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2007-09-08 Terror Networks

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Posted by Fred 2007-09-08 00:00|| || Front Page|| [8 views ] Top
File under: al-Qaeda

#1 At least we now know one of the other disguises the UTube snowman uses. Anyone in Justice interested on how abc got a pdf file of this BS?

Posted by Phinater Thraviger 2007-09-08 01:09|| 2007-09-08 01:09|| Front Page Top

#2 "..how it plays with the interests of the peoples and their blood by sacrificing soldiers and populations to achieve the interests of the major corporations."

Looks like Binny has been ready Chomsky. Now if we could just get him to recommend one of the Chumpter's comics like Chavez did.

Posted by Apostate 2007-09-08 07:01|| 2007-09-08 07:01|| Front Page Top

#3 OKI Binny boo boo- you take an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.

OTOH, we will just drop a precision-guided bomb on you and your false beard, thereby keeping both our eyes and all of our teeth.

Posted by Free Radical">Free Radical 2007-09-08 09:25|| 2007-09-08 09:25|| Front Page Top

#4 Increasingly, the only "Solution" that Osama will bring about is a "Final" one.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2007-09-08 12:57|| 2007-09-08 12:57|| Front Page Top

#5 Zen, unfortunately its looking more and more likely every day.

Posted by 3dc 2007-09-08 13:23|| 2007-09-08 13:23|| Front Page Top

#6 unfortunately its looking more and more likely every day.

Yup. Islam simply will not have it any other way. Eventually, we will have no other choice but to oblige their collective death wish.

The West cannot possibly impose reformation upon Islam. Both taqiyya and shari'a law make it futile. Islam continues to show no glimmer of reform save that towards an even more violent and puritanical doctrine. All of this points in only one direction and that is towards the extermination of Islam. While I try to retain some hope that an alternative might arise I no longer have any illusions nor do I continue any longer to oppose calls by others for Islam's destruction. The farce is over.

This will be bin Laden's ultimate gift to Islam: Its complete and total destruction.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2007-09-08 13:38|| 2007-09-08 13:38|| Front Page Top

#7 Blah, blah, blah. We have taxes and credit card debt. We have greedy corporations that give evil muslims money for their oil which has allowed them to live in unprecedented prosperity. After all, they are nothing but ignorant goat herders who wiped their asses with sand before we sold them toilet paper. Never in ten thousand years would they have figured out what to do with the oil if we hadn't showed them. We are not perfect.

But we are free to worship God as we please or to not worship Him if we don't please. God gave us free will so it's between us and Him. We don't need the self-appointed likes of bin Laden to be the middle men or the enforcers. What kind of god would want people to bow to him out of fear that they will have their throats cut if they don't? I'd just as soon go to hell because to me that sounds like hell on earth.

Some of us believe in Jesus Christ who told us to love our enemies. That's a pretty tall order when it comes to muslims. Theirs is the religion of war and death. Jesus talked about a God who loves us so much that it hurts him when we kill each other even when there are those who seem to need killing. But we are exercising some restraint. Our enemies use our restraint against us but we still hesitate because we don't want to lose our souls. We have the power to kill them in the billions and yet we don't. It's hard for those of us who have strong survival instincts because we know they would not show us the same mercy.

Instead of killing them we are trying to teach them democracy. It might work and it might not. I have to believe that most human beings would chose democracy over the kind of totalitarian theocracy that bin Laden has in mind. Sometimes I think George Bush is a complete idiot and sometimes I think he's just a human being doing the best he can. Given the limited understanding of our people and theirs, I think we're giving them the best chance we can and the rest is up to them. It could be that none of us are sufficiently evolved for this challenge. But at least we tried.

Posted by Abu Uluque6305 2007-09-08 15:13|| 2007-09-08 15:13|| Front Page Top

#8 It's good he understands what "an eye for an eye" means..... pigf*quer.

Posted by Clomogum Hatfield7830 2007-09-08 15:35|| 2007-09-08 15:35|| Front Page Top

#9 Uh, Abu...they still don't use toilet paper.

