Frogs place a high value on avoidance.

No wonder so much of their culture is impenetrable to us. Americans can not stand the stench of defeatism.

dang wussies!
Posted by: defscribe || 04/08/2003 13:07 Comments || Top||

#6  George: If you mean it, c'mon over! In post WW-V we'll need translators and people who can explain the inner working of French politics and public-think. It makes no sense to us. Top pay and you'll actually be appreciated for your contribution. But one word of advice: melt, brother, melt. Become one of us, not a hyphenated tumor on the body politic, please.
Posted by: PD || 04/08/2003 13:29 Comments || Top||

#7  France wants to be the second nuclear Islamic country?? George, run for it. Leave before Christian Dior previews its new spring burqa line.
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 14:44 Comments || Top||

#8  George, If you leave the Surrender-Monkeys to suffer in their own stench, I'll buy you an inferior (Well, superior to French beer though.)American beer when you arrive.
Posted by: Mike N. || 04/08/2003 15:10 Comments || Top||

#9  It is classically French though isn;t it? To cave in rather than stand up for or against something that is.

The French have let so many Muslims immigrate to their country that they're losing whatever it used to be to be French. Current estimates I've seen put France under Shia law within the next 15-25 years. 'Course, by then the Vichy government ought to be back up and in coercion with their CFCM (Islamofascist) "brothers" just like they were 60 years ago.
Posted by: FOTSGreg || 04/08/2003 15:39 Comments || Top||

#10  The French Muslim council, to be known by its acronym ,CFCM

Hmmmmm...
Could that mean, Completely Freakin' Crazy Muslims?
Posted by: Celissa || 04/08/2003 18:44 Comments || Top||

#11  Mebbe Coercing Fatwa-Creating Mullahs
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 04/08/2003 18:49 Comments || Top||

#12  Get a grip, guys. France wields nuclear weapons. France going Sharia will be as bad as if we never went to Iraq.
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 19:27 Comments || Top||

#13  Hopefully the same fools that designed the De gaulle, were in charge of nuke production
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 20:29 Comments || Top||

#14  Yes, and Proche-Orient reports that an Islamist majority will win next Sunday's elections. These pigs will make demands on the secular government, and put France's 5,000,000 Islamaniacs on the street if they don't get them. France is finished. Take your investment funds out of that crap country.
Posted by: Anonon || 04/08/2003 21:40 Comments || Top||

#15  --Proche-Orient reports that an Islamist majority will win next Sunday's elections.--

Wonder if that'll raise some eyebrows.

france has decided to state-fund islamic schools, the thinking is the bureaucracy can control content.
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/09/2003 1:05 Comments || Top||

#16  --Proche-Orient reports that an Islamist majority will win next Sunday's elections.--

Wonder if that'll raise some eyebrows.

france has decided to state-fund islamic schools, the thinking is the bureaucracy can control content.
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/09/2003 1:05 Comments || Top||


European analyst: War is in its last days
A Middle East expert at a leading European think tank said Tuesday that the war in Iraq is in its last stage and that he does not think the US would target other countries in the region.
Cheeze! This guy's really on top of it, isn't he? Thank God we have experts to tell us things like that!
"I think that the war is in its last days. It is a matter of time that the dead body of Saddam Hussein is found," Michael Emerson, senior research fellow at the Brussels-based Centre for European Policy Studies, told IRNA. He noted that the Iraqi population at the moment are "not dancing but they are also not hostile and are passively receiving the US and British forces." Emerson said the Bathist leadership in Iraq has three choices now: to get killed, give themselves up, or hide.
That about covers all the options. I guess they could just lie down and begin to rot, too...
On post-war US plans for the region, Emerson said he did not think that the Americans are going to attack Iran or Syria. "They will be quite busy in establishing a new government in Iraq. I think it will be for quite some time, he said. He said that in today's meeting, Blair will be telling Bush "cool down buddy."
No, we're not going to attack them. We're going to engage in a lengthy and intricate and very tedious diplomatic dance, on a dance floor that's much altered from the way it was before this war. Syria and Iran don't have to meet the 3rd Infantry Division. Nor does Soddy Arabia. But they've got to start remodeling their political houses — the Baathists become democrats, the ayatollahs introduce personal liberties. Basically, we demand surrender instead of war. We'll push China to deal with North Korea, Singapore and Malaysia to deal with Indonesia, and we're going to become a little less compromising with the Soddies. I dunno what we're going to do with Pakistan — probably trade it in on a dog and shoot the dog.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 10:32 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Poor dog. I suggest trading Pakland in for a rat and flush the rat down the crapper.
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 10:35 Comments || Top||

#2  "I dunno what we're going to do with Pakistan — probably trade it in on a dog and shoot the dog"

I suppose we'll give Musharraf some more time to reign in the fundos. I give him a 10% chance of pulling it off. Then, hopefully, we'll have the good sense to cut a deal with India and do what needs to be done in regards to Pakistan.
Posted by: Patrick Phillips || 04/08/2003 10:38 Comments || Top||

#3  Meaning I should put my retirement fund into a good paving an asphalt company?
Posted by: Fred || 04/08/2003 10:45 Comments || Top||

#4  Fred -- either that, or try shorting TotalFinaElf.
Can't we shoot a cat instead? Dogs are loyal animals, not at all like the French.
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 14:54 Comments || Top||

#5  I like the dog idea, except for shooting it. Well, it is pakland, so the dog would haveta be rabid I'm sure, so OK. Nice islamic insult trading for a dog, which they believe is unclean
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 18:20 Comments || Top||

#6  Malaysia ain't gonna deal with Indo.

Dr Mahatir is a beligerant Muslim wanna-be Islamofascist.

He has openly called for a return to the Islamic Gold Dinar as a unifying currency for the Muslim world as a big F* You to the US dollar. They think they can bring down the US economy by returning the Islamic world to a gold standard.

Indonesia is a BIG problem, worlds most populous Islamo-nation. Just last night Megawati was threatening Australia over our stance on Iraq.

Veiled threats, sure, but threats none the less.

The problems stem from the epicentre of Java.
Posted by: anon1 || 04/08/2003 19:43 Comments || Top||


Fifth Column
Protestors delay frigate deployment
Edited for brevity.
Greenpeace protestors have managed to stall the departure of an Australian navy frigate which was heading to join troops in the Persian Gulf. Two protestors attached themselves to the bow and stern of the HMAS Sydney as it was leaving Sydney Harbor Tuesday morning. Other protestors in boats cast a mooring rope across the path of the frigate, forcing it to first stop, then begin returning to its base at Garden Island in the middle of Sydney Harbor. Both protestors attached themselves with ropes to the ship as it was moving after pulling up alongside the vessel in motorboats. The protestors both carried Greenpeace signs and one was able to unfurl a "No War" banner while hanging precariously from near the bow of the naval vessel.

Sydney Water Police removed and arrested both protestors after about 15 minutes. Another protestor on a surfboard also attempted to disrupt the ship's departure, before being picked up by police. It is not yet known whether the mooring line caused any damage to the ship and the vessel has now resumed its journey to the Gulf, steaming out of the heads of Sydney Harbor just before noon Tuesday. HMAS Sydney is destined to replace two other Australian frigates operating in the Persian Gulf as part of the coalition forces attempting to remove Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein from power. The frigate is expected to take three weeks to reach the Persian Gulf, where it will join another navy vessel operating there, HMAS Kanimbla.

Australian Prime Minister John Howard early Tuesday farewelled the HMAS Sydney, saying the troops had the support of all Australians. He later criticized the actions of the protestors saying they had no regard for the feelings of the sailors or their families. "These clowns ought to understand that and if they think that's winning support to their cause, they're very badly mistaken," Howard told radio listeners. "I'm sure they'll be dealt with by the law and they should be."
Tell it like it is!
Posted by: Dar Steckelberg || 04/08/2003 09:27 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  One of the Greenappeasement protestors was also previously arrested for trespassing on US military property, hindering the launch of the Star Wars missile defence shield thingie a couple of years back. Saw him clearly on the news, taking it again for Greenpeace-at-any-price.

Professional protestors all.

Time to give them professional jail sentences, though I feel sorry for that guy he is being used as a pawn (again).

Can't the government sue Greenpeace the corporate organisation for the expense of sending out the police rescue teams? public endangerment?

Surely there are civil damages to be awarded, money to be recouped?

And we could add the Greens on the list of defendants to be prosecuted, their MP Ian Cohen was also arrested to his great joy and pride.
Posted by: anon1 || 04/08/2003 9:52 Comments || Top||

#2  They shoulda just left them attached.
Posted by: Rawsnacks || 04/08/2003 9:54 Comments || Top||

#3  Start a fashion - dongle-protestors!

Every navy'll want some...
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 10:09 Comments || Top||

#4  If it's possible to train dolphins to sweep mines and deal with frogmen, why not train orcas to consume Greenpeaceniks? Maybe it's because their anaemic vegan flesh tastes too much like tofu. Sadly it's the French who've shown the way when it comes to dealing with these ecopirates.
Posted by: Bulldog || 04/08/2003 10:40 Comments || Top||

#5  After putting up with Greenpeace's antics for a while, the U.S. Navy started giving them some rough (and embarrassing) handling in the late 80s and early 90s. As a consequence, Greenpeace seems to be steering clear of the U.S. Navy and looking for more tolerant targets.
Posted by: Patrick Phillips || 04/08/2003 10:45 Comments || Top||

#6  Maybe we should train orcas instead of dolphins.

"Mmmmm....Greenpeace Protesters......taste like chicken"

---Ollie the Orca
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 04/08/2003 10:50 Comments || Top||

#7  Patrick--Got any links for goodies on that theme? I'd love to read a few!
Posted by: Dar Steckelberg || 04/08/2003 10:54 Comments || Top||

#8  Greenpeacers eaten by whales? Is that one of those irony things?

Dar Steckelberg, sorry, but I'm going on memory. Back in '89 Greenpeace was blocking Trident missile tests by running their ship and several rubber rafts through the launch zone.

They got away with that ONCE. The next time there was a destroyer in the area that shouldered (that's a polite way of saying "not a direct ram") the Greenpeace ship out of the way while using firehouses to pour water into the ship's stack -- flooding the Greenpeace ship's boilers. Meanwhile, in the launch zone, waiting for the rubber rafts, were SEALS with knives. It was a short joyride for the rubber-raft drivers.

I don't know if there were any other consequences for Greenpeace. But ever since, you don't read too much about Greenpeace hassling the USN.
Posted by: Patrick Phillips || 04/08/2003 11:03 Comments || Top||

#9  Heh, heh, heh. That's good enough! Thanks for the memories! :-)
Posted by: Dar Steckelberg || 04/08/2003 11:23 Comments || Top||

#10  Patrick---Enjoyed the post. All we need is a little institutional memory to realize that the best way to deal with Greenpeace chaps is to use SEALS, so we don't need the orcas yet.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 04/08/2003 13:30 Comments || Top||

#11  Actually, that's a superb way to deal with all these idiots. I recommended to the State of Colorado that they begin targeting "environmental organizations" that try to stop the clearing of dead timber in State forests. Most of the time, these groups file nuisance lawsuits that stop the process until the State answers them. I suggested that every time there's a forest fire in Colorado that requires the State to respond, the people who have sued to stop logging and thinning be held accountable as "accessories after the fact". I haven't seen any OFFICIAL response, but supposedly one enviro group settled out of court for some big bucks.

There are consequences to behavior. More and more often, these "Environmental groups" cause more problems than they solve. They should be held accountable, in a court of law, for any expenses they force upon local, state, or federal government.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 04/08/2003 13:57 Comments || Top||

#12  Seems like everyone has their breaking point with Peagrease sooner or later. Like the American approach - must've been fun for (almost) all concerned, but the French way - blow up their flagship whilst the crew are asleep - had a certain finalite.
Posted by: Bulldog || 04/08/2003 14:00 Comments || Top||


Oakland Police Fire Non-Lethal Projectiles at Protesters
Don't even think about questioning their patriotism!Police opened fire with non-lethal projectiles at an anti-war protest at the Port of Oakland on Monday, injuring at least a dozen demonstrators and six longshoremen standing nearby. Most of the 500 demonstrators were dispersed peacefully, but police shot the projectiles at two gates when protesters refused to move and some of them allegedly threw rocks and bolts. The longshoremen, pinned against a fence, were caught in the line of fire. Police spokeswoman Danielle Ashford said officers fired bean-bag rounds and wooden dowels. They also used "sting balls," which send out a spray of BB-sized rubber pellets and a cloud of tear gas and feel like a bee sting when they hit someone. Demonstrators said they targeted the port because at least one company there is handling war supplies. They said it was the first time they had been fired upon in Bay area protests since the Iraq war began last month. "Oakland police are being the most aggressive of any department I've seen in the Bay area since the war began," said protester Damien McAnany, a database manager. "The San Francisco Police Department never used any of this stuff against us."
I guess they thought the Oakland police would give them flowers and hugs.

About 200 of the port demonstrators later marched to the federal building in Oakland, blocking a street and chanting: "Out of the office and into the streets! U.S. out of the Middle East!" They were joined by Oakland City Council members Jane Bruner and Jean Quan. "They should not have been using the wooden bullets," Bruner said. "Given what's happening in the world today, we're going to be seeing more of this. And we should be prepared to handle it."
Sounds to me as if it was handled just right...

Oakland Police said at least 31 people were arrested. "Some people were blocking port property and the port authorities asked us to move them off," said Deputy Police Chief Patrick Haw. "Police moved aggressively against crowds because some people threw rocks and big iron bolts at officers." Nevertheless, Police Chief Richard Word said the department would evaluate the officers' tactics. The dowels are supposed to be shot at the ground and carom up to strike their target, Word said, but some of the injured complained that officers took direct aim at them. Mayor Jerry Brown said police were right in trying to keep order. He blamed the melee on a handful of protesters. "When a guy picks up a bolt and throws it at a policeman, he's setting in motion a chain of events," Brown said. Six longshoremen were treated by paramedics, some of whom had bloody welts the size of a silver dollar.
It's a shame that six innocent bystanders were harmed as a result of the protesters' idiocy.

"I was standing as far back as I could," said longshoremen Kevin Wilson. "It was very scary. All of that force wasn't necessary." Steve Stallone, spokesman for the International Longshore and Warehouse Union, said most of the dockworkers went back to work after the protesters left. A few were too shaken up to return. Protests also took place Monday at the federal building in San Francisco and at the Concord Naval Weapons Station. And seven people were arrested when they temporarily blocked an exit ramp off Interstate 280 in San Francisco.
Posted by: Bent Pyramid || 04/08/2003 06:25 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I'm reminded of an ancient Egyptian proverb: "A man's ears are on his back--he hears only when he is beaten".
Posted by: Bent Pyramid || 04/08/2003 6:42 Comments || Top||

#2  "They should not have been using the wooden bullets," Bruner said.

You've got that right. Throwing rocks and bolts at police and failing to move as ordered should merit a few well-placed real bullets.
Posted by: Tom || 04/08/2003 7:12 Comments || Top||

#3  You're obstructing the perfectly legal business activities of an entire port, are throwing missiles at police with intent to cause injury, and then have the hide to complain about efforts made to remove your waste-of-space carcasses out of the way? These lefties are riding on a wave of hypocrisy they've been building up for so long we're expected to let them get away with anything short of clubbing their oponents unconscious.
Posted by: Bulldog || 04/08/2003 7:44 Comments || Top||

#4  Gentlemen, gentlemen... You don't understand!

The protestors' rights always supersede everybody else's rights!

We're all equal. They're just more equal.
Posted by: Dar Steckelberg || 04/08/2003 8:23 Comments || Top||

#5  Some of the longshoremen were actively involved in the 'demonstration'.
Posted by: Parabellum || 04/08/2003 8:27 Comments || Top||

#6  Oakland is in SF, right?

Well protests are a way of life in SF, it's like their indigenous culture or something.

When I was there I saw their 'reclaim the streets' bike thing, it was hilarious. They tried to have it in Sydney too, but no way is it as funny here as it is in SF.

It's OK, the police are developing more and more non-lethal protestor-dispersal tactics all the time. I particularly liked that part about Sting Balls.

When can we import them?

I would like to be a police officer in the Protest Response division: a specialist hippie-deterrent. How much fun would that be? Sting balls all round I say.

Tom, I hope your comment is for entertainment purposes only!
Posted by: anon1 || 04/08/2003 8:29 Comments || Top||

#7  "Oakland police are being the most aggressive of any department I've seen in the Bay area since the war began," said protester Damien McAnany, a database manager. "The San Francisco Police Department never used any of this stuff against us."

Oakland PD must be Raider fans. Guess we won't be seeing too many protests in that town for awhile. We'll stay across the Bay where they'll put up with our shit.
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 8:35 Comments || Top||

#8  "...protester Damien McAnany, a database manager"

is that what you call yourself when you're unemployed, but have a list of jobs available from the want ads?
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 8:52 Comments || Top||

#9  Sorry to let you down, anon1, but my comment was not for entertainment purposes only. Civil protest is one thing, but I have zero tolerance for people throwing rocks and bolts at our police. As far as I'm concerned, they've crossed the line. Not that I'd want them shot in the chest, but a few leg wounds wouldn't upset me. On the other hand, a serious fine and/or jail term would suffice. I'm talking $10,000, not $20, and 90 days, not 90 minutes.
Posted by: Tom || 04/08/2003 9:04 Comments || Top||

#10  "Out of the office and into the streets! U.S. out of the Middle East!"

Oh, fer Pete's sake. Who thinks up this crap?
Posted by: Patrick Phillips || 04/08/2003 9:09 Comments || Top||

#11  I'm with you 100%, Tom. They are assaulting the police with intent to cause bodily harm and should be dealt with appropriately! There is no excuse for that behavior, but there is an answer to it.
Posted by: Dar Steckelberg || 04/08/2003 9:33 Comments || Top||

#12  Back in the city where I lived several hundred people came to protest after the war started; they gathered on the main drag in front of the university, blocking traffic. The police were very polite and simply redirected traffic around them (no small feat in this town). My sister later overheard one of the protesters talking to someone about the protest. She said "We sat down on the drag, and when we realized the police officers weren't going to rough us up (which was our goal), we decided to march to Congress."

Kinda answers the question why a "peace activist" would throw rocks and bolts in a crowd of people, don't it?

Posted by: TheMightyEmu || 04/08/2003 9:35 Comments || Top||

#13  Murat from your posts of lately compared to previous posts it seems your getting a little frustrated. Things not going your way?

Give the guys some time for the chems, anyway we may have to go to damascus to get all of them.
Posted by: Dan || 04/08/2003 10:11 Comments || Top||

#14  Notice: OAKLAND AIN'T SF. The SFPD let you fools lie in the streets and annoy pretty much everyone, thanks to the wimp city government.

Oakland is a whole 'nother deal. They WILL beat your ass. As they did in the 60's, though many seem to have selective memories of that decade...
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 10:12 Comments || Top||

#15  Mojo's right. The Rodney King Riots wouldn't have taken place if the LAPD had been as tough on the inciters as the Police of the surrounding communities were on theirs.
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 10:40 Comments || Top||

#16  SF and Oakland are separated by the Bay Bridge, joked by some to be the longest in the world.
Two completely different police departments.
SF is given over to war protesters.
Oakland, at times, borders on being a war zone.
Posted by: Dishman || 04/08/2003 11:16 Comments || Top||

#17  I would also add that the Port of Oakland, where it appears the incident took place, is site of the 3rd largest port facility on the Western US, with a massive container shipment operation. The ports and container shipment areas are much tougher on security since 9/11.
The treatment you would receive here in a high security area located on privately run property is justifiably harsher than what you would get on the steps of City Hall in SF.
The mayor critisizing the protestors is non other than former CA Governor "Moonbeam" Jerry Brown whose history and political bent is way left, so I was glad he came down on the side of common sense too.
Posted by: Capsu78 || 04/08/2003 12:22 Comments || Top||

#18  "Oakland police are being the most aggressive of any department I've seen in the Bay area since the war began," said protester Damien McAnany, a database manager. "The San Francisco Police Department never used any of this stuff against us."

Hey, Damian, it's called "sending a message"! You ought to be familiar with that concept.
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 15:07 Comments || Top||

#19  Why do they always try to make these whackos look mainstream? If they were mainstraim there would be a Million people out there each time not 500. These are the remnants of the broken down lefties organizations. I applaud the OPD for their non-lethal response to these holigans. I bet they pick a different place to picket (in SF).
Posted by: Cyber Sarge || 04/08/2003 18:25 Comments || Top||

#20  "Demonstrators said they targeted the port because at least one company there is handling war supplies"
attempting to stop supplies ffrom reaching the troops! Wouldn't it be nice if the could try them for treason? May be more effective than the rubber bullet sin stopping the protests.
Posted by: scott || 04/08/2003 18:35 Comments || Top||


India-Pakistan
Gas supply suspended as Pakistani tribesmen blow up gas pipelines
Supply of gas to parts of provinces of eastern Punjab and the North West Frontier provinces were suspended as two gas pipelines were blown up, allegedly by warring Neanderthals tribesmen early Tuesday morning, officials said. The pipelines, bring gas from Sui gas fields in southwestern Baluchistan, caught fire and the authorities shut compress injection to control the blaze, Director Sui Northern Gas Pipeline Abdur Rashid Lone told the state-run television. He said that one pipeline was blown up at 3 a.m. in the morning, followed by another blast two hours later. Lone said that fire fighters have been sent to the area to extinguish the fire. He said that repair of the damaged pipeline would start soon. Gas to the domestic consumers is being provided from other sources. The incident is a source of major embarrassment for the government as it is the third time in less than four months that the pipelines were blown up. The recent blast of the pipeline is attributed to the clash between the Bugti and Mazari primitives tribesmen. The warring hominids tribesmen, use rockets to attack each other in the region, where provinces of Baluchistan, Punjab and Sindh converge.
But that's okay, 'cuz both sides are devout Muslims...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 11:15 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Do these people know how to do anything but destroy?
Posted by: Dave D. || 04/08/2003 11:51 Comments || Top||

#2  They are good at making AK47 knock-offs.
Posted by: RW || 04/08/2003 17:15 Comments || Top||


Pakistan closes 'lots' of Kashmiri training camps: FM
Pakistan Foreign Minister Khurshid Mehmood Kasuri has said that Pakistan has closed camps for the training of Kashmiris as well as stopped collection of money for the fighters in public places.
"How many'd you close?"
"Lots."

"We have done a lot. Lots of training camps have been closed and we have stopped public donations for those fighting for Kashmir," Kasuri told the UN information news service in Islamabad, lying through his teeth. He was replying to a question that there has been a lot of pressure from the international community, post-11 September, to stop the infiltration over the line of control in the Pakistan-controlled Kashmir, but it has not stopped.
Cheeze. Even the UN noticed, huh?
The foreign minister said that some of the Kashmiri leaders have also been arrested and then released, adding Pakistan is trying to control the movement in the area and it has been reduced considerably. He reiterated Pakistan's suggestion for deployment of international monitoring to check cross-border-moment. "If some people are prepared to die despite efforts by the Pakistan army and police forces, my question to the international community is: there are 250,000 Indian soldiers on the line of control itself, which means there is one soldier for every three meters and, if they can't control the infiltration, how do they expect us to," he asked.
It'll be controlled when they've paved it, won't it?
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 11:08 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "we have stopped public donations for those fighting for Kashmir"
Private donations are welcome.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 11:12 Comments || Top||

#2  The Fuck they have:
[Extremist Groups Renew Activity in Pakistan; Support of Kashmir Militants Is at Odds With the War on Terrorism]
Yes, I know the website is Indian but the article was originally written in the washington post which I can't find any more. Here is the original source. The content has been moved but the title and picture is still there.
Posted by: rg117 || 04/08/2003 11:33 Comments || Top||

#3  In my estimate Pak-jihadis in NWFP and Balochistan will get their hands on $100,000,000 in US aid, distributed under Pigistan's constitutional redistribution formula. And these wild animals endorse suicide massacre against American soldiers. I have made several law firms aware of the gross negligence of the Norquist-Bush government, in subsidizing jihad in Pakistan. American taxpayers will pay for this jihad subsidy.

