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| Britain |
| More on the London bombmaker |
| 2005-07-14 |
| Millions of people in Britain and elsewhere in Europe stood in silence for two long, quiet minutes today in memory of the victims of the terrorist bombings exactly one week ago when 52 people died on three subway trains and a red double decker bus. The attack was the city's worst since the Second World War and rekindled resilience along with a sense of vulnerability after police identified the bombers as British citizens who blew themselves up at the height of the morning rush-hour. Accusing Al Qaeda of responsibility, Prime Minister Tony Blair has blamed the bombing on "an extreme and evil ideology whose roots lie in a perverted and poisonous interpretation of the religion of Islam." Even as investigators pressed a worldwide search today for the masterminds of the bombings, stores emptied, traffic halted and officer workers poured onto the streets in bright sunshine to observe the commemoration. According to police accounts, the bombers began their murderous journey from the northern city of Leeds, where police raided six homes after identifying at least three of the suspects as residents. Police again cordoned off a part of Leeds today and ordered people to stay away, apparently as they looked for explosives. The police investigation is now focused on a fifth man who may be the bomb-maker, investigators said. Forty miles north-west of London police also continued searching a suburban house in the town of Aylesbury. A neighbor told Sky News the resident of the house had been a "man of African origin, maybe paler" whose wife was always veiled in public. But police have given no further details. The fifth man police are searching for was seen on a videotape with the four suspected bombers last Thursday morning at the Luton train station, according to an American official. The four suspected bombers are seen leaving for a London-bound train, but the fifth man stays behind. Investigators said the man is a British citizen, as were the four suspected bombers. While he is not "Anglo," said the American official, he is not of Pakistani descent. The official, who spoke on condition of anonymity so as not to upstage the British on a case the two countries are cooperating on, added that British police investigators know the man's name but decided not to release it or his image. This fifth man is suspected of being the ringleader and possibly the bomb maker, the official said, in the attacks last Thursday in the London Underground and on a double-decker city bus that killed at least 52 people. Investigators described him as a highly trained person. On Wednesday, several American law enforcement officials identified one of the suspected suicide bombers as a Jamaican-born British resident named Lindsey Germaine. The other suspected bombers were of Pakistani descent and lived in the gritty working-class neighborhoods of Leeds. Late Wednesday, the British police said officers had searched a home in Aylesbury, 40 miles northwest of London and close to Luton, but would not say whether anyone had been arrested.The developments Wednesday emerged as Charles Clarke, the British home secretary, offered the first official indication that British officials believed the four attackers were suicide bombers. The attacks confronted Britons for the first time with a suicidal attack by British-born terrorists, apparently drawn from the ranks of disaffected Muslims and seeming to copycat attacks most Britons see only on their television screens from Israel or Iraq. According to police accounts, the four men, aged between 18 and 30, gathered at King's Cross station at the heart of the London subway system and fanned out from there, detonating explosives on three subway trains and, almost one hour later, aboard a No. 30 bus. One theory is that the men had aimed to strike at the four points of the compass on subway lines but were foiled by delays on a northbound line. The three Underground bombs exploded south, east and west of King's Cross. "This is not an isolated criminal act we are dealing with," Prime Minister Tony Blair told Parliament. "It is an extreme and evil ideology whose roots lie in a perverted and poisonous misinterpretation of the religion of Islam." Mr. Blair said his Labor Party planned to open negotiations with other parties on new antiterror laws. "We will look urgently at how we strengthen the procedures to exclude people from entering the U.K. who may incite hatred or act contrary to the public good, and at how we deport such people, if they come here, more easily," Mr. Blair said. Muslims and Christians alike have recoiled from the notion that the suspected bombers had emerged from the ranks of Britain's 1.6 million Muslims, who make up around 3 percent of the population. "What we know now is appalling to contemplate," said Michael Howard, the leader of the Conservative opposition. "It will take us a long time to come to terms with the fact that these atrocities appear to have been committed by those who were born and brought up in our midst." Mohammed Sarwar, a Muslim