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2003-12-19 Europe

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Posted by Fred Pruitt 2003-12-19 00:08|| || Front Page|| [1 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 Wasn't Egon Krenz one of the Ghostbusters?

Posted by Pete Stanley 2003-12-19 2:22:41 AM|| 2003-12-19 2:22:41 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 Image of editorial cartoon, timely a decade-odd back: Outline map of Germany (E and W) with Wall between. To the west, crowded with heads. To the east, emptiness except ladders laid up against the Wall. Comment rising:

Well, we achieved German reunification, but not quite the way we intended.

But the Germans are still wrestling with this, socially and economically, and will for another generation or so. Don't let 'em kid you.

Posted by Glenn (not Reynolds) 2003-12-19 2:36:51 AM|| 2003-12-19 2:36:51 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 I kinda disagree, Fred. Egon wasn't "human" enough (the Stasi had the concentration camps already set up), he was just overwhelmed and Gorbachev had made it very clear that the Soviets would provide no help.

If they wanted to crush the protesters they missed the right time anyway. Once you have one million in Leipzig tanks won't help you anymore.

Krenz was not human, he was just clueless. Oh well, who cares.

He bears responsibility for the people killed at the Iron Curtain but at that time the guys who controlled everything were the Soviets. Krenz (and Honecker) would not have sneezed without Soviet permission.

Krenz has tried to glorify himself by saying that he didn't want to kill thousands. How pathetic is that?

Especially if the thousands would probably have killed him in the end. After violent repression (without Soviet backup) East Germans could very well have "pulled a Ceausescu" on Krenz and Honecker.

Posted by True German Ally 2003-12-19 1:37:48 PM|| 2003-12-19 1:37:48 PM|| Front Page Top

#4 TGA, what is your take on why there was massive looting after the fall of Baghdad but only isolated assasination of Baathists? I understand that there were plenty of assinations in Basra after Kuwait was liberated.

Posted by Super Hose 2003-12-19 2:32:00 PM|| 2003-12-19 2:32:00 PM|| Front Page Top

#5 I can only guess: But the fact is that so many ministeries were stormed makes me suspicious. I guess lots of Baathists used (or even instigated) lootings to burn as many documents as possible. The Stasi "stormed" the building in Normannenstrasse along with the protestors and while the protestors tore apart any paper the Stasi destroyed what was really important. They knew where to look for it. Many armoured safes were opened without violence.

And I suppose that despite the tumbling of statues many Baghdadis weren't so sure about the end of the Baathist regime. And compared to Basra Baghdadis lived rather ok with the Baathists while people in Basra hated them with passion.

In Basra the Baathists were the oppressors from outside, in Baghdad the front was less defined. From what I heard scores are being settled in Baghdad, too, and quite a few robberies and murders are in fact assassinations.

Posted by True German Ally 2003-12-19 2:55:40 PM|| 2003-12-19 2:55:40 PM|| Front Page Top

06:04 Mark Hart
15:33 ed
12:56 Daniel King
23:58 PBMcL
23:54 Les Nessman
23:37 OldSpook
23:09 Gasse Katze
22:56 Gasse Katze
22:55 Super Hose
22:51 Super Hose
22:47 Alaska Paul
22:41 ed
22:40 Vic
22:39 Super Hose
22:30 JP
22:20 Super Hose
22:18 Super Hose
22:11 Super Hose
22:10 Matt
22:06 Glenn (not Reynolds)
21:56 True German Ally
21:55 Super Hose
21:52 Super Hose
21:47 Glenn (not Reynolds)