Article

2004-04-02 Fifth Column

Mainstream Left Blog Gloats Over American Deaths in Fallujah

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Posted by Steve White 2004-04-02 10:15:05 AM|| || Front Page|| [1 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 Kos isn't the only one. Commenters at the Democratic Underground and Hesiod are referring to civillian contractors as "mercenaries" and all but gloating over the Falluja atrocity. Respected opinion journalist Eric Alterman thinks we deserved it and it's all Bush's fault.

Posted by Mike 2004-04-02 10:35:42 AM|| 2004-04-02 10:35:42 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 This should be under Fifth Column.

Posted by Steve from Relto 2004-04-02 10:40:13 AM|| 2004-04-02 10:40:13 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 This should be under Fifth Column.

Done.

What really bothers me: the Left sees four Americans working in Iraq to ensure the security of food deliveries as "mercenaries". I thought a mercenary was a man carrying a rifle in the service of another country or cause. These are Americans working for us!

Posted by Steve White 2004-04-02 10:43:05 AM|| 2004-04-02 10:43:05 AM|| Front Page Top

#4 I understand your anger gents, but I wouldn't get too worked up about these idiots - one, you can't change their thinking, two, they're fucking morons who spout off tired rhetoric without any logic - so who cares. At most, I'd say long on to their blogs as a sort of muck4doo style satirist and clown on them all day long or until they cut out your posting ability.

Posted by Jarhead 2004-04-02 11:19:41 AM|| 2004-04-02 11:19:41 AM|| Front Page Top

#5 We are now the Bleeding Heart Conservatives, while they are the cold-hearted, socialist Left.

Posted by eLarson 2004-04-02 11:24:15 AM|| 2004-04-02 11:24:15 AM|| Front Page Top

#6 DU and Hesiod arent mainstream, theyre widely reviled in the "center" Alterman aint particularly mainstream either. Doubt any of them wanted Kerry over Dean. Not sure about Kos - some folks seem to think hes mainstream - i never read him - Josh Marshall is as much as I can take, and dont like him all that much.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 11:24:17 AM|| 2004-04-02 11:24:17 AM|| Front Page Top

#7 Michelle of "A Small Victory" has still more from the DU feverswamps.

'Hawk, I don't think DU, Kos, Hesiod, or Alterman are anywhere near the mainstream of U.S. opinion. Unfortunately, they are in the mainstream of opninion of the people who run the Democratic Party.

Posted by Mike 2004-04-02 11:28:47 AM|| 2004-04-02 11:28:47 AM|| Front Page Top

#8 Odd, LH, how those folks outside the mainstream sound just like most of the Democrats who ran for president.

Posted by Robert Crawford 2004-04-02 11:35:09 AM|| [http://www.kloognome.com/] 2004-04-02 11:35:09 AM|| Front Page Top

#9 I agree with LH: these guys aren't mainstream Democrats.

Posted by Matt 2004-04-02 11:45:15 AM|| 2004-04-02 11:45:15 AM|| Front Page Top

#10 Blogger Michael Friedman has a great idea on how to introduce Kos to the concept that actions have consequences.

Posted by Mike 2004-04-02 12:56:15 PM|| 2004-04-02 12:56:15 PM|| Front Page Top

#11 I also agree with LH. Most Democrats have no idea that Democratic Underground even exists. They have never heard of Eric Alterman. Actually, I am willing to bet that a sizable number of them don't know who John Kerry is. Most Americans just aren't all that political. They aren't members of the "chattering class," nor do they wish to be.

Case in point: my 82-year-old grandmother is a lifelong Democrat. Why? Because her personal experiences during the Great Depression have convinced her that Republicans equal greed and suffering. Nevermind evidence to the contrary. She doesn't know or care very much about the finer points of John Kerry's politics either, nor the growing anti-semetism of the American left, or even the American left itself. She's picked her political brand and that's how she's voted for the last half century.

Really, she is the typical American Democrat, not Kos.

