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Home Front: Culture Wars
What is the deal with these riots?
2014-08-26
At a glance, as an outsider, looks like one side of America has a victim complex probably fuelled by a steady stream of low level police harassment

But that in turn is fed by the higher propensity for crime by young makes from that aforementioned group.

Looks like a difficult problem. Don't know how you can bridge the divide.

The Telegraph, UK has an interesting piece here:


Michael Brown: What the Ferguson riots tell us about race in America today


Another shooting, more riots -- and again, the US is torn apart on racial lines. Rob Crilly reports from Ferguson.

 They came to demand justice as the sun set over the Missouri suburb of Ferguson. Dawn and Chuck were white, like many of the other marchers parading up and down the town's main strip, past looted, burnt-out shops and dozens of police officers.

What set them apart was their banner. "Justice for police officer Darren Wilson," it read. They had come to demand justice not for Michael Brown, the unarmed black teenager, but for the white cop who shot him dead. They barely escaped.

Within minutes of their arrival, a crowd had formed, shouting abuse. They were gone in seconds, bundled away to safety by police. "What is the police doing," one woman screamed. "They aren't arresting them. They're helping them. Protecting their own."

The brief episode on Wednesday night was a stark reminder of America's trouble with race. Brown's death two weeks ago has led to demonstrations by day and riots at night. It has highlighted the gulf between a community on the edge of St Louis and the men and women who police it.

Across the country, it has polarised opinion between those who see a nation where white cops kill black men, and those who have donated 100,000 to a fund for Officer Wilson, or lit their porches blue to show support for the police.

More than 50 years after Martin Luther King's "I have a dream" speech, and with an African-American president well into his second term, the violence demonstrates just how sensitive the issue remains.

Markese Mull, who described himself as a friend of Brown, believes the killing was about one thing. "It's about race, much as we don't want it to be," he said, standing near the memorial of flowers, candles and balloons where the teenager died. "It is about a figure patrolling an area that he just didn't understand."
as i understand it the man had thieved a shop and was running away. Death is too high a price to pay for theft - but because everyone in the US potentially owns a gun, the coppers would be more likely to shoot first ask later
Witnesses differ on exactly what happened at midday on Saturday August 9. CCTV footage shows Brown and his friend in the Ferguson Market and Liquor Store. Brown grabs a box of cheap cigars. A member of staff tries to prevent him leaving, but is shoved into a display of crisps.
so he is a no good individual from the start
The fatal confrontation came minutes later as the pair walked down Canfield Drive. Officer Wilson ordered them out of the street on to the pavement so his car could pass.
so walking in the middle of traffic ... Could be he was on drugs? That isn't normal
A struggle followed. The police say Brown tried to grab the officer's handgun.
hearsay at this stage
A shot went off inside the car.
that is serious.... Must be he was on drugs
One witness said Wilson was enraged when Brown slipped his grasp. He gave chase and opened fire.
version 2
In contrast, Josie, a friend of the police officer, described how the 6ft 4in teenager punched Wilson in the face. As Brown fled, she said, Wilson ordered him to freeze, whereupon the 18-year-old turned and "bum-rushed" him, running full-speed into him and forcing him to shoot six times in self-defence. All the later accounts cast doubt on the original story that Brown died trying to surrender, arms in the air.
hope someone photographed in the minutes after so if his face was punched there is a contemporaneous record
Whatever the sequence, the outcome is clear: 10 days of tear gas and rubber bullets.
this is where everyone goes crazy as black people believe the system is rigged against them, from here the facts of the case don't actually matter any more. This is grudge settling. This wouldn't happen if people had faith in their police.

Now this is a problem. The police probably are targeting that community - and that is because the crime rates are probably higher. They have to do their jobs. people may have an urban sub-culture that glorifies violence and breaking the law - which in turn is encouraged by them feeling that is a rebellion against a power system they aren't a part of.

What to do? Geez it a big issue, i don't rightly know.
Posted by:Anon1

#14  good luck with your upgrades, delightful Trailing Wife!

Besoeker: very interesting. Yes indeed this is the heart of the problem. Multiculturalism doesn't work unless there is one clearly defined dominant culture that is too strong to challenge. Once smaller cultures get strong enough to challenge, they do - which is why Islamism the political dogma must be banned from the West, weeded out root and branch. Only reformation style moderate Muslims should stay - who accept the separation of mosque and state and whose religion is only a private matter for the home.

But these riots looked different to me, i mean black people have lived in the US for hundred of years so they are not new immigrants with a different culture and language.

I looked at this situation as racial conflict within one culture. having said that it is clear they have evolved a separate sub-culture on racial lines with its own speech patterns etc.

yes they have been lied to that their lot in life is all the result of racism and slavery.... this is hundreds of years on, and they're not victims any more.

Lack of education: big problem. Culture that encourages you to disrespect education and not make the most of it: bigger problem.

I have black friends from poor third world countries whose parents used to study hand-me-down charity books under street lights as they had no electricity and couldn't afford candles.

They were successful and their children are well-adjusted people living in Australia: captains of merchant ships, chefs, teachers.

That generation's children are now studying accountancy and law.

these kids in the USA would have had some shot at learning to read and write at least in primary school

that is more than my friend's parents

so what do you do? short of sending in the military?