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=story_9-4-2003_pg7_21
Posted by: Anonon || 04/08/2003 21:47 Comments || Top||


Seven killed in attack on Pakistan coal mine workers
Seven persons have been killed and four others injured when unidentified gunmen opened indiscriminate firing on the workers of a coal mine in southwestern Balochistan province, police said. According to the reports some 14 to 20 persons opened fire on the mine workers when they were getting off from their buses for working in the mines at Chamalan area in Loralai district Monday night. The attackers also kidnapped three workers but they were released later. Those kidnapped were given a letter in which the assailants asked the workers not to work in the coal mine. There is a conflict between the Marri and the Loni tribes of the area regarding the ownership of the coal mines, locals said. After the incident there was a strike in Loralai city. The people set the tyres on fire and raised slogans against the government.
More unrelenting tribal violence in the boil on the rump of South Asia.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 11:04 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:


Iraq
Headlines...
Saddam down to 19 tanks
Shall we stop, while they run out to get more?

Yanks crush bus brigade
Military genius in action...

Why the left will never put its hands up
It can't be so, so it must not be so...

Torture hellhole
Why we fight. One of the reasons, anyway...

Pockets of resistance still struggle in Arab media
It can't be so, so it must not be so...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 09:48 pm || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:


Iraqi military commanders unaware of location of U.S. troops
Maj. Gen. Sufian al Tikriti left Baghdad on Sunday in a white Toyota sedan, in uniform and alone except for a chauffeur. Just outside the city, the Republican Guard general came upon a Marine Corps roadblock, where he died. His sudden death, and a great deal of other evidence, suggests how little Iraq's military knows about the whereabouts and movements of the U.S. and British soldiers who invaded their country three weeks ago.

"I think they are basically clueless," said a senior officer of the 1st Marine Expeditionary Force (IMEF). "They have no situational awareness," he said. Even before the war, Iraq's military had only rudimentary systems for collecting battlefield intelligence and commanding troops. Their one- and two-man observation posts were equipped with simple radios, regular landline telephones and sometimes cordless phones slightly more powerful than the household variety, plus Thuraya satellite telephones. Now three weeks of U.S. air strikes appear to have blinded Saddam Hussein's forces and left his commanders incapable of ordering troops to the right place at the right time.

The cuts in communications, plus the Baghdad TV and radio claims of decisive triumphs over the American and British invaders, appear to have left most Iraqi soldiers almost completely unaware of their enemy's advances. Marines recently reported spotting several Iraqi convoys in single file and close to each other as they drove unawares into U.S. troops. Several prisoners of war have said they were surprised to encounter U.S. forces because their commanders and Baghdad broadcasts had reported that the Americans were bottled up in southern Iraq. Intercepts of Iraqi military chatter also show that some commanders have been lying to their superiors about battle results, apparently aware of Saddam's penchant for executing officers who fail in battle. One key result of the strikes on communications centers was the Iraqi military's inability to fix the position and direction of most of the American troops racing from Kuwait to Baghdad. Only four of 34 Iraqi artillery volleys fired on Monday landed in the vicinity of Marine forces, said Lt. Col. Nick Morano, the senior watch officer at IMEF's combat operations center southeast of Baghdad.

If the Republican Guard's Baghdad Division had moved from the Kut region to a crossroads 20 miles to the northwest last week, it might have upset the Marine attack from the rear that cut off its only escape route back to Baghdad. "It's eerie. They're moving units around, but it's almost like they are two days behind their sync," IMEF planner Col. Christopher Gunther said last week. More importantly, the lack of intelligence about U.S. deployments has left the Iraqis unable to mount a coordinated defense. "It's clear they don't have the command and control capability to mount an effective, organized defense," Morano said, adding that most of the U.S. battles are now against a "hodgepodge" of small army and militia units.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 09:13 pm || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  From the field reports, it sounds like they're barely aware of where their troops are!
Posted by: Reed || 04/08/2003 21:55 Comments || Top||

#2  Pretty much explains why they haven't rolled out the WMD ... they don't even know where to aim.
Posted by: B. || 04/08/2003 22:28 Comments || Top||


Damn. Missed him.
Saddam Hussein survived an attack on a building in Baghdad in which he was reported to have been meeting his sons Uday and Qusay on Monday afternoon, British intelligence sources said last night. "He was probably not in the building when it was bombed," a well-placed source said. The source added it was believed that President Saddam had been in the building earlier. The intelligence sources de scribed their view that President Saddam had not been killed in Monday's attack as a "preliminary assessment", presumably from intelligence in Baghdad. But the Pentagon said yesterday it could be days before it was known for certain who had died. At least 40 senior officials were understood to be meeting President Saddam and his sons in a bunker at the back of the building, connected to a restaurant. Iraqi officials said they found two bodies in the rubble and were searching for another 14 they thought were still buried, but said no members of the leadership had been killed.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 08:21 pm || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  And worse, we killed a lot of locals who had nothing to do with the leadership, but who just happened in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Dammit.
Posted by: Patrick Phillips || 04/08/2003 20:32 Comments || Top||

#2  Damn indeed. Still. All things considered, I'd rather he were strung up by irate Iraqis a la Mussolini than given the instant-whack-by-smartbomb, and the locals may yet have the chance. Saddam-as-strange-fruit is absolutely the *one* pic I most want to see from this war, the one I'll set as wallpaper on my computer and look at with satisfaction for weeks.
Posted by: jrosevear || 04/08/2003 20:44 Comments || Top||

#3  I dunno. One un-named source in Al Grauniad makes it so? I'm still waiting.

I also seriously doubt the figure of 14 dead, but we'll never know if that's correct.
Posted by: Parabellum || 04/08/2003 20:55 Comments || Top||

#4  Iraqi officials said they found two bodies in the rubble and were searching for another 14 they thought were still buried, but said no members of the leadership had been killed.

Take anything that "Iraqi officials" say with a grain of salt, until they prove they speak the truth.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama || 04/08/2003 20:56 Comments || Top||

#5  I agree with Parabellum on both points.

Although I think it was probably a stupid idea for the administration to even do it in the first place the way that they did, I'm going to put my faith in them that they wouldn't bomb a civillian area with such mega-bombage on just a hunch. But damn if he wasn't in there that's really gonna suck!
Posted by: g wiz || 04/08/2003 21:04 Comments || Top||

#6  Bill Gertz (WaPo) says "We'll know in one or two days".

(FOXNews, two minutes ago)
Posted by: Parabellum || 04/08/2003 21:58 Comments || Top||


"No hard finding" on Iraqi chemical weapons: Pentagon
US forces have yet to make a confirmed discovery of chemical weapons in Iraq, a top military official said Tuesday. US defense officials on Monday said preliminary tests showed that barrels found at a military site near the central Iraqi town of Karbala contain chemical agents. But Major General Stanley McChrystal, vice director for operations at the US Joint Chiefs of Staff, told a news briefing there were some positive field tests "but they were mixed."

"We have taken samples out to get definitive testing," he said. "It is something we're looking at closely, but no hard finding." According to US news reports, US Marines said they found a warehouse near Baghdad's main airport containing missiles loaded with warheads filled with mustard gas and sarin. cChrystal said he had seen a news report on the rocket rounds. "But I have seen nothing in official reports that would corroborate that."
Does anyone know what happened to the 20 missile story? Only NPR and Reuters reported it yesterday, and now nobody seems to be posting any follow-ups. Is it dead?
Posted by: Ben || 04/08/2003 06:01 pm || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Methinks the prosecution is trying not to tip its hand, especially while some of the suspects are still at large (in Elysee Palace).

Nothing to see here, move along.
Posted by: Dishman || 04/08/2003 18:36 Comments || Top||


Army Repels Major Iraqi Counterattack
Iraqi forces staged a major counterattack Tuesday morning, sending buses and trucks full of fighters across the Tigris River in an attempt to overrun U.S. forces holding a strategic intersection on the western side of Baghdad. A U.S. Army commander says at least 50 Iraqis were killed during the battle, which apparently was Iraqi retaliation for a U.S. airstrike on a residential complex that U.S. intelligence indicated may have held senior Iraqi leadership, including Saddam Hussein and his sons. The fate of Saddam remains unclear.
"You killed Sammy! Yo-o-o-o-u dirty ratz! I must have Dire Revenge®!"
U.S. troops strafed the Iraqis from A-10 Warthog attack planes and opened up with artillery and mortar fire. Snipers reportedly wounded two American soldiers, one seriously.

An Associated Press reporter embedded with a Marine unit in the eastern suburbs of Baghdad said Iraqi fighters are still taking occasional shots at the Marines. He said many of the fighters apparently have taken off their military uniforms to blend in with the civilian population, which is considered a war crime. The Marines are coming across enemy tanks and plenty of fighting holes — but no Iraqi troops in them. They've apparently abandoned the vehicles and their bunkers.
I guess they took the bus over to fight the army...
Civilians have approached the unit to offer food and cigarettes, but the Marines aren't allowing them to get close for fear of terrorist attacks. The Marines have been told to shoot at any vehicles approaching at a high rate of speed.

Earlier, troops with the Army's 101st Airborne Division launched an attack on an eight-story former Republican Guard headquarters about half a mile from the airport. Two Iraqis were reported killed in the gun battle. There were no U.S. casualties.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 03:59 pm || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Well, so far the goblins are doing just what we want. C'mon boys, don't be shy - come over here and let us shoot you en mass...
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 16:36 Comments || Top||

#2  Just having a touch of trouble with the "Major Counterattack" leadin... A couple of busses of "soon to be martyrs" doesn't qualify for that description... Not exactly Battle of the Bulge.
Posted by: Capsu78 || 04/08/2003 16:58 Comments || Top||

#3  Fox said they were using technicals: white Toyota pickups with guns in the bed. Watched too much Blackhawk Down, hmmm? A-10's LOVE technicals
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 18:46 Comments || Top||

#4  Ollie North was telling Greta a few minutes ago that most of the fedayeen they're finding are Syrians, Jordanians, and similar sweepings. He said they had another ambulance boom, and the driver and passenger were Jordanians.
Posted by: Fred || 04/08/2003 21:52 Comments || Top||

#5  Capsu78: Re: "soon to be martyrs"

The accepted term is "pre-martyrs"... please check your style guide for details.
Posted by: Reed || 04/08/2003 21:52 Comments || Top||


PA: Bombed in Baghdad
The Palestine National Authority, following the lead of many of its citizens who have long protested in favor of Saddam and against the U.S., condemned the "U.S. aggression” of yesterday. American fighter jets bombed the PA's embassy in Baghdad yesterday afternoon. “The US aggression on the embassy was premeditated and directly singled out the Palestinian embassy, which is located in the diplomatic neighborhood in the Iraqi capital,” a PNA official spokesman said today. “No other embassies were targeted by bombing, which proves that the targeting of the Palestinian embassy was premeditated and not an accident." The spokesman noted that the building's roof was destroyed, as were all its contents and assets. He continued his attack on the American strike by calling it “a flagrant violation of all diplomatic norms and laws, which endow foreign embassies with immunity..."
"Dammit, we're the only ones allowed to bomb embassies!"
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 03:43 pm || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Sounds like a successful mission to me.

Hey, PNA! Better keep your gunnies off the roof!
[1 hour passes...]
Sarge, shall I call in coordinates?
Yeah, go ahead. Those guys in the embassy keep givin' me the finger and the guys on the roof are disturbing my delicious midday MRE with their potshots.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 04/08/2003 15:56 Comments || Top||

#2  The link to this one had me thinking something like Baghdad Bob getting polluted on Jaegermeister while delivering one of his Denial of Reality™ checks.
Posted by: Rex Mundi || 04/08/2003 16:18 Comments || Top||

#3  A spokesman from CENTCOM issued the following statement in response to a query by ABC's Terry Moran: "Naturally, our stated goals have been to remove Saddam Hussein's regime and to disarm that regime of its weapons of mass destruction. We shouldn't have to remind you, Mr. Moran, that this current war is very much an extension of our larger war against terrorism, further . . .Okay. I can see by the look on your face that you remain confused. Let me put into words you should be able to understand: 'If it quacks like a duck and shoots like a duck, it's a friggin' duck,' and so it is within this larger context of international duck hunting that our response to the Palestinian National Authority is, with some reservation, 'tough shit.' Thank you."
Posted by: FormerLiberal || 04/08/2003 16:20 Comments || Top||

#4  and what embassy exists without a state? Nice try Paleos, this wasn't an embassy, it was a target!
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 16:29 Comments || Top||

#5  "If it quacks like a duck and shoots like a duck, it's a friggin' duck,' and so it is within this larger context of international duck hunting that our response to the Palestinian National Authority is, with some reservation, 'tough shit.' Thank you."

ROTFLMFAO!!!

Tell me he didn't really say this - actually, don't tell me that. Lemme' keep on laughing.

The look on the reporter's faces must've been hilarious.

Start passing out the duck hunting licenses.
Posted by: FOTSGreg || 04/08/2003 16:40 Comments || Top||

#6  Ducks? Wrong cartoon!

These PA terrorist morons think that they're fooling us with a wolf-in-sheep's-clothing act. No way! This is a Roadrunner cartoon, and the roadrunner they are not! Kerrbooom! Beep, beep!

How else can you explain that so many of their people blow themselves up!
Posted by: Tom || 04/08/2003 16:43 Comments || Top||

#7  Sorry, FOTSGreg. I made it up. But you don't wish that, just once, the remarkably polite men who give the press briefings could cut loose on the halfwits that comprise today's press corps?

ccwbass
Posted by: FormerLiberal || 04/08/2003 16:55 Comments || Top||

#8  U.S. "Knock knock."

P.A. "Who's there?"

U.S. "Jay."

P.A. "Jay who?"

U.S. "JDAM!"

BOOM!
Posted by: Parabellum || 04/08/2003 18:33 Comments || Top||

#9  "Achmed, I think I hear incoming."
"Oh, damn!"
"No, Achmed, JDA..."
( . . . )
"Nothin' here, Sarge..."
Posted by: Old Patriot || 04/08/2003 19:33 Comments || Top||


Kurdish forces press closer to Kirkuk after air strikes
Edited for length:
Kurdish forces tightened their ring around the key oil center of Kirkuk to advance within sight of the city Tuesday following heavy coalition airstrikes on front-line Iraqi positions. The Kurdish militia took control of the strategic Sekamian plateau, about six miles north of Kirkuk, the center of Iraq's No. 2 oil region, Kurdish media reported. The area affords a commanding view of the city and the vast oil fields.
Took the high ground, did they?
Kurdish forces -- aided by coalition airstrikes and U.S. ground troops -- have steadily moved closer to Kirkuk and Mosul in the past week but have stopped short of mobilizing all-out offensives. Some military officers believe the northern front will attempt to pin down Iraqi troops while U.S. forces solidify control of Baghdad. There are also fears a battle to claim Kirkuk could lead Iraqi troops to set the oil fields ablaze.
There was a oil industry expert on Nightline last week that said he didn't think the Iraqis could set the fields on fire very easy. He said the northern oil fields are old and there is no pressure left to force oil out of the wells.
The Western-allied Kurds seized the territory north of Kirkuk after skirmishes that left at least three Kurdish fighters dead, Kurdish reports said. Coalition airstrikes then drove back Iraqi troops toward the heavily defended city -- the main prize of the northern front and considered by Iraqi Kurds as part of their ethnic homeland. Kurdish fighters also are closing in from the southeast. Coalition airstrikes hammered Iraqi positions near Kirkuk until early Tuesday, sending up huge flashes that lit the sky, officials and witnesses said. Kurdish soldiers, taking up front-line positions abandoned by the Iraqis, described occasionally intense resistance from the Iraqi military. Iraqi mortar fire destroyed a key bridge in Laylan, about 12 miles southeast of Kirkuk. There were no reports of casualties. At another front-line position -- the town of Dibagah near a key crossroads on the main Kirkuk-Mosul road -- fighting eased after battles that left at least 10 Iraqi tanks disabled. Iraqi forces have retaliated with artillery barrages after a retreat Sunday, but have not mounted a counteroffensive.

The Kurdish fighters said Tuesday they found a 22-year-old Iraqi soldier in Dibagah, about 55 miles southeast of Mosul. The soldier, emaciated and wearing a mud-splattered uniform, said he was separated from his unit during the last few days of fighting. U.S. forces talked to him, but later turned him over to the Kurds. The soldier, said the Iraqi soldiers had a fairly clear idea of how the U.S.-led war was progressing in the south and that coalition forces were in Baghdad and Basra. Asked why they continued to fight, the soldier, whose name was not revealed, said they had no choice: There were still standing orders to shoot deserters.
Of course.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 03:18 pm || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Hang in there guys, the 4th I.D. will be on it's way soon!
Posted by: Parabellum || 04/08/2003 18:36 Comments || Top||

#2  Parabellum: And, when the 4th is finished in the North, they'll be warmed up and in perfect position to follow that busted pipeline right into Baby Assad's backyard. and Syria is a 2-fer: you get Lebanon as a bonus...
Posted by: PD || 04/08/2003 23:39 Comments || Top||


Marines find apparent training camp for PLF
United States Marines may have uncovered "smoking-gun" evidence supporting one of the coalition's justification for war in Iraq. The Los Angeles Times reports soldiers from the 2nd Battalion, 23rd Regiment found what appears to be a large-scale terrorist training camp for the Palestinian Liberation Front, as well as documents indicating Iraq recently sold weapons to the terror group for its fight against Israel. "This proves the link between Iraq and terror groups," the Times quotes Capt. Aaron Robertson, the battalion's intelligence officer, as saying. According to the paper, the 25-year-old hidden compound could have accommodated 600 recruits at one time. Its 20-plus cement buildings contain an obstacle course, parade deck, lecture halls, dining halls, barracks, administrative offices and small jail cells likely used to teach students how to survive as a prisoner of war. The obstacle course is described as being better than some used to train American forces. Uniforms, books and bomb-making materials were found inside the largely abandoned facility, along with a clay table-top model of a city, which the Times likens to those used by military officers in planning an attack. Intelligence officers were studying what city the model's design was meant to replicate, according to the paper. Marines also recovered documents from the PLF and its political arm, the Palestinian Liberation Organization.
Documents are good
Large murals of Iraqi President Saddam Hussein cover the walls on the outside, while side-by-side pictures of Hussein and PLF leader Abu Abbas fill the walls inside. Other photographs showed Abbas posing with senior officers of the Iraqi Republican Guard. Slogans on walls linked the PLF and Iraqi causes, including one that, in Arabic said, "Live the Dream of Both Causes Against the Invading Enemy: the Jew." Another read "Beginning In This Prison Is The Flower of Our Manhood."
I'm going to stay away from that last slogan, gentle readers. Feel free.
The camp is due east of the Diallo River on the southwest edge of Baghdad, set away from main roads and surrounded by berms and large trees. Outfitted with electricity, running water, air-conditioning and a sewer system, the facility is described as having better conditions than nearby residences.
You don't expect terrorist's to suffer like the common folk, do you? I mean, they're holy warriors! They're better than you.
The U.S. has long insisted regime change is needed in Iraq because it allegedly has weapons of mass destruction and harbors terrorists.
Which the looney left denied.

I would think this camp might have been run by the PLF as a training cadre, but I wouldn't think it trained PLF fighters — they haven't managed to carry out a successful attack since 1992, and their leadership's pretty much folded back into the PLO. I'd say it's more likely a training facility for Fatah thugs — it'd be interesting to see how many al-Aqsa Martyrs and Tanzims went through their training here. Maybe the documents will shed some light on that.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 02:49 pm || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "Beginning In This Prison Is The Flower of Our Manhood,"

EEEEEEEEEEEWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 15:21 Comments || Top||

#2  Under the slogan "Beginning In This Prison Is The Flower of Our Manhood," was another which stated: "New recruits will be flowered by prison strongman "Tiny" and considered martyrs for the jihad"
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/08/2003 15:55 Comments || Top||

#3  "Beginning In This Prison Is The Flower of Our Manhood,"

... what the article failed to state was that the above sign was posted in the shower room, underneath which was another sign that said. " Umm, would you please pick up that bar of soap I dropped?
Posted by: Ken || 04/08/2003 16:10 Comments || Top||

#4  That is so wrong!
Posted by: Rex Mundi || 04/08/2003 16:13 Comments || Top||

#5  Squeal Shaeed!
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 16:32 Comments || Top||

#6  Just FYI -

The 2/23 Marines are a reserve unit from the
San Francisco Bay Area, the depot is in San Bruno, on the penninsula just south of SF.

The 2/23 was earlier involved in fighting at Nasiriya.
Posted by: buwaya || 04/08/2003 16:53 Comments || Top||

#7  They're on foot patrol in downtown Baghdad right now. Rick Leventhal (FoxNews, natch) is with them.
Posted by: Fred || 04/08/2003 22:27 Comments || Top||


Jailed Iraqi children run free as marines roll into Baghdad suburbs
More than 100 children held in a prison celebrated their freedom as US marines rolled into northeast Baghdad amid chaotic scenes which saw civilians loot weapons from an army compound, a US officer said. Around 150 children spilled out of the jail after the gates were opened as a US military Humvee vehicle approached, Lieutenant Colonel Fred Padilla told an AFP correspondent travelling with the Marines 5th Regiment. "Hundreds of kids were swarming us and kissing us," Padilla said. "There were parents running up, so happy to have their kids back."
Cheeze. A jail full of kids...
"The children had been imprisoned because they had not joined the youth branch of the Baath party," he alleged. "Some of these kids had been in there for five years." The children, who were wearing threadbare clothes and looked under-nourished, walked on the streets crossing their hands as if to mimic handcuffs, before giving the thumbs up sign and shouting their thanks.
Makes it all worth it, doesn't it?
Civilians also took advantage of the collapse of Iraqi President Saddam Hussein's authority to grab weapons from an army base, said Group Sergeant Jeff Treiber. As marines were alerted by radio that civilians had seized weapons, Treiber warned that anyone seen to be armed could be a target of US-British coalition forces. "With the weapons they are becoming combatants," said Treiber. "If they don't take the weapons they will be fine."
It doesn't sound like they're intended for use against the Marines. It sounds more like the Iraqi version of "Get a rope!"
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 02:43 pm || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  That was just the Hussain Day Care Center... Please, Sir, May I have some more?
Posted by: Capsu78 || 04/08/2003 14:59 Comments || Top||

#2  Too bad an embedded with a camera wasn't there. This would have made some incredible footage.
Posted by: mhw || 04/08/2003 15:00 Comments || Top||

#3  "Please sir? Can you tell me where Mr Scott is? He was so kind to me when he was here. He said that if I was really nice to him he would help me. But he never came back, can you help me find him? I think his last name was..Bitter, or something."
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 15:09 Comments || Top||

#4  Holy Blackmail, Batman
It's the Scott Ritter Daycare Center ?!?
Posted by: Dixie Normus || 04/08/2003 15:33 Comments || Top||

#5  I wonder if this is the place Scotty says he saw but didn't want to talk about because it would get everybody mad at Iraq. I'm starting a pool for when Slappy Fisk declares those kids were American plants.
Posted by: Christopher Johnson || 04/08/2003 15:38 Comments || Top||

#6  "Mr. Murat",Please pick up the white courtesy phone....

