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| Europe |
| Morocco Bans Unislamic Names in Netherlands |
| 2009-01-30 |
| Moroccans in the Netherlands are not allowed to give their children any Berber names any more. In this way, Islamic identity is being stressed, Trouw newspaper reported yesterday. By far the biggest group of Moroccans in the Netherlands are of Berber origin, a region in the mountainous north of Morocco. "They will now be forced to give their children a Moroccan-Islamic name," according to Trouw. "Morocco wants to secure the Moroccan identity of its nationals in this way, including the Moroccan Dutch." The Moroccan government in Rabat sent all embassies and consulates abroad a list of banned name this week. Christian names were already forbidden. "We forbid Berber names because they conflict with the identity and because they open the door to the spread of meaningless names," said Idris Bajdi, a top official in Morocco, in the newspaper. Labour (PvdA) MP Samira Bouchibti, a Moroccan national (by royal Moroccan decree) like all other Moroccans who moved to or were born in the Netherlands, is angry. "We must get rid of these lists of names and this interference. I want to be able to decide myself how I name my children. This is discriminatory." Bouchibti also criticised her party leader Wouter Bos, who said at a PvdA party meeting earlier this week that dual passports "belong in the Netherlands." Bouchibti: "Bos has no enforced dual nationality and therefore does not know what it means in practice." Bos considers dual nationality can foster intergation. |
| Posted by:tipper |
| #22 Midoman: A microcosm of Islam. |
| Posted by: Lonzo Gleper2520 2009-01-30 22:35 |
| #21 Finally, you say, what would have happened if America had not been discovered... but America was discovered quite a few times. The Irish, for instance, had been fishing off Canada since the Dark Ages, and the Vikings established colonies. Bottom line, America was fated to be settled, and settled by Europeans. The Berbers were too busy with their little Mediterranean slave trade, and all the Ummah was busy scheming and murdering to rule the caliphate, China gave up looking beyond its borders during -- if I recall correctly -- the Ming Dynasty, the Indian subcontinent reeled beneath the skull-collecting Moghuls, so fond of rape that Hindu widows threw themselves on their husband's funeral pyres to protect their corpses from violation. If you go to the mosque with any regularity you know that there are sermons calling for all Jews, Hindus and Christians to be killed. If you don't, check out some of the videos at www.MEMRI.com, which shows all sorts of interesting things from around the Muslim world. Then come back and we can talk without either ignorance or taqiyah. |
| Posted by: trailing wife 2009-01-30 22:33 |
| #20 Mr. Midoman, you may hope all you wish, but it is your duty as a guest not to insult your hosts by openly insulting them. As for English being your fourth language, that does not impress here. Most of us speak several languages -- my own being English (both British and American dialects), German, Flemish and Hebrew, with a little French -- many of us speak Arabic or Farsi or Pashtu or Urdu, depending on personal need. My husband, f'r instance, speaks more or less well several varieties of Arabic including the Egyptian, Saudi and Moroccan versions -- although those he dealt with in Morocco generally chose to speak to him in French, for some reason -- and startled his Indian hosts many years ago by reading the Urdu shop signs to them. I suspect you dare not claim as much worldly accomplishment. You live in Morocco, where Arabic and French are taught in the schools, and clearly speak Berber at home. Thus your only linguistic achievement of note is the English, and clearly your grasp of history is a bit weaker than you should like, although no doubt that is due to the schooling your received, poor dear. We in America do not care about the Crusades. That happened over five hundred years ago, and we refuse to be shackled by events distant in both time and space. But if you wish to talk about wars and murder, remember that the entire Ottoman empire, including Egypt, and the entire Berber region of Africa, were originally Christian until the Arab Muslims forced the natives (those would be your very own ancestors, my dear rudeling) to choose between conversion to Islam or death. So rather you, as representative of the murdering Muslims, should apologize to us for forcing the Christians of western Europe to go to war to secure the safety of their coreligionists against the depredations of those you claim as yours. I think the psychologists refer to that as Hostage Syndrome, where the victim identifies so strongly with those who victimized him. Yes, Rome has come and gone. So too, every one of the Muslim caliphates, although your own king claims direct descent from your prophet, and their current descendants are clearly unfit to establish another. So? We do not fight to maintain American supremacy, but rather that all can live in freedom, not oppressed by a totalitarian philosophy like Communism or a totalitarian religion like the one forced upon your Christian ancestors, those who did not accept death instead. |