Posted by Secret Master 2004-04-02 1:04:48 PM|| [www.budgetwarrior.com] 2004-04-02 1:04:48 PM|| Front Page Top

#12 My Dad (lifelong Democrat, successful candidate for public office, and retired judge) is the same sort of Democrat as Granny Secret (or is that Granny Master?[:-)]), and I never meant to imply otherwise. The problem is that the Party isn't in control of people like that (or people like our dear friend Liberalhawk, for that matter)--it's in the control of people who are, in the aggregate, uncomfortably too much like Kos.

Posted by Mike 2004-04-02 1:18:15 PM|| 2004-04-02 1:18:15 PM|| Front Page Top

#13 I think Secret Master is absolutely spot-on about ordinary, mainstream Democrats. I was one of them until a year ago, though I'd voted for Reagan in '80 and '84 and for Bush in '88. But until recently I was largely apolitical and non-ideological; I just voted for whoever I "felt" would probably do the best job. Even those mainstream Democrats who are more strongly political than I was vote the way they do mostly out of a sense of tradition, I suspect.

But the leadership of the Democratic Party is another story and I have come to view them, like Kos, the Indymediots and the DUers, as sociopaths. They seem incapable of understanding that other people are actually living, thinking, feeling human beings. Where most of us have some empathy for our fellows these people appear to have... just a black void.

Something is deeply wrong with them.

Posted by Dave D. 2004-04-02 1:18:50 PM|| 2004-04-02 1:18:50 PM|| Front Page Top

#14 SM - That's not at all comforting, not that that was your point! And I have known people who mirror your description perfectly. Habitual voters (read: those who've picked their political brand) and anyone who would ever vote straight-party, regardless of the party, makes a mockery of the citizen's duty. I won't vote in a race where I feel I haven't sufficient information - and I'm sure I'm one of the slowest voters due to wading through page after page in the ballot to locate those where I feel competent enough to register my choice. It's hard to recall that far back, but prior to the League of Women Voters' pre-election newspaper supplements, and now the Internet, I was limited to voting in only a fraction of the races.

Posted by .com 2004-04-02 1:21:58 PM|| 2004-04-02 1:21:58 PM|| Front Page Top

#15 The democratic "establishment" includint McAullife, the Clintons, etc, not to mention the DLC all favored Kerry over Dean. Gore being the main exception. Alterman im sure favored Dean over Kerry. I presume DU and Hesiod did too - again i dont follow those blogs, you'll have to fill me in. Not sure about Kos.

RC - why do they sound like mainstream Dems - perhaps cause they keep saying Bush shouldnt be reelected. Kinda like everyone from anti-Israel Robert Novak to pro-Irael Charles Krauthammer attack Kerry, Clark, etc. Doesnt prove that Kraut and Novak share views on the middle east - just they agree on who should be president. Same applies to DU, Hesiod, et al

If we had proportional rep in the US we could all vote for our little micro party that agreed with us on everything. WE dont. On other forums than this, Im seen as a conservative, cause i support the war in IRaq, treating the WOT as a war, and i have nice things to say about Ariel Sharon and the Patriot Act. To those folks, im saying the same things Bush is saying. And i may yet vote for Bush. But I beleive in national govt provided health insurance - does that prove that Bush supports it??? No, of course not. Use logic, people.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 1:32:32 PM|| 2004-04-02 1:32:32 PM|| Front Page Top

#16 But I beleive in national govt provided health insurance

LH, I'd look carefully at health provision in countries where such a 'service' is provided by the state, and consider: a) is it better than the US's?; b) is it more efficient?; c) which system has advanced human health, in terms of basic research and pioneering techniques, more than the other? Like so many issues, nationalised health sounds sooo good until you actually have to live with it.

I speak as someone in a first world country with government-run, socialised healthcare that is universally acknowledged as far inferior to America's (the remaining debate is whether it's 'catching up' or 'falling behind' - if it's catching up, it's doing it slower every year). Inefficient, ludicrously bureaucratic and embarrassingly third-rate. I say: drop the ideology, and just look at the evidence.

Posted by Bulldog 2004-04-02 1:47:37 PM|| 2004-04-02 1:47:37 PM|| Front Page Top

#17 im not for a brit style national health service, but something more like a canadian or German single payer system, with health provision still private.