Posted by Remoteman 2007-09-08 16:05|| 2007-09-08 16:05|| Front Page Top

#10 Some of us believe in Jesus Christ who told us to love our enemies. That's a pretty tall order when it comes to muslims. ... Jesus talked about a God who loves us so much that it hurts him when we kill each other even when there are those who seem to need killing. But we are exercising some restraint. Our enemies use our restraint against us but we still hesitate because we don't want to lose our souls. We have the power to kill them in the billions and yet we don't. It's hard for those of us who have strong survival instincts because we know they would not show us the same mercy.

Time to connect the dots. First, there are many of us who do not follow all of Jesus' frequently-wise recommendations. We have no such compulsion to "love our enemies". It represents far too tall of an order for a rational being. Furthermore, when one's own survival is at stake, self-preservation takes precedence over concern for one's deadly foe. I do believe that even Jesus would approve of that, especially so for his followers so they might continue to be fruitful and multiply.

An enemy who punishes you for showing restraint is the most unworthy sort. Unless you are willing to surrender or commit suicide the only other choice is killing the majority of that enemy with all due haste. Any forebearance guarantees more of you and less of them dead. The equation has no other result.

Finally, there is the simple fact that Muslimsif they possessed a significant nuclear arsenalwould have no compunctions about destroying the West the very next minute. This speaks volumes about the course we face. Confronted with an implaccable enemy that absolutely refuses to temper their intolerance for all other beliefs and cultures, neither restraint nor mercy represent the same beneficial qualities they usually do amongst our own kind.

I have to believe that most human beings would chose democracy over the kind of totalitarian theocracy that bin Laden has in mind.

Disabuse yourself of that glaring error in judgement, Abu. A huge percentage of Muslims view democracy as a complete affront to Islam. How dare the West consider man-made laws as superior to those God-given laws handed down by Allah through his messanger, Mohammed.

That's it. In sum total, why Muslims think that theocratic rule is the ne plus ultra in governance. They want nothing less. And they want it applied to our entire world. We, as rational concious living beings must learn to accept the fact that retaining our civilization and its centuries of progress is worth more than the life of every single Muslim on the face of this earth. We will soon have to realize that ridding earth of Islam is the only path to survival. How many ex-Muslims make it through that historic choke-point is strictly up to them and none of our concern.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2007-09-08 17:56|| 2007-09-08 17:56|| Front Page Top

#11 I hear you, Zenster. But it's just not in the majority of civilized people to go out and murder billions of people. Not yet, anyway. I know that I am one of the strongest advocates here of bombing Iran to destroy their nuclear program. I'd also like to see their holy city of Qom leveled. Further, I would be amused to see Mecca wiped out. I believe that every time muslims push, Western Civilization needs to push back harder. But in the long run I believe we are in a war for the hearts and minds of people and we are in a war for our own souls. We simply cannot kill them all without losing our own humanity. We must offer them a viable alternative to the suicidal course that bin Laden is offering them. Somehow we must convince the average muslim in the average muslim street that Islam is nothing more than a suicide pact. We must convince them that we are not evil even if we are not perfect because the future of mankind is very bleak if we can't. You know what happened in World War II. What could happen in the future could be a hell of a lot worse. Nobody in their right mind wants that. This will involve the media. We need people with the wisdom and the courage to speak out so muslims can hear them. That's why I'm so disappointed when Bush speaks or when the Pope speaks. They just don't seem to get it. We need to call a spade a spade. We need voices that are more forceful and more direct that do not attempt to whitewash the problem by pretending that there are moderate muslims when there is nothing moderate about the Koran. We need Theo van Goghs and Satanic Verses and Danish cartoons. We need Rantburg. But still we need compassion. We are just as guilty as them if we go about gleefully killing them without at least trying to find a better way.

Posted by Abu Uluque6305 2007-09-08 18:43|| 2007-09-08 18:43|| Front Page Top

#12 Abu, please know that I understand your personal reservations. At one time I shared a majority of them. Now I do not.

We simply cannot kill them all without losing our own humanity.