| Posted by: trailing wife 2009-01-30 22:25 |
| #19 Mr. al-midoman: If the your Mohammad came to earth today, would he castigate or praise bin Laden? |
| Posted by: HammerHead 2009-01-30 21:30 |
| #18 The Crusades were started because Christian pilgrims to the Holy Land were robbed and enslaved. Yes, Muslims (and Jews) were killed. Muslims did the same, not that that is an excuse. Ultimately, the Crusades were a failure, since the Muslims still retain (most of) the Holy Land. |
| Posted by: Rambler in Virginia 2009-01-30 21:30 |
| #17 com 15 "Besides, I thought the Quran preached that the world is divided into Dar sl Harb and Dar al Islam - in other words, them vs us" Is that what u think about islam and Quran? You think muslims want to kill Christians? Have you forgotten the Christians crusade in the 11-14 centuries and all the killing happened against muslims and arabs?. Anyway, with Obama, things will improve and US-muslim people relations will change for a better world. Hope so! |
| Posted by: Midoman 2009-01-30 21:09 |
| #16 You want me to apologize for what? I hope Hussein Obama will convert you all into Islam and get your penises and clitos circumcised. I loved America very much to such an extent that I learnt English which is my fourth language next to Berber, Arabic and French. But now, If I could erase English language shit from my mind, I would do it! Yet, remember that as Rome has come and gone, USA will do! |
| Posted by: Midoman 2009-01-30 20:33 |
| #15 Besides, I thought the Quran preached that the world is divided into Dar sl Harb and Dar al Islam - in other words, them vs us. How is this different from how Midoman claims America sees the world? I also second Barbara's comment - I would love it if we could bring all American military home, and the world would just leave us alone. Ain't gonna happen - not in my lifetime, probably not in my sons' lifetimes, and maybe not even in my 10 year old granddaughter's lifetime. |
| Posted by: Rambler in Virginia 2009-01-30 20:31 |
| #14 When will assholes like Midolman wake up to the fact that most Americans do not consider "cowboy" to be an insult. Do cowboys scare you, Midolman? |
| Posted by: tu3031 2009-01-30 20:16 |
| #13 Midoman dear, many of us are not Americans, and many of us are not living in America (separate but intersecting groups). So tell us, since as a Berber this is your area of expertise, how does Morocco claim the right to order those who live outside its borders what they are permitted and forbidden to name their children? What possible justification could Morocco bring to the claim that its laws overrule the laws of another independent country? You are quite right: to us it looks like Muslim imperialism, an attempt to extend the rule of the Ummah into a portion of Dar al Harb. We see so much of that attempt here, you see, by Somali cab drivers demanding the right to refuse fares who carry alcohol, or dogs, or are female; the demand at factories that Muslim employees get to take prayer breaks, stopping the lines, at times other than and in addition to the breaks scheduled for the rest of the workers; the demand that Muslim schools may teach hate of Jews and Christians and Westerners, and that jihad is incumbent upon all Muslims in Dar al Harb until the global caliphate is established, and that Israel must be destroyed and all Jews killed... So share with us, if we are wrong as you claim, what this does mean, this banning of names in another country. We are eager to learn the subtleties of which we are thus far unaware. But remember your responsibility as a guest to be courteous to your hosts, rather than rude and insulting as you were in you last post. Also remember that those you insult are highly unlikely to be persuaded by any arguments you might present. So start with an apology for your bad beginning, and then go on. |
| Posted by: trailing wife 2009-01-30 19:32 |
| #12 "what would have happended if America hadn't been discovered ... I think the world would have been a better place to live." I see midol-man is back. *yawn* Hate to be the one to tell ya', but Americans would just as soon not be involved with the rest of the world. Y'all quit attacking us and demanding our money/charity/military aid, and we'll be glad to stay home. And keep our inventions here, too. The rest of the world is welcome to live in the 17th Century (or earlier); so few of you have even bothered to invent anything at all, and a lot of you can't/won't even feed your own people - none of which is our fault. You don't like Americans, think the world would be better without us? Try living without American inventions for one day. Please. Starting with the computer and Internet you're using to vomit here. |