Labor member of Parliament, said, "We are deeply shocked that these are homegrown bombers, and the vast majority of the Muslim community condemn these barbaric attacks." Investigators said authorities were concerned that despite Tuesday's raids on six homes in the Leeds area and the seizure of a car laden with explosives at Luton, some of the high-grade explosives used in the attack might still be unaccounted for. The police said Tuesday they had seized explosives from one of the homes in Leeds, and on Wednesday night, erected scaffolding and plastic sheeting around all six and refused to allow hundreds of residents to return to nearby buildings. The investigators, who spoke in return for anonymity because they are not officially allowed to talk to reporters, said it was worrisome that the London bombers had gained access to such powerful explosives, possibly highly sophisticated plastic explosives from the Balkans. Investigators were trying urgently to find out whether the bombers had contact with Al Qaeda operatives, possibly in North Africa. Since the bombings, the police have given the impression that the attackers were what Mr. Clarke on Wednesday referred to as "foot soldiers," whose anonymity made it easier for them to slip through the net of the security services. But after a meeting of European Union interior ministers in Brussels, Nicholas Sarkozy, the French ministry, said: "It seems that part of this team had been subject to partial arrest" in the spring of 2004. Mr. Clarke denied that any of the bombers had been arrested and released. Mr. Sarkozy's aides scrambled later to say he had been referring to arrests among the broader Islamic movement, not the London bombers. Before the meeting, Mr. Clarke said European nations had to defend their values of society "against those who would destroy it." Without using the term "suicide bombing," he said: "That means standing out against, in a very strong way, anybody who preaches the kind of fundamentalism, as I say, that can lead four young men to blow themselves and others up on the tube on a Thursday morning. "We have got to root out those elements from within our community that want to destroy it. That puts different burdens on all of us. "We have to understand that these foot soldiers who have done this are only one element of an organization that is bringing about this kind of mayhem in our society. "And we have to attack the people who are driving it, organizing it, manipulating those people," he said. Pakistan's interior minister, Aftab Ahmed Khan Sheparo, said Wednesday that his country had given "information" to Britain about a possible attack before the British elections in May, but did not elaborate. With government ministers warning that more attackers may still be at large, many Britons have shown themselves stoic, despite a rash of security scares across the capital as police investigate apparently suspicious packages. "I'd rather catch a bus than a tube now unless I'm in a desperate hurry," said David Ellis, 45, an office worker awaiting a subway train at St. James's Park station. "Probably before long I will have forgotten about it. It sounds dreadful, but you just get on with life." In radio talk shows and in e-mail messages to television stations, Britons seemed puzzled - and annoyed - about the causes of the attack. Some expressed frustration with the government's close alliance with the United States in its campaign against terrorism, which has led to two wars. "We've got to look at the reasoning behind these things," said Saraj Qazi, a 25-year-old Muslim boutique owner in Luton, just north of London, where police suspect the bombers gathered for their final brief journey into the British capital on July 7. "There's no denying it's payback for what's happened in Iraq and Afghanistan," he said. "You've been bombing people for the last two to four years, so you are going to get a backlash." "England is a great country and we love it to bits but do we love this government? No," Mr. Qazi said. "There were 24 Muslims killed in Iraq today; there will be more tonight and more tomorrow." The identification of the attackers as British-born Muslims has deepened the anxieties of Muslim leaders that they will face a backlash. There have already been incidents of mosques being attacked. Mr. Blair, who met with Muslim legislators on Wednesday, promised immediate discussions with Muslim leaders to "debate the right way forward." But, referring to Islamic extremism, he said, "In the end this can only be taken on and defeated by the community itself." In Parliament, Shahid Malik, a Labor legislator from the same West Yorkshire area that was home to the bombers, said condemnation of extremists was "not enough and British Muslims must, and I believe, are prepared to, confront the voices of evil head on." The notion of more draconian anti-terror laws has raised concerns that Britain will forfeit its long-standing commitment to tolerance and civil rights in the name of a war on terror modeled on that of the United States. But Mr. Clarke, the home secretary, argued that civil rights had to be balanced against the needs of security. "I argue that it is a fundamental civil liberty of people in Europe to be able to go to work on their transport system in the morning without being blown up or subjected to terrorist attack or to conduct their lives without being at risk of serious and organized crime," he said. "The question of civil liberties has to be treated in a proportionate way." |
