You have commented 339 times on Rantburg.

Your Name
Your e-mail (optional)
Website (optional)
My Original Nic        Pic-a-Nic        Sorry. Comments have been closed on this article.
Bold Italic Underline Strike Bullet Blockquote Small Big Link Squish Foto Photo
Iraq
Army files charge in combat tactic
2003-10-29
He should be getting a medal, instead of having to put up with this shit
The Army has filed a criminal assault charge against an American officer who coerced an Iraqi into providing information that foiled a planned attack on U.S. soldiers.
Better have a really good case...
Lt. Col. Allen B. West says he did not physically abuse the detainee, but used psychological pressure by twice firing his service weapon away from the Iraqi. After the shots were fired, the detainee, an Iraqi police officer, gave up the information on a planned attack around the northern Iraqi town of Saba al Boor. But the Army is taking a dim view of the interrogation tactic. An Army official at the Pentagon confirmed to The Washington Times yesterday that Col. West has been charged with one count of aggravated assault. A military source said an Article 32 hearing has been scheduled in Iraq that could lead to the Army court-martialing Col. West and sending him to prison for a maximum term of eight years.
I have my doubts that's going to happen...
Some soldiers are privately questioning the Army’s drive to punish the officer for an interrogation technique that likely is used regularly to get information from terrorists.
That one's rather mild. One story I heard about SKor techniques in Vietnam involved taking two bad guys, shooting one in the head, and taking notes while the other sang. Our guys are mild as milk compared to most others...
Col. West’s unit in Iraq operates amid extreme danger. Fighters loyal to ousted Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein are poised at any moment to kill the soldiers in ambushes using explosive devices, guns and rocket-propelled grenades. Col. West, 42, says he pressured the Iraqi after taking into account the dangerous environment and the risk to his soldiers’ lives.
Which is what vindicates him...
In response to an e-mail from The Times, Col. West, a 19-year veteran, gave his version of events. Col. West is a member of the 4th Infantry Division, the Fort Hood, Texas, division occupying areas around Tikrit, Saddam’s hometown and an area infested with loyalists of the former regime. An informant reported that there was an assassination plot against Col. West, an artillery officer working with the local governing council in Saba al Boor. On Aug. 16, guerrillas attacked members of the colonel’s unit who were on their way to Saba al Boor. An informant told the soldiers that one person involved in the attack was a town policeman. Col. West sent two sergeants to detain the policeman, who was placed in a detention center near the Taji air base. The interrogators had no luck at first, so Col. West decided to take over the questioning. "I asked for soldiers to accompany me and told them we had to gather information and that it could get ugly," Col. West said in his e-mail. He said his soldiers "physically aggress[ed]" the prisoner. A subsequent investigation resulted in nonjudicial punishment for them in the form of fines.
Thereby protecting them from court martial...
After the physical "aggress" failed, Col. West says he brandished his pistol. "I did use my 9 mm weapon to threaten him and fired it twice. Once I fired into the weapons clearing barrel outside the facility alone, and the next time I did it while having his head close to the barrel. I fired away from him. I stood in between the firing and his person.
Stimulates the imagination...
"I admit that what I did was not right but it was done with the concern of the safety of my soldiers and myself." Col. West said he informed his superior of his actions. The incident lay dormant until the Army conducted an overall command-climate investigation of the brigade. The investigation turned up the interrogation technique, and Col. West was charged with one count of aggravated assault.
Somebody got all official on him — probably somebody who doesn't ride a track...
Col. West said the gunshots spurred the Iraqi to provide the location of the planned sniper attack and the names of three guerrilla fighters. Col. West says the 4th Infantry’s staff judge advocate, the unit’s prosecutor, is offering him two choices: resign short of gaining retirement benefits or face court-martial. Article 128 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice describes assault in these terms: "Any person subject to this chapter who attempts or offers with unlawful force or violence to do bodily harm to another person, whether or not the attempt or offer is consummated, is guilty of assault and shall be punished as a court-martial may direct."
Take 'em on. Dispute the "unlawful" nature of the offer...
The Army relieved Col. West of his battalion command and has placed him in the 173rd Airborne Brigade, which is attached to the 4th Infantry in Kirkuk. Said his wife, Angela, who lives in Fort Hood: "My husband is a top-of-the-line officer. My husband is an African-American. He has had to overcome a number of things to get where he is."
Goddammit! He's not black. He's green.
"I accept being retired at the grade of major and paying whatever fine required, but resignation and prison seems an attempt to destroy me," Col. West says. "All I wish is to go away, re-establish my family and retain some of my dignity."
Posted by:tipper.

#17  I wrote the other day about how senior promotions had undermined the Army's ability to wage war. This only confirms what I said. The people making these charges have never faces an enemy, have never been in danger, have never feared for their life. Unfortunately, they're well-insulated in virtually every part of our military, and it'll take a decade to weed them out.

