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| Europe |
| German neo-Nazi threat ’rising’ |
| 2003-09-15 |
| The Beeb picks up TGA’s threads... EFL The threat to Germany from neo-Nazis has risen to a new level, Interior Minister Otto Schily has warned. The discovery of a suspected plot to bomb a Munich Jewish centre during a visit by the German president has "dramatically confirmed" the danger to society, he said on Monday. At least 10 suspects were held and up to 14kg (31lb) of explosives seized in police raids last week. Officials believe plans were being made to bomb the centre on 9 November, when its foundation stone is due to be laid at a ceremony attended by President Johannes Rau, Bavarian governor Edmund Stoiber and Jewish leader Paul Spiegel. The suspected attack would have coincided with the anniversary of the Nazis’ 1938 Kristallnacht attacks, when thousands of Jewish targets were attacked and dozens murdered. "One could (even) say there is a new quality of terror, though we know from previous times that in right-extremist circles bombing attacks were planned and carried out," Mr Schily told Germany’s ZDF television, referring a 1980 attack that killed 13 people. "There have been hints that right extremists are really a great potential danger for our society... and this has now been dramatically confirmed." A "hit list" detailing other possible targets, including mosques!!!, a Greek school and an Italian target, had been recovered, said Bavarian Interior Minister Guenther Beckstein. The explosives included at least 1.7kg of TNT. Weapons, grenades and ammunition were also recovered. German media reports at the weekend speculated on the possible phenomenon of a neo-Nazi "Brown Army Faction", referring to the disbanded left-wing Red Army Faction. "Faced with the flood of pictures from the Middle East, we had forgotten what extremists could also plan here at home," wrote commentator Guido Heinen in Die Welt. "German political terrorism is back." |
| Posted by:Bulldog |
| #18 The ceremony has not been cancelled or postponed. And I hope this won't change. |
| Posted by: True German Ally 2003-9-16 9:23:50 AM |
| #17 ""You are philoNazi scum and as evil as they. Burn in hell, baby, burn. LMAO." Oh man.. there should be a classic comments section." Heh. I wish I'd been keeping a record! TGA, Has the ceremony on the 9th been postponed? TGA & Aris, When I said "marriage of convenience", I didn't mean to imply that there was an actual deep-rooted association between neo-Nazis and Islamists, only, I presumed, a kind of unspoken non-aggression agreement given the overriding centrality of their shared judeophobia. Attacks on immigrants, including Turks, are par for the course for neo-Nazi behaviour, but high profile attacks on mosques are surely a new development (tell me if I'm wrong), and would have considerable international consequences, being interpretable as an attack on Islam itself and not just on foreigners who happen to be Muslim. Do neo-Nazis really have controlling leadership with defined political agenda? I gather the brownies are few in numbers anyway, and as TGA indicates, primarily mentally challenged (did the Neanderthals really speak German, badly ;) ) losers for whom hate is adopted as a world view for want of the ability to grasp anything more intellectually demanding. Acts of violence for them are simply achievements in themselves, as they are for al Quaeda, with no realistic assessment, or no assessment at all, of the consequences of the acts, which will in all probability be an overwhelming counteraction. Methodical madness, you could say. |
| Posted by: Bulldog 2003-9-16 5:34:10 AM |
| #16 You are philoNazi scum and as evil as they. Burn in hell, baby, burn. LMAO. Oh man.. there should be a classic comments section. |
| Posted by: Rafael 2003-9-15 11:07:44 PM |
| #15 *amused* People, there's no reason to apologise for the actions or words of jlc -- his idiocy is his alone and I know most people here don't approve of it... And I was mostly amused, not offended, by his second post - first the "I don't give a shit if you call me a bigot" thing but then flying off the handle when I did call him one. Funny! :-) |
| Posted by: Aris Katsaris 2003-9-15 9:48:43 PM |
| #14 Aris, There are many websites that a conservative mid-westerner like myself can hang at and here people like myself agree in a conservative love-fest. I would rather frequent a website with divergent views. You, Bulldog, Murat et al make the site interesting and mentally challenging. Please continue and ignore the skinhead. Hopefully, he will take a break to enjoy some autoerotic asphyxiation and find his bowie knife too dull to part the chord at the moment of truth. |
| Posted by: Super Hose 2003-9-15 8:37:58 PM |