I assume that even Tony Blair wouldnt be for the NHS if UK was starting from scratch, would he? NHS is an institutional legacy from another time, you folks seem to be stuck with.

And my main point was not to debate health care here - it was to point out that A says X, and B says X, ergo A believes everything B believes is a fallacy.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 1:51:10 PM|| 2004-04-02 1:51:10 PM|| Front Page Top

#18 Brother 'Hawk, we are more in agreement than either of us realized. I wish the looney left would get out of the way and let the folks like you and Dad and Secret Granny* take over so the Dems could be a responsible center-left party again; it would be healthy for the country.

*-Too cool a moniker not to use. No offense to your Grandma intended, SM.

Posted by Mike 2004-04-02 1:51:11 PM|| 2004-04-02 1:51:11 PM|| Front Page Top

#19 LH/Mike

I would also like to see a responsible center-left party again. Now consider how many votes Liberman got (the center-left). Compare it with the combined votes of Dean, Sharpton, Kucinich and Clark (the hard left). Compare it to Kerry and Edwards (the uber pander left).

Ouch.

Posted by mhw 2004-04-02 2:41:47 PM|| 2004-04-02 2:41:47 PM|| Front Page Top

#20 Sorry, LH, you can't convince me. There is no firewall between people like Kos and the Democrat party; Kerry has repeated some of the feverish conspiracies folks like Kos embrace and promote. Hell, the idiotic "Bush AWOL" lie didn't get national press notice until McAuliffe brought it up.

How can you act like there is a vast gulf between loons like Kos and the party when the party chairman repeats the same slanderous lies?

Posted by Robert Crawford 2004-04-02 2:43:40 PM|| [http://www.kloognome.com/] 2004-04-02 2:43:40 PM|| Front Page Top

#21 the demographics simply dont exist for the kind of left that mike and mhw and i would like - that kind of center left was strong when the US had a large base of unionized blue collar workers (not that every blue collar union shared those politics) The class structure (dare i use such words here?) has changed, there is no longer the class basis for that kind of politics. But I will stand by my beliefs anyway.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 2:45:45 PM|| 2004-04-02 2:45:45 PM|| Front Page Top

#22 so if the RNC repeats something juicy that Pat Robertson brings up, that proves that the RNC beleieves everything Robertson does? dont think so.

try this A doesnt like C. B also doesnt like C. B comes up with something juicy to attack C. A repeats the juicy item. Ergo A agrees with everything B beleives. I leave it to students of logic to analyze.

Try this - some of the things Islamists say about the "evil US imperialists" are the same things Slobodan Milosevich says. Does it follow that Slobo is an Islamist?

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 2:49:41 PM|| 2004-04-02 2:49:41 PM|| Front Page Top

#23 LH, you're both more conservative and more liberal than you think :-)

I have no problem with the notion that many, many Democrats disagree with Kos, the DU, etc. My mother-in-law is a "yellow dog Democrat", and despite my pleas she'll prolly vote for Kerry this fall out of habit.

The problem is that mainstream Democrats just aren't slapping down their goofs with enough gusto. The Repubs had this problem in the early '90's, and it cost GHWB an election. The Repubs finally go their goofs under control (for the most part), and it made them a better party.

We need a sane, responsible, vibrant center-left Democratic party. Right now we don't have one, and that's sad.

Posted by Steve White 2004-04-02 3:04:55 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:04:55 PM|| Front Page Top

#24 LH, you're both more conservative and more liberal than you think :-)

I have no problem with the notion that many, many Democrats disagree with Kos, the DU, etc. My mother-in-law is a "yellow dog Democrat", and despite my pleas she'll prolly vote for Kerry this fall out of habit.

The problem is that mainstream Democrats just aren't slapping down their goofs with enough gusto. The Repubs had this problem in the early '90's, and it cost GHWB an election. The Repubs finally go their goofs under control (for the most part), and it made them a better party. We need a sane, responsible, vibrant center-left Democratic party. Right now we don't have one, and that's sad.

Posted by Steve White 2004-04-02 3:05:12 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:05:12 PM|| Front Page Top

#25 *sigh*

Never mind, LH.