Can any of you even imagine what this was like? Can anyone protesting this war hear this and not ask themselves what the hell were they doing supporting this nightmare?

For those of you who need a little hollywood to help you with the understanding, I recommend episode 9 of "Band of Brothers: Why We Fight"
Posted by: Frank Martin || 04/08/2003 17:16 Comments || Top||

#7  Not a day-care...It's the Iraqi chapter of the Dixie Chicks fan club!
Posted by: Cyber Sarge || 04/08/2003 17:41 Comments || Top||


Iranian and Arab media attack Kurds and Kurdistan
Since the beginning of the war on Iraq, Iranian and Arab media have launched a media war on Kurds and Kurdistan. The Arab media has made attempts to undermine the Kurdish issue. Last week, for example, Al-Jazeera brought a so-called Arab intellectual to attack the Kurds, who argued that the debate on the Kurdish issue was too "early", implying that a strong and centralist Arab government in Baghdad would have to be established first, before the Kurdish issue could "debated".
They still seem to think that Iraq is a "Arab" country.
The Iranian Arabic Satellite news station, Al-Alam, on the other hand calls the current war on Iraq, "the War of Control." Al-Alam has several reporters stationed in different locations in south Kurdistan (Iraqi Kurdistan) and reports news about the northern front regularly. Al-Alam hosts discussion programmes about the war in Iraq, in which speakers from south Kurdistan and the Arab world participate. Arab speakers participating in their programmes make comments such as "Kurds will pay a heavy price for their assistance to the US."
Is that a threat? I think it was.
Recently, Al-Alams reporter in Arbil, regarded the friendly-fire inccident in Dibiga as a "purposed and aimed" attack by the Americans. The reporter said that the American fighter jet attacked the Kurds on purpose to stop them from advancing. The Al-Alam reporter was unaware that four members of the American Special Forces were killed in the friendly fire accident. An Arab speaker from Egypt confirmed Al-Alam's claim.
They knew that Special Forces were killed, it just didn't fit their view so they ignored it.
Arab TV channels such as Al-Jazeera and Abu Dhabi TV, also aim to create chaos and disappointment among Kurds. After the friendly-fire accident, the Abu Dhabi TV reporter in Sulemani said that Wajeeh Barzani, head of the Kurdistan Democratic Party’s Special Forces, was confirmed dead, while Wajeeh Barzani was seriously injured in the incident and is currently in Germany for treatment. People in south Kurdistan seem not very happy with the attitudes of the Arabic channels. Recently, a group of students from Sulemani University arranged a demonstration against the media war on Kurds.
I don't think I'd like it if the Kurds were not happy with me.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 02:33 pm || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  The Master Race isn't happy at all with the Kurd military successes. And hooking up with the Merkins makes them next thing to infidels.
Posted by: Fred || 04/08/2003 14:47 Comments || Top||

#2  We build a new middle east, one success at a time... Someday the Arab Street is going to run out of spittle.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 04/08/2003 16:04 Comments || Top||


Iraq vows no surrender
US forces will either surrender or "be burned in their tanks," Iraqi Information Minister Mohammad Said al-Sahhaf warned when asked if Iraq would surrender. "We have imprisoned them inside their tanks," said Sahhaf, speaking outside the Palestine Hotel housing journalists minutes after it came under bombardment.
"Yep. They're stuck in there. Can't get out. Nope. Nope."
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 02:36 pm || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  But they have cable, lap dancers on tap, and cold Bud in the cooler. That Abrahms is really something!

I've heard that they've been warned not to throw the empty bottles out, however, littering is frowned upon in Baghdad.
Posted by: PD || 04/08/2003 14:54 Comments || Top||

#2  Arnett hasn't felt the need to report it, but the word on the "Arab street" is that all of the IM's appearances are going to compromise the first of several volumes of hilarious "Baghdad Bloopers" which will be sold in DVD and VHS formats, the sales of which will be used to pay for a large portion of rebuilding Iraq. The second volume, assuming the rights can be purchased from the BBC, will be of that esteemed body's radio coverage of events on Saturday, April 05 juxtaposed against the pictures shot the same day of Coalition forces doing everything the BBC said the Coalition wasn't doing. - Your Man in Baghdad
Posted by: FormerLiberal || 04/08/2003 15:14 Comments || Top||

#3  Hey, Info Man! So I guess he wasn't at the "meeting" last night?
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 15:18 Comments || Top||

#4  I never had sexual relations with Saddam Hussein.
Posted by: Mohammad Said al-Sahhaf || 04/08/2003 15:23 Comments || Top||

#5  tu3031-- No! Don't kill Info Man! His standup comedy routines are the best!
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 15:52 Comments || Top||

#6  If Saddam was dead, then wouldn't Infoman bug out?
Posted by: Douglas De Bono || 04/08/2003 16:08 Comments || Top||

#7  Former Liberal--Could we call the second volume Information Ministers Gone Batshit, and have Tariq Aziz footage from the first Gulf War as a complement?
Posted by: BMN || 04/08/2003 17:39 Comments || Top||


CIA Pushed Iraqi Opposition Out of Southern Town
A local militia opposed to Iraqi President Saddam Hussein took control of the southeastern city of Amara on Sunday but a CIA officer told them to withdrew under threat of bombing, opposition officials said on Tuesday. The militia of several thousand armed men, led by a man by the name of Abu Hatem Mohammed Ali, captured the headquarters of the governorate, 230 miles southeast of Baghdad, without support from U.S. forces, opposition leader Kanan Makiya told the American Enterprise Institute in Washington. He described Abu Hatem as a well-known guerrilla leader, a longtime contact of the opposition Iraqi National Congress (INC) and a man known to the Pentagon. "He was then told by a CIA officer whose name I do not know but who spoke perfect Arabic that he had to vacate that city ... He was threatened with bombing and strafing of the building, the compound he took over, so he decided it would be better to be wise and he did withdraw in fact," he added. Makiya said the lesson of the incident was that U.S. forces should cooperate with local opposition forces instead of trying to do everything alone. "I bring it as a cautionary tale of where we can go wrong," he said.

An INC official in the Gulf said there had been a problem coordinating with the U.S. units in the field and with the INC leadership, which moved to the southern town of Nassiriya on Sunday under leader Ahmad Chalabi. "Those guys (U.S. troops) are not used to dealing with Iraqis with arms who are their allies. It's a learning process," added the official, who asked not to be named.
Humm, CIA guy not get the memo, or is there something about Abu Hatem we don't know?

My guess is that we're avoiding the possibility of competing warlords setting up. I haven't seen SAIRI do much more than make faces and complain, either. This isn't and Iraqi operation; it's an American operation, and we're letting people play only according to our rules, one of which is no freelancing.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 01:47 pm || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I think that the warlord argument is valid, however unlike afghanistan the tribalism of this country is much less marked. They have a stronger nationalist identity which is going to be valuble in reconstruction efforts. However, the key to being able to stabilize iraqi will be the introduction of another strong central government to replace the baathist regime. You cannot do that with factional guerilla/political parties running around making problems by trying to assert dominance from a controlled region onto a national stage. The situation with the kurds is sticky enough.

-DS
"the horns hold up the halo"
Posted by: DeviantSaint || 04/08/2003 14:04 Comments || Top||

#2  "a man known to the Pentagon"

once again (simple, this time):
DoD likes INC. State and CIA dont. DoD doesnt like Saudi, Egypt, makes nice with Israel. State's job is to make nice with all countries, likes Saudi and Egypt, distrusts this democracy crap. CIA's job is to run agents, likes authoritarian regimes that cooperate, distrusts this democracy crap. CIA and State make nice with Saudi. CIA and State have "issues" with Israel. CIA and State always wanted regime change "by coup" in Iraq.

Question now is who will rule Iraq - DoD, or State/CIA. UN, Blair, just pawns in this struggle. The war is on. DoD put INC people on the ground in Nasariyah. Brits running Basra, so its a neutral zone. Kurds are strong enough to be independent (of US agencies, that is) CIA doesnt want to be completely outflanked so keeping INC linked group out of Amara. All this prelude for Battle for Baghdad (which will NOT involve any Fedayeen or "elite" guards - will be
fought out in UN, on Capital Hill, etc Rummy vs Powell and Tenet)
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 14:15 Comments || Top||

#3  also

note well - Chalabi and INC have friends among supporters of Israel, as do Kurds. Chalabi in power in Iraq takes away pressure on Israel - road map less likely - State and CIA jobs of currying favor in rest of middle east made more difficult.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 14:23 Comments || Top||

#4  Maybe we wanted to minimize blue/blue events.
Posted by: mhw || 04/08/2003 14:59 Comments || Top||


US Army takes aim on Tikrit
US commanders are preparing to launch a major assault to seize Saddam Hussein's birthplace in Tikrit in the next few days, even before US troops have completed the encirclement of Baghdad. According to coalition military sources, advance elements of the US Army's 4th Infantry Division (Mechanised) are being rushed into central Iraq from Kuwait, ready to spearhead the attack on Tikrit. US commanders say resistance to coalition forces in southern Iraq is now slackening off considerably, allowing them to pour more troops into the battle around Baghdad and to contemplate pushing north to Tikrit.
Posted by: Yosemite Sam || 04/08/2003 01:46 pm || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:


Derbyshire's "brief moment of jubilation"
Yeah. It ain't over until it's over — but at this point it's almost over...
You've lost the war, and we're not in much of a mood to accommodate your delusional fantasies. You — the Arabs. "This is what all Arabs want to see." That's the shape of it in your mind, isn't it? You were at one with Saddam Hussein, weren't you? — poison gas, secret police, torture chambers, rapist sons, wars of invasion (Iran, Kuwait), and all. He was a son of a bitch, but he was your son of a bitch, wasn't he? It was the Arabs versus the Crusaders and the Jews, wasn't it? But look: As always in every modern engagement, the Arabs have lost. Lost big: We don't know the body count yet, but it's at least 100 to 1, and quite possibly 1,000 to 1. The wisdom of the late Moshe Dayan has been borne out yet again. Asked to reveal his recipe for winning wars, Dayan replied with a soldier's crisp brevity: "Fight Arabs."
There's still mopping up do do. We haven't taken our last casualties yet, and won't for awhile. Maybe we still have to catch Sammy, and if not we still have to catch Izzat Ibrahim ("I dunno. Izzat him?") and hang him. We have to root out the Baathist die-hards, and catch as many of the Paleokillers — Hamas, Hezbollah, Islamic Jihad, and sundry others — who were imported for the fight as we can. They should be killed, rather than being repatriated, but we know they won't be. But Sammy's Iraq is essentially done, and now we're working in Occupied Iraq. So I'd say it's now permissible to pause to ululate for a few brief moments, and to vent methane in the general direction of Mecca, before moving on to the next task...

Thanks to Kathy for the link...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 01:17 pm || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Oh I'm ululating alright, and I'm having gun sex too.

But I leave the methane to Ptah, who seems to be a bit gassy today, what with the elderberries.

I would love it for a missile to accidentally stray and hit that big ugly cube thing in Mecca: couldn't we blame it on the last gasp of the Republican Guard?
Posted by: anon1 || 04/08/2003 23:46 Comments || Top||


That's his opinion, anyway...
Aziza al-Badri, in Al-Hayat
It's time to support the Iraqi people, for the battle is one, the enemy is one and his aim is no longer a mystery to anyone. The aim is to spread "the American-Zionist" control on the whole region, to eradicate the Palestinian cause for good to pave the road for Israel's dream from the Nile to the Euphrates.
Oooh! Zionists! Oh, hold me, Fatimah!
Yes! It's not the time to blame Saddam. It's the time for sorrow on Iraq, on the Arab region threatened in its roots. It's the time for sorrow on Palestine where death is spreading its wings on the camps and villages, all day and night, by the same guilty weapons and hands. The time is for us to go beyond all rancors.
Except for the ones toward them damn' Zionists, of course...
Finally, I address Mr. Mohammad al-Rahimi by saying: "I thought you, my brother, were in pain just as we are. I hope Iraq will win this ferocious war, after its resistance has become an example and a lesson in patriotism for the entire world. French President Jacques Chirac admires the Iraqi resistance and assured that those who planned the war had misjudged the Iraqi resistance. Hail to the dear Iraqi people!
Perhaps we might add that Mr Chiraq misjudged those who planned the war, too...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 12:29 pm || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Classic Islamofacist anti-logic. The sad thing is, though we would like not to be forced to engage such demented stupidity and our minds reel from the sheer obvious absurdity of the words and what they truly convey, sometimes you just gotta clear the decks.

Arabs are capable of any degree of self-delusion imaginable. Tack on some Islamo-foolishness, such as a fatwa, and you can expect the poor mindless tools to come out of the woodwork.

Take note that those who issue the fatwas are NEVER the ones who attempt to carry them out.

Sad.
Posted by: PD || 04/08/2003 13:24 Comments || Top||

#2  Fatwa? Somebody mentioned Fatwa? We don't write may of 'em but the few we write get results. They are Army (navy, airforce, marine)-based and they kick ass. Heh heh.

--al-Aska Paul
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 04/08/2003 18:46 Comments || Top||

#3  I listened to an expat Iraqi on local Toronto radio this morning. He was as would be expected of two minds; glad to see Saddam gone but worried about family safety and occupation of his homeland. But when the announcer asked him who should be in charge of the post Saddam Iraq, he immediately said the UN. Huh? Who does he think kept Saddam in power and forced him (the speaker) to leave Iraq?
Posted by: john || 04/08/2003 20:10 Comments || Top||


I Sat On Saddam’s Throne
Warming the Seat of All PowerThe Sun delivers once again!
I joined British troops yesterday as they stormed Saddam Hussein’s palace in Basra -- and sat on the despot’s golden throne.
Don't miss the accompanying picture for this article.
The garish loo, painted in gold leaf, was in one of the 18 marble bathroom suites we found in the palace.
By the way, if you've never visited the Sun website -- and you happen to be at work -- be a little careful about the links you click.

I had to add the picture, just to get the full effect...
Posted by: Patrick Phillips || 04/08/2003 11:43 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  You know, I thought those gold toilets would be gaudy, but they're rather tasteful. I wonder how you clean the gold; ordinary toilet cleaners might react with it.

Article also said there was a gold-plated toilet brush.
Posted by: Angie Schultz || 04/08/2003 12:39 Comments || Top||

#2  This guy obviously doesn't understand advertising. He should have pulled down his pants and snapped the picture with him reading a Sun newspaper-- for an instant connection with the readers back home.
Posted by: Anony-mouse || 04/08/2003 12:43 Comments || Top||

#3  "...ordinary toilet cleaners might react with it. "

Ahem.

Only if you're using Aqua Regia, Angie.
Wear gloves...
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 12:46 Comments || Top||

#4  Sweet. Hey Sammy: All your base are belong to us!
Posted by: Rex Mundi || 04/08/2003 14:14 Comments || Top||

#5  Angie,
I would avoid abrasive cleansers like Comet, gold plating is likely to be fairly soft and thin. mojo is right that very few chemicals will corrode gold.
Posted by: Craig || 04/08/2003 15:13 Comments || Top||

#6  No mercury, either. Amazing what a fistfull of mercury will do to a wedding band.

Fun explaining it to the wife, too...
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 15:29 Comments || Top||

#7  The Coalition -- flushed with victory!
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 15:59 Comments || Top||

#8  Sez here that gold will react with chlorine, which is found in a lot of cleaners. Of course, they're talking about chlorine gas, but I suppose it's possible that some other chlorine compounds might react to it.

I know gold is largely nonreactive, but I was just thinking that if I had fancy toilets like that, I'd hesitate to get out the Comet.

You know how us chicks are, always thinking, "Now how would you clean a thing like that?"
Posted by: Angie Schultz || 04/08/2003 17:00 Comments || Top||

#9  Hey Angie -- this chick would use....a cleaning lady! ;)
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 20:56 Comments || Top||


Marines engaging Hezbollah & PLO in eastern Baghdad
From The Command Post.
The strongest resistance to U.S. troops in the eastern half of Baghdad is coming from foreign fighters, including a few hundred members of the Palestine Liberation Army, MSNBC reported Tuesday, citing reporting by one of its reporters embedded with the U.S. Marine Expeditionary Force. MSNBC cited Israeli sources as saying some of the foreigners were probably recruited in Lebanon and then sent to Baghdad via Syria. There are members of the Palestinian Liberation Organization among them, and some may be members of Hezbollah, MSNBC said.
Go get 'em, Marines!
Posted by: Mike || 04/08/2003 11:41 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  If this is true, these people have gotta have some devastation laid on them. Take a few prisoners, for some intel and then to go home and tell the tale, but wipe these people up.
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 11:51 Comments || Top||

#2  I hereby declare that it's now open season on the PLO and Hezbollah. Daily bag limit is 10,000,000, possession limit is twice the bag limit. Licenses required include basic training, advanced infantry training, and combat experience. License waived for all current and former members of the US Army, Navy, Marines, and Air Force, and any member of the British, Australian, Czech, Polish, and Slovak armed forces. Season is open until further notice.
Posted by: Old Patriot || 04/08/2003 11:57 Comments || Top||

#3  Truly, these maggots need to be pulverized. Flesh flayed, bones crushed and ground into dust. No corner of hell is hot enough for these scum.
Posted by: Rex Mundi || 04/08/2003 12:19 Comments || Top||

#4  Orson Scott Card, a democrat hawk, said it first (at his "Ornery American" website): - we should have started with Syria. That pipeline nation has to be shut down.
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/08/2003 13:04 Comments || Top||

#5  If ever there was an opportunity to avenge the Beirut barracks bombings this is it! Shoot for the belly, Marines! Make 'em suffer!
Posted by: Ned || 04/08/2003 13:10 Comments || Top||

#6  It took 20 years, but payback will be final.
Posted by: Douglas De Bono || 04/08/2003 13:16 Comments || Top||

#7  Oooo - this could be sweet, indeed. I like the idea of direct payback. Sigh. Why is it that when the really clean fight, one with such clarity that there is no doubt in anyone's mind, comes along I find I'm an old fart. It. Really. Sucks.
Posted by: PD || 04/08/2003 13:34 Comments || Top||

#8  I hope the Marines don't stop when there's 281 dead Hezbollah fedayeen. Maybe a brief pause for ululation, but don't stop...
Posted by: Fred || 04/08/2003 14:00 Comments || Top||

#9  These morons still seem to think that all you need to kill US Marines is a truck load of explosives and human guidance system. The Rules of Engagement have changed and they're not the rules that the morons are familiar with.
Posted by: Someone who did NOT vote for William Proxmire || 04/08/2003 16:52 Comments || Top||

#10  How is it that people who don't even have a state actually have an army on foreign soil? Wipe 'em out. Any that are accidentally left over can be shipped off for a loooooong Carribean holiday at Gitmo.
Posted by: Tom || 04/08/2003 17:06 Comments || Top||


Grip on Baghdad Tightens After Try for Saddam
U.S. forces tightened their grip on Baghdad on Tuesday, blitzing targets in the heart of the capital and seizing an air base after trying to kill Saddam Hussein and his sons with four huge bombs. The U.S. military said it did not know if the air raid on Monday evening had killed the Iraqi president, but said his grasp on the country of 26 million was fast disintegrating. "We're not sure exactly who's in charge at this particular point in time," U.S. Brig. Gen. Vincent Brooks said. Aircraft, tanks and artillery pounded the nerve center of Saddam's administration in a thundering raid in central Baghdad that began at dawn, meeting only scattered Iraqi return fire. "It's raining bombs," said Reuters correspondent Samia Nakhoul. "They're targeting the same area over and over. The place is shaking and there's smoke rising," she said from the Palestine Hotel where most foreign media are based.
No telling who's in charge if Sammy's titzup. Maybe no one. There was a report yesterday that there were clashes between the Baathists and Baghdadis. We should expect to see them start stringing up the Fedayeen any time now — that's when we'll know for sure Sammy's gone.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 11:27 am || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:


Coalition forces hit Palestine Hotel in Baghdad
The coalition forces have targeted offices of the al-Arabiya and MBC TV channels in the Palestine Hotel in Baghdad on Tuesday, the al-Arabiya channel reported. By targeting the residence of correspondents, the US is determined to silence voices of Arabic news channels and prevent them from broadcasting war-related news and developments, al-Arabiya correspondent reported. During the ongoing US-led war against Iraq, the Arabic news channels have had an active role in broadcasting war reports.
The conversation at this morning's briefing consisted of "You told us to get out of the Palestine Hotel, and we didn't. Is that why you targeted it?"
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 10:22 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I suppose our soldiers and Marines should make a statement along the following lines.