| #13 AP> Thank you. Aris> Apologies from a regular. |
| Posted by: Old Grouch 2003-9-15 8:35:07 PM |
| #12 The issues in postings here are often of great importance and serious and heated arguments are good. That is why Rantburg is here. However, the "go fuck yourself" and other personal attack lines are counterproductive and vile and serve only to bring the whole thing into the gutter. There are plenty of other websites where one can wallow in the gutter. That's my two cents, anyway. |
| Posted by: Alaska Paul 2003-9-15 8:20:25 PM |
| #11 I read what jlc wrote to Aris and am quite surprised that there are still some the "enemy of my enemy is my friend" dudes still hanging around. I file the skinheads in with abortion clinic bombers and the anti-government militia shooters that hate the central government so badly that they "off" the local sherrif. For a historical recap Stalin was nobody's pal. He killed Germans, Jews, Russians and Poles. Basically, he killed indescrimminantly. Hopefully, the Poles weren't cheering when Stalin depopulated whole Russian villages, because Stalin was an equal opportunity psychopath. More recently OBL was not our friend when he was arming the mujahadim. We made that mistake. Only the village idiot cheers the skinheads. |
| Posted by: Super Hose 2003-9-15 7:59:28 PM |
| #10 "Aris Katsaris, you can go fuck yourself with a baseball bat. Better yet, let me do it for you! Faggot. " Hey, didn't you say you didn't give a shit about what I think about you? It now seems to me that you *do* give a shit or you wouldn't have gotten so upset. I think that people who feel the need to mention they don't give a shit about other's opinions are generally the most insecure of them all. Or they wouldn't have bothered to mention it. Anyway, you supported the murderous actions of the racist and xenophobic Neonazis. The kind of people who take innocent teenage children and (because said children are Greek or Turkish or generally non-Aryan) carve svastikas on their foreheads. Your kinds of people, your best pals. You said that though you disapprove of their antisemetism you are glad about all the rest of their anti-foreign actions. In your stated approval of them, you became morally complicit. You are philoNazi scum and as evil as they. Burn in hell, baby, burn. "The brownshirts in Germany, and other fascists in Europe will never attain political power again, unless a given country totally disintegrates politically and economically" Not pan-European power, no. But the nationalist racist anti-Muslim scum had enough power to cause ethnic cleansing and genocide in Bosnia. Or to drown Grozny in blood, for that matter. But, hey you probably are happy of the Serbs battling the Muslim terror in the Balkans. And here is me, disgusted and all about the attitude of most Greek media which supported the Serbs: You'd probably think that is the proper attitude to take, instead. Bulldog> I think that the long-term thinking Neonazis are in an alliance of terror with the Islamists, both being opposed to Israel or secular democracy. Short-term thinking Neonazis haven't evolved much beyond the level of "Evil non-Christian or foreigner! Get him!", I'd say. The difference between Neonazi leadership and troops. Or it may be as TGA said. |
| Posted by: Aris Katsaris 2003-9-15 7:50:02 PM |
| #9 It's always a good idea not to feed trolls, of all sides. They will crawl back to stormfront.org soon enough. My sympathies for nutbags who wanted to blow up a ceremony I was going to attend is limited. I don't believe that Germany will "relapse". If these guys manage to blow up something significant they will be whacked thoroughly and that's that. Unlike leftist of islamist terrorists these brown dirtbags only applaud themselves. I've been getting occasional death threats from them for the last 30 years. If only they used toilet paper I could put them to good use. Nothing to lose sleep over. They write German worse than a Neanderthal man. Actually the radicalization of the brownies show something: They have no other chance to get some attention. Bulldog, as for the link between Islamofascists and Neo-Nazis we established, I think it's more an (ideological) one way street. The islamofascists may draw from Nazi ideology, but I can't just see a fanatic Turk and a Neo-Nazi burning a synagogue together. Of course you can never tell how much of a method madness may have. But if mosques go up in flames, will we witness a whiny Bin Laden ask us: "Why do they hate us so much?" |
| Posted by: True German Ally 2003-9-15 5:32:09 PM |
