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2012-03-29 Science & Technology
Cheap Natural Gas Makes Inroads as U.S. Vehicle Fuel
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Posted by Fred 2012-03-29 00:00|| || Front Page|| [3 views ]  Top

#1 I was talking to a friend who has converted many engines and a few vehicles in the past. He told me that a fuel injected engine was "hard" but a carb based engine was easy and he suggested an Impco carb. (even offered me some old ones for free but I no longer have carb based transport - excepting the mower).
Posted by watermodem 2012-03-29 00:18||   2012-03-29 00:18|| Front Page Top

#2 the energy density of CNG is about 30-40% less than gasoline; also, using cng results in more methane emissions

but the cost per volume of CNG is about half that of gasoline so, yes, for fleet operations within a region, the numbers work pretty good
Posted by lord garth 2012-03-29 00:32||   2012-03-29 00:32|| Front Page Top

#3 Very nice, but must still be compared against the lack of International Govts-Perts consensus on "Peak Oil/Resources" [+ GWCC], etc.

By most accounts, the GULF OF MEXICO is still leaking flumes of Oil, while on a NORTH SEA RIG [North Atlantic] a "DEEPWATER/BP HORIZON" STYLE EVENT may be unfolding as per NATURAL GAS.

Its quite possible that our OWG-NWO that no AMerican = Amerikan has voted for, nor been asked to, may wake up one day circa 2040 and discover the World is low or zilch in fossil fuels, etc. because DA [COMMON = UNIVERSAL]MATH METHOD(S) WAS SCREWED UP = NEVER AGREED UPON.

* OLD ADAGE = WHAT DOES TRUTH HAVE TO DO POLITICS", correct???

Ya know, besides the life and survival of all Mankind both on Earth and in Deep Space.

[YEAR 2040 = INTERNATIONAL OUTLAWING OF
"FRACKING" here].
Posted by JosephMendiola 2012-03-29 00:38||   2012-03-29 00:38|| Front Page Top

#4 It not yet a consumer item. The markup is enough to buy 4000 gallons of gasoline at current prices.


Chrysler, Ford, GM Introduce Natural-Gas Pickup Trucks
Built in Saltillo, Mexico, the 2012 Ram 2500 Heavy Duty CNG—priced at $47,500, or roughly 30% more than a comparably equipped three-quarter-ton Ram—is offered only in a crew-cab, long-box configuration with four-wheel drive.
Posted by Shimble Guelph5793 2012-03-29 01:28||   2012-03-29 01:28|| Front Page Top

#5 Pickup trucks in general are grotesquely overpriced compared to items like sedans. The manufacturers get away with it because pickups are in high demand. I set no store whatsoever in statements like "30% more than comparably..."
News coverage of most aspects of the petroleum economy is utterly inadequate. You can drive massive amounts of political and economic agendas through holes left by the media. Inadequate emphasis is given to the differences between CNG and LNG. "CNG trucks are well suited to the severe service market as the payback period can be a little longer," said Ann Duignan, an analyst for J.P. Morgan, in a recent investor note, adding that "some conversions cost up to $18,000, and fleets are balking at this incremental cost." My friend Jim, an over-the-road trucker, years ago mentioned his company didn't bat an eyelash at buying him a new tractor with $8,000 worth of a diesel pony engine, designed to run A/C in his cab and to keep his batteries charged when he has to park for his mandatory rest breaks. Many jurisdictions now ban prolonged idling of parked semi truck/trailers. That money was spent years ago.
Jim drives his truck 100,000 miles a year, gets 7 mpg diesel. He burns about 14,285 gallons of diesel a year, at current prices of $4.10/gal (his company probably pays a bit less than the pump price), he burns up $58,5xx worth of fuel - per year. He is paid much less than the cost of fuel to run his rig.
So some conversions cost $18,000. B. F. D.
Reporters and analysts must be selected for their cluelessness and inability to operate a calculator.
Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2012-03-29 02:03||   2012-03-29 02:03|| Front Page Top

#6 A 2011 article in WSJ sheds some light on heavy trucks running on NG:
-- A trash truck that costs $200,000 outfitted for diesel costs only another $10,000—or 5% more— equipped for natural gas, said Kevin Walbridge, executive vice president of operations at trash-hauler Republic Services Inc. That price premium has fallen as trash-truck manufacturers have cranked out steadily larger volumes.
-- UPS pays about $95,000 for an average long-haul "tractor"—the front part of the 18-wheeler, housing the engine and driver. It recently ordered 48 natural-gas versions at a cost of $195,000 apiece—about double the cost of a diesel model
A trash truck cost 5% more to run on NG, while a UPS semi tractor costs 100% more - this makes little sense.
Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2012-03-29 02:15||   2012-03-29 02:15|| Front Page Top

#7 Here in Perth, it took about 10 years to go from no petrol stations selling CNG, to almost every station selling CNG.