"Normally, it's rude to point. Right now, it's dangerous to point. Do not point things at us. We have lots of people pointing things at us who wish to hurt us. We cannot promise that we will notice that it was a camera you were pointing at us. We will react when you point things at us. You may not like our reaction."
Posted by: Patrick Phillips || 04/08/2003 10:54 Comments || Top||

#2  This was part of a training class given to Combat Camera people. A broadcast ENG camera looks an awful lot like a shoulder fired weapon from a distance. Ya need to be careful who you point it at. Sucks to be a embedded reporter with the Iraqi army.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 11:10 Comments || Top||


Denied Entry Into Iran, Ansar Fighters Surrender
Denied entry into neighboring Iran, scores of Islamic militants who had retreated into the mountains during recent attacks by US forces are trudging through snow and across fields to surrender to Kurdish fighters in northern Iraq. The Ansar Al-Islam guerrillas are considered terrorists, would-be suicide bombers with ties to Al-Qaeda. But as 15 of them sat in the dimness of a cinder-block house here Sunday, some with frostbitten toes, they seemed more misguided and scared than dangerous.
Until they exploded, anyway...
Some are boys. Others said they had never fired at an enemy. Upon surrendering Sunday, their weapons were seized, their watches and combs confiscated. And in their cracked and muddy shoes, they were put on a bus and shipped to jail.
Good place for them.
More than 300 Ansar guerrillas have agreed to surrender in the coming days to the Kurdish government, according to Abdullah Haji Mahmood, a commander in the Kurdish Socialist Party who negotiated the deal. Among them are Ansar leaders, including Abdullah Shafee, Mohammad Hassan, and a man identified as Dr. Omer.
Ansar was defeated in a two-day battle last month when US Special Forces and 6,000 Kurdish fighters attacked their strongholds along the Iranian border. About 250 of Ansar’s 700 fighters were killed; others fled over the mountains and sought refuge in Iran.
Let's see, 250 dead, 300 surrender, carry the one, that's around 150 bad guys missing.
I think there were more killed in the bombardment and the 250 were killed in the ground assault. We're pretty close to accounting for all 600-700 of them...
But Kurdish officials said Iran has played a critical role in squeezing Ansar militants by preventing them from crossing the border, even for medical treatment. Although the Kurds have been asking Tehran to help isolate Ansar for months, Iran acted only after quiet US intervention, through both secret talks and diplomatic messages via Swiss diplomats, a ranking Kurdish official said Sunday. “Iran is pushing back Kurdish members of Ansar,’’ the official said. “Iran even refused to help the wounded. Perhaps the Iranians understand English better than Kurdish.’’
They understand English: Cruise missile, JDAM, Boeing, Marines, Special Forces, regime change, words like that.
Other Kurdish officials, however, said the Iranians are still holding a number of Ansar’s leaders, including bombmaker Ayub Afghani and Hemin Benishari, who allegedly specialized in military tactics and assassinations.
Holding is better than on the loose.
And Kurdish authorities are investigating whether Iran gave Arabs who belonged to Ansar safe passage to a third country.
Surprise meter didn't twitch
Although made up largely of radical Kurds, Ansar had an estimated 120 hard-core Arab fighters from Yemen, Morocco, Israel, Tunisia and other countries.
As they say, "The Usual Suspects". These would be the missing bad guys.
A number of them trained in Al-Qaeda’s camps in Afghanistan, and Washington claims Ansar manufactured chemical agents and was a terrorist bridge between the Middle East and Europe. Many of the Ansar fighters who have surrendered, however, “are different from Osama Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda,’’ said Mahmood, whose men guarded and fed the guerrillas until they were taken to prison. “Most of them are brainwashed youths,’’ he said.
Probably more like the Pak madrassah trash that swarmed into Afghanistan to fight the infidels and got slaughtered in droves...
“We believe they have been cheated and deceived and don’t really believe what Ansar teaches... We have two options: to forgive them, or kill them. If we kill them, we will be no better than them.’’ Younger fighters not involved in killings will be released to their families following “elaborate security checks,’’ said Barham Salih, prime minister of the Patriotic Union of Kurdistan, which governs the eastern half of the Kurdish enclave in northern Iraq. “We will investigate. This is not about vengeance. It’s about justice.’’
The Kurds have got their act together.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 10:06 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Why did we try to deal with Turkey again? Maybe Bush should start pushing for a sovereign Kurdistan as soon as the dust settles around Baghdad. The Kurds have caught a raw deal from all sides since the Ottomans ruled the steppe, and this is just the kind of stunt Bush would pull to teach the Turks a lesson.

Rise Kurdistan rise!
Posted by: defscribe || 04/08/2003 12:04 Comments || Top||

#2  The Turks had their chance to be part of the solution. When they blocked the 4ID entrance through Turkey, they became part of the problem.
Posted by: Douglas De Bono || 04/08/2003 13:25 Comments || Top||


People of Basra do not accept British occupation
The people of Basra do not accept occupation of their city by British forces, the al-Arabiya television channel said on Tuesday. The reporter of the TV channel, who arrived in the city this morning, said Basra is gradually to begin its ordinary life. The city's stores have already started activities, he added. Although the people are interested in change of regime, due to suppressive policies of the Baathist regime, they do not accept this kind of occupation, the reporter added. The British forces are fortifying their positions throughout the city, he said adding that they try to tell the local people that they are not occupyers or invaders and that they are only in Iraq to provide the Iraqi nation with freedom.
Thanks for your opinion. Now shuddup and get back to your hotel.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 10:13 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  See the post on the Abu Dahbi station being attacked a little later. Money quote: The al-Arabiya, Al-Minar and Al-Jazeera news channels broadcast shots of the arrival of two aggressors' tanks on a major bridge on the Tigris river.

The al-Arabiya, Al-Minar and Al-Jazeera news channels all SIMULTANEOUSLY show the same shots? Sounds to me that the same people are calling the editing shots too.
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 10:21 Comments || Top||

#2  These people are grabbing for any straw that might add a little hope to their doctrine. Just like some Europeans(primarily French)are looking any mistake the Coalition forces make to exploit it to the fullest.
Posted by: George || 04/08/2003 10:43 Comments || Top||

#3  The British presence is not optional, so yeah... shuddup and get back to your hotel :-)

The fact is that the US and Brits will be happy has hell to gtf out of that place when the job is done. But not before.
Posted by: Perry de Havilland || 04/08/2003 12:06 Comments || Top||


Iraq's Planning Ministry bombarded
The al-Arabiya TV channel aired directly from Baghdad shots of Iraqi Planning Ministry being heavily bombarded. The al-Arabiya correspondent said parts of the ministry were set ablaze near the Tigris river.
Maybe they should plan on going into a different line of work?
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 09:50 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Got a feeling they weren't gonna be too busy in the near future anyways.
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 11:46 Comments || Top||

#2  Not the original group. The new ones, speaking gringo, will be very busy
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 19:18 Comments || Top||


Abu Dhabi TV bureau attacked
Abu Dhabi TV bureau in Baghdad had been hit on Tuesday, said the Qatar-based Al-Jazeera TV channel. The al-Arabiya, Al-Minar and Al-Jazeera news channels broadcast shots of the arrival of two aggressors' tanks on a major bridge on the Tigris river. The al-Arabiya channel reported the area which is currently under heavy bombardment is an administrative complex near the Tigris river. A US missile hit the Arabic Al-Jazeera TV channel's premises in Baghdad early Tuesday, leaving one correspondent dead and a cameraman wounded, the satellite TV channel itself reported. It said their office is located in a civilian area in the city and there were other buildings in the vicinity.
Too bad when those civilian areas of the city start crawling with jihad lice. Guess that's why they call it a war zone, huh?
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 09:49 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Guess CENTCOM got the letter from al-Jazerra giving their position.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 10:30 Comments || Top||


Iraqi Baath militias massacre family in Baghdad
Baghdad, April 8, IRNA -- Militias of Iraq's ruling Baath party and the so-called Saddam's Fedayeen massacred six members of a family in Baghdad on Monday. Jassem Hassan, his three sons, and two of his brothers had apparently cheered the approach of Saddam's demise before they were shot dead by the militia in their residence, eastern Baghdad. Hassan's wife was injured and was transferred to hospital for treatment. Frustrated over their fate, the pro-Saddam forces have resorted to the harshest measures against the people who are critical of the regime. Similar incidents had earlier been reported in Iraq's southern city of Basra as well as Kerbala.
Humm, I'm beginning to see a trend in these IRNA stories.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 09:44 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:


US missile hits Al-Jazeera office
A US missile hit the Arabic Al-Jazeera TV channel's premises in Baghdad early Tuesday, leaving one cameraman wounded and a correspondent missing, the satellite TV channel itself reported. It said their office is located in a civilian area in the city and there were other buildings in the vicinity. It said a number of other TV channels are also operating near the Al-Jazeera premises in Baghdad.
I heard this morning that one of their correspondents is dead.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 09:43 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Saw news of this unfold on TV. Some reports of US claiming to have seen snipers/men with binoculars on the roof of the building, but the round hit nowhere near the top storey. Seems like case of mistaken identity - AFV just seeing personnel and equipment pointed in their direction and shooting first, before finding what could be some new Russian guided ordinance headed their way. Odd they hit al J though, but guess they might have been the only ones filming from an exposed balcony. Other crews, like BBC, seem to have been on a lower roof. IIRC, the Information Ministry (Chuckles Mo and his troupe) are based at the Palestine Hotel too, so wouldn't be at all surprised if there had been binoculars on the roof...
Posted by: Bulldog || 04/08/2003 10:00 Comments || Top||

#2  Dammit, I'm confusing the al J incident with a Reuters one...
Posted by: Bulldog || 04/08/2003 10:21 Comments || Top||

#3  Break out the bubbly! Our new bullshit-seeking missile is a success!
Posted by: (lowercase) matt || 04/08/2003 12:10 Comments || Top||

#4  "Our new bullshit-seeking missile is a success!"

Yeah, baby! InfoMan better watch his ass...
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 12:49 Comments || Top||

#5  Whatever the circumstances, an attack on (clearly known) information sources that leaves journalists dead, is not something that should raise cheers... especially not on a site that deals with information from all available sources.
Posted by: True German Ally || 04/08/2003 16:33 Comments || Top||

#6  TGA-- good point.

Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 21:02 Comments || Top||


Pro-Saddam forces attack US positions in Nassiriya
Independent news sources inside Iraq said pro-Saddam forces attacked positions of the US forces in Nassiriya two times on Sunday night and early Monday. The operations included an attack on the positions of foreign forces near Nassiriya hospital and two other attacks against their military cars, the sources added. The news sources refused to give further information on the details of the attacks and their results. The US and British forces captured southern Iraqi city of Nassiriya on Saturday after days of bombardments.
I don't imagine these amounted to more than harrassment...
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 09:41 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:


US-KDP ties unharmed
Spokesman of the Kurdistan Democratic Party (KDP) said Monday that killing of 18 KDP combatants during the recent US air attack on his party's positions has no effect on the existing relations between KDP and Washington. Al-Jazeera television network Monday night quoted Hooshyar Zibari as saying that a full coordination exists between the KDP and US forces in northern Iraq. All operations in northern front are carried out jointly by the American and Kurdish forces, he said adding, ''we have repeatedly announced that we will not take any measure or make any activity in the region separately."
Accidents happen. Getting rid of Sammy is more important than recriminations.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 09:40 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Still, this is regrettable. Rather than saying that a full coordination exists between the KDP and US forces in northern Iraq., they should be saying that they will strive for greater coordination between KDP and US forces.

At the same time, this DOES seem to indicate the existence of Kurdish intelligence considerably better than what we find in some places of the West: The Canadian Broadcasting Company aired a documentary trying to pin the ultimate blame for the gassing of the Kurds on the United States for selling agricultural spraying helicopters to Iraq, who converted them to deliver chemical WMD. The Kurds know the origin of the Helicopters too, but have enough moral sense to know that Sammy and co were to blame, not the United States. They'd be whistling a different tune, obviously, if the United States did all this deliberately and with intent.

I'd credit the Good character and integrity of our Special Forces that went initially into North Iraq to work with the Kurds. The Kurds know that these guys are the meanest, nastiest, sneakiest fighters we have, and if they come across as straight up, I-won't-stab-you-in-the-back types, then the kurds will know that the US Military doesn't mean them ill. (The State Department, on the other hand, is a different story. I believe that, if the Kurds had a say, Immediate Post-Iraq governance would be military, not civilian, for a long while.)

I'm sure the SF trooper involved got on the horn after this attack to "discuss it" with the higher ups. I'm sure he had a Kurd Laison with him, overhearing him. I'm sure that Kurd told Zibari what he heard.
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 10:12 Comments || Top||


Shiite cleric rejects holy sites in Iraq struck
Special Note: This story is from the Islamic Republic News Agency, a "unbiased source".
A prominent Shiite cleric on Tuesday denied reports that coalition forces had struck holy sites in the cities of Najaf and Karbala in central Iraq. "This claim that holy sites have been damaged is not true at all," opposition figure, Seyyed Abdelmajid al-Khoei, told IRNA from Najaf by telephone. "Believe me, not a single bullet has hit the wall of the shrine," he said when asked to comment on the speculation that some of the Shiite holy sites, including the mausoleum of Imam Ali (AS) — the first infallible imam of the household of Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) — in Najaf had been targeted.

The US and Iraq have been trading charges since the American-led invasion began on March 20 over the holy sites in Iraq. The US military has denied striking mosques in Najaf. Iraqi Information Minister Mohammed Said al-Sahhaf said last Wednesday that US-led forces were trying to destroy the mausoleums of Imam Ali (AS) and his martyred son, Imam Hussein (AS) — the third infallible imam — in Karbala. Khoi had earlier been cited as saying that Iraqi militiamen were using residents in Najaf as "human shields" around holy sites against the invading troops.

The cleric, who arrived in Najaf last Tuesday from his usual base in London, told IRNA that life in the holy city was very much back to normal. "Restaurants, shops and the grand bazaar are currently open and the only problem is the lack of power which force shops to close earlier," he said. Khoi described Najaf "very secure and calm", saying the city was completely in the hands of its residents and the last remnants of Iraqi militiamen from the ruling Baath party and Saddam's suicide Fedayeen forces in the city had "either gone to hell or been captured or fled".
Nice touch, that last line.

"Clashes between Iraqi militiamen and coalition forces were limited to the early days after US-led foray into Najaf. But local people's assistance eased up affairs very much after they reported the hide-outs of the criminals to the coalition forces," he said. Coalition forces control all the city's entrances and exits, he said, adding there is no sign of military presence inside Najaf. "Running water, which was cut a week ago after the Baath forces blew off the main network upon retreat, has been relinked since Monday morning," he added. The only major problem now is the lack of gas since gas stations have been affected by lack of electricity, which was supplied from Baghdad, Khoei said. The city's administration has no order and all state offices are vacated and schools closed, the cleric said, adding local people were running Najaf's affairs. "Volunteer groups of people from among the tribal heads of Najaf and other prominent figures such as traders, university professors and former state officials have been designated by the citizens to run the city's affairs," he said. Khoei said there were no clashes inside Karbala, which lies on a strategic way to Baghdad and that the war went on 25 km outside the holy city on the main road which links the two cities.
I don't think a US Army PIO could write a more glowing report.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 09:24 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "Running water, which was cut a week ago after the Baath forces blew off the main network upon retreat, has been relinked since Monday morning"

Very good news.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 9:47 Comments || Top||

#2  Volunteer groups of people from among the tribal heads of Najaf and other prominent figures such as traders, university professors and former state officials have been designated by the citizens to run the city's affairs," he said.

Bravo! Damn good start! Keep that up, and we'll be happy to leave when you ask.
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 10:15 Comments || Top||

#3  Come on, Murat. Let's hear your take on this one.
Posted by: Tom || 04/08/2003 11:24 Comments || Top||

#4  Murat, I'm still waiting.
Posted by: Tom || 04/08/2003 16:53 Comments || Top||


MKO barracks in Iraq bombed by US planes
During the heavy bombardments of targets in Iraq by US planes during the past 24 hours a number of barracks of the Iraq based terrorist Mujahedin Khalq Organization (MKO) were severely pounded, a Kurdish TV station reported on Monday. The said barracks of the outlawed Iranian armed opposition grouplet were positioned near the Iraqi cities of Khaneqin and Al-Imara, according to the (Patriotic Union of Kurdistan) PUK TV. The two cities, too, were under heavy bombardments of the US-British planes during the past 24 hours, according to the said TV's report, monitored here. Yet, heaviest losses and casualties were inflicted against the Iraqi forces and military compounds during the Sunday night and Monday bombardments of Khaneqin and Al-Imara, according to the PUK TV report. The number of the MKO guerrillas who got killed in the air attacks is not exactly mentioned in the report, but the reporter emphasized they suffered very heavy casualties.
That must make the Medes and the Persians very happy. Kinda, "the enemy of my enemy is toast."
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 09:29 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "the enemy of my enemy is toast." With protein jelly.

dorf
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/08/2003 9:57 Comments || Top||


Some Baath leaders flee to Syria
The Iraqi Kurdistan PUK TV channel reported on Tuesday a number of leaders of the Iraqi Baath Party have fled to Syria over the past few days.
Rats leaving the sinking ship.
The channel, belonging to the Patriotic Union of Kurdistan, said the leaders have applied for political asylum from Syria. It added the invading forces have arrested a number of leaders of ruling regime in Iraq in al-Karkh area in Baghdad city. PUK refused to give further information on the name of these leaders and details of their arrest, noting they tried to flee from Baghdad to get to a secure place. The Kurdish channel claimed the Pentagon has given three days to Iraqi President Saddam Hussein and his two sons to attend a live program in one of the Iraqi TV channels, or else be declared dead which will pave the way for the formation of a transitional government.
Interesting idea. I think the 3rd ID ought to swing by the crater and see if they can help with the search.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 09:07 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  the Pentagon has given three days to Iraqi President Saddam Hussein and his two sons to attend a live program in one of the Iraqi TV channels, or else be declared dead

Won't happen. IF Sammy is still alive, then he's had two close calls and is probably a nervous wreck. He's an evil bastard, but that doesn't mean he's stone cold stupid.
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 10:19 Comments || Top||

#2  Better keep on runin', guys. Syria's already made our list by backing Saddam and his boys.
Posted by: FOTSGreg || 04/08/2003 11:48 Comments || Top||


British Set Up First Post-War Iraq Govt.
Edited for length:
British forces began establishing the first post-war administration in Iraq on Tuesday, putting a local sheik into power in the southern city of Basra shortly after their troops took control of the city.
British forces installing their own sheik after taking control, that'll bring back memories around the mess table. Next we'll see pith helmets and swagger sticks.
The sheik was not identified. Col. Chris Vernon, spokesman for the British forces, said the sheik had met British divisional commanders Monday and been given the job of setting up an administrative committee representing other groups in the region. The sheik and his committee will be the first civilian leadership established in liberated Iraq, even as retired U.S. general Jay Garner, appointed by the Pentagon to form an interim post-war administration, tries to define a new leadership for the whole country. The sheik's committee will be left alone by the British to form a local authority, Vernon said. Garner has signed off on the British plan. "Gen. Garner has come up and spoke to the British divisional commander and we will be working fully in cooperation with his Office of Reconstruction and Humanitarian Aid," Vernon said.
The sheik is a local figure and not an Iraqi exile, Vernon said.
Locals in charge of locals, best way to go.
The sheik indicated that he could tap some figures in Saddam Hussein's ruling Baath party who did not oppress the local people. Most of the Baath officials in Basra had been outsiders and were detested.
There'll be a few who joined the Baath party just to get a job, after a good background check they should be ok.
"We have ascertained that he is worthwhile, credible and has authority in the local area, particularly with the tribal chiefs," Vernon said, adding that the sheik will form his committee as he sees fit "and we will take him at his word on his judgment... We would very much trust their self-selection. Their knowledge of the locals is far greater than ours is. They've been there. We've only been there 14 days."
Keep an eye on them.
In Basra, elements of the local police could be involved to help re-establish law and order, Vernon said, but indicated for the moment, they would not be allowed to carry weapons. Anyone carrying a gun will be considered an irregular fighter and risks being killed.
We'll carry the guns, thank you. Call us if you need help.
The British consider Iraq to be fertile ground to transfer as much control to civilians quickly, Vernon said. Apart from shortages of water, there is no major humanitarian problem. "This is not a former Yugoslavia, this is not Afghanistan," Vernon told a news briefing. "Basically, what we see in the Basra province is a broadly functioning civil infrastructure, and administration, to a lesser degree."
Sounds good.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 08:22 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  This'll be a stop-gap measure to try to curb the rampant looting of (mainly government) property that's going on in Basra, I assume. Clamping down on lawless elements with tact and discrimination the British forces couldn't hope to apply themselves. And to coordinate emergency humanitarian relief and infrastructure repairs on the ground. Hope this sheikh appreciates the 'interim' aspect of his job description and behaves with due propriety.
Posted by: Bulldog || 04/08/2003 9:08 Comments || Top||


Airstrike may have killed Saddam
A U.S. Air Force warplane dropped four enormous bombs Monday on a residential complex where “extremely reliable” intelligence indicated that Iraqi President Saddam Hussein and one or both of his sons were attending a meeting, senior administration officials told NBC News. The sources would not rule out the possibility that Saddam could have moved before the bomber struck, but they said it was likely that he and his sons were dead.

BASED ON information from an intelligence source on the ground in Baghdad, U.S. military officials were confident that Saddam and his son Qusay were attending a meeting in the neighborhood with other top Iraqi leaders, senior officials told NBC’s Carl Rochelle at the Pentagon and Andrea Mitchell at the State Department. They said they believed it was possible that Saddam’s other son, Uday, also was there. The intelligence information was considered so reliable that it justified a massive attack in a residential area of the al-Mansour district of western Baghdad despite the administration’s declared emphasis on avoiding civilian casualties, diplomatic and military sources said.

Officials quickly called in an Air Force B-1B bomber to strike the location. At 2 p.m. (6 a.m. ET), the warplane dropped four GBU-31 Joint Direct Attack Munition weapons, the 2,000-pound smart bombs known as “bunker busters,” leaving giant holes in the ground, the officials said. Diplomatic officials and officials at the Pentagon told NBC News that they were highly confident that they killed most of the people at the meeting, but they said it could take a day or two before they knew for sure. The airstrike was confirmed by senior administration officials at the White House and military officials at U.S. Central Command forward headquarters in Doha, Qatar. The officials would not comment on the possible effect of the airstrike, but officials in Qatar said that the atmosphere at Central Command was one of “confidence” and that more information could be released in the coming hours.

Senior U.S. officials have told NBC News that Saddam’s likely successor, assuming Qusay Hussein was not available to take command, would be Izzat Ibrahim, vice chairman of the Revolutionary Command Council. The sources said Ibrahim was believed to be in Mosul in northern Iraq in recent weeks, not in Baghdad.

The air raid in al-Mansour, a stronghold of Saddam’s Baath Party, blasted a 60-foot-deep crater, ripped orange trees from their roots and left behind a heap of concrete, mangled iron rods and shredded furniture and clothes. Witnesses said nine Iraqis were killed. If Saddam was among them, U.S. military planners would have achieved one of their prime objectives in the war. It would cap a dramatic day in which U.S. forces established a foothold in one of Saddam’s palaces in Baghdad after swooping into the city the day before and moving to cut off escape routes from the capital.
Posted by: Bent Pyramid || 04/08/2003 04:47 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Let's hold back on ululating and the distribution of candy to children until we're sure we hit them...
Posted by: Brian || 04/08/2003 7:08 Comments || Top||

#2  Earlier Monday, the military was led to a site in a city near Baghdad where suspicious chemical compounds were stored, but subsequent tests proved negative, military sources told Reuters.


Even though the stuff discovered is supposedly pesticides, I wonder why it was stored in a military looking depot. Even if it isn't accepted as a Chemical Weapon, its effects on people are so equivalent, that one wonders if Saddam and Company went on a search for suitable, POTENTIALLY dual-use chemicals. After all, Zyklon B, the gas used by the Nazis in the concentration camps, was originally marketed as an effective verim killer and disinfectant, no?
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 7:10 Comments || Top||

#3  Perhaps commercially available pesticides can be chemically transformed into nerve agents? I'd have to bone up on my chemistry to be sure. That way they wouldn't obviously be buying precursor chemicals.
Posted by: Bent Pyramid || 04/08/2003 7:16 Comments || Top||

#4  Many commercially available pesticides work in the same manner as nerve agents, but are chemically/physically tailored to kill pests (non-human) better than they kill people. Vice-versa for nerve agents. In a pinch, these pesticides can be used as never agents to kill people. The antidotes for accidental nerve-agent like pesticide intoxication (atropine, pralidoxime or 2-PAM) are the same as those used by the military for nerve gas exposure.
Posted by: Tresho || 04/08/2003 8:42 Comments || Top||

#5  Is Info Man scheduled for his press conference today? I'm interested on how he tries to spin this thing. Or has even he given up?
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 9:19 Comments || Top||

#6  If you read the fine print on the pesticide bottles at your local garden store, it'll scare the hell out of you. The symptoms of exposure are exactly those of the nerve agents taught in the NBC training classes I received.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 9:21 Comments || Top||

#7  How come if one of these barrels of pesticides were stored next to a day-care center here in North American, the Lefty-Greens would be screaming murder, WMD, the end of the world? Bet they'll scream about this now? No.
Posted by: Don || 04/08/2003 9:28 Comments || Top||

#8  Is it true that, in a gesture of fence-mending, Villepan offered us a sample of Saddam's DNA taken from Jacques Chirac's lips?
Posted by: tbn || 04/08/2003 17:08 Comments || Top||

#9  One report I heard said the chemicals were found one block away from a terrorist training camp. Pesticides were found inside the camp as well.
Posted by: Jon || 04/08/2003 17:57 Comments || Top||

#10  Maybe it was for the roaches? that's why the camps were empty
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 19:27 Comments || Top||


SAS troops stop Russian convoy in Iraq
Australian Special Air Service (SAS) soldiers have stopped a convoy of cars carrying Russian diplomats leaving Baghdad. Several days ago the diplomats were shot at and injured as they fled Baghdad on the road to Syria. Defence spokesman Brigadier Mike Hannan says earlier today a group of SAS soldiers stopped the convoy. He says the Russian Ambassador to Iraq and his entourage declined any medical assistance from the SAS and were allowed to continue their journey.
"Hey Doc, whattya got in yer kit for these =cough= friends of ours?"
"Sarge, I got some band-aids and some greazy ointment."
"That'll have to do. Hand them over to Boris there. Be ready to take 'no' for an answer."