| Posted by: Barbara Skolaut 2009-01-30 19:24 |
| #11 Thats a'mighty SOVEREIGN of MOROCCO to decide for the Netherlands. |
| Posted by: JosephMendiola 2009-01-30 19:15 |
| #10 We are not about subduing Europe. In fact, earlier in the seventies of 20th century, Europeens came to North Africa looking for some workforces. A lot of berbers took the opportunity for a better life and traversed Gibraltar to Spain, France and Netherlands etc. Later, new generations were born and settled there. When Islam first time conquered Morocco, local Amazigh names were replaced by arab names to obliterate berber identity and give them a new arabo-islamic one. I'm not against Islam which is my beloved religion but just looking for who I am through my real culture and berber identity. When I read in comment N°1 "add them to target database", I thought you guys from USA see the world as 2 clans (friends and ennemies) and the ennemies should be destroyed. Is that your add to the universel civilisation? I wonder why people hate you! Isn't it because you think you're the ones and everybody else must submit to you. Or maybe because you think your way of life is the best and everybody else's is meaningless. Or maybe you've destroyed a millenium Mesopotamian civilisations in Irak because of zionists and oil.. What would have happended if America hadn't been discovered and produced a bunch of bastard cowboys? I think the world would have been a better place to live. |
| Posted by: Midoman 2009-01-30 19:15 |
| #9 This aint about Islam subduing europe. Its about Arabs desperately trying to keep Berbers subdued. In Morocco they cant take Berber names. What if some dual national living in Holland takes a berber name and comes back. The berber cooties will spread. Master race cant have that, now can they? who's to say it isn't about both? wahabbiism appears to be as much concerned using islam as a tool to "arabify" non-arabic moslems as it is expanding islam at all. how do you think the berbers wound up in arabic states anyway? |
| Posted by: Thing From Snowy Mountain 2009-01-30 17:01 |
| #8 The Berbers have always been trouble. Look how long it took Rome to conquer Carthage, then the problems the gnostic Christianity of the Berbers caused the Church of Rome. Thank goodness for St. Augustine, local boy made good...at least until Islam came through. |
| Posted by: trailing wife 2009-01-30 16:01 |
| #7 what #6 says. This aint about Islam subduing europe. Its about Arabs desperately trying to keep Berbers subdued. In Morocco they cant take Berber names. What if some dual national living in Holland takes a berber name and comes back. The berber cooties will spread. Master race cant have that, now can they? |
| Posted by: liberalhawk 2009-01-30 15:38 |
| #6 Berber Liberation Front, anyone? The Sahara is one huge soft underbelly. |
| Posted by: Halliburton - Mysterious Conspiracy Division 2009-01-30 15:16 |
| #5 Remember people, Netherlands = Holland. The Dutch are on a path to become the first to totally surrender to dhimmitude in Europe. The Muslim a-brains in Morocco can set any laws on Dutchmen that they want. |
| Posted by: Herman Glavique9758 2009-01-30 14:31 |
| #4 What the fuck business is it of the government of Morocco? Just tell them to go to hell & stuff their dual citizenship up their capacious assholes. If I were Moroccan Dutch, I'd be slavering for a Dutch passport, anyways. Unless I was a fucking tax cheat. |
| Posted by: Mitch H. 2009-01-30 14:19 |
| #3 They are just another islamic potentate that feels it can overrule both the will of former Moroccans and the laws Should be on a sign as you leave Virginia and enter the District. |
| Posted by: Besoeker 2009-01-30 12:19 |
| #2 Um, I don't think they are in any danger of losing their muslim heritage. |
| Posted by: bigjim-ky 2009-01-30 12:08 |
| #1 Conquest by immigration. I would immediately a) deport all Moroccan muslims to that country, or b) refute Morocco's attempt to force the issue. Nations need to learn that their writ does not extend beyond their borders, and any attempt to force the issue is an act of war. I have always considered Morocco a "special case" for their support and good will toward the United States (Morocco was the first nation to recognize the fledgling United States of America). Not any more. They are just another islamic potentate that feels it can overrule both the will of former Moroccans and the laws of other nations. Add them to the target database. |
| Posted by: Old Patriot 2009-01-30 12:07 |