The situation rapidly is turning into one of "it's us or them". We extinguished Imperial Japan using firestorms and nuclear weapons, yet did not become like them. We largely eradicated Nazism and did not lose our soul in doing so. There is absolutely nothing to indicate that eliminating even one billion Muslims will endanger our well-preserved sense of humanity.

We must offer them a viable alternative to the suicidal course that bin Laden is offering them.

We have. They DO NOT want it. Look at Afghanistan and Iraq. Both countries were liberated from the most dispicable Islamic tyrannies and yet BOTH of them immediately installed shari'a law, the most tyrannous form of theocracy.

Somehow we must convince the average muslim in the average muslim street that Islam is nothing more than a suicide pact.

They know it is a suicide pact. Why do you think so many of them blow themselves up? How do you steer a collective culture away from death when they revere and reward it?

We must convince them that we are not evil even if we are not perfect because the future of mankind is very bleak if we can't.

The future of mankind is far more bleak iffor fear of losing our humanitywe allow one of this world's most profound evils to exist without penalty. There is literally NOTHING you can do to make the West NOT seem evil to most Muslims. While they are fascinated by what they see, they also know it is an absolute threat to their way of life.

Forgetfor the noncehow offensive Christianity is to Muslims. Try men and women holding hands or kissing in public. Try men and women frolicking in revealing swimsuits at the beach, dancing together, attending CHURCH together. Our movies show people KISSING and MAKING LOVE! Our women go about uncovered! Women are even allowed to DRIVE! Young people live together! Women choose who they want to marry! The Jews live among us and pay no poll tax!

ALL of these are deathly affronts to Islam. However minor they may seem to you, most of them are punished by lashes or a death sentence in Muslim majority nations. Our very freedoms are what make us evil. Without abandoning these essential liberties, how in hell are you going to convince the average Muslim that we in the West are not evil? It cannot be done.

You know what happened in World War II.

Yes. As I recall, we won. And for all the right reasons.

What could happen in the future could be a hell of a lot worse.

It probably will be in light of how many people have forgotten the lessons of World Wars I & II. Even worse if we do not find the resolve to eliminate the threat of Islam. It cannot be tolerated in a free world.

Nobody in their right mind wants that.

"[W]ants"? Perhaps not. "Foresees", definitely. Islam's own path assures a Muslim holocaust. The only other alternative is a Global Cultural Holocaust, otherwise known as the global caliphate. Nobody in their right mind can possibly tolerate the creation of a global caliphate. Half this world's population would perish.

Islam has every intention of killing numbers far in excess of its own membership.
THAT IS A TIPPING POINT ALL BY ITSELF.
Let a billion live so that BILLIONS may die? Face the question squarely.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2007-09-08 19:23|| 2007-09-08 19:23|| Front Page Top

#13 OK, Remoteman, I'm sorry to hear that.

And, Zenster, you may very well be right. I hope you're not but I too can see situations where people in countries like France and the UK could take matters into their own hands if their governments don't wise up.

I would like it if our leaders and our so-called "media elite" would be more forceful, more blunt and tell the world that Binny is a product of a twisted culture that must change if it is to co-exist with ours. Over and over again, every time somebody like Binny or Achmadinutjob or any of the wacky clerics anywhere says anything they need to pounce on it, call bullshit and expose the Koran for the pack of lies that it is. Ridicule them, polarize them, confuse them, make them doubt themselves. Isolate the preachers of jihad. Lock them up or even liquidate them. Do not allow Korans in prisons.

Ok, take Iraq, for instance. Bush is waging a limited war there and attempting to introduce democracy. It is proving to be a long, tedious and painful process. Their culture is incompatible with it. Have we failed? Harry Reid thinks so. I myself think we should have been far more ruthless in destroying mosques and liquidating people like Tater Tot. Sometimes you have to be cruel to be kind. I'm just not to the point yet where I believe we have to kill them all.

I'm no genius. I'm not even George Bush. But there may be more subtle, more effective ways to do this.

Posted by Abu Uluque6305 2007-09-08 20:52|| 2007-09-08 20:52|| Front Page Top

#14 Abu, please understand that I truly respect the position your are seeking to maintain.