The Defence Ministry has also announced some of the Air Force personnel operating Orion maritime surveillance aircraft in the Middle East will return to Australia to be refreshed by other air crew.
Thanks again, mates!
Posted by: Steve White || 04/08/2003 01:51 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Was this a second wave of Ruskies?
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 7:12 Comments || Top||

#2  Ptah, I can never hear the word "Ruskies" without thinking of Slim Pickens in Dr. Strangelove. Always a good way to start my day!
Posted by: Bent Pyramid || 04/08/2003 7:21 Comments || Top||


At Intersection, Army’s Mission Turns to Chaos
Description of a hellish fire-fight in WaPo.

BAGHDAD, April 7 -- As Army troops barreled into the heart of Baghdad today, a unit from the 2nd Brigade of the 3rd Infantry Division was ordered to hold onto a key cloverleaf in the southern part of the city, a mission that sounded routine but quickly turned into five hours of killing and fiery chaos.

An Iraqi rocket-propelled grenade slammed into a U.S. ammunition truck at the intersection. As mortars aboard the ammunition truck exploded, they set a nearby fuel tanker truck ablaze, sending clouds of black smoke billowing into the sky. With the cloverleaf now an inferno, soldiers dove for cover or ran for their vehicles. Two Special Forces vehicles -- Toyota pickup trucks -- went up in flames.

"RPG on the roof! RPG on the roof!" yelled one soldier from beneath an overpass as he peered through binoculars at a building up ahead. M2 Bradley Fighting Vehicles and other armored vehicles poured 25mm cannon and machine-gun fire at the target, but the incoming rounds continued. "Get out of here now!" a sergeant bellowed.

At least two soldiers of the 3rd Battalion, 15th Infantry Regiment task force were killed and four were wounded in the battles, which were fought without air support. Commanders said air missions were called off because of antiaircraft fire and the thick ocher haze that hung over the city. U.S. jets bombed targets in Baghdad later in the day, however.

Two of the wounded U.S. soldiers were victims of friendly fire when an artillery round from a Paladin 155mm self-propelled howitzer fell far short of its intended target -- the building where Iraqi snipers and militiamen were spotted firing rocket-propelled grenades. Instead, the round landed on the stone embankment of one of the cloverleaf ramps, about 50 yards from troops holding the intersection.

First Sgt. Chris French estimated that at least 25 Iraqis were killed in the fighting, and about 30 others threw up their hands and surrendered when infantrymen of the 3rd Battalion's Bravo Company cleared a series of trenches and bunkers in and around the intersection. The surrendering loyalists, members of Saddam's Fedayeen and other militia groups, were ordered to strip when they emerged from the trenches as a precaution against suicide attacks.

"Do not wave them to you!" Capt. Ronny Johnson, the Bravo Company commander, yelled at his platoon leaders as the first group of fighters came forward. "Make 'em strip! I want these guys butt-ass naked!" Some of the captured loyalists were forced to remove all their clothing, but most were allowed to keep their underwear on. Several had been wounded before giving up.

One of the prisoners said he was Syrian, part of a group of 5,000 from his country that he said volunteered to defend Iraq, according to French. Hundreds of rocket-propelled grenade rounds were found in the trenches with the loyalists, he said.
Syrian, eh?
An Army medic, Sgt. Mario Manzano of St. Petersburg, Fla., said one wounded prisoner offered him a thick wad of Iraqi dinars for treating him. When he refused, Manzano said, the Iraqi man began weeping, thanked him for the medical treatment and denounced President Saddam Hussein in broken English.
I snipped some of the set-up description; the following picks up the account from shortly before reaching the cloverleaf.
Steadily, the convoy pushed past factories, military compounds and warehouses, all constructed of the same sand-colored brick and plaster. By the time the convoy reached the cloverleaf, the Bradleys, Humvees and support vehicles were under fire. The smell of cordite hung in the air. Muzzle flashes were spotted from buildings ahead.

"Be advised, the suicide bombers are out," Johnson told his troops on the radio.

"We've got enemies coming from the north!" shouted one platoon leader. "Engage and destroy," Johnson ordered.

From then on, any vehicle that approached from the north was considered fair game. Several civilian vehicles were blasted with 25mm high-explosive rounds and machine-gun fire, their passengers assumed to be hostile.

Then came a radio report of enemy bunkers to the rear, south of the cloverleaf and even within it, a few dozen yards from the column's vehicles. Infantrymen poured out of their Bradleys and began moving down the trench line, occasionally firing into it. Fighters hiding in the trenches began to surrender, raising their hands and climbing out.

From its spot beneath an overpass, the nose of an M88 armored recovery vehicle occasionally ventured forward to poke out from the shadows. Staff Sgt. David Fields, the vehicle's commander, ordered his driver and mechanic to keep a sharp lookout. Through his binoculars, the mechanic, Pvt. Luke Tate, a 28-year-old farmer from Missouri, repeatedly picked out targets behind fighting positions on the ground or in the windows of tall buildings up ahead, and Fields opened up on them with his M-16 rifle or the .50-caliber machine gun mounted on his turret.

"There's still someone in that left back window," Tate said after directing fire at men he said were holding rifles and RPGs.

Fields, 38, of Lee's Summit, Mo., picked up his M-16 and fired. "They were firing AKs at us, but they didn't get any RPG rounds off," Tate said, referring to AK-47 assault rifles.

That luck did not hold. As the morning stretched into afternoon and the company stayed put, enemy combatants filtered into the area, opening fire on the Americans in and around the cloverleaf. Then, shortly after 1 p.m., a column of resupply trucks, including fuel tankers, pulled up from the south.

"We've got the whole support platoon showing up," French said on the radio.

"Who the [expletive] brought these guys all the way up here?" Fields muttered. "What a bunch of idiots."

"I didn't ask for them to come up here," French added. "We really haven't consolidated yet."

Johnson radioed that the resupply was for two other battalions that had gone ahead and were running short of ammunition.

"I'm fully aware of [that], but this is not a good place to stop," French replied.

He was right; the fighting intensified. Inside the M88, hot brass shell casings poured into the open hatch, covering the vehicle's floor, as Fields blasted away with his 7.62mm machine gun.

"This bitch is almost over," said the driver, Pvt. Damon Winneshiek, a Native American and a former blackjack dealer in a Wisconsin casino. "These guys are going to have to give up soon."

"I just don't believe we're sitting here," Fields said.

As the fighting continued, five naked prisoners were escorted back to the cloverleaf from a trench that the infantrymen cleared in the northwestern corner of the intersection. Then the RPG round arced into the ammunition truck, and it was bedlam.

Fields and Tate poured fire into the building about 400 yards ahead of them, Fields shooting his machine gun and an AT4 antitank missile and Tate firing his M-4 automatic rifle.

"Load up all the dismounts, a section at a time!" Johnson ordered. It was time to leave.

The infantrymen piled into their Bradleys. Once everyone was accounted for, the convoy resumed its northward push, the armored vehicles protecting the fuelers and ammo trucks needed by the other battalions up ahead.

All along the route, fighting continued, machine guns and Bradley cannons opening up on targets in front of the column and on both sides. At one point, an RPG round hit the side of a bridge just as the M88 was passing under it, missing the turret by several feet. Another RPG round struck the M113 armored personnel carrier of French, the company first sergeant. But it bounced off. A dud.

Arriving at Hussein's Sijood Palace, where they pulled up for the night, Fields ordered Winneshiek, the M88 driver, to knock down the wall and iron fence of a compound bordering it, using the 56-ton vehicle as a battering ram.

"You busted the palace wall," Fields told the quiet 25-year-old private afterward. "You can brag about that the rest of your life. You broke the palace wall."
Wow. Quite a job. Deepest sympathy for the two who died and for their families.
Posted by: Steve White || 04/08/2003 01:40 am || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Wapo this morning reports that in Basra bodies were found with ID papers from Syria, Yemen, and elsewhere. Apparently the regime was using the Baathist secular Arab nationalist equivalent of "afghan arabs" to keep the locals down. This, as much as anything else, may explaing the warm welcome coalition troops are receiving - they dont see this war as the beginning of foreign occupation, they were ALREADY under foreign occupation. I dont imagine the locals have been left with fond feelings towards the people who were holding them down.

I would love to be present when the representative of the new Iraqi govt appears at a meeting of the Arab league - it should make the "discussion" with the Kuwaiti representative look like a lovefest by comparison.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 8:47 Comments || Top||

#2  Maybe we've slaughtered enough Arab freelancers to create a shortage for the oppress-Iranian-students job?
Posted by: someone || 04/08/2003 11:52 Comments || Top||

#3  Maybe. I'll keep an eye on the "Hench-Thugs for Hire" column to see if the hourly rate goes up...
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 13:56 Comments || Top||


Humanitarian Toll Less Than Expected
The U.S.-British invasion's impact on Iraqi civilians has been less severe than some feared, an American relief coordinator said Monday. But U.N. chicken littles officials quailed said the power, water and medical breakdowns afflicting Iraq are "critical" and could worsen. "With each passing day, as the conflict continues, a humanitarian clock is ticking," said Wivina Belmonte of the U.N. Children's Fund.
"Please send us money for our corporate accounts!"
Michael Marx, leader of the U.S. government relief team for Iraq, said its prewar planning had been based on the prospect of millions of Iraqis fleeing their homes. "This is not a major humanitarian crisis," he said, "and we are happy about that."
Sounds like some "humanitarian" agencies aren't.
Posted by: Steve White || 04/08/2003 01:35 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "With each passing day, as the conflict continues, a humanitarian clock is ticking,"

So even though the humanitarian crisis doesn't appears to be panning out (DAMN!) please continue giving 'til it hurts, because there will always be a crisis somewhere for Humanitarianism Inc. to respond to. Even if we have to create it ourselves.
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 8:45 Comments || Top||

#2  While this is unfair to a lot of good people, when I see the acronym "NGO" the phrase "careerist hack" comes to mind.
Posted by: Hiryu || 04/08/2003 9:01 Comments || Top||

#3  What fun being mean and sarcastic! It doesn't change the fact that a lot of women and kids are going to be sleeping under tarps or visqueen tonight, through no fault of their own. I spent last night listening to people slam the phone down on the hook when asked to help starving refugees, and I'm barely making the rent. Go verbally abuse someone else, count your Enron shares, or contemplate how you'll spend your well-deserved tax break. I'm sure you deserve it.
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/08/2003 14:42 Comments || Top||

#4  USWAR/UN Aid agencies paint grim picture of massive relief tasks


Posted by: Anonymous || 04/08/2003 14:56 Comments || Top||

#5  It doesn't change the fact that a lot of women and kids are going to be sleeping under tarps or visqueen tonight, through no fault of their own.

So who's fault is it, Anonymous? I'd be interested in your take on that. Maybe I'll read your response while "I'm counting my Enron shares and spending my well-deserved tax break".
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 15:47 Comments || Top||

#6  Anonymous, no one here's happy about the women and kids sleeping out tonight, and we appreciate your intentions are good, but it's necessary to see these events in perspective. Tomorrow and the day after they will have freedom from tyranny and the chance to live in an infinitely happier country. Sacrifices are often necessary for progress.
Posted by: Bulldog || 04/08/2003 17:13 Comments || Top||

#7  Let's see,you need donations to pay rent.
Well here is solution for your problem:Get a job,ya bum!
Posted by: raptor || 04/09/2003 11:06 Comments || Top||

#8  Thanks for your suggestion, but I already have a job. (At $8/hr., no medical, your typical careerist hack.) Sometimes the best way to take your mind off your own difficulties is pitching in for people who are even worse off.
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/09/2003 12:11 Comments || Top||


Fate of ’Chemical Ali’ Remains in Question
Rats.
Since the first night of the war in Iraq, U.S. commanders have been trying to find and kill Ali Hassan Majeed known as "Chemical Ali" for ordering the use of poison gas against ethnic Kurds 15 years ago. Time and again over the last 18 days, U.S. forces have bombed and raided houses where they thought he was staying, only to turn up empty-handed.
"Finally Rasputin is dead!"
"Aaaaaarrrrrgggh!!!!"


Over the weekend, an informer told U.S.-British forces that Majeed could be found at an office compound in Basra, the country's second-largest city then under siege by British forces. Majeed, a cousin of President Saddam Hussein and his military commander in the south, might have chemicals with him, the informer said. In swooped the F-16 jets, and the buildings exploded into fireballs. This morning, British officers said they found Majeed's body. By this evening, however, British forces said they believed Majeed might have survived the attack. But Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld and other U.S. officials in Washington said they believed he was dead. Given Majeed's success in eluding his hunters, U.S. officers in Iraq remained more cautious. "Until they do a DNA, I'm not going to speculate," said an exasperated Col. Larry Brown, operations chief for the Marines in Iraq. "The guy has been like Freddy Krueger -- we've killed him five times already."
Should have used a silver bullet.

"There were concerted efforts to track him and kill him," said Lt. Col. Jamie Martin, the chief British liaison at Marine headquarters. "He's a very powerful figure of the regime, and his reputation for ruthlessness [was well known]. As with Saddam, his personal control has been quite a key function in what resistance there has been."

"We felt he had his finger on the button and if he said, 'Deliver chemical weapons,' chemical weapons would be delivered," said Lt. Col. David Pere, senior watch officer at the Marine headquarters. Pere has overseen several attempts to kill Majeed and said the hunt alone has been enough to sideline the Iraqi commander. "We felt if we could take him out, we would reduce the possibility of chemical attack. And two weeks later, there's been no chemical attack, and he's been on the run."

While U.S. military officials announced publicly that they had targeted Hussein in the initial barrage of Tomahawk missiles that kicked off the war, they did not mention that they were trying to hit Majeed as well.
Hey, whoever we can hit.
When they missed, they tracked him through intelligence to a house in Amarah, north of Basra, two nights later and sent in F/A-18 Hornets to bomb it. U.S. officials initially thought they had succeeded that time, and one officer jubilantly declared, "We think he's no longer breathing air."

Not the case, they discovered; a week later, they thought they had found him again in Ash Shattra, a small town north of Nasiriyah. They launched a commando raid but came up empty again.

The Basra strike occurred when a source told the U.S.-British commanders that Majeed would be returning to a complex of office buildings on the riverfront early Saturday morning, along with a general and two colonels, according to U.S. and British officers. "We set up a strike for later that morning," Maj. Bryant Sewall, a U.S. Marine liaison officer working with the British, said. "We made a positive ID on the target that was described."

The officers first requested JDAM precision-guided bombs, but that was rejected because of fear of collateral damage, so instead a pair of F-16 jets dropped a half-dozen 500-pound laser-guided bombs. Sewall, studying satellite imagery accurate to a meter, talked in the pilots to the target and "cleared them hot."

Sewall said he believed the strike got Majeed. There is "no credible evidence he's still around," he said, and people in Basra are "totally and completely convinced he was in there and is dead." A British officer, Maj. Andrew Jackson, told the Associated Press that Majeed was dead.

But later in the day, other officers backtracked. British troops received a tip that Majeed was alive and began to pursue him again. "The Brits say they have him cornered," Pere said, "so when they said a couple days ago that it was 99 percent [certain that he was dead], I guess the 1 percent was right."
Keep hunting, boys, and if you can take him alive, hand him over to the Kurds. That'll ensure the loyalty of the Kurds to us for the next fifty years.
Posted by: Steve White || 04/08/2003 01:28 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Sorry. Iraq section. Man, blogging is hard work!
Posted by: Steve White || 04/08/2003 1:39 Comments || Top||

#2  Hard work, agreed. We do appreciate your dedication, Fred and Steve!
Posted by: therien || 04/08/2003 2:57 Comments || Top||

#3  Wapo reports they may also have gotten head of Iraqi intel who was meeting with Majeed.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 8:42 Comments || Top||


Southeast Asia
Philippine Police Arrest 2 in Bombings
Philippine authorities arrested two Filipino suspects Tuesday for two deadly bombings in the southern city of Davao, President Gloria Macapagal Arroyo said. Arroyo identified the men only as Toto and Tuhamed Urong, and said they were arrested in Cotabato city, 550 miles southeast of Manila and near Davao.
Toto?
Toto is accused of planting the April 2 bomb that killed 16 people and injured 55 others at Davao's busy wharf, Arroyo said. Toto and Urong are also believed involved in the March 4 bombing outside the city's airport, which killed 22 people and injured more than 100, Arroyo said. Authorities have charged leaders of the separatist Moro Islamic Liberation Front in the airport bombing. The group has denied involvement.
"Nope, wasn't us. Must of been some other guys"
Arroyo also said "reliable intelligence" indicated that Indonesian nationals were involved in the recent spate of terrorist activities. She claimed the perpetrators have links to the al-Qaida terrorist network, and said the Indonesian suspects "have also been sighted in terrorist training camps in Mindanao," the main southern island where the attacks took place.
Indonesians being involved doesn't budge the surprise meter
Another blast in the southern Philippines on Tuesday led to the discovery of two bombs outside a mosque, the Radio Mindanao Network reported. Police and army bomb experts, responding to a loud explosion in the village of Banale, outside Pagadian city, found two 60 mm mortars with timing devices and blasting caps outside the mosque and an adjacent Arabic school owned by an Islamic aid association, the Radio Mindanao Network station in the city reported. The report said there were bloodstains inside the mosque.
Either islamic turf war or christian reprisal, take your pick.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 08:12 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "And your little dog too, my pretty! HAHAHAhahahaha!"
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 10:23 Comments || Top||


Middle East
After Iraq
The Train is Leaving the Station
By Victor Davis Hanson
National Review | April 8, 2003
Edited (somewhat) for brevity

Wars disrupt the political landscape for generations. An isolationist United States became a world power after the defeat of Japan and Germany, buoyed by the confidence of millions of returning victorious veterans. Even today the pathologies of American society cannot be understood apart from the defeat in Vietnam, as an entire generation still views the world through the warped lenses of the 1960s. In some sense, postmodern quirky France today is explicable by the humiliation of 1940 and its colonial defeats to follow.

So, too, one of the most remarkable military campaigns in American military history will shake apart the world as few other events in the last 30 years. But it is eerie how the more the experts insist on all these probable scenarios, the more they seem terrified that things are not as they were.

Something weird, something unprecedented, is unfolding, driven by American public opinion — completely ignored in Europe — and the nation’s collective anger that Americans are dying by showing restraint as they are slandered by our “friends.” Despite the protestations of a return to normalcy, this present war will ever so slowly, yet markedly nonetheless, change America’s relationships in a way unseen in the last 30 years.

With little help from Saudi Arabia or Turkey — “allies” and “hosts” to our troops — damned by many of our NATO allies, stymied in the U.N., turned on by Russia, opposed by Germany and France, the Coalition nevertheless is systematically liberating a country under the most impossible of conditions. This experience in turn will oddly — if we avoid hubris and maintain our sanity — liberate us as well.

Far from making the United States hegemonic, the success in Iraq will have a sobering effect on Americans. Contrary to pundits the hard-fought Anglo-American victory will not make us into hegemonists, but simply less naïve about tradition-bound relationships and the normal method of doing business. I expect military spending to increase, even as reluctance grows to get involved with any of our traditional allies. Given billions of dollars in foreign aid, the past salvation of Europe from the Soviet juggernaut, and a half-century of protection under our nuclear shield, the old way was supposed to work something like the following.

At worse France and Germany would quietly call Mr. Powell. They would explain their predicaments and then abstain at the U.N., ensuring passage of a second decree. The traditionally wise and savvy German diplomats — conscious of everything from the Berlin Airlift to the American promise to pledge New York to preserve Bonn from a Soviet nuclear strike — would cherish American goodwill toward the German people, grimace somewhat, and then say something like: “We believe you are wrong; but we are not going to ruin a half-century of mutual amity over a two-bit fascist Iraq. So good luck, win, and let us pray that you, not we, are right — for both our sakes.”

The author forgets, or at least whitewashes, the fact that present German leadership was forged in the streets of Berlin protesting against American "imperilaism" and that the German Foreign Minister may once have been an ally, if not an outright member, of the Bader-Meinhoff Gang of terrorist thugs.

A Turkish prime minister would learn from Tony Blair, and thus explain to his parliament the historic and critical relationship with the United States, while vigorously campaigning to win approval for our armored divisions to hit Iraq from the north to help shorten a controversial war.

Assuming, of course, that Turkey really has its own interests at heart as well as those of its principle ally during the Cold War.

Mexico and Canada would complain privately, but express North American solidarity. In other words, sober and sane Western statesmen would swallow their pique at a powerful United States acting unilaterally, seek to provide it diplomatic cover, and quietly accept that a removal of a mass-murdering dictator was in all liberal states’ interests.

Instead, just the opposite happened, and so we must eventually react to this radical realignment that brought it about.

We can start with those hosts of American military bases. Many Americans are now dead in part because a NATO ally Turkey not merely refused its support, but did so in such a long and drawn out fashion that it is impossible to believe that it was not preordained to hamper U.S. military operations. And, of course, Turkey’s last-minute refusals to allow transit of U.S. divisions did exactly that by delaying the critical rerouting of troops and supplies to the Gulf.

Hey, Murat, did ya' see this one? Turkey is directly repsonsible for the deaths of Americans. Will we forgive Turkey for that? Probably, yes - because that's the kind of people we really are.

I would expect that we all will smile, still extend some minor aid, but simmer on the inside and quietly and professionally take steps to ensure that we are never put in such a position again. We should, without fanfare, bow out of Turkish-EU discussions, and let Europe and Turkey on their own decide the wisdom of allowing an Islamic country into the “liberal” European confederation. The EU can handle Cyprus.

Ditto the erosion with the Saudi Arabian relationship. Bases that earn us enmity, cannot be adequately used when Americans die nearby, and are expensive political liabilities, are not military assets. The paradox grows worse when bases exist through the pretexts that they in part help to protect the host country that does not wish to be protected.

