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| Quiet diesel subs surface as new threat - paid for by Electric Boats |
| 2004-01-28 |
| Years after the Cold War threat of a Soviet submarine attack ended, the U.S. Navy is confronting a new danger – the growing fleets of quiet, diesel-electric subs among potential enemy nations. As a result, the service is creating a San Diego-based command tasked with training and developing strategies and tactics for hunting undersea foes. "We have a I think we’re doing OK, Pat. Over the past decade, the submarines that once cruised the ocean depths waiting to launch nuclear missiles at U.S. cities have rusted away at Russian naval bases. Relieved, the Navy mothballed many of its anti-submarine forces, including sub-hunting submarines and aircraft based in San Diego. Naval training has largely eschewed looking beneath the waves, instead focusing on long-range missile attacks and escorting aircraft carrier strike groups. The Burke Class can do ASW as well as AAW, but the Spruance class was an inferiour AAW platform. However, several nations, including potential adversaries such as Iran and China, now have small but growing fleets of almost undetectable diesel-electric subs. Undetectable is a stretch. We can take out Iran’s subs at a time of our choosing. A hostile, seafaring nation that wants to influence world events has only to go out and buy a diesel sub, Brandhuber added. Newer models, plus older surplus ones, are being sold by Germany, France, Italy and Russia. There are cheaper ways to influence world events with a much higher chance of success than trying to train bedouins to fight underwater. self-serving alarmism by various naval analysts continues Realistically, there are better ways to spend our defense dollars than going full-bore to combat the diesel sub threat. Those that are buying these knock-offs have limited operational budgets. Here are some quick thoughts: 1. Replace aging P-3s with an airframe similar to what we are going to lease for tanker aircaft. Diesels subs generally don’t operate in the blue water. Unescorted P-3’s are not safe for patrolly an enemy’s contiguous waters. 2. Use more boomers to launch tomahawks. Use the fewer atttack subs against deisel subs. Helo’s are even safer to use against subs but sub on sub engagement has its advantages with respect to thermal layers. 3. Unmanned subs should be explored as a cost effective alternative to attack subs. |
| Posted by:Super Hose |
| #4 Any chance of using a modified SURTASS type array off an FFG? Try laying it outside the littorals as a kind of SOSUS? Or expand keeping track of the diesel boats' cows and re-supply ships? |
| Posted by: Jack Deth 2004-1-28 11:55:56 PM |
| #3 Unescorted P-3’s are not safe for patrolly an enemy’s contiguous waters. My question: how does an airframe similar to the proposed tanker improve upon that? Use more boomers to launch tomahawks. Use the fewer atttack subs against deisel subs. Helo’s are even safer to use against subs but sub on sub engagement has its advantages with respect to thermal layers. Agreed. However, there are places a boomer can't go. Unmanned subs should be explored as a cost effective alternative to attack subs. Perhaps a more cost-effective method would be to use USVs in concert with attack subs as an ASW system, (thinke German anti-mine Troika system). |
| Posted by: Pappy 2004-1-28 11:14:38 PM |
| #2 We also have the new 'PT' boats the US Navy is considering. These boats may possibly be built just to counter such a threat. Diesel subs are like house cats. They gotta come up and take a dump sometime. Their ability to stay underwater is severely limited by battery power. All a diesel sub has to do is to stick its snokel up, and it is found. |
| Posted by: badanov 2004-1-28 10:20:54 PM |
| #1 Don't be so sure that we can catch them - diesels, with all the quieting of modern (US-UK) Nuc boats (well designed and machined screws, vibration damping, anechoic coatings, and now composite material to reduce the magnetic signature, etc), these things can be essentially undetectable when turning slow screws and running on battery. Also given the noise in brownwater ops and coast/littoral, these guys can hide quite well. Best counter are FG/DD's and helis. Or to be proactive and lay mines in their harbor mouths, then fling missles at their ports to drive them into the mines :-) |
| Posted by: OldSpook 2004-1-28 10:11:01 PM |