| #8 "And why in the world was Bulldog surprised that mosques were being targetted? Is it the first time you guys have ever heard of anti-Turk violence by neo-Nazis?" A combination of surprise and amazement at what the consequences would be. Surprise because, as was discussed a couple of days ago, there is a historical and political association between German neo-Nazis and Islamists (despite the anti-Turk violence which I'm well aware of), which is, the marriage of convenience created by shared Judeophobia. Amazement at the idea of mosques being targetted by terrorists in the heart of the EU. Imagine the self-righteous protestations of Muslims throughout the world. Imagine the possible soul-searching that would presumably, hopefully, follow. Imagine the response of the western political "elites", Islamic terror apologists, and the holier-than-thou Europhiles (such as yourself). Just ponder the consequences... |
| Posted by: Bulldog 2003-9-15 5:00:29 PM |
| #7 Aris Katsaris, you can go fuck yourself with a baseball bat. Better yet, let me do it for you! Faggot. It is my opinion that bout 5-10% of Muslims in Europe are out and out terrorists, maybe 20% are enablers of terrorism, and a mojority(60-70%?) silently cheer the Islamofucks on. They are a mortal threat to Western civilization. The brownshirts in Germany, and other fascists in Europe will never attain political power again, unless a given contry totally disintegrates politically and economically. They may just, however, put the fear of G-d into the ruling elites, and finally force them to change course. That would indeed be a godsend. So I say, more power to them. I'm cheering them on. |
| Posted by: jlc 2003-9-15 3:38:38 PM |
| #6 Sheesh! And I was just getting used to the idea that I'm a wild-eyed-racist and kill-em-all-and-let-God-sort-em-out genocidal maniac kind o' guy. I'm a fucking wimp! I'm crushed! |
| Posted by: .com (Prez for Life - My Isles of Langerhans) 2003-9-15 3:24:50 PM |
| #5 "Didn't know they had a beef with Italians?" Italians are foreigners so they have a beef with them. That's the way it works. And why in the world was Bulldog surprised that mosques were being targetted? Is it the first time you guys have ever heard of anti-Turk violence by neo-Nazis? |
| Posted by: Aris Katsaris 2003-9-15 3:15:55 PM |
| #4 "Please don't respond saying that I'm a bigot, blah, blah, blah. I don't give a shit what you think. " You are a bigot and a racist and an all-around evil man. And I don't give a shit that you don't give a shit what I think. |
| Posted by: Aris Katsaris 2003-9-15 3:10:54 PM |
| #3 I think they have a beef with anything that is not 'Aryan'. Let me be the first to say that this is great news! No, not he anti-semitic stuff, but that fact that xenophobic anti-foreigner violence is taking root. This is a slap in the face to EUropean PC, and nanny socialism. I especially delight in the fact that they would target mosques! Wow, more power to them. Finally, the Islamofascists will take some of their own fucking medicine. I say, kill them, kill them all. Please don't respond saying that I'm a bigot, blah, blah, blah. I don't give a shit what you think. I support Israel, and feel that the Israelis are too soft on the Arabs. It would be unfortunate that anti-semitic attacks would kill innocent Jews, but if it forces more of them to go to Israel and prop up their non-Arab population, then it might be for the better good in the long run. I am just ecstatic that finally, finally somebody is targeting those motherfucking Muslims. Bout time. |
| Posted by: jlc 2003-9-15 3:04:47 PM |
| #2 Even with the anti-everything sentiment present right now, I'll put my money on honest regular Germans to slap these neo-Nazis down when they show up on the radar screen. Every society has morons like this who seek to make a niche for themselves by hating someone - offering up what they hope will be a social scapegoat for slaughter to assuage the frustrations of the dysfunctional. This isn't history rearing its head, it's history being repeated endlessly in every society - and the Germans won't tolerate or support it. More than anyone else today, they appreciate the dangers and stupidity present in such crap. I hope they cut the funding off first, to take them off the news, then quietly snuff these parasitic cretins. Shan? Shan, where are you? Doesn't this disgust you? Or might you be a target for these people? Murat would be, if he were to immigrate to Germany - and your stupid racial references indicate you would likely be, as well. Is it OK to "remove" these people from society? Is it okay to fight fire with fire when reason is beyond their ken? Can you discern differences which allow one situation, yet not another? Speak Solomon, or crawl back into your superior shell of silence. |
| Posted by: .com (Prez for Life - My Isles of Langerhans) 2003-9-15 3:00:32 PM |
| #1 Didn't know they had a beef with Italians? It must have been a left-wing or Euro-oriented target? |
| Posted by: J.H. 2003-9-15 2:08:06 PM |