We should smile, profess goodwill — and then withdraw all American troops from Saudi Arabia as soon as events settle down in Iraq, reassessing in a post-Cold War, post-9/11 world our entire relationship with that medieval country. After all, we buy oil from the worst of all dictatorships in Teheran and the people there like us better than do the Saudis precisely because we are not complicit in their government. The Saudis, of course, could still catch the train as it leaves the station, and join the 21st century — but it is their call, not ours.

We are told that an Israeli-Palestinian solution will restore our good name in the Middle East. Maybe. But like the past spectacle of Palestinians cheering news of the 3,000 American dead, the recent West Bank volunteers who wish to go to Baghdad to blow up more Americans and protect another Arab fascist don’t play well in the United States — and make us wonder what our hundreds of millions of dollars in aid for the Palestinian Authority are for.

We must maintain cordial relations with Russia — but Russia has never had an accounting with tens of thousands of Communist apparatchiks who here and there inhabit the present government. This was a country, after all, which to the silence of the Arab and European worlds killed thousands of Muslims in Chechnya, rooted for the mass murderer Milosevic, allowed weapons to be sold to Saddam Hussein that would be used to kill Americans, and thwarted all our efforts in the U.N. Surely it is time for sobriety and circumspection in everything we do with them.

If we thought Turkey’s recent turnabout was depressing, imagine a South Korea when that crisis heats up, as thousands in Seoul take to the street to protest our presence as they are hours away from being annihilated by North Korean artillery. As soon as possible we should begin discussions about carefully drawing down troops and relocating them far to the south to compose a “strategic reserve” as tens of thousands of wealthy brave South Korean teenagers assume their exclusive place on the front-line to protect their own motherland from Korean Stalinists. And if we cannot convince China that it is time to rein in Pyongyang’s nukes, then we should throw up our hands and let Tokyo, Seoul — even Taiwan — do what is necessary to provide for their own strategic deterrence.

Certain elements in the Japanese government are already openly discussing whether or not they should have their own nuclear weapons program - and Japanese nuclear research is well-advanced over that of North Korea - or even maybe mainland China.

In the neighborhood of the battlefield, Iran is in a unique position. The illegitimate government will have to tell its own restless population why the liberation of Iraq next door is a bad thing. The unfortunate Iranians, scarred by a dirty war with Saddam Hussein, weary of mullocracy that they brought in themselves, will not be unhappy that the soldiers a decade ago who slaughtered them are losing, and the changes that are coming across the border are what they themselves want.

Imagine a free Iraq, with trade goods flowing across the border to Iran - what effect will that have of the mullocracy?

Syria, the embryo of most terrorist groups and the occupier of Lebanon, still issues empty threats. For all the scary rhetoric and promises of worldwide jihad, an impotent Syria must be terrified of the consequences should it send direct aid to Saddam Hussein. It is a historical rarity that 300,000 United States troops are at last fighting an Arab dictator with 70 percent of the American people’s support — and losing far fewer dead than those slaughtered in one day in their sleep in a barracks in Lebanon.

And then there is the madness of Europe. It is time to speak far more softly and carry a far larger stick. France may be right that we all have really come to the end of history — and so we should give them an opportunity to prove it, to match deed with word by being delighted as we withdraw troops from Germany. Germany may or may not be embracing the frightening old nationalist rhetoric

I mentioned this very possibility and the historic reminders of Germany's past history, in a post here just last week.

— but again that will be France’s problem, not ours. Let us hope that the more sober in Germany can still grasp at what Mr. Schroeder has nearly thrown away, and see that few superpowers have given it so much and asked for so little in return — and genuinely wish it to do well.

But again it is their call, not ours. We do not have to withdraw from a dead NATO, but we should simply grin and spend as much on it as Europe does — and so let it die on the vine. How could we be allies with such countries as France and Germany when sizable minorities there want a fascistic Saddam Hussein to defeat us?

There is not much need to speak of the governments of Canada and Mexico. More liberal trade agreements and concessions with Mr. Chretien are about as dead as open borders are with Mr. Fox. It is the singular achievement of the present Canadian government to turn a country — whose armed forces once stormed an entire beach at Normandy and fielded one of the most heroic armies in wars for freedom — into a bastion of anti-Americanism without a military. Both countries are de facto socialist states, and the Anglo-French pique we see in Europe is right across our northern borders in miniature. Anyone who looked at the papers in Mexico City could rightly assume our neighbors’ elite preferred an Iraqi victory.

And so where does all that leave us? Unlike the conventional rhetoric of pessimists (e.g., “the world hates us”), we may well be in a stronger position than ever before. Russian arms, German bunkers, and French contracts will become known in Iraq and will be weighed against America’s use of overwhelming force for a moral cause in a legal and human fashion against a barbaric regime. The Middle Eastern claim that we won’t or can’t fight on the ground is a myth. And America, not the Orwellian Arab Street, is the catalyst for democratic reform. Looming on the horizon are Iraqi archives, the evidence of weapons of mass destruction, and a happy liberated populace that Europe would have otherwise left well enough alone to profit from its overseers.

And with any luck at all the Iraqi people will remember this for a long time. Europe looked the other way while they were slaughtered - and American soldiers died to liberate them.

The United Nations has lost its soft spot in the hearts of Americans, and is more likely to appease dictators than aid consensual governments. The general-secretary should be scrambling madly before the armistice to win our good graces — never has American support for the U.N. been lower, even as a U.N. resolution has never been better enforced at almost no cost to its general membership. The debate has now spun out of control and questions not merely our own membership but also the very propriety of the residence of the General Assembly headquarters in New York.

And as for Britain, Australia, Spain, Denmark, Italy, and a host of Eastern European countries who are rolling down the tracks with us, waving to the exasperating at the station, we have to show them as much appreciation for their stalwart courage as we do abject disdain for the duplicity of their peers behind.

May God, and America, continue to bless them all.

The world is upside down and we should expect some strange scenes of scrambling in the weeks ahead as side-glancing diplomats and nail-biting envoys flock to meet Mr. Powell in Washington, who — far from fearing those recent idiotic calls for his resignation — will in fact emerge as one of the most effective and powerful secretaries in recent history. Such are the ironies of war.

It will all be an interesting show.

It will be, indeed...
Posted by: FOTSGreg || 04/08/2003 02:57 pm || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Wonderfully argued the subject was the ever increasing nationalism we are feeling with reasonable actions that would creat more punishnent than direct action.Reminds me of a title fight when the winner finally realizes his opponent is being held up by his punches,and the ropes.When he stops fighting and backs away the opponent falls.
Posted by: Themiddle || 04/08/2003 16:05 Comments || Top||


PM threatens to quit as Arafat hinders change
Facing an imminent deadline to form a new government, Palestinian prime minister Mahmud Abbas is meeting dogged resistance to change from his boss Yasser Arafat (1927-2003?) and has even threatened to quit in protest at the obstacles being presented. Abbas, also known by his nom de guerre Abu Mazen, was "astonished" by the corruption he uncovered in a fact-finding mission to Gaza after he was appointed on March 19, said one official. Abbas has spent much of his time so far in Gaza, which unlike the West Bank has not been reoccupied by Israel and where the Palestinian Authority, set up under the 1993 Oslo accords and headed by Arafat, still functions. After extensive talks with various factions and individuals, private sector business and human rights workers, Abbas was "astonished by the degree of corruption" he found, especially in the security apparatus, one official said. The range of abuses by the security services ranged from protection rackets to major mismanagement. When he returned to the Fatah Central Committee on Saturday he told Arafat he was ready to quit, insiders said, but stressed they believed the threat was a bargaining tactic. The two men, co-founders of the mainstream Fatah faction, argued over the role of the security forces and the need for reforms, with Arafat insisting the apparatus was under his jurisdiction and he that would take steps, not Abbas.
No surprise here, unless it's that he actually threatened to quit. The PA is a sick critter. Its only saving grace is that Hamas is sicker.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 02:34 pm || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  He was Shocked...Shocked to see so much corruption
Posted by: Capsu78 || 04/08/2003 14:49 Comments || Top||

#2  No matter who or what (not always identifiable as human) leads the PA, it will never command more than 80%-85% of the population. Half of the remainder will support the terrorist groups (Al Aqsa, Hammas, Hezbollah, etc. - any of which is capable, thanks to funding from the Saudi's, Syria, Iran, and Iraq, oops, not anymore! Heh.

Er, as I was saying, any of which is capable of torpedoing any "peace process" anytime they wish. Now if the money and arms and other forms of support were cut off (Iran, Syria, and Saudi were somehow put on ice), then the "leaders" of these terror clans would rather quickly vacate the premises.

Without money to buy protection and cooperation from the locals (now accustomed to being bribed for help), the loss of social status and prestige (you just know they are feted as heros - and are addicted to it), and the sudden loss of income (which is the real driver) these cretins would finally get out of the way. Probably go to France to enjoy whatever cash they skimmed and stashed.

I would imagine that some might actually be relieved - the Israelis might forget about them if they left...not! But that's another story, eh?

The PA couldn't run a lemonade stand. They'd eat all of the lemons and steal the cashbox. I think the real fools are the morons who support them. They are stealing these clowns blind.
Posted by: PD || 04/08/2003 15:08 Comments || Top||

#3  Your winnings, Capsu....
Posted by: Brian || 04/08/2003 17:36 Comments || Top||

#4  Brian and Capsu: connoisseurs of fine films, where the french knew there place except for the few real resistance people....mmmm and Ingrid
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 20:24 Comments || Top||


Death toll rises to seven in Israeli air strike on Gaza City
At least seven Palestinians were killed and more than 20 wounded as Israeli F16 fighters and Apache helicopters attacked a residential area in Gaza City, Palestinian medical sources told AFP. One of the dead was named as Saadi al-Arabit, a local leader of the Ezzedin al-Qassam Brigades, the armed wing of the Islamic radical movement Hamas, security sources said. An aide was also killed, while women and children were among the 27 injured, six of whom were in critical condition, the sources said. Witnesses said the Israeli warplanes appeared to be targeting a car but they hit the house instead. It was not immediately clear to whom the house belonged, they said. Security sources said the car belonged to members of the Ezzedine al-Qassam Brigades, armed wing of the Islamic radical movement Hamas. It was unclear if anyone inside the car was hurt in the attack.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 02:26 pm || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  That's the latest from Haaretz:

Five Palestinians killed when F-16 jet fires missile at vehicle in Gaza
45 hurt, 8 critically; Hamas military leader Sa'id Arbid and his deputy are among the dead.


Posted by: marek || 04/08/2003 22:35 Comments || Top||


Home Front
Fourth ’Buffalo Six’ Member Pleads Guilty
A jobs counselor who met privately with Usama bin Laden in Afghanistan after attending an Al Qaeda training camp pleaded guilty Tuesday to providing support to a terrorist organization. Sahim Alwan, 30, is the fourth of six American men of Yemeni descent to reach a deal with the government in exchange for a lesser sentence. Like the others, he agreed to cooperate in the government's continuing terrorism investigation. The government indicated it would seek a nine-year term when Alwan is sentenced in July. All of the defendants faced 15 years in prison.

In his plea agreement, the Buffalo-born Alwan, a married father of three, said he saw bin Laden at a Kandahar guest house before attending the camp and was taken to meet with the terrorist leader again after he left the camp. At the second meeting, Alwan said bin Laden asked "what Americans thought about martyrdom missions as well as how the brothers were doing at the al-Farooq camp." Alwan also heard bin Laden speak while at the camp. He said, "There were people willing to bear their soul in their hands for jihad." Unlike his co-defendants who pleaded guilty before him, Alwan did not say he knew the trip was illegal. He said he believed he was attending training in jihad, described as a struggle against those not of Islamic faith.
"How was I to know it was illegal, I could hardly hear what he was saying over the gunfire and explosions."

Last month, Yahya Goba and Shafal Mosed each pleaded guilty to one count of providing material support to a foreign terrorist organization. Prosecutors said they would seek an eight-year sentence for Mosed and a 10-year prison term for Goba. Faysal Galab pleaded guilty in January to supporting Al Qaeda. He is expected to receive a seven-year sentence. The two other defendants, Mukhtar al-Bakri and Yasein Taher, remain in plea negotiations, attorneys said.
Four down, two to go.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 02:02 pm || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Where are all the 'racist' critics now? Quote: 'Other than attending a terrorist training camp in afghanistan, do you have any other proof'? -Katie Curic
Posted by: Cyber Sarge || 04/08/2003 17:45 Comments || Top||

#2  I saw a video colonoscopy Katie was undergoing on TV, and they actually found her head - it was a true dramatic moment™
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 18:25 Comments || Top||

#3  He said he believed he was attending training in jihad, described as a struggle against those not of Islamic faith.

The thinking of your standard Religion of Peace™(lgf) member in a nutshell.
Gotta fight those horrible infidels and kaafir.
Posted by: Celissa || 04/08/2003 19:04 Comments || Top||


North Africa
Sahara tunnels could solve mystery of missing tourists
Desert nomads were reported yesterday to have discovered an abandoned vehicle and a network of tunnels in a remote region of southern Algeria thought likely to provide clues about the mysterious disappearance of 29 western tourists in the Sahara over the past seven weeks. Germany's ARD television channel said the off-road vehicle was found in a mountainous district north of the Algerian town of Tamanrasset at the weekend by a camel train of nomads passing through the region. The vehicle was left parked outside the entrance to a complex system of underground caves linked by tunnels. The nomads said they suspected the caves "were inhabited", although they had not entered the system to find out.
"I ain't going down there, you go." "Screw that!"
The nomads' find appeared to be the first clue so far in an increasingly desperate search for the missing tourists, whose number increased to 29 last week after Austria announced that eight of its citizens had disappeared in the region. Sixteen Germans, four Swiss and a Dutchman have gone missing in the Algerian Sahara since the beginning of March. The last evidence of their whereabouts is a photograph taken by a friend of the missing tourists that shows six of the explorers with a car and three motorcycles while taking a break on a pass in the Algerian mountains on 21 February.
Shades of "The Blair Witch Project".
Two days later, the first group disappeared. German and Algerian investigators suspect the tourists may have been taken hostage by a militant Islamist group, known as the Salafist Group for Call and Combat (GSPC), which has links to al-Qa'ida.
However, no ransom demand has so far been made. "We cannot rule out any possibility; there have been no demands," said a German Federal Criminal Bureau spokesman. He said the search had been widened to include the use of helicopters equipped with heat-seeking cameras.
Which won't do squat hunting for cold dead bodies.
German tour operators had recently insisted that Algeria's southern Sahara rated as a relatively problem-free area.
I think they also rate Iraq, Afghanistan, the Congo, and the Ivory Coast as relatively "problem-free" areas.
However, Germany's Sahara Club, which organises trips to the region, strongly criticised the German Foreign Ministry yesterday for failing to do enough to warn tourists of the dangers. The club claimed it had warned the German authorities about the dangers of the region some three weeks ago but had been ignored. It said it suspected the tourists had been captured by a "well-organised group" that had extensive contacts beyond Algeria's borders.
Tourists keep disapearing, locals find a complex system of underground caves linked by tunnels. I think I saw this movie on the USA network last week. "Lair Of The C.H.U.D."
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 11:16 am || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "Snakes! Very dangerous...You go first."
-- John Rhys-Davies (RIP)
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 11:49 Comments || Top||

#2  Is it just me, or why would anybody in their right mind want to vacation in the Sahara Desert?
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 12:40 Comments || Top||

#3  It's not just you.
Posted by: Tom || 04/08/2003 13:21 Comments || Top||

#4  It's not just you.
Posted by: Tom || 04/08/2003 13:21 Comments || Top||

#5  RIP? Do you mean John Rhys-Davies is dead?
Posted by: OldSpook || 04/08/2003 15:11 Comments || Top||

#6  As far as I can tell, he's still alive. I did a search and found nothing about his death.
Posted by: Steve || 04/08/2003 15:38 Comments || Top||

#7  Oops. Ignore my last. Alive and kicking, apparently.
Even after a wall fell on Gimli...

John Rhys-Davies (actor) -- Alive. Born May 5, 1944. Sallah in the Indiana Jones movies, Gimli the dwarf in the Lord of the Rings movies
http://dpsinfo.com/dps/rnames.html
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 15:39 Comments || Top||

#8  Yum! I ate 'em, in revenge for Iraq.

EAT 'EM UP!
Posted by: Hungry Allah || 04/08/2003 17:11 Comments || Top||


Middle East
Some Arab states have become hosts to US bases, says Lebanese minister
Lebanese State Minister Bechara Morahhaj said here on Tuesday that some Arab states have become hosts to US bases.
Picked right up on that, didn't he?
He told IRNA that if Arab governments did not compete with each other in order to establish special relations with Washington, the US government would not have been confident of invading Iraq.
Kuwait didn't have to compete with anyone to have a special relationship with Washington. It's significant that those Arab states with whome we do have special relationships are of about the same size and level of vulnerability as Kuwait.
The US has been successful in exerting pressure on certain Arab governments, but the Arab nations will never accept conditions imposed on their countries, he said, adding that the demonstrations staged in front of US embassies and military bases in these countries is proof of this fact.
Either that, or proof of the fact that lots of people have time on their hands...
On the US' recent accusations against Iran and Syria, the Lebanese state minister stressed that the Zionist lobby, which enjoys great influence in the US administration, is trying to isolate Iraq from the world community. By exerting pressure on Iran and Syria, the Zionist lobby is also trying to force the two countries to be neutral in the current war in the region, he reiterated. But both Tehran and Damascus are sensitive toward current political and military developments in Iraq and cannot be indifferent towards what is going on in that country, Morahhaj said.
They can be neutral, or they can pay the price for taking Sammy's side. Iran's trying to remain neutral, Syria's not...
The Lebanese minister further called on the Iranian and Syrian governments to help settle the regional crisis within the framework of UN regulations.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 10:56 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "Lebanese State Minister Bechara Morahhaj said here on Tuesday that some Arab states have become hosts to US bases."

He then rolled his eyes amusingly before his head spun completely around. At no time were Baby Assad's lips seen to move.
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 11:18 Comments || Top||

#2  It's funny, but if you read the article, Bech mentions none of these accused nations by name. Sure, he thinks they sold out the Iraqis, but you never know when he'll have to hit up said countries for a "loan" perhaps? And it's not like the Syrians are rollin' in dough.
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 11:32 Comments || Top||

#3  Close study of the footage showed that the Lebanese State Minister was attempting to relay information to the world by blinking his eyes in what is known as Morse Code. The message said:

Syria next, please.
Posted by: Yank || 04/08/2003 11:49 Comments || Top||


Iran
Supervising board criticizes IRIB for pro-Iraq reporting of war
The supervising board of state TV has criticized the network for biased reporting of the Iraqi crisis in favor of the Iraqi regime, cautioning that this could threaten Iran's interests.
Oooh! Lookit! The Medes and the Persians have discovered the concept of "before and after," with "after" only a day or two away...
The Persian-language daily `Abrar' on Tuesday quoted Nasser Qavami, a member of the Board to Supervise the Performance of the Islamic Republic of Iran Broadcasting (IRIB), as saying that the supervisors in a meeting on Monday had unanimously agreed that the IRIB was slanted in its reporting of the Iraqi crisis.
No! State-run terriblevision? Slanting its reporting? That's never happened before, has it?
Qavami said the board had thus decided to ask the IRIB and the Supreme National Security Council (SNSC) to report whether they had a particular guideline on how to cover the developments of the war. He also said the board had asked the SNSC to notify the IRIB of its guidelines through secret procedures. IRIB's mode of reporting the Iraqi crisis had already provoked the ire of the parliamentarians on Sunday when several of them voiced concern that the state TV, only answerable to the Supreme Leader Ayatollah Seyyed Ali Khamenei, was defying Iran's positions of neutrality toward the crisis.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 10:50 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "provoked the ire of the parliamentarians on Sunday when several of them voiced concern that the state TV, only answerable to the Supreme Leader Ayatollah Seyyed Ali Khamenei, "

More internal power jockeying between moderate reformers and hardline ayatollahs. IRIB is directly controlled by Khamenei - the parlimentary guys would, I presume, dearly love to pry it away from him. Now who is this Qavami?
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 11:32 Comments || Top||


International
Iraq not a "treasure chest," UN warns US, UK
UN Undersecretary-General Shashi Tharoor warned Britain and the US Tuesday that Iraq is not a "treasure chest to be divided up" after the war.
Nor is it a whorehouse for the UN to run. What's yer point, you pompous gasbag?
He also said that the UK and American governments had no rights under international law to change Iraqi society or politics or to use their economic resources. His warning came as British Prime Minister Tony Blair and US President George W. Bush were holding a war summit in Belfast, where it was expected controversial proposals would be announced to offer the UN a limited role in post-war Iraq. "The UN has no desire whatsoever to see Iraq as some sort of treasure chest to be divvied up," Tharoor said. This should not be a case of "people dividing up the spoils of a conquest that they undertook," he told BBC Radio. He said that the "only thing that matters ultimately is the right of the Iraqi people to determine their own future, to control their own natural resources and to determine their own destinies."
"Oh, yasss... The Iraqi people are free to have an iron-fisted tin-hat dictator diverting their wealth into monumental construction to glorify himself and to buy weapons upon weapons. No one can take that right away from them..."
The Anglo-American forces had rights and responsibilities of any occupying power, but "they really have no rights under the Geneva Conventions to transform the society or the polity or to exploit its economic resources," the undersecretary-general said. "If they do need more they need to come to the Security Council to get the backing of international law for anything more ambitious than merely being an occupying power in the military sense," he warned.
"Or they can tell the UN and the Security Council to go whistle and then then watch them talk themselves to death for the next forty years..."
Tharoor said anything the UN does would require a Security Council mandate and "that includes involvement in reconstruction, involvement in any aspects of governance or civil administration." UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan was expected to meet Blair and other European leaders later this week over what is expected to be the next diplomatic challenge over the future of Iraq.
If he adopts the same insulting tone as this sanctimonious pinhead, Bush and Blair might beat him up.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 10:43 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  After the surrender of Japan, MacArthur became head of the military government of Japan. The Soviet Union demanded a part of the post-war dealings with Japan. MacArthur ignored the USSR and made things happen. This is the same thing that we face now in Iraq. Let the Kofi Klub say anything they want for as long as they want, all they do is speed up global warming. We'll get the work done.
Posted by: Alaska Paul || 04/08/2003 11:00 Comments || Top||

#2  This a*&hole's significance diminishes with every word he speaks. They'll still be ankle-biting when it's a done deal...like next week. What are you going to do, Tharoor boy? take Baghdad international airport from us? Take the Port facilities? You ccome in when we say so, and you'll know your place - at the rear
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 11:04 Comments || Top||

#3  The UN takes itself very seriously,except for that piece of paper which says Convention...Human Rights...something.You know what I mean.In other news,UN officials demanded today that the National Socialist party be reinstated into power in Germany.
Posted by: El Id || 04/08/2003 11:26 Comments || Top||

#4  the kind of rhetoric coming from this guy doesnt make it any easier for Blair to support a UN role. Tends to work against Kofi's goals. Perhaps the guy has his own agenda - the UN secretariat has its own internal politics too.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 11:28 Comments || Top||

#5  We do need to watch our step, however, I think the traditional response is you and what army?