Posted by Robert Crawford 2004-04-02 3:06:46 PM|| [http://www.kloognome.com/] 2004-04-02 3:06:46 PM|| Front Page Top

#26 Mike:
None taken. I think that my grandmother would enjoy being known as "Secret Granny."

Posted by Secret Master 2004-04-02 3:07:37 PM|| [www.budgetwarrior.com] 2004-04-02 3:07:37 PM|| Front Page Top

#27 Mike:
None taken. I think that my grandmother would enjoy being known as "Secret Granny."

Posted by Secret Master 2004-04-02 3:07:44 PM|| [www.budgetwarrior.com] 2004-04-02 3:07:44 PM|| Front Page Top

#28 steve white - do you read Oxblog?

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 3:11:15 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:11:15 PM|| Front Page Top

#29 steve makes an interesting point.

When David Duke ran as a Republican, the mainstream Republicans denounced him. When Sharpton ran as a Dem, the mainstream Dems embraced him (not to mention the mainstream media). Republican fund raisers extract money from the management class of corporate American and some from working class also. The big givers to the Dems are the entertainment industry stars, trial lawyers, the guilt ridden rich.

Posted by mhw 2004-04-02 3:12:32 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:12:32 PM|| Front Page Top

#30 I wouldnt say they embraced him, but they didnt denounce him. Duke doesnt represent a constituency as large and (dare i say) as thin skinned as Sharpton does.

BTW, the dems also raise money form corporate america. Clinton raised money from silicon valley, and so did Lieberman. Clinton also raised money from investment banker, like those at Goldman Sachs.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 3:21:39 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:21:39 PM|| Front Page Top

#31 heres what armed liberal at winds of change has to say about Fallujah;

Falluja, Again
Armed Liberal

The pictures and story from Falluja are horrible. As we should, we recoil from the rage and inhumanity of the actions that led to them, and try to figure out how to respond. On one of my email lists, the discussion is between those who want to respond with massive destruction and those who - equally hopeless about the future of Iraq - want to simply leave.

I'll offer the photo linked here (note that it is slightly, but not horribly, graphic) as evidence why we shouldn't do either.

Note the dateline: Marietta, GA, 1915. That's where Leo Frank was brutally lynched.

In case you think those horrors are in our distant past, I'll suggest that Andrew Goodman, James Chaney and Michael Schwerner would probably feel differently - if they were alive.

While some might disagree, I think I can safely say that the American South is, today, civilized.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 3:22:46 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:22:46 PM|| Front Page Top

#32 That is who these people are now and by that I mean the "Democratic Wing of the Democratic Party"--to them, the people who died working in the WTC on 9/11 deserved death also because they were feeding the capitalist system to make evil (and "Jewish") profits to feed the "military industrial complex."
Their aims are virtually inseparable from the Islamist terrorists except that the terrorists at least have a semblance of a religion.
The DemoncRATS will say and do anything, including walk over innumerable corpses, to get power and money.
They worship themselves and getting the world back to the way it was on 9/10.
The kind of old-fashioned Democrat described so often above barely exists anymore and Sen. Zell Miller has said as much.
These people are evil; you can tell because their stock in trade is LIES and they delight in the deaths of their fellow men and women.
This isn't the first time they've done this.
Dave D. is a former Dim so he knows whereof he speaks.
They have a black void where their hearts and souls should be.
How we share a country with these people is beyond me.
It's ugly and evil and I'm sick of hearing their sh*t and living in the cesspool they try to make this country into.
It's not the America I know and love, but they have the media microphone (including a good part of the blogosphere) and so it's the America they bully a good part of the world to accept.
It's a sacrilege, a horror, and a complete outrage that these nihilists threaten to destroy everthing good and decent and enduring to get their power back and keep it!
Michael Savage was right: Liberalism is a mental illness and a disease and should be treated as such.
Embrace their ideaology, aims and rhetoric at your peril!

Posted by Jen 2004-04-02 3:25:29 PM|| [http://www.greatestjeneration.com] 2004-04-02 3:25:29 PM|| Front Page Top

#33 Comeon Jen, tell us how you really feel!

Don't hold back!

