Article

2003-10-03 -Short Attention Span Theater-

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by Dar 2003-10-03 10:06:04 AM|| || Front Page|| [11133 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 There is an administrative out, regret I don't know what it's called because I haven't had the chance to exercise it. It applies to inheritances, etc., sudden wealth that unsuits a soldier/sailor for duty because managing that kind of money takes a lot of time, and because it's a tremendous morale and discipline buster from many perspectives. All I hope is he buys his buddies more than a box of cigars out his good fortune.

Posted by longtime lurker 2003-10-3 10:17:36 AM|| 2003-10-3 10:17:36 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 For you vets, is there a legitimate and honorable way to leave the service early because you simply want to?

-Only way I know of is what's called a hums sep which stands for humanitarian separation...
i.e. some family matter where your active duty status is totally incompatible w/the family situation - for example you are the only child w/no other family available to take care of an extremely ill parent back home or something of that ilk.

They chose to receive a lump sum payment of $88.9 million, and now plan to ask the Army for releases.

Give me a break, this soldier's Sergeant Major should be putting his boot up this idiot's ass for those comments. He doesn't want to play anymore 'cuz he's got the bucks now?! You don't ask the service to early release you because now that you're rich the Army may just inconvenience your life. He should've just said I plan on faithfully serving out the rest of my current enlistment and then I will go back to the private sector when I'm done.

Posted by Jarhead 2003-10-3 10:25:17 AM|| 2003-10-3 10:25:17 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 You don't ask the service to early release you because now that you're rich the Army may just inconvenience your life. He should've just said I plan on faithfully serving out the rest of my current enlistment and then I will go back to the private sector when I'm done.

Exactly. Make a commitment, live up to it. Okay, so a person won $88 mil; it's not going to go anywhere, and it'll be waiting for them when their stint is done.

Posted by Bomb-a-rama 2003-10-3 10:59:10 AM|| 2003-10-3 10:59:10 AM|| Front Page Top

#4 Just took a quick look through Army seperation handbook, as far as I can see, he's going to be completing his enlistment. No way out because you just got rich. The only way out would be to become a dirtbag, fatboy, etc, but since the Army knows why he's doing it, they could string out the process till his current enlistment is up. I'm sure they're just excited about getting the money and once they calm down, and the Army explains the rules to them, they'll finish their tours. I'll bet somebody told them they had heard from somebody else that a friend had told them you could get out early under some rule. Typical barracks lawyer advice.

Posted by Steve 2003-10-3 11:05:42 AM|| 2003-10-3 11:05:42 AM|| Front Page Top

#5 "I'm looking for Sgt. Moore's quarters..."
"It's the big Colonial over there, with the tennis court..."

Posted by snellenr 2003-10-3 11:10:34 AM|| 2003-10-3 11:10:34 AM|| Front Page Top

#6 There is an administrative out, regret I don't know what it's called because I haven't had the chance to exercise it. It applies to inheritances, etc., sudden wealth that

I remember something like that too. The added caveat was that you had to pay back the gubmint for training and some other expenses. Never saw it put to use though. But with over $80M in the back pocket I think he can handle that.

Posted by Bubblehead 2003-10-3 12:07:24 PM|| 2003-10-3 12:07:24 PM|| Front Page Top

#7 Long Time Lurker >> I've heard that as well. If you come into money that is "X" amount times what you make you get discharged.

The reason is simple. It's disruptive to the order and discipline of the unit. The soldier could simply disobey superiors, miss duty, fail PT tests, be overweight, etc. Until they chapter them out.
Besides, aside from being put in jail, there's nothing the Army can do that they can hold over their head. (IE: Dishonorable discharge or an Article 15, come on.)

Jarhead >> I understand your initial disgust, but look at it this way. They DID serve their country. Whereas many thousands of chickensh!t scumbags walking around the US want all of their "freedoms" on a free meal ticket.

Let's face it. Their mommies and daddies most likely aren't the Rockefellers. You'll know, if you've served, that the military isn't going to make you any real money. Most people do it for family tradition, patriotism, or simply to get away from a bad situation (crime, gangs, etc.) I wish them the all the best. I guess I just like to see an average Joe get his day.

Posted by Paul 2003-10-3 12:29:09 PM|| 2003-10-3 12:29:09 PM|| Front Page Top

#8 Here's another way to solve the problem -- have a big poker game out at the barracks!

Posted by Chris Smith 2003-10-3 12:45:36 PM|| 2003-10-3 12:45:36 PM|| Front Page Top

#9 There are lots of ways to get out 'honorably' from the service. Administrative is the best fit in this circumstance. A guy I was stationed with in Greece (80âs) inherited a couple mil from a rich aunt. The Air Force asked him if he wanted to get out before he had to ask them. Now this guy only being an E2/E3 so that may make a difference. I also knew an E5 in California (90âs) that made a ton of money in the stock market. He liked the Air Force and still in as far as I know (weirdo). My guess is that the Army will let him go on Admin/Convenience grounds.

Posted by Dear Leader Kin Jing Ill 2003-10-3 1:03:48 PM|| 2003-10-3 1:03:48 PM|| Front Page Top

#10 He won't get out, and by the time he does the wife will have skipped with the loot.

BWahahahahahaha!

Posted by john 2003-10-3 1:14:48 PM|| 2003-10-3 1:14:48 PM|| Front Page Top

#11 Jarhead >> I understand your initial disgust, but look at it this way. They DID serve their country.

Paul - my response:

-Then let them finish serving their country.

Whereas many thousands of chickensh!t scumbags walking around the US want all of their "freedoms" on a free meal ticket.