How about a little respect for the hegemon Shashi ol' boy?
Posted by: Hiryu || 04/08/2003 11:37 Comments || Top||

#6  Yeah, only the UN can decide what countries are treasure chests to be divided up, preferably with them getting the biggest cut.
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 11:42 Comments || Top||

#7  He also said that the UK and American governments had no rights under international law to change Iraqi society or politics or to use their economic resources.

Translate as: You can't do it if you don;t get our approval and we won't give it.

The Anglo-American forces had rights and responsibilities of any occupying power, but "they really have no rights under the Geneva Conventions to transform the society or the polity or to exploit its economic resources," the undersecretary-general said. "If they do need more they need to come to the Security Council to get the backing of international law for anything more ambitious than merely being an occupying power in the military sense," he warned.

Translation: We want our cut and if you don't give us our cut we'll hold our breath and stomp our feet until we turn blue and pass out, so there!

This is just another of thousands of reasons to abandon the UN to its own devices, tell 'em to get the hell out of the US, and tell 'em to get bent in the process. Pompous asshelmets like the Undersecretary think, and will continue to think until we show them different, that they run the world and continue to believe that sovereign states should give up their sovereign rights to the likes of them. They want to give the UN the right to tax the citizens of sovereign nations to support the UN and its activities. Naturally, the citizens of the US would pay more than their fair share, as we already do to participate in the UN and its activities.

The more I hear, the more this organization has to go.

Posted by: FOTSGreg || 04/08/2003 11:43 Comments || Top||

#8  This un speak for leave international socialism alone, we should all recognize by now that the un has become the home of the International, where former friends project the lefts values across an unwitting population. This is the story not being told, but in essence, this is all about the continuation of the cold war between right and wrong (the left). EU is posturing for hegemony over member states constituions one government at a time. Then use those elected shills to subvert the US Constituion from within our own shores. Make No Mistake, the u n needs to be dismantled as we now know it.
Posted by: AnonymousLy yours || 04/08/2003 11:44 Comments || Top||

#9  This from the gas bags wo have been raking in the money over the oil for food program.
Posted by: Douglas De Bono || 04/08/2003 13:04 Comments || Top||

#10  Please send our answer in six large ALCM missiles, targeted for the 3rd floor of the United Nations building in New York, preferably coming in on the sea side, so there won't be any need to junk and jive. ALCM's have larger warheads than Tomahawks, and equal targeting prowess. After the initial bang, we'll clean up the mess, and build a nice park. Have a GREAT Air Force day...
Posted by: Old Patriot || 04/08/2003 13:26 Comments || Top||

#11  Sure, bring it up in front of the Security Council. Let it come up for debate, and then we can declare that we will veto anything they propose before we even read it. We can play that game, too.
Just deal with them like you deal with any children's temper tantrum. Ignore it, and eventually they'll get exhausted and shut the hell up.
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 15:16 Comments || Top||

#12  Are you even surprised by these people? The same ones who defiantly protected Saddam, want to determine who gets what. I think it should be on a sliding scale. Those who helped Free Iraq the most get the best contracts and those who help the lest get a proportional amount. I am sure the UN, France, Germany, and Russia would never soil themselves witht the profits of an 'illlegal' war such as this.
Posted by: Cyber Sarge || 04/08/2003 17:17 Comments || Top||

#13  This is all about Oiiiil! Food for Oil to be specific. The UN was making a tidy profit on Iraq and now they are bleeding. They will try to hold Iraq for ransom with the $40bil hiding in French banks. That money will disappear into French debt repayment and UN admin charges before it ever gets back to an "illegitimate" Iraq. Listen to the words but watch the cash change hands.
Posted by: john || 04/08/2003 19:39 Comments || Top||

#14  Yeah. But what he said makes sense. Is this just a cheering society here? Do any of you believe there
is such a thing as international law? Before you
answer too quickly, recall that the U.S. Declaration
of Independence, and the Constitution, are founded
on "natural rights." In other words, "God-given law." In other words, international law.
Posted by: Bruce || 04/08/2003 22:13 Comments || Top||

#15  Er, Bruce, I think that "international law" is a concept that came about after 1880. Prior to that, we basically had, for want of a better term, "gentlemen's agreements" ie. the Geneva
and treaties. International law is simply the more formal continuation of this idea, mainly, the rules that regulate a nation's conduct with another. These laws do NOT technically determine a country's internal laws, at least not according to the classic definition of international law.


The Constitution, Declaration of Independence, Magna Carta, et al, are based on common law. Common law, as practiced in English-speaking countries, derives from the idea of custom and precedent, not "natural law".

Natural law is a later concept (around the 15th century or so), that states that there are certain principles that are binding on society in addition to or in absence of existing law. We can argue till the cows come home if this is "God-given law", but it is by no means international law.


Natural law influenced the documents you mention, but they are still based on good ol' English common law. OK, Louisiana is a special case due to the influence of the French, but let's not get too technical here.

Therefore, I submit that international law ain't part of any of our founding documents, or Britain's, or damn near any other country I can think of.

*Whew, I need a tequila after that.....and I DON'T mean Jose Cuervo*

I leave it to the rest of you to state if this is a cheering section. Discuss amongst yourselves.....


Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 23:08 Comments || Top||

#16  Ok, that should have been "Geneva Convention", don't know why that didn't work with the rest of the above.
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 23:10 Comments || Top||


Korea
A sense of urgency in China
When the US pushed China to participate in an Asian coalition to halt North Korea's nuclear ambitions, Beijing demurred. It claimed little influence over Kim Jong Il... Now, since the start of the US-led Iraq war, Chinese efforts have increased and taken firmer shape in response to the Bush administration's "doctrine of preemption," now on display in the Gulf. "The Iraq war has brought a change," says Shi Yinhong, a professor of international studies at People's University in Beijing. "Before Iraq, there was a stalemate in the Chinese position, and fragmentation. Now there is some recognition of a possible time sequence in the US approach to North Korea, and that has created a sense of urgency in China."
Proof that you don't need beat up all the tough guys in the world. Just one, really well...
Posted by: ----------<<<<-- || 04/08/2003 09:47 am || Comments || Link || [2 views] Top|| File under:

#1  *nods* Let's see what NKor info man has to say about THAT.
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 10:27 Comments || Top||


International
Anti-war protesters picket Belfast war summit
Communists, anarchists, and nuts Peace campaigners from all over the world held a picket Tuesday outside the security fortress drawn around the war summit being held between US President George W. Bush and British Prime Minister Tony Blair in Northern Ireland. Thousands of anti-war protesters gathered near Hillsborough Castle on the outskirts of Belfast to express their anger and cynicism as the two leaders flew in Monday evening, chanting they "want nothing to do with the Iraqi massacre." The local press reported a procession of demonstrators from as far as the Congo joining Americans, Italians, Australians, British, Irish and other peace campaigners.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 09:58 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  So, was the Congo delegation escaping the massacre that the UN is monitoring?
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 20:22 Comments || Top||


Iran
Khatami to visit Syria and Lebanon
President Mohammad Khatami will travel to Syria and Lebanon early May. "Khatami will travel to Syria and Lebanon in order to fine tune his country's stance with those of Syria and Lebanon regarding the prevailing developments in the region," SPA said. The Iranian president's visit to Lebanon has been called off several times. Khatami last visited that country in 1997 before coming to power the same year. He visited Syria in May, 1999 on a Middle East tour, which also took him to Saudi Arabia and Qatar. Syrian President Bashar al-Assad paid a lightening visit to Tehran in March this year to discuss the Iraq crisis.
Now they can discuss what they're going to do in the aftermath of it...
Syria was the only Arab country which backed the Islamic Republic in the Iraqi-imposed war of 1980-1988. While their political ties are steady, the two countries' economic relations are not significant. The two countries also have a common cause for concern, which they share with Turkey, regarding the Kurdish question. Both Iranian and Turkish officials have stressed in recent weeks the need for the three countries, which have Kurdish communities on their territories, for holding joint consultations as the US-led war in Iraq takes a sensitive turn with Iraqi Kurds being on the spotlight.
The Kurds are going to represent a fine club with which to occasionally whack all three countries. They seem to be better at setting up governments and governing their territory than at least two of them.
Posted by: Fred Pruitt || 04/08/2003 09:34 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  How's he plan on getting there, by boat? The airspace might be a bit congested in certain spots.
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 11:40 Comments || Top||

#2  "Khatami will travel to Syria ...........The Iranian president's visit to Lebanon has been called off several times.

Will there be a Syria to visit in May?

dorf
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/08/2003 11:42 Comments || Top||

#3  Are the wheels coming off the axis, er I mean axle?
Posted by: PD || 04/08/2003 23:31 Comments || Top||


Korea
Seminars on Songun policy held abroad
Just when you thought you had the army-based policy and Juche down, their diseased little minds come up with something new.
Seminars on Songun policy (Songun means regarding the military affair as the greatest state affair, and strengthening the main agent of the revolution and promoting national defense and socialist construction as a whole with the people's army as the mainstay) were held by the Russian Youth Association for the Study of the Juche Idea and the Juche Philosophy Study Committee of India on March 29 and 30 on the occasion of the 10th anniversary of Kim Jong Il's election as Chairman of the National Defence Commission of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea.
Sounds like "Army-based Policy: XP" or "Juche 2000".
The chairman of the Russian youth association in a speech said that with the election of Kim Jong Il as Chairman of the NDC the Korean people have strengthened the defense capability of the country in every way and achieved great success in socialist construction. Thanks to his Songun policy the DPRK has turned into an ideological and military power that nobody in the world dares provoke, he noted, adding If the U.S. indiscreetly ignites a war on the Korean Peninsula it will sustain a defeat that has never been in the world.
...and if Kimmie ever comes out of that hole in the ground and sees his shadow, there'll be six more weeks of Korean winter.
The chairman of the Indian committee in a speech said that Kim Jong Il put forth the unique Songun revolutionary line and built up the KPA as a matchlessly strong army and firmly defended the gains of socialism.
It's the "Total Total Police State" plan.
Thanks to the Songun policy, unity between the army and the people and unanimity in the way of struggle have been established in the DPRK and the KPA plays a leading role in accomplishing the cause of socialism, he noted, stressing: The Songun policy is the best way of independent policy and a powerful political mode of socialism. A message of greetings to Kim Jong Il was adopted at the seminar in Russia.
... which will be given to him when he come out of his bunker in approximately 2006.
Posted by: tu3031 || 04/08/2003 08:04 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  KCNA: home of the run-on sentence! featuring Songun, Juche, and Army-Based drivel - these guys must get paid by the word
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 9:09 Comments || Top||

#2  Frank G: "...if Kimmie ever comes out of that hole in the ground and sees his shadow, there'll be six more weeks of Korean winter."

If Kimmie doesn't get his testosterone under control, there may be six weeks of nuclear winter!
Posted by: Tom || 04/08/2003 9:14 Comments || Top||

#3  After this war is finished the Iraqi Information Minister is going to be head-hunted (in the employment sense rather than the tribal sense) by the KCNA. Its really hard to find someone with such high journalistic credentials.

"My feeling, as usuall, is that the imperialist american forces will be slaughtered and the Korean peninsula will be a graveyard for the invading forces"
Posted by: rg117 || 04/08/2003 9:57 Comments || Top||

#4  "Seminars on Songun policy (Songun means regarding the military affair as the greatest state affair, and strengthening the main agent of the revolution and promoting national defense and socialist construction as a whole with the people's army as the mainstay)..."

Boy, them guys sure can pack a lot of meaning into one word, huh?
Posted by: mojo || 04/08/2003 10:22 Comments || Top||

#5  "Songun": Probably shorthand for "Son of a Gun"?

*holds up card* 8.2. Points taken off for failing to correlate Songun policy with Juche. Also, "Songun", as a word, lacks the hop, punch, and drive that "Juche" carries. Some points added for promising start.

Let's see what the "Army Policy" guy comes back with. This should be interesting.
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 10:32 Comments || Top||

#6  "If the US indiscreetly ignites a war"

Rummy: "Whoa....duck Kimmie!"
BOOM!
Rummy: "My bad".
Posted by: Rex Mundi || 04/08/2003 12:16 Comments || Top||


International
US to handle war crimes trials, not UN
The United States has the "sovereign right" to prosecute Iraqi leaders for war crimes in its own courts, and will not hand Saddam Hussein or his henchmen to any international tribunal, senior American officials said yesterday. In a move likely to alarm Downing Street, senior Pentagon and State Department officials summoned reporters to hear a pre-emptive rejection of any role for the International Criminal Court (ICC) - the permanent war crimes tribunal established in The Hague. Instead, Iraqi leaders accused of war crimes could be tried in federal courts in the United States, or by special military tribunals, they said. The United States had the right to imprison those found guilty, or sentence them to death. Britain, as its ally in the war, would have the same rights.
I seem to recall that the Four Powers didn't require an ICC to deal with the Nazi and Japanese war criminals. Didn't we do something about that in, oh, what's the name of that town?
The Bush administration has aggressively resisted the authority of the ICC, saying it fears that its military personnel and other citizens might be singled out for politically motivated prosecutions. To Britain's dismay, Washington last year "unsigned" the treaty establishing the court, and has leaned on allies worldwide to sign agreements shielding American citizens from any potential ICC probe.
Among the many smart things GWB did.
Pierre-Richard Prosper, the United States ambassador for war crimes issues, said the ICC had no jurisdiction over this war, because neither America nor Iraq had signed up to the treaty establishing the court.
"So there!"
W Hay Parks, a senior Pentagon lawyer, accused Baghdad of three specific violations of the Geneva Convention and the rules of warfare, and said others were being investigated and catalogued. The first two alleged war crimes centred on Iraqi television footage of American soldiers captured and killed when their supply convoy was ambushed near the southern city of Nasiriyah, Mr Parks said. A third crime involved alleged acts of "perfidy", when Iraqi forces attacked coalition troops while carrying the white flags of surrender, or while disguised in civilian clothes. Mr Parks said that further charges might be levelled, amid signs that prisoners of war might have been killed, tortured, or treated inhumanely. The mention of humane treatment raised the prospect that a teenage soldier rescued last week might become a key witness against the Iraqi regime. Pte Jessica Lynch, 19, is the only American prisoner of war to have returned to American custody. There were initial reports that some members of the 507th Maintenance Company - Pvt Lynch's unit whose supply convoy was ambushed at Nasiriyah - had been executed in cold blood.
We, the Brits and Aussies should form up the tribunals. We could invite in some of our coalition allies if they want. Run the tribunals as we did in Nuremburg. Let the Iraqi people in to see the trials and broadcast them via satellite to the entire Middle East. Keep the UN and ICC as far away as possible.
Posted by: Steve White || 04/08/2003 01:56 am || Comments || Link || [1 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Statement by justice Jackson on War Trials Agreement; August 12, 1945

"We must make clear to the Germans that the wrong for which their fallen leaders are on trial is not that they lost the war, but that they started it. And we must not allow ourselves to be drawn into a trial of the causes of the war, for our position is that no grievances or policies will justify resort to aggressive war. It is utterly renounced and condemned as an instrument of policy."
Posted by: True German Ally || 04/08/2003 2:43 Comments || Top||

#2  In these days the word Germans should be replaced with "Americans"
Posted by: Murat || 04/08/2003 2:52 Comments || Top||

#3  Still defending Al Qaida and Saddam, I see, Murat. Your subculture is directly and provably responsible for their acts. Without you and the facetious sound-bite reaction so beloved of conformist power-seekers, they could never have hoped to preserve their demonic power through terrorism and defiance. You, personally, and every like-minded terror-apologist and anti-war hypocrite, are entitled to occupy the Julius Streicher chair at this new tribunal. You are a hate-monger, a bigot, and an arrogant buffoon. You and your cohorts have incited this terrible war. Your world has crumbled in the fires of Baghdad, and now you must pay the price.
Posted by: Atomic Conspiracy || 04/08/2003 3:28 Comments || Top||

#4  I see a defending of truth by “peace mongers” is called nowadays defending Al Qaida and Saddam, very ingenious. Me a hypocrite? Look who’s talking, where are the Chemical and biological Mass destruction weapons which supposedly should legitimize this slaughter of a nation?
Sure buddy me and my cohorts have incited this terrible war of butchering and looting liberation. Ah well you are going to introduce democracy, of course beginning with a military junta that will run the country for the next few years which eventually will be replaced by a puppet regime. I laugh at the British and American reports putting the civilian casualties on 2000 at most, let sarcasm rule.
Posted by: Murat || 04/08/2003 3:59 Comments || Top||

#5  Murat your team lost! Not because Allah hates your team, but because you joined the wrong team. And if you continue to join the wrong side you will be beaten every time. The middle east needs change in a big way. Start by joining the right side for change, and not totalitarianism; then you will be on the winning team.
Posted by: George || 04/08/2003 4:15 Comments || Top||

#6  Murat,
Why don't you want a democratic Iraq as your neighbor? Do you wish for chaos and failed democracy and civil war so that you will be proven right, even thought the effects for Turkey would be bad? Are you sure the Weapons of Mass Destruction are a myth invented by the Americans?

Perhaps you wish for a peaceful, democratic, prosperous Iraq but refuse to accept that the Americans can pull it off. What other possibilities exist?
Posted by: Tokyo Taro || 04/08/2003 4:22 Comments || Top||

#7  I dunno George, those Islamo-fascists are always saying the evil 'Mericans "...will be defeated! God willing!" Apparently God is not willing to side with terrorists and those who rape and torture the innocent.
Posted by: B. || 04/08/2003 4:26 Comments || Top||

#8  Tokyo Taro, I do wish a democratic Iraq, but not trough carnage and occupation and at the burden of thousands of innocent people losing their lives. By the way what is your definition for installing a junta regime to replace Saddam, democracy? How about the fact that the occupation power can decide about the fate of that countries natural recourses, in this case oil, isn’t this an equivalent of looting making Iraq per definition a colony. And if there are Weapons of Mass Destruction, then why didn’t Saddam use it or there has not been found any, maybe it is an invented myth indeed (a just cause). Naivity is not a blessing pall.
Posted by: Murat || 04/08/2003 4:51 Comments || Top||

#9  Murat:
We are not Europe, we are not France, and we are not the Soviet Union. We are a very different people and nation over hear, and therefore, do things differently for different reason. We have already discussed and planned for the return to Iraqi civilian rule, once the situation allows. There will be a military government for a period of time, but only for as long as it takes to get Iraq back on its feet.

As for the thousands of innocents, not even the Iraqi Information Ministry is claiming that level of carnage. And if there were another way to do it, without war, don't you think we would have? What do you think we are, Europeans? We know all to well what wars cost and how people die in them. We have gone out of our way to minimize the civilian casualties in this. Not that folks like you would even care, but the Iraqi people do care, and will care, long after we are gone.

As for you charge of "looting", come on, guy. Have you not heard our President, our Secretaries of Defense and State all say that the Iraqi oil belongs to the Iraqi people? The money from their oil will go to the Iraqi people, the American people will see to that. There is too big a political risk to the administration to "loot" as you call it.

Why did Saddam not use his weapons? Well that is a good question and one of little importance now. Perhaps you would be happier if he did, but think on this for a moment. Coalition troops have protective gear, the civilian population does not. You say you don't want a carnage, but that is exactly what you would get, if Saddam provided the proof of his weapons.

[Saddam may be out of action. In any event, Saddam will not deploy them himself, but order a subordinate to do it for him. Whether that subordinate is capable of doing it, has the time to do it before being removed by us, or even goes through with such mass murder, these are all large varables]

You don't like how we are removing Saddam, fine. The problem is that it is working, and what comes next will be better and more in accordance with what you say you want, than any of the alternatives presented. So what has you upset, I have to admit to some confusion. Unless you think we are just like France, which we ain't.
Posted by: Ben || 04/08/2003 5:20 Comments || Top||

#10  Murat,
I'm not naive, I'm just not jumping to conclusions yet like you are. There are other possible, or likely explanations why WMD have not been used or discovered yet (to name one of many, Saddam is obviously trying to win the PR war in the world's press). I know you're a skeptic, buy why don't you apply the same skepticism to Iraqi claims as you do to America's? If any are discovered, will you automatically dismiss them as fake or planted?

Carnage happens in war and Saddam is not leaving without a fight. Everyone, including you, knows that thousands of innocents were dying and suffering under Hussein. Except they didn't get primetime coverage in the world's media. You accuse us of being naive but do you not recognize your own selective outrage? The carnage will only stop when the Baathists are gone. So if you care about Iraqis like you claim, why not pray for swift US victory?

As for occupation, again, I'll wait and see. You are already certain that it is nothing but a grab for territory and resources. The US will be in Iraq to help provide security in the power vacuum that follows Saddam's removal and rebuild the economy and infrastructure. You know these things don't happen overnight or in a matter of weeks. So every month they are in Iraq rebuilding, you will holler "Colonialism!" If they were to leave you would cream "Abandonment!"

The US knows it must contend with this type of emotional response but it would be nice if reasonable people like yourself stopped to consider that, in the short and long-term, Turkey's best interests are perfectly in-line with Bush's stated objectives. I'm not saying you should not be completely unskeptical of Bush. But since this has already started, shouldn't you at least give it a chance? On the other hand, if all those (cynical, hypocritically self-righteous) governments opposing US action succeed (not likely) in undermining the US's aims, the results will be bad for the US (and you, Chirac, Assad, etc. would cheer) but awful for Iraqis (another 25 years or more of war, poverty, and oppression), as well as Turkey (long-term refugee problems, Kurdish separatism, oil-supply unstability). It would be a loss for the whole world. If I were you, I would join me in wishing Bush great success with the War, the Transition Government, and eventual Iraqi Democracy. Unless, of course, for you the idea of a successful Bush is worse than the prospect of continued chaos, tyrany and suffering. If that's the case, go ahead and continue bashing the US.
Posted by: Tokyo Taro || 04/08/2003 5:44 Comments || Top||

#11  I should add, Murat, that you are correct in stating that a Bush installed junta will not equal Iraqi democracy. Iraqi democracy will come after that when they vote. This will give Iraq a legitimate sovereign government (not a coerced vote like Saddam's farce last year). Until that is established, they need someone to govern and those people you will call American Puppets but at least they wont torture people who critcize them, sponsor terrorism, and attack their neighbors (unless Syria refuses to stop sending Jihadis and weapons into Iraq).

The Iraqis tried numerous times to get rid of Hussein without the Americans (and once with them) but Saddam succeeded in gassing, slaughtering or torturing them all. At this stage, there was no chance without the U.S. military. If King George had used mustard gas on Philadelphia, maybe America would never have achieved independence by themselves (ok with a little help from France) either.

If the US wanted to snatch oil wells, we could have just grabbed Kuwait's without much cost or lives lost.

Why am I telling you this, Murat? You are smart enough to know this already but angry or ideological enough to stubbornly refuse to acknowledge this. Am I wasting breath?
Posted by: Tokyo Taro || 04/08/2003 6:17 Comments || Top||

#12  Tokyo Taro, you are wasting your breath I'm afraid. Murat's not worth the effort of dialogue. He does at least bother to look around for opinions different from his own, but doesn't buy any of them, preferring to stick with his prejudices irrespective of conflicting evidence. If you see a corpse on the street, step over it, don't try to resuscitate it.
Posted by: Bulldog || 04/08/2003 6:43 Comments || Top||

#13  In these days the word Germans should be replaced with "Americans

Murat,sounds like those sour grapes are getting mighty bitter.Guess we could include Turkey in that statement too.Not only for past War Crimes,but also it's current perfidity and collusion.
If Turkey had let the 4I.D.through.This war would have been over 7-10 days ago,saving hundreds of dead and injured.Your tacid support of Saddam left him with the impression he could stay in power if he could just hold out long enough.
What happen with your fear of the Kurds?
Seems they didn't cause any trouble for you,on the contrary,they stayed in thier own yard.
Many of the family's of the dead and maimed have only the sanctimonious,money-grubbing,hypocrites like Turkey and the Axis of Weasals to blame.
You remind me of the far right here in the U.S.,just cannot admit that you may have been wrong even when the truth slaps you in the face.