CNG vehicles here do more miles than all petrol and diesel vehicles combined.

And NG is 3 times the cost of the US, because NG is priced based on long term contracts to East Asia.

The real scandal is that vehicle manufacturers wasted billions on electric cars, while spending almost nothing on developing NG vehicles (European bus manufacturers excepted).
Posted by phil_b 2012-03-29 03:50||   2012-03-29 03:50|| Front Page Top

#8 Why not burn off the most nasty and destructive "gas" you have? OIL. Burn that crap before you play with billions of gas stations.

No hurry here, burn that nasty oil off.
Posted by newc 2012-03-29 04:56||   2012-03-29 04:56|| Front Page Top

#9 They also make a CNG compressor for the home so you can fill your car at home.
Posted by 49 Pan 2012-03-29 12:27||   2012-03-29 12:27|| Front Page Top

#10 I think y'all missed the news that earlier this week Zero's administration more or less banned the construction of serious power plant construction except for natural gas plants.

This will have the effect of increasing consumption of natural gas being used for power (substituting for coal, which we weren't importing to begin with) and thereby decreasing the amount available (and/or increasing the price) for use for transportation where it could possibly decrease oil imports.

(And y'all were wondering how greenhouse regulations were going to make money for the Saudis. Now you know).
Posted by Thing From Snowy Mountain 2012-03-29 13:39||   2012-03-29 13:39|| Front Page Top

#11 With the proper people in government this could be the biggest development since the model T. I hate to say government but that's our world today.
Commercial aircraft, all manor of equipment basicly anything that uses gas or diesel. Heating for homes to mention another. Downunder they are selling NG at 4.5 cents/cubic liter to China. The Aussies don't get that break. The Gulf is loaded with this gas. So much that 600 million years ago they claim a massive methane burp caused a massive extinction. Yes, we are due. Duke energy has several lines into the Gulf now.
Posted by Dale 2012-03-29 16:26||   2012-03-29 16:26|| Front Page Top

#12 So much that 600 million years ago they claim a massive methane burp caused a massive extinction.

I'm inclined to deposit that into the circular filing cabinet along with the other climate speculator guesses (I refuse to dignify these charlatans with the words "scientist" or "theory", both of which relate to people who have come up with models that are replicable and have both explanatory and predictive power).
Posted by Zhang Fei 2012-03-29 17:30||   2012-03-29 17:30|| Front Page Top

#13 If you have a cng filling location near your location, then you can easily buy a used cng fleet car (police cars are particularly nice) for under 10k.
Posted by rammer 2012-03-29 19:25||   2012-03-29 19:25|| Front Page Top

#14 Price keeps going down. They are running out of storage locations.
A little more on Methane.
Posted by Dale 2012-03-29 22:16||   2012-03-29 22:16|| Front Page Top

#15 Well, other than being hard to transport, the US has more Natural Gas than any fuel. Ditch the golfer in chief and get someone who will make an easier transition (due to market forces - not government)

I Am all for it - when I see all the stinking pumps at the rual gas stations I frequent.

You still need to burn off that nasty oil tho. That will not change.
Posted by newc 2012-03-29 22:48||   2012-03-29 22:48|| Front Page Top

#16 Well, other than being hard to transport, the US has more Natural Gas than any fuel. Ditch the golfer in chief and get someone who will make an easier transition (due to market forces - not government)

I Am all for it - when I see all the stinking pumps at the rual gas stations I frequent.

You still need to burn off that nasty oil tho. That will not change.
Posted by newc 2012-03-29 22:48||   2012-03-29 22:48|| Front Page Top

00:00 JosephMendiola
23:54 JosephMendiola
23:42 crosspatch
23:37 JosephMendiola
23:01 canalzone
22:53 gromky
22:50 newc
22:48 newc
22:48 newc
22:41 canalzone
22:32 Frank G
22:29 JosephMendiola
22:27 JosephMendiola
22:16 Dale
22:15 crosspatch
21:10 Pappy
21:08 Pappy
20:55 trailing wife
20:53 Frank G
20:43 Shimble Guelph5793
20:41 Secret Master
20:25 Barbara
20:22 M. Murcek
20:20 Thing From Snowy Mountain









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