As for SKor interrogation methods, some of them made me sick. They also got results. Twenty years ago, the kind of thing this Colonel did was actually TAUGHT at our interrogation school, along with 'good cop-bad cop' and a few other choice fundamentals.

Bomb - re the helicopter rides: Two or three Cong were taken up. The interrogator asked the first guy a question, which was usually ignored. The interrogator would grab him and toss him out the door. Then he'd start questioning the second guy. Definitely not PC, but then, neither is war. Compare our methods with those of Saddam that we learned about in Basra. Hell, even this colonel is a saint, compared to that!
Posted by: Old Patriot   2003-10-30 12:57:41 AM  

#16  Cyber Sarge is probably right about the outcome. I'm just pissed it had to come to that. Someone high up needs to go to bat for this Soldier. Give him command of a Brigade.
Posted by: Jarhead   2003-10-29 11:41:46 PM  

#15  This reeks of one of Clinton's PC flunkies. His actions saved lives.

It isn't as if he started shooting off toes or anything...
Posted by: CrazyFool   2003-10-29 7:12:37 PM  

#14  I guess what I would like he to say is, "What I did was wrong. I am sorry that I embarrassed my country, but in the same situation I would make the same decision again. I am prepared to take one for the team."
Posted by: Super Hose   2003-10-29 6:39:15 PM  

#13  You all make way too much from this. I predict that Col West will be convicted and forced to resign. But without loss of rank or benifits. There is not a group of Army Officers that would send this guy to Jail. Since the story is out they had to do something, this is probably the Army's way to come clean with a public 'incident'.
Posted by: Cyber Sarge (VRWC CA Chapter)   2003-10-29 6:08:15 PM  

#12  You know, I've heard stories that Viet Cong prisoners were taken up in helicopters and coerced into talking, then pushed out the open hatch with no parachute. This pistol-firing incident pales in comparison.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama   2003-10-29 5:46:49 PM  

#11  This is the type of leader we need more of. Take no shit, execute the mission, and take care of your lads in the process. His actions SAVED LIVES!! He has absolutely nothing to apologize for. I'd follow this guy. No offense to my Army bro's, but for their brass to entertain hurting this man's career is absurd. To even let it get any media attention is total horse shit. Some Army JAG-"OFF" is trying to make a name. Thank God I'm in the Corps.
Posted by: Jarhead   2003-10-29 2:58:29 PM  

#10  Roger that, Greg.

Hell, I'd have started with the goblin's toes and worked my way up.
Posted by: mojo   2003-10-29 2:06:34 PM  

#9  Second Charles' suggestion... and do it *now* to spare the officer the hassle of going through the trial.
Posted by: snellenr   2003-10-29 1:40:39 PM  

#8  This is just another effect of the Clinton feminizing of the Army. I am glad I got out when I did, because I wouldn't have been as polite as this guy!
Posted by: Greg   2003-10-29 1:26:03 PM  

#7  Better judged by 12 then carried by 6... and it sounds like they were gunning for him.
Posted by: tu3031   2003-10-29 12:59:46 PM  

#6  Can anybody say Presidential Pardon?
Posted by: Charles   2003-10-29 12:32:05 PM  

#5  We can't be like them.

Remember the CIA policy of trying to recruit "clean" people in foreign countries as agents? The reward was little to no agents on the ground in areas where they were needed. The U.S. paid dearly for that little piece of PC idiocy. There is a need for rules, but rules can and should be bent when prudent, especially in the face of an enemy that is trying to kill as many of you as they can in any way possible. This is one of those instances.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama   2003-10-29 11:34:47 AM  

#4  This is crap. This man questioned a terrorist, and got information that potentially saved the lives of his troops. This little Iraqi TERRORIST is lucky that neither of those bullets hit him, I can't say I would have had the same restraint.
Posted by: Anonymous   2003-10-29 10:53:53 AM  

#3  I hope the shit-for-brains PC-suckup JAG weenie who's driving this is drummed out of the service - sans the retirement goodies. Obviously, he hasn't Clue One™ what it's like outside of the Beltway Bubble™ and has no standing regards judging the actions of real soldiers actually serving in a live-fire zone.

They'd better not follow through on this - or they will have sent the message loud and clear to the troops that the REMF gutless turds are in charge of the WoT - and still in charge of the Pentaloon.
Posted by: .com   2003-10-29 10:35:08 AM  

#2  There's a fine line, and I think he ventured just a little over the line. Remember, he also ordered his prisoner roughed up.

We can't be like them.
Posted by: Chuck Simmins   2003-10-29 10:27:01 AM  

#1  I seriously doubt that our enemies are going to hold themselves to an equally lofty standard. This persecution is nothing but PC-inspired bullshit.
Posted by: Bomb-a-rama   2003-10-29 10:19:16 AM  

00:00