| Posted by:Dan Darling |
| #25 Heh. ;) |
| Posted by: .com 2005-07-14 23:36 |
| #24 wudn't me, didn't do it. ;) |
| Posted by: Asedwich 2005-07-14 23:35 |
| #23 What? You mean there's a difference between debate / discussion / ranting and blowing up innocent kafrs with Allan's blessings? Who'da thunk it? |
| Posted by: .com 2005-07-14 21:03 |
| #22 'cuz, of course, all of us advocating nuking Mecca spend the rest of our time running around building bombs to blow up Muslims, and when that doesn't work we string 'em up in a tree. Haven't you seen it on the news? |
| Posted by: Asedwich 2005-07-14 20:55 |
| #21 So the Egyptian chemist made the bombs. Who is the "mastermind" ? |
| Posted by: john 2005-07-14 20:34 |
| #20 Liberalhawk, you would have lost us World War II with your moral equivalence lunacy. You could never have bombed the Germans or the Japanese -- you'd have just stewed in your arguments until one or the other of the hostile powers reached your doorstep and blew your brains out. I thought self-preservation was inate, but I was wrong. You deserve a Darwin award. Name all the places that Islamic nutjobs are blowing people up recently. Go ahead. In just the last two weeks will suffice. London, Israel, Thailand, Turkey... Now name some recent bombings that were not carried out by Islamic nutjobs. World War III is breaking out, the enemy is clear, and you are not up to the task. |
| Posted by: Neutron Tom 2005-07-14 20:27 |
| #19 One form, triacetone triperoxide or TATP, is apparently used by Palestinian suicide bombers. Was the "mastermind" a Palestinian "Engineer"? |
| Posted by: john 2005-07-14 20:21 |
| #18 It seems the "high grade" explosives was simple acetone peroxide made in a bath tub using common ingredients (sulphuric acid, acetone, hydrogen peroxide). |
| Posted by: john 2005-07-14 20:13 |
| #17 I wonder if there is no moral equivalence beneath a finger wagging liberal. Silly me, of course not. |
| Posted by: .com 2005-07-14 19:33 |
| #16 Backlash in London for 52 dead = one case of arson. Backlash for one false rumour of a Koran flushing = ? |
| Posted by: Super Hose 2005-07-14 17:31 |
| #15 Supporters of terrorist acts are not engaging in free speech. Just as someone shouting "Fire!" in a crowded theater is not engaging in free speech. As for razing Mecca, I support that OPTION in RETALIATION for the next ISLAMOFASCIST ATTACK on US soil. The same reason and mode of operation that led to nuking Hiroshima and Nagasaki. And the same threat made to the Soviet Union during the Cold War. Claro? |
| Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) 2005-07-14 17:00 |
| #14 now i would NOT mind have any muslim who says "its all pay back" put on a watch list, and followed around, to see which mosques they attend, who they associate with, etc. I wonder if there would be any objection for similar treatment of those who call for nuking Mecca? |
| Posted by: liberalhawk 2005-07-14 16:05 |
| #13 "SUCH statements should be cause for jail and permanent banishment. " so much for free speech. Lets review. Free speech means you have the right to call Islam an abomination, and to call for its abolition, even if I think thats a poor idea and that saying that undermines the WOT (which I do). Free speech ALSO means that somebody can say "ah, its all payback" though i find that despicable, and am troubled that some muslims are saying that. |
| Posted by: liberalhawk 2005-07-14 16:04 |
| #12 " I have a wonderful (to me, anyway) piece of Political art. I'd call it PorKoran. It would be an actual Koran mounted on Pigs feet, with a tail and book marks made of bacon. Maybe with some hog jowels up front. Think a sculptural cross between Dali's watches and Piss Christ. Then I'd franchise copies that could tour the world. What do you think? Does free speech protect me? " Yes, in the US anyway. |
| Posted by: liberalhawk 2005-07-14 16:01 |
| #11 THIS is what regular Moslems think: Saraj Qazi, a 25-year-old Muslim boutique owner in Luton, just north of London... "There's no denying it's payback for what's happened in Iraq and Afghanistan," he said. "You've been bombing people for the last two to four years, so you are going to get a backlash." SUCH statements should be cause for jail and permanent banishment. Anything more sympathetic to Moslem mass-murderers should lead to trial for treason and the death penalty. Are we waiting for them to use nukes against our cities? |
| Posted by: Kalle (kafir forever) 2005-07-14 15:01 |
| #10 Really, 2B???? I was sure that the NEA would declare it hate speech. Afterall it's not directed at white Christians and Jews. Maybe I'll have to work up a grant request. |
| Posted by: AlanC 2005-07-14 14:55 |
| #9 But you'd do well to use the funds to get a bodyguard or two as well as a teflon vest for the back and neck. (Van Gogh ring a bell?) |