-I agree about the scumbag part. I respect your opinion & see your pragmaticism but disagree in pure principle. One doesn't justify poor behavior based on someone else's poor behavior.

Let's face it. Their mommies and daddies most likely aren't the Rockefellers.

-Doesn't matter who they are, Moore made a commitment to the country - he should honor that commitment. No one's taking any money from them. My point is when you raise your right hand and swear to support and defend the constitution of the U.S. against all enemies foreign and domestic there's no clause saying "in case of lotto ticket and windfall we will void any past promises you made & forget about your oath of office and contract with the American people..."

The soldier could simply disobey superiors, miss duty, fail PT tests, be overweight, etc. Until they chapter them out. Besides, aside from being put in jail, there's nothing the Army can do that they can hold over their head.

-Let him. There's a thing called a brig and a bad conduct discharge. Maybe it won't matter to him because he's rich and may never need a job but let him live w/being a scumbag and shirker. However, if a supposed soldier can live w/shirking his load and acting like an ass because he got some cash then that's on him the rest of his life.

Posted by Jarhead 2003-10-3 1:29:56 PM|| 2003-10-3 1:29:56 PM|| Front Page Top

#12 Seems to me that if the US had an obligatory conscription process going, it'd make sense not to allow anyone to leave because of money suddenly earned...

But since the US army is currently an all-voluntary force, I think it'd make sense to give people the opportunity to exchange the remainder of their service for cash. E.g. let him pay to the US government the money he would have normally earned during the time remaining to him. Or perhaps twice the amount of money he would have normally earned. Details could be worked out.

Posted by Aris Katsaris 2003-10-3 1:55:25 PM|| 2003-10-3 1:55:25 PM|| Front Page Top

#13 Actually, Aris, there used to be a proceedure for that many years ago. It faded away along with the laws that permitted the raising of privately paid for military units. The Brits used to do that all the time, and the US military continued the tradition until after the American Civil war. Once the Uniform Code of Military Justice was created to be the legal standard for the uniform services of the USA, it vanished.

This was mostly due to distrust. A number of such privately raised military units had problems with discipline during the Civil War, as their loyalties were inclined towards the officers who paid them, not the nation as a whole.

As a result, such semi-private units, naval privateers, mercenary companies, and the right to buy your way out of military service began to fade away.

Ed.

Posted by Ed Becerra 2003-10-3 5:42:56 PM|| 2003-10-3 5:42:56 PM|| Front Page Top

#14 Aris has a brilliant idea though if we wanted covert revenge on another sovereign nation; we could just allow a company to do the dirty...
(Logan Act falls from the heavens, strikes me dead)

Posted by Brian 2003-10-3 6:17:03 PM|| 2003-10-3 6:17:03 PM|| Front Page Top

#15 How much does a letter of Marque cost these days?

Posted by Shipman 2003-10-3 7:26:27 PM|| 2003-10-3 7:26:27 PM|| Front Page Top

#16 The reason is simple. It's disruptive to the order and discipline of the unit.

Had I been in this guy's shoes, I would not have asked outright for release. I would simply carry on with the intention of serving out the rest of my obligatory time. I mean, when a person signs up, it is for X years, right? Now if the military brass sees fit to discharge me anyway under the regulation that you state above, then it all works out - I get to leave before my time is up, but more importantly, I leave with honor.

Posted by Bomb-a-rama 2003-10-3 8:15:47 PM|| 2003-10-3 8:15:47 PM|| Front Page Top

#17 Shipman---The use of Letters of Marque was discontinued by many countries who signed the Declaration of Paris in 1856. The United States as well as several other countries signed the International Treaty much later. Beside$, the happy couple i$ in the army. If they joined the navy, though....LOL!

Posted by Alaska Paul 2003-10-3 9:40:09 PM|| 2003-10-3 9:40:09 PM|| Front Page Top

#18 ...FWIW, USAF policy in the early 80s - and to the best of my knowledge, remaining unchanged - was that if you Hit the Jackpot, you were on your way home and you had no choice in the matter. The reasoning was, quite simply, the USAF simply had no hold on you any more. Even the most dedicated troop with an eight-figure bank account would think twice about accepting those orders to Boondockia AB in Southern Slobbovia, and if he said no, what was the AF going to do - throw him out? He could quite simply laugh in their face if he was so inclined. Another problem was that if he did take the orders to Boondockia - a 1 year, remote, UNACCOMPANIED tour - all he had to do was write a check that he wouldn't even notice to insure that he lived in comparative luxury off base with his spouse and family, while everybody else got to line up at the phone booth once every couple of weeks or wait for a letter. I know from personal experience that this happened at Kunsan while I was there 84-85 - an A1C who came into a six-figure inheritance brought his teen wife over and they lived in what passed for a luxury home in Kunsan proper, and it didn't go over well at all with the troops who were living in the 30-year old collapsible dorms on base with cold and cold running water.
Let the guy go - if his first thought was to ask to leave, the Army doesn't want him.

Mike

Posted by Mike Kozlowski 2003-10-4 12:07:25 AM|| 2003-10-4 12:07:25 AM|| Front Page Top

19:16 Goober Pyle
10:12 Some Old Guy
01:48 JAB
00:43 Anonymous
00:31 True German Ally
00:07 Mike Kozlowski
00:04 Dishman
23:36 GregJ
23:33 Robert Crawford
23:21 A Jackson
23:21 Old Patriot
23:14 Fred
23:10 Penguin
23:07 Super Hose
23:01 Super Hose
22:59 Super Hose
22:58 Steve
22:56 Super Hose
22:52 Old Patriot
22:51 Super Hose
22:48 Old Patriot
22:48 Ernest Brown
22:47 Super Hose
22:44 Jarhead