Saw on the news that the"Chicks with Dicks"(Dixie Chicks),after a month of cancelled concerts,and plumetting records sells,now say it was just a joke.
Ha,Ha,I hope you are having a good laugh,Dixies.
Posted by: raptor || 04/08/2003 6:43 Comments || Top||

#14  Tokyo Taro and Ben, you both bring forward nice and appreciative intentions of removing dictators and bringing democracy, all without supposed self benefit earning the US a place in heaven, but one question though, why is the US so selective in these charity operations.
What about Rwanda an African nation where at least 10 fold of people died of much worse oppression than Saddam could ever inflict (don’t take this as a Saddam defending), secondly if bringing democracy is the course of this stimulus, then why did you guys withhold the Kuwaiti people from it, wouldn’t a democracy be more appropriate than an artificial monarchy there? I could summon you at least a dozen of countries in the class of Iraq, why this selectivity of such an US charity operation for the sheer love of the Iraqi people (who by the way have shown little cheer to their liberators)?
Posted by: Murat || 04/08/2003 6:58 Comments || Top||

#15  Murat's a troll whose comments, as far as I am concerned, are equivalent to farts.
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 7:04 Comments || Top||

#16  Oh Murat, are you upset that between Turkey and the United States only one of us is under the rule of law, whereas the other is under the rule of ululating backwards Islamic fundamentalists masquerading as responsible statesmen?

You shouldn't let that show, your "Constitution envy..."
Posted by: Brian || 04/08/2003 7:07 Comments || Top||

#17  Murat: "Naivity is not a blessing..."

You've got that right, Murat. Neither is delusion, which also seems to be characteristic of many of Iraq's neighbors (and Iraq's Information Minister). The years centuries of bullshit are over. You're either going to become peaceful, productive Islamic world citizens or you're going to suffer severely at the hands of the infidels, because we infidels aren't taking this bullshit anymore. Your choice.
Posted by: Tom || 04/08/2003 7:29 Comments || Top||

#18  I have followed this war from the sabre rattling to the present.The coverage from the press has been great and the blog sites are even better. With that having been said I haven't seen one report that puts our intrests in a perspective that the indigenous people of the middle east can understand.The first fact we have never occupied a country to try and displace the inhabitants or their culture.This country was founded on a platform of religeous tolerance, not as a despotic, dictatorial land grab.We have never kept any territory from military action except the area we needed to bury our fallen. Iraq's former government was untrustworthy this is not to say that we have deposed any country for this lack of character, but they also had wmd and were seeking more lethal types.The care that our military is using to ensure the least amount of casualties, and colateral damage has not been stressed enough by the opposition press.
There seems to be confusion on the issue of Iraq's oil resources,and our intentions.The U.S.government has repeatedly said the oil is for the Iraqi people.To put the subject in another perspective the amount of oil that is being pumped pre-war was 3 million barrels per day at a price of $30 per barrel this is 30-40 billion dollars per year gross dollars.To be objective twenty percent cost of production and delivery leaves 24-32 billion net dollars which is 1.5 percent of our total economy.For anyone to argue that we would spend 100's of billions to prosecute this war, and ensure the peace afterwards for this relatively small return is not being objective.
To summarize yes we will defend our interests do we want to invade sovereign countries, no.Did we start this war over oil, no. Did we start this war because Iraq's former government was threatening our sence of security, yes.Will we do it again, you bet.
Posted by: Themiddle || 04/08/2003 7:41 Comments || Top||

#19  TGA - fine quote - and your point is?
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 8:29 Comments || Top||

#20  Murat,
There is a fundamental misunderstanding here. We go out of our way to point out that our motives for this war are not related to conquest and oppression. That's Saddam. You then point to us and say "No! You are only in it for yourselves! Look at all of your flaws!"

This is a false contradiction. You are half-correct in that: U.S. foreign policy is always self-interested...and flawed (perfection being impossible in this world). The question is: Are our interests the same as Turkey's? Yes! Is a war-torn, impoverished, corrupt, unfree, undemocratic, unstable Iraq in our interests? No, no, no, no! We'll only see more terrorism, eventually turning into state-sponsored WMD terrorism. So a peaceful, prosperous, democratic Iraq is in our interests. Bush doesn't have to be a saint or American policy based on altruism. The benefits for the Iraqi people and America (and Turkey) are mutual. These are the same principles of free trade. People who don't get this are the ones who are stuck in the old Colonial Power Grab, balance-of-power, mind-set - namely old Europe (Turkey is an old Colonial power too). Or they're neo-Marxists (European social democrats not being too far from that). Britain and Spain are old colonial powers but Blair and Aznar understand.

The Arab and Muslim world refuses to believe it could be anything but conquest. No amount of talking will convince them. Only by following up our promises with action will some of them reconsider. Even if we achieve a little success rebuilding Iraq, most will probably still hate us. But that doesn't matter. What matters is if they decide the need copy some of free-Iraq's reforms in order to compete and not collapse further into the cesspit of economic woe and violent ideological extremism. If that happens, then Turkey will no longer be the only country in the region that is not a third-world dictatorship/terrorist factory. Iran would probably be the first country to go in that direction.

Sorry for not discussing Rwanda. My only comment is that Rwanda is proof that waiting for UN permission is a recipie for disaster. Somolia was not in our interest so we gave up when it turned bloody. No one benefited, least of all the Somalis. The Somalis sabotaged themselves and probably ruined any chance of us doing anything in Rwanda. One more Middle East Country with an appetite for self destruction.
Posted by: Tokyo Taro || 04/08/2003 8:48 Comments || Top||

#21  Yes, Murat is a troll. But he's OUR troll...

Has anybody mentioned to him about the cypriots yet? Or the Armenians, or the Kurds?

Wouldn't it be nice if the Kurds got their own state - they've proven themselves capable of democratic, secular, tolerant self-rule, with no less than 4 female judges! They deserve their own state soon, and Didn't George W Bush recently say words to the effect of "Good luck to the Kurds, I hope they get their state"?
Posted by: anon1 || 04/08/2003 9:16 Comments || Top||

#22  "Yes, Murat is a troll. But he's OUR troll..."

LOL anon1.
Posted by: Bulldog || 04/08/2003 9:30 Comments || Top||

#23  I've come to the conclusion that Murat participates only to tweek and tease. He just wants attention. He has never made any criticism of the Baathist regime nor of his own people/govt. He never answers questions put to him re Turkish/Ottoman treatment of Kurds, Armenians, Greeks, Greek-Cypriots, and Bulgarians. Yeah, Murat, they detest the Turks, and there are root causes.

Murat reminds me of a Turk I went to university with in the '70's. We took the same class on Central American history. US actions there have often been shameful and I'd say that the professor brought that out. The Turk was the number one critic of the US in the class and kept saying that nobody trusted us in the world because of such actions. Fair enough. After about 3 months of his daily comments, I finally asked him if Turkey had met the same lack of trust vis a vis Armenians and Greeks since the Turks were responsible for a lot of carnage in the aftermath of the collapse of the Ottoman empire (Just read Hemingway's account of the Turkish slaughter of Greeks living in Izmir in the early '20's) You know, I was just asking. This guy exploded in my face and DENIED slaughter ever happened. It was the Greeks and Armenians who wanted to destroy the great Turkish nation, blah, blah, blah. He sounded just like the Serbs explaining how the Muslims of Sczbernica (sp?) died. Just battle field casualties. I thought of this incident the other day when I read some more Murat drivel.

So pal, we're on to you. It's too bad because I lived in Riyadh from 1997-2000 and met many Turks who were generous with their time and hospitality. So let's hear some well-thought out discussions on your part rather than Cold War 3rd-world 70's BS and I might respect you. Otherwise, you're just like a fly in my soup. I'll just dump you in the toilet and flush.
Posted by: Michael || 04/08/2003 10:32 Comments || Top||

#24  Murat: I was wondering what happened to you. Honestly, I had hoped that the whole Muslim shame/honor thing had completely overcome you and that you'd disappeared for good.
Posted by: 11A5S || 04/08/2003 11:10 Comments || Top||

#25  "why is the US so selective in these charity operations. What about Rwanda an African nation where at least 10 fold of people died of much worse oppression than Saddam could ever inflict (don’t take this as a Saddam defending), secondly if bringing democracy is the course of this stimulus, then why did you guys withhold the Kuwaiti people from it, wouldn’t a democracy be more appropriate than an artificial monarchy there? "

Murat: Different administration entirely. Your hero, and Europe's, BillyJeff used military force to insure popular support here at home or to defelct attention away from his problems here, not for the just purpose of removing repressive regimes from power or defending innocent people being terrorized.

Be patient. We'll get to various other bad guys in due time (Somalia (big payback time coming there eventually), North Korea, Zimbabwe, maybe even Turkey).
Posted by: FOTSGreg || 04/08/2003 12:02 Comments || Top||

#26  bulldog: If you see a corpse on the street, step over it, don't try to resuscitate it. LOL!

I don't think he's looking around for a different viewpoint as much as he is looking for converts to his blind faith. Not that he would really know what to do with a convert if he found one. He's like the Jesus Freak's on the corner, it gives him a sense of purpose and worth to shake his finger condenscendingly at the infidels.
Posted by: becky || 04/08/2003 12:55 Comments || Top||

#27  Murat,

You, not those who support this war, are the one who is blind to the suffering of the Iraqi people. I won't even group you in with the well-intentioned but misguided liberals here in the US who protest in what they believe to be the best interest of the Iraqis.

You are a knee-jerk anti-American who is bitter and ashamed that your country asserted its "sovereignty" and got severely burnt. Turkey will suffer because they did not assist the US. It was people like you in the Turkish parliament who played such stupid destructive games with our goodwill. Now, all you can do is sit on the sidelines and take potshots while the Turkish economy goes down the SHITTER, the coalition accumulates the good will of the Iraqi people, and the US enjoys the help of their new ally, the Kurds.

The only people I have seen protest this war are those who are too weak and unprincipled to do anything but talk, and those who are losing something because of our intervention (or both). Yes, it's true that there will be casualties. However, Iraqi exiles (who have lived under Saddam) and civilian Iraqis in Basrah, Najaf, and Nasiriyah have all come out in support of the people who are ridding them of the brutal status quo.

Frankly I doubt the Iraqis give two shits whether the tanks rolling into their cities are American, British, or (haha) French. They are just glad to be FREE. As for the criticism of the small-minded and craven, I honestly don't give a shit what they/you think, and I truly doubt the Iraqis do either.

Every time I see a picture of a wounded Iraqi civilian...my heart goes out to them and I feel a loss. But that sorrow does not lessen the value of setting a people free from tyranny. If seeing results such as the one linked below can't convince you of the value of this campaign, then you are hijacking humanitarian concerns to further your own pathetic insecurities.


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=1514&e=4&u=/afp/20030408/wl_mideast_afp/iraq_war_marines_prison_030408163048
Posted by: mjh || 04/08/2003 13:14 Comments || Top||

#28  I'm rather surprised how much attention my quote has raised. It served two purposes:

1) to show that the Germans were taught a lesson in 1945 which, according to the same nation that taught it to us, we have learned too well. I suppose that most of you would no longer agree with Jackson's quote about war.

2) it was Murat who replaced "Germans" with "Americans". I had "Iraqis" in mind. Because Saddam started that war... in 1990. It's time that it is brought to an end.

Still I believe that this tribunal should not be held by Americans but by a neutral stance. Nuremberg was frowned upon by many Germans because it was seen as "Siegerjustiz" (justice by the victors). While the Americans tried to maintain a certain fairness the Russians had far less moral ground. At that time Stalin had murdered millions of his own people. Millions languished in prison camps which weren't much better than German concentration camps. And before you yell out: I have seen both.
Posted by: True German Ally || 04/08/2003 16:25 Comments || Top||

#29  Is it still a compulsory part of education in Germany to visit a concentration camp? Or have they done away with it?
Posted by: RW || 04/08/2003 17:27 Comments || Top||

#30  It still is. But I was referring to the times when they still worked.
Posted by: True German Ally || 04/08/2003 17:46 Comments || Top||

#31  TGA: i have respect for you
Posted by: anon1 || 04/08/2003 22:47 Comments || Top||

#32  --Ah well you are going to introduce democracy, of course beginning with a military junta that will run the country for the next few years which eventually will be replaced by a puppet regime.--

Murat, why do I think the Japanese would be extremely insulted at that statement?

Maybe if we still ran the show there, they wouldn't be in a 20 year recession, but, hey, can't mess w/the culture. So drag down the world they must.
Posted by: Anonymous || 04/09/2003 1:23 Comments || Top||


Bush, Blair Discuss Postwar Iraq Plans
Followup to yesterday's posts.
Looking beyond the war, President Bush and British Prime Minister Tony Blair are trying to bridge differences over how to rebuild and govern Iraq, while also seeking to boost peace talks in Northern Ireland. In their third meeting in three weeks, Bush and Blair were meeting at Hillsborough Castle outside Belfast to discuss Iraq reconstruction and peace efforts in the Mideast and Northern Ireland.

Most of their focus Tuesday was on Iraq. The two leaders were showcasing military progress there and looking ahead to the postwar period, while seeking to minimize splits on who should govern and rebuild the country. ``The hostilities phase is coming to a conclusion,'' said Secretary of State Colin Powell, accompanying Bush aboard Air Force One to this British province with its own decades-long history of violence. ``It's time for all of us to think about the post-hostility phase, how we create a representative government consisting of all elements of Iraqi society.'' A key component of the talks Tuesday was to be on U.N. resolutions that would define what role the international body would play in reconstruction and governing. ``There is enough work for everyone to have a role,'' Powell said, even as aides conceded privately that Blair seems to want a more influential U.N. role than Bush favors.
Sounds like Powell opened the door.

Bush has said he supports a U.N. role and the creation of an interim governing authority for Iraq. But he has not provided key details, such as the exact nature of the U.N.'s role and the makeup of the authority. Powell said the United Nations can provide humanitarian aid and add legitimacy to the interim authority, but he did not offer a role for the international body beyond that. A Blair spokesman, stressing agreement with the United States, told reporters the United Nations has never expressed a desire to run Iraq.
Somebody send for Kofi.

Irish Prime Minister Bernie Ahern, invited for talks Tuesday on Northern Ireland, said he would tell Bush the United Nations should have a primary role in Iraq's reconstruction. Bush added a complex set of issues by heeding Blair's call to meet in Northern Ireland and to back Blair's peace blueprint, due out later this week. Blair has racked up IOUs from Bush by backing the president on Iraq in the face of fierce opposition at home.
We can certainly back Tony on the Northern Ireland plan.

Blair hopes presidential backing will strengthen his hand when he publishes his government's new Northern Ireland plans by Thursday, the fifth anniversary of the so-called Good Friday accords. The pact sought to end three decades of sectarian conflict in the British territory. The visit demonstrates Bush's support for Blair's approach, administration officials said. ``This is a very significant step in the life of Northern Ireland,'' Powell said.

The Iraq war undercut support for Bush among some citizens in Belfast. In the Bogside district, a 50-foot-high wall that for more than three decades has read ``You are now entering Free Derry'' was painted solid black in a gesture of mourning for Iraqis killed in the war. The area's veteran civil rights activist, Eamonn McCann, said most Derry Roman Catholics considered Bush a hypocrite for telling the Irish Republican Army that violence doesn't pay. ``Bush is saying to political leaders here: Give up the gun, don't use violence to pursue political ends, follow the rule of law. He is demanding that they do that even as he prosecutes the war in Iraq,'' McCann said. ``I doubt if I've ever encountered anything as grotesquely hypocritical as the exercise in Hillsborough.''
Go ask Gerry Adams.
Posted by: Steve White || 04/08/2003 01:21 am || Comments || Link || [0 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Arrgh, forgot to put my name in the line. Can you fix this Fred?
Posted by: Steve White || 04/08/2003 1:35 Comments || Top||

#2  Even Kofi has said theres not going to be a Kosovo style UN admin in Iraq. Kosovo was unique - in Iraq there is the option of returning power to the Iraqi people - in Kosovo a simple handover to the Kosovo people would have meant Kosovo independence from Serbia, which allies insisted was not what they had gone to war for. Therefore a long term occupation was needed and UN was most appropriate to do it. In Iraq we are presumably looking at something less than a year, maybe only 6 months depending on how it goes. The question is therefore more a matter of going to UN for a UNSC res. "authorizing" coalition administration. The French and Russians are likely to insist on some degree of UN oversight and participation in return. The question will be how hard we bargain, and - yes, set again - whether we are willing to go unilateral if they threaten to veto a reasonable compromise. Bush and Blair are hammering out negotiating strategy, and may yet again play "good cop - bad cop". For the sake of the UN and multilateralism, I hope it works better this time - IE I hope the French and Russians are more reasonable and place the interests of the UN ahead of their narrow agendas.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 8:37 Comments || Top||

#3  The UNSC? are you insane? Why would we need or want to play ball with those perfidious aholes? So Cameroon or Chile can tell us how to put together a nation? F*&k the French Germans and Russians. East european countries need the work, and would appreciate the economic assistance. The WHO, UNICEF, et al have a place in humanitarian services, but there will be no power sharing with those who stab us in the back...bastards! Got me so pissed off, now I don't need this coffee!
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 9:02 Comments || Top||

#4  Frank - uh once again to help Tony, Aznar, et al, and to strengthen our position in the region etc.

You raise 2 objections - The UNSC interfering with the nation building and the Weasels muscling in on contracts. Both legitimate concerns. Ideally we would like a UNSC res. that "authorizes" us without giving the UN ANY say in nation-building, political or economic. How close we can come to that will depend on the course of negotiations, and is what Dubya and Tony have presumably been discussing. With regard to contracts - keep in mind that any contracts will be short term only IIUC - no occupation admin, even UN can bind the future Iraqi govt. With regard to political, the more that we can establish on the ground now (Chalabi in Nassariyah, some friendly Sheik the Brits have found in Basra, etc) the less room there will be for the UN or anyone else to impose their will later. That may be one reason we're trying so hard to win the battle of baghdad quickly - so we can create facts on the ground while the UN process grinds on. Remember in the pre-war the slow UN process hurt us - now it can help us

Colin: We want the UN liasion to report to Jay Garner
Du Villepin: That is unacceptable!!!
Colin: Ok, we'll draw up a new proposal that attempts to meet your objections.
Du Villepin: And when can we see it?
Colin: Well theres only one guy I trust to write it, and he's going on a well-deserved vacation. Oh, and when he comes back hes supposed to work on a trade agreement with Micronesia. How about three months? Sorry if we the Iraqi Interim authority has already taken power by then.
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 9:43 Comments || Top||

#5  Frank - Don't forget, we've got that Security Council Veto power, too, as do our good friends the Brits. Nothing is going to get forced on us without our own consent, and we're not letting France push anything through.

Yes, unfortunately, we do have to cooperate with the French to get a resolution, but they have to cooperate with us as well.
Posted by: Dar Steckelberg || 04/08/2003 10:10 Comments || Top||

#6  One more thing--Bush and Blair have demonstrated quite clearly (is going to war a strong enough statement?) that they will do things "unilaterally" if the UN hinders or blocks our best interests.

Going back to the UN doesn't mean we will be slaves to the UN process.
Posted by: Dar Steckelberg || 04/08/2003 10:13 Comments || Top||

#7  Heh, heh. We really don't want the UNSC to "rush things", now do we?
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 10:44 Comments || Top||

#8  Saw Richard Holbrooke on Charlie Rose last night. He is brilliant and I hope Bush can find him a job re Iraq. He said TWICE that the French had "jerked us around" at the UN; that we need to tell the Germans, French, and Russians basically that the train is leaving the station, but that the best they can hope to do is be porters and not engineers (my words, but that was the spirit). ALSO, he said the pissing war over which US govt/UN/EU entity would get the glory in reconstructing Iraq was "garbage". He said all of this for the forseeable future should be handled by the military since it has the people and resources to get the job done. He said it was "tasteless" for Paris, London, Brussels, and DC to be fighting when PEOPLE need food and water now. To sum up, it is the Coalition of the Willing that is in the driver's seat and prissy Eurocrats can give us money and food, but not their opinions. WOW.
Posted by: Michael || 04/08/2003 10:48 Comments || Top||

#9  I think you guys are right on most points here but this action was done under UN1441, which they refused to back up when they had the chance(s). I personally enjoy listening to their UN whining, and, Liberalhawk, you are correct about no long-term obligations imposed on the new Iraqi gov't, but we should and will influence the iraqi frame of mind tremendously.
I think we need to publish the lists of illegally-transferred goods from these bastards at each UNSC meeting they want to have to discuss terms of rebuilding. It won't shame the French, they have no honor to shame, but it might shut some of the others up a bit. Tell Chirac to send a carrier for rebuilding support...it'll never get out of the Med
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 12:22 Comments || Top||

#10  Ptah:

This from Den Beste: "Unlike the last few rounds of diplomatic wrangling, time is no longer on the weasels' side. British and American administrators are beginning that process now."

Great minds think alike :)
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 13:27 Comments || Top||

#11  Heres what we should propose at the UNSC

"UNSC Res 14XX:

The UNSC, bearing in mind yada yada
Resolves that :
The Secretary General shall appoint a commision to study all aspects of the issue of Iraqi governance, to consult with all interested parties. The commision shall report back to the UNSC no later than October 1, 2003, at which point the UNSC shall review the report and take further steps as appropriate.

The UNSC determines to remain seized of the matter."
Posted by: liberalhawk || 04/08/2003 13:39 Comments || Top||

#12  Liberalhawk, that deadline, it is, well, too specific. I mean, we hafta wait for Hans Blix's report on, um, something.
How's about October 1, 2020? ;)
Posted by: Former Russian Major || 04/08/2003 15:36 Comments || Top||

#13  OK people - I'll buy your approach but only if Hans and El-Baradei have to make periodic (say, every 3-4 months) reports with discussion and unanimous approval before they further define steps to review the current status, discuss, and yadda yadda ....ad infinitum
Posted by: Frank G || 04/08/2003 18:33 Comments || Top||

#14  Liberalhawk! I blush!
Posted by: Ptah || 04/08/2003 19:51 Comments || Top||

#15  The US should propose (1) that the administration of post-war Iraq be handed over to the UNSC and (2) the US will veto any measures taken by that body to make it so.
Posted by: Tresho || 04/08/2003 23:23 Comments || Top||

#16  Liberalhawk: The UN is DEAD. Period. Full stop.
Posted by: PD || 04/08/2003 23:52 Comments || Top||



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Tue 2003-04-08
  "We′re not sure exactly who′s in charge"
Mon 2003-04-07
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Sun 2003-04-06
  Baghdad surrounded
Sat 2003-04-05
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Mon 2003-03-31
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