| Posted by: GhostofBonzo 2005-07-14 14:29 |
| #8 What do you think? Does free speech protect me? Are you kidding? An NEA grant awaits. |
| Posted by: 2b 2005-07-14 14:20 |
| #7 "there may be more than a just a bombmaker there are motivators, masterminds, operational assistants" That is right. First some thought it was just al Qaeda, .001 of the Muslim population, and that was scary enough. While holding to that belief, some wondered why the Muslim clergy and the moderate Muslims were silent. Then some said it was the radical Wahhabi sect, and it was observed that they ran schools in the Middle East and in the US. While making these observations, some wondered why the moderate Muslim clergy was silent and why, again, were mainstream Muslims not standing up. Then some noticed that when the mainstream moderate Muslims would speak out, it was always with a caveat. "Islam condemns the the killing of innocent people, but . . .." It is then that the realization becomes clear, the mainstream Muslims are speaking out. The mainstream "moderate Muslim" fully supports the objective of the establishment of an Islamic Caliphate governed by Sharia everywhre there are Muslims - and there are Muslims everywhere. The "moderate Muslim" believes in the objective, but is afraid of the sacrifice to get there. The small minority of Muslims who truly dissent from the goals and aspirations of the jyhadists, are just afraid of the jyhadists themselves. |
| Posted by: Hank 2005-07-14 14:17 |
| #6 Why does backlash only work as an excuse for them, not for us? Because! That's why! |
| Posted by: Shipman 2005-07-14 14:15 |
| #5 I have a wonderful (to me, anyway) piece of Political art. I'd call it PorKoran. It would be an actual Koran mounted on Pigs feet, with a tail and book marks made of bacon. Maybe with some hog jowels up front. Think a sculptural cross between Dali's watches and Piss Christ. Then I'd franchise copies that could tour the world. What do you think? Does free speech protect me? |
| Posted by: AlanC 2005-07-14 14:06 |
| #4 Why does backlash only work as an excuse for them, not for us? I mean, wasn't our invasion of Afghanistan backlash against their bombing of the World Trade Center? Can we use "backlash from the London bombing" as an excuse for our next operation against terrorists? |
| Posted by: WhiteCollarRedneck 2005-07-14 13:53 |
| #3 there may be more than a just a bombmaker there are motivators, masterminds, operational assistants |
| Posted by: mhw 2005-07-14 13:36 |
| #2 I don't think many of them in the UK do either. A common theme is how they consider themselves muslim first and a citizen of the UK second. That is in keeping with being a slave to your god in a religion that provides for only one form of legitimate government. It is in keeping with a religion that goes to great length to define the "us versus them" mentality behind the faith. On that basis the killing of your own countrymen in your nation because of the foreign policy of the nation's government that is perceived to be infringing on the lands and people of your coreligionists makes perfect sense. If this is indeed a perversion of their faith it has to be pretty close to the most ugly perversion imaginable. The community has no qualms about being persistently and publically vocal about headscarfs, koran besmirching, and other issues dear to them yet this and other daily "perversions" of the first degree have received relatively little of the type of condemnation one might expect would be reserved for such an ugly affront to the faith. The public explanation of this as a "perversion" doesn't fit with the reality of what can be seen in the UK. |
| Posted by: GhostofBonzo 2005-07-14 13:29 |
| #1 Color me furious... "We've got to look at the reasoning behind these things," said Saraj Qazi, a 25-year-old Muslim boutique owner in Luton, just north of London, where police suspect the bombers gathered for their final brief journey into the British capital on July 7. "There's no denying it's payback for what's happened in Iraq and Afghanistan," he said. "You've been bombing people for the last two to four years, so you are going to get a backlash." "England is a great country and we love it to bits but do we love this government? No," Mr. Qazi said. "There were 24 Muslims killed in Iraq today; there will be more tonight and more tomorrow." Here is your "moderate, westernized" muslim. 1) Who the &*&&^* started this shooting war a lot more than 4 years ago? 2) Who the &*&&*+(&^T%TTY*)O(Y&^%&^&^ killed those 24 Muslims ( and a hell of a lot more ) in Iraq? 3) What the (^%**(($(&*&* reasoning is behind this? As far as I can tell, there is a relatively small number of actual ACTIVE Islamonazis, BUT, there is a very, very, LARGE number, maybe even a majority, that has absolutely NO problem with what is done in the name of their religion. To all those folks who say that "the solution to ending Isloterror must come from the "moderate" Muslims" I ask, "What if the MMM (mythical moderate Muslims) DON'T WANT THE TERROR TO END?? (see above) |
| Posted by: AlanC 2005-07-14 12:51 |