Maybe that is what should happen

I also note there is something in the individualism of the US that lends itself to looting and rioting - which may not necessarily be a bad thing (though of course looting and rioting is). It is a willingness to defy authority

Japan: in the worst of the tsunami or any other disaster, the people will not loot anything

if you leave your wallet on a train they will give it back.

a strong civic culture - society first, self second.

the downside is uniformity and blind obedience

Posted by: anon1   2014-08-26 23:34  

#13  as i understand it the man had thieved a shop and was running away. Death is too high a price to pay for theft - but because everyone in the US potentially owns a gun, the coppers would be more likely to shoot first ask later

The cop shot for the same reason as a woman shoots an unarmed man charging at her - the 100 lb difference means Brown could have killed with his bare hands, much as an adult can easily kill the average 7-year-old using merely his fists.
Posted by: Zhang Fei   2014-08-26 17:54  

#12  Lying is sine qua non for the Democrats.
Posted by: JohnQC   2014-08-26 16:09  

#11  Besoeker, the lies are worse than that.

They were lied to by feminists when they were told fathers were unnecessary.

They were lied to when they were told there were jobs Americans won't do only to find unskilled jobs priced out of their hands.

They were lied to by unions who felt that whatever company had to meet their demands and found the companies moving to other states.

They were lied to when they were told that governmetn assistance is a right and not a safety net that you should hope to never have to use.

They were lied by their own culture when they were told that education wasn't essential in success.

Holder and Companies lies are horrific because they are trying to redirect blame for this massive failure on those that have been trying to stop it all along.
Posted by: rjschwarz   2014-08-26 14:38  

#10  Undocumented shoppers and potential Donk voters.
Posted by: JohnQC   2014-08-26 10:50  

#9  I don't seem to recall this kind of behavior tolerated among the community during segregation (a vile institution that should never come back). Of course, at that time, upper and middle class were forced to live among the lower class. The extensive amount of anti-social behavior wasn't tolerated. While the Left talks about white flight, they blind themselves to the effects of upper and middle class black flight from the very same areas. Instead they substituted government as the adult supervision in these areas forgetting the need for someone who lives there rather than a commuter who had to work among them was needed. Someone, who like the older segregated community, wouldn't accept excuses for anti-social behaviors rather then rationalize it away to avoid having to do something about it till it got too ugly and destructive to avoid.
Posted by: Procopius2k   2014-08-26 09:23  

#8  
Posted by: Besoeker   2014-08-26 09:22  

#7  PJ Media - Andrew Klavon on Culture.

American black people are being lied to and the lies destroy them. They are being lied to by corrupt people like Attorney General Eric Holder and Al Sharpton Jr. and Jesse Jackson and the leftists in our news media. They are being told that their poverty is due to prejudice and that the police are targeting them out of bigotry. They are being told that the dreadful existence of slum life grew out of slavery and is being perpetuated by hatred.
None of this is true. Poor black people are poor because they have no family structure and get little education. Police target them because so many more young black men are criminal thugs than young men of other colors. Women clutch their purses when a black man gets on an elevator not because they’re racist but because the statistics and the facts they have seen with their own eyes have taught them that that’s the wise thing to do. People aren’t suspicious of young black men in hoodies because people are ignorant or bigoted. They’re suspicious because reason and experience tell them that young black men in hoodies are threatening.

O. J. Simpson wasn’t innocent. Tawana Brawley wasn’t raped and neither was Crystal Mangum. George Zimmerman killed Trayvon Martin in self-defense. There is always racism everywhere, but America may be the least racist country on earth. For black people to think otherwise is to believe lies created to keep a narrative in place. The narrative gives the people who create it power and an appearance of virtue — Holder, Sharpton, Jackson, the news media and the rest. As for poor black people, the narrative keeps them poor and angry and helpless and so destroys their lives.

Posted by: Besoeker   2014-08-26 08:46  

#6  Now watch the youth. This is a green light to attack also for them. 10-14 year old youths will be very active and at all hours. They will destroy their own neighborhoods. They will attack anyone. When you have anything- you got to spread it around brother.
Posted by: Dale   2014-08-26 08:21  

#5  Well that took a bit of de-unicoding.
Posted by: Bright Pebbles   2014-08-26 07:49  

#4  http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=6160

Maths is impolite.
Posted by: Bright Pebbles   2014-08-26 07:45  

#3  Ferguson, Missouri is a media amplified micro-example of a larger phenomena. Policemen and judicial systems are not the problem. The problem is white policemen and white judicial systems. A Native American reservation style of law enforcement and justice [our people - our system] is the eventual goal, but we're still talking micro.

Macro examples can be found in Zimbabwe and South Africa, where so-called 'white flight' and the resulting tribal law enforcement and governance have resulted in entire cities, communities, and entire countries revert to tribalism, lawlessness, and anarchy, what I like to refer to as soft genocide.

No amount of cultural awareness, Affirmative Action (AA), Black Economic Empowerment (BEE), or flat denial by progressives can alter cultural differences and demographic shifts. As in the case of the Jew, people eventually move elsewhere and start over, simply to survive.

The irony here is, blame for failed pluralistic societies is oftentimes placed upon those who have left, not those who are now in charge who actually ran the others off. It would be somewhat comical, if it were not so tragic....and fok'n obvious.
Posted by: Besoeker   2014-08-26 05:39  

#2  Sorry for the squares dunno where they came from...

We've been having a bit of a problem with that, dear Anon1. A minor glitch in the latest upgrade.
Posted by: trailing wife   2014-08-26 05:29  

#1  Sorry for the squares dunno where they came from...
Posted by: Anon1   2014-08-26 04:50  

00:00