Posted by CrazyFool 2004-04-02 3:30:23 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:30:23 PM|| Front Page Top

#34 Sorry, CF--I know it was a rant, but I really *hate* these people.
I think they are monsters and they've made the world we live in a miserable place.

Posted by Jen 2004-04-02 3:34:51 PM|| [http://www.greatestjeneration.com] 2004-04-02 3:34:51 PM|| Front Page Top

#35 LH:im not for a brit style national health service, but something more like a canadian...

If you had to wait two weeks to see your family doctor, a month to see a specialist, and more months for specialized tests using old equipment, you'd quickly change your mind. That's assuming you live in a big metropolitan area; out in the boonies...you're on your own. BTW, Buffalo MRI, just across the lake from Toronto, is doing a booming business. They even have radio ads thanking all their Canadian customers! Yup, my kind of health care.

Posted by Rafael 2004-04-02 3:40:01 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:40:01 PM|| Front Page Top

#36 Raf - im not going to debate health care here. I was giving an example.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 3:47:40 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:47:40 PM|| Front Page Top

#37 Here, by the way, is what John Kerry actually said about Fallujah

My deepest sympathies are with the families of those lost today. Americans know that all who serve in Iraq - soldier and civilian alike - do so in an effort to build a better future for Iraqis. These horrific attacks remind us of the viciousness of the enemies of Iraq's future. United in sadness, we are also united in our resolve that these enemies will not prevail."

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 3:48:37 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:48:37 PM|| Front Page Top

#38 I was giving an example.

Give a better one next time.

Posted by Rafael 2004-04-02 3:50:53 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:50:53 PM|| Front Page Top

#39 "Dave D. is a former Dim so he knows whereof he speaks."

Gaaaaack! I was not!!!! I was a former Dem, not a former Dim! Gee willikers...

As to LH, a few posts back he seemed to be characterizing the Dem leadership and their public advocates as merely arguing that Bush shouldn't be re-elected. Sorry, but that's not what I've been hearing from them. What I have been hearing, from mainstream Democrats, is that Bush BETRAYED the country; that he is a MISERABLE FAILURE; that all of America (except Bush's corporate fat-cat cronies) is SUFFERING THE WORST ECONOMY OF THE LAST FIFTY YEARS; that our work in Iraq is an ABSOLUTE DISASTER; that Republicans are RAPING the environment; and so on and so forth.

Sorry, but the attacks on 9/11 abruptly reduced my tolerance for dishonest bullshit to absolute zero. And dishonest bullshit is all I've heard out of Democrats for the last two and a half years.

I can understand the desire to have a healthy center-left political party; but I don't think it's going to evolve out of today's Democrats.

Posted by Dave D. 2004-04-02 3:51:44 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:51:44 PM|| Front Page Top

#40 So do as every Republican here share Jens beliefs? If not, why think every Dem shares Kos' beleifs?

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 3:51:45 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:51:45 PM|| Front Page Top

#41 well gee,DD, what did you expect them to say, Bush is the greatest president of all time, but we're against him anyway??? Sure many mainstream dems demonize Bush - didnt many mainstream Reps demonize Clinton? Isnt demonizing your opponent a grand tradition in american politics going back to the Federalists and the Jeffersonians??? Again how does Terry McAuliffe (say) agreeing with Kos that Bush is a miserable failure, imply that he agrees with Kos about deaths in Iraq???? Where the men mutilated in Iraq named Bush??? If Kos beleives that its smart to drive without seatbelts, does that imply that McAullife beleives the same.

Again A beleives X, and B believes X and B beleives Y DOES NOT IMPLY that A beleives Y. This is elementary logic.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 3:58:02 PM|| 2004-04-02 3:58:02 PM|| Front Page Top

#42 "So do as every Republican here share Jens beliefs? If not, why think every Dem shares Kos' beleifs?"
Lh, maybe because most of the crew over at DUH Underground say the same thing Kos does...and worse.
And I'm an American. before I'm a Republican,
I'm a Republican because I love the America of our Founding Fathers.

Dave D., sorry! Color yourself and Zell Miller two of the last remaining"Truman Democrats."

Posted by Jen 2004-04-02 3:59:12 PM|| [http://www.greatestjeneration.com] 2004-04-02 3:59:12 PM|| Front Page Top

#43 Arik Sharon believes that it was right to kill Yassin. Liberalhawk believes it was right to kill Yassin. Arik Sharon beleives that Israel should keep about 40% of the West Bank - Ergo LH believes that Israel should keep about 40% of the West Bank - NO!

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 4:00:14 PM|| 2004-04-02 4:00:14 PM|| Front Page Top

#44 Jen - i never said Democratic Underground didnt share Kos' beliefs. Who said DU represented the mainstream of the Democratic party. Just cause they managed to register that name doesnt give them the right to speak for Dems - does this site speak for all Rants? Do you speak for the entire WW2 generation?

Raf - any example i picked would have been a domestic issue on which i disagree with most here, and would not be suitable for debate here.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 4:03:08 PM|| 2004-04-02 4:03:08 PM|| Front Page Top

#45 "well gee,DD, what did you expect them to say, Bush is the greatest president of all time, but we're against him anyway???"

Please point out what it is, in what I wrote above, that suggests I would expect any such thing from them.

Actually, I'd be satisfied if they would simply refrain from demagoguing every goddamn issue to death with breathless, hate-filled, over-the-top hyperbole, particularly the entire issue of our struggle against Islamic totalitarianism.

Jen: all is forgiven.

Posted by Dave D. 2004-04-02 4:21:26 PM|| 2004-04-02 4:21:26 PM|| Front Page Top

#46 id be happy with less demagoguing from both sides, but this sort of thing has been going on from both sides for years.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-04-02 4:26:38 PM|| 2004-04-02 4:26:38 PM|| Front Page Top

#47 Again how does Terry McAuliffe (say) agreeing with Kos that Bush is a miserable failure, imply that he agrees with Kos about deaths in Iraq????

Way to miss the point! Did you do that on purpose?

It's not that McAuliffe says Bush is a failure, it's that McAuliffe repeats the lie about Bush having been AWOL. It's as if the Republican Chairman had started reading the "Clinton Death List" on "Meet the Press".

Posted by Robert Crawford 2004-04-02 4:50:09 PM|| [http://www.kloognome.com/] 2004-04-02 4:50:09 PM|| Front Page Top

#48 By the way, LGF is reporting that Kos has taken down his post and tried to wipe all traces of it.
So apparently Kos is not even a mainstream human being.

Posted by Matt 2004-04-02 4:59:17 PM|| 2004-04-02 4:59:17 PM|| Front Page Top

#49 Several Democratic candidates who had an ad on the Daily Kos blog were contacted by conserned Bloggers and commenters and these Democratic candidates have retracted their ads. There is a war going on the Blogosphere. And Daily Kos is the bitten dog. He desereves it after his disgusting comments.

im read that somewhere but dont know if its true.

Posted by muck4doo 2004-04-02 5:03:47 PM|| [http://www.peta.org/feat/hiddenlives/index.html] 2004-04-02 5:03:47 PM|| Front Page Top

#50 Quote from James Taranto's Best Of The Web today:

It's worth noting that the Daily Kos is popular among Democratic leaders. Zuniga is a principal in the Armstrong Zuniga political consulting firm, which touts the Daily Kos as "the most popular political weblog with over 3 million monthly visits." Friedman has a list of congressional candidates who advertise on the site, and in a February posting Zuniga reported that Terry McAuliffe, chairman of the Democratic National Committee, "asked if I would post" a "Message to Blog Community."

Too many of them are drinking that damned Kool-Aid, and no good can come from it--either for the Party, or for the country.

Posted by Dave D. 2004-04-02 5:16:42 PM|| 2004-04-02 5:16:42 PM|| Front Page Top

#51 Jesus H. Christ and his half brother harold... leave Liberalhawk alone people! He's our friend! He's also one of our best posters. If you tick him off and he goes away our collective IQ drops by about 10 points!

Posted by Secret Master 2004-04-02 5:19:01 PM|| [www.budgetwarrior.com] 2004-04-02 5:19:01 PM|| Front Page Top

#52 SM - So, um, you're saying he's not responsible for what he posts? C'mon.

Posted by .com 2004-04-02 5:21:47 PM|| 2004-04-02 5:21:47 PM|| Front Page Top

#53 Kos isn't completely anonymous. His name is Markos Moulitsas Zuniga (hat tip Instapundit).

Posted by spiffo 2004-04-02 5:49:01 PM|| 2004-04-02 5:49:01 PM|| Front Page Top

#54 oops - that hat tip should have been to Opinion Journal . . . too many damn open windows.

Posted by spiffo 2004-04-02 5:51:27 PM|| 2004-04-02 5:51:27 PM|| Front Page Top

#55 The Presidential election this year is no longer politics - it's a full-scale war. The blogosphere is only one of many battlegrounds. Some of this is absolutely insanity on the part of the participants. Some of the stuff being done, especially on the left, should blow up so badly it takes a generation for them to recover.

Here are some exerpts from various newsfeeds today:
GOP Rails at Kerry's 'Unprecedented Criminal Enterprise'

Lights, camera, politics - Prime time TV takes on the president

Bush Haters Refuse Clarke's Request to Stop the Exploitation

Fallujah is just one weapon they will use to fight the rest of this nation. They have no concern for the war on Terror. Their only concern is POWER - and their only desire is to have it. God help us all if they succeed.

Personally, I kinda agree with what Jack Wheeler says in this article.

Posted by Old Patriot 2004-04-02 6:14:01 PM|| [http://users.codenet.net/mweather/default.htm] 2004-04-02 6:14:01 PM|| Front Page Top

#56 .com:

Certainly not. We all are responsible for what we post here without exception. It's just that LH wasn't trying to make a point about health insurance, he was trying to make a point about political parties and personal political philosophy within those parties as opposed to "groupthink." I happen to disagree with him strongly on the topic of nationalized health coverage -- but it's still not the topic we were actually discussing.

IMAO it's one of life's hard lessons, but political parties are like fleets of small mercenary warships who travel together for mutual protection. Each of these small, lightly armed and armored ships are a special interest group such as gun owners, trial lawyers, farmers, and gays. Everybody simultaneously hoists the same flag of convenience, shouts "Go Navy!", and heads into battle. Nobody wants to be out there alone in their one little cruiser when their opposing number shows up with his friends....

If the opposing fleet makes a better offer every ship is for hire too. Organized labor went overboard to Nixon back during the Nixon/McGovern election if you recall.

The Greens are a party with a WWI-era Russian manufactured dreadnaught, and the Libertarians (God bless em!) have a PT Boat.

Posted by Secret Master 2004-04-02 6:33:22 PM|| [www.budgetwarrior.com] 2004-04-02 6:33:22 PM|| Front Page Top

#57 SM - Wow! That's the best constructed analogy of the day, certainly! Prolly the whole week! Shit - it's so cool I'll bow out and STFU! No shit - Kudos!

Posted by .com 2004-04-02 6:39:14 PM|| 2004-04-02 6:39:14 PM|| Front Page Top

#58

Markos "Kos" Zuniga

We need to remember this response from Zuniga and other propaganda-mercenaries the first time a Reuters or Al Arabiya crew is butchered by a Shiite mob in Iraq, as seems more and more likely every day.

It doesn't worry the terror-tools that we are on to them, we don't kill inciters and propagandists.
It should worry them a great deal that Black Flag, the Shia anti-terrorist vigilante group, is on to them.

Posted by Atomic Conspiracy 2004-04-02 9:10:15 PM|| 2004-04-02 9:10:15 PM|| Front Page Top

19:05 Anonymous4100
11:40 ex-lib
10:46 Anonymous4020
22:18 .com
21:31 Anonymous3999
13:16 Valentine
13:03 Zenster
01:25 .com
00:50 Beau
00:49 Bomb-a-rama
00:34 Zenster
00:18 Zenster
23:48 Zenster
23:43 Barbara Skolaut
23:29 .com
23:17 Phil_B
23:07 Anonymous2U
23:04 Anonymous2U
23:03 RWV
22:59 True German Ally
22:56 Alaska Paul
22:51 Traveller
22:44 Jen
22:44 Edward Yee