I would like it if our leaders and our so-called "media elite" would be more forceful, more blunt

Some really bad news. Our "media elite" are being "more forceful, more blunt". It's just that they are on the wrong side. I full well realize what you are saying and agree totally. We need a domestic propaganda campaign that makes America aware of just how dire this threat to our freedom actually is. Due to some unique and incomprehensible failing in the Bush administration, there has been littleif anythingin the way of a concerted effort to use America's superior media facilities to rally support against and exposure of Islam.

and tell the world that Binny is a product of a twisted culture that must change if it is to co-exist with ours.

Again, the MainStream Media (MSM) seeks the exact opposite. Its multiculturalist, anti-West, anti-Christian agenda all militates directly AGAINST such a desirable message.

Over and over again, every time somebody like Binny or Achmadinutjob or any of the wacky clerics anywhere says anything they need to pounce on it, call bullshit and expose the Koran for the pack of lies that it is.

Yes, they do. Sadly, this vital job has been neglectedif not overtly underminedfor so long that only far more direct and physical measures will suffice.

Ridicule them, polarize them, confuse them, make them doubt themselves.

The cartoons only produced riots and more Muslim deaths than Western ones. What would you have? As to making them "doubt themselves", I give you Bertrand Russell's immortal words:

The fundamental cause of trouble in the world today is that the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.

Somehow, I doubt he'd agree with my contextual placement of his quote but he's dead so screw him.

Isolate the preachers of jihad. Lock them up or even liquidate them. Do not allow Korans in prisons.

Bravo, we are on the exact same page. Welcome to the club. The West must summon forth the courage to kill a few thousand of Islam's elite or face the inevitability of a Muslim holocaust.

Bushby spouting the Religion of Peace [spit] nonsenseactually encourages the prospect of a Muslim holocaust. You yourself recognize the importance of calling a spade a spade. This is not happening and all of it leads to the charnelhouse.

I have simply run out of patience with trying to save Islam from itself. If one billion people want to declare war upon five billion people who possess massive quantities of nuclear weapons, who am I to argue? If one billion people prize death over that of life itself, why should I continue to argue, especially after 9-11, Bali, Madrid, Beslan, Bali, London and thousands of smaller Islamic atrocities?

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2007-09-08 21:34|| 2007-09-08 21:34|| Front Page Top

#15 I have faith that if, in the end, we must erase Islam to save humanity, we will do so, sacrificing our own souls if that's what it takes to save the soul of mankind, as others have willingly done in the past for us. But like Abraham bargaining with God for Sodom and Gemorrah, we must first give the people of the Ummah the chance to make reject evil teachings and save themselves from destruction.

Willy nilly or with deliberate wisdom, or more likely both, we are yet in the experimental phase, waiting to see what the Ummah will choose.

Or, you can just read Dave D's Options. He lays it out as clearly as ever an engineer can do, with no poetry to stand between words and meaning.

Posted by trailing wife 2007-09-08 23:04|| 2007-09-08 23:04|| Front Page Top

#16 The chance to ~~make~~ reject

I really should resist the impulse to wax philosophical when I'm tired.

Zenster sees the endgame and sees no reason for more innocents to suffer by prolonging the interim stage. After all, had Hitler been stopped, the holocausts of Europe would not have occurred. I see that innocents will suffer regardless, and hope that we can help the Muslim world choose not to be erased. But regardless, it is they who will have made the choice.

We've been arguing this at Rantburg from almost the beginning. There is strong merit on both sides, I think. But for the nonce those on the ground think they can make it work, and it is not our discussions that will change their minds.

Posted by trailing wife 2007-09-08 23:21|| 2007-09-08 23:21|| Front Page Top

23:58 Sherry
23:53 3dc
23:47 Themp de Medici6050
23:45 trailing wife
23:41 trailing wife
23:34 Zenster
23:21 trailing wife
23:06 JSU
23:06 Zenster
23:04 trailing wife
23:01 Fred
23:00 Zenster
22:47 Sherry
22:32 tu3031
22:23 trailing wife
22:22 Zenster
22:19 gromgoru
22:14 Zenster
22:11 Zenster
22:05 Zhang Fei
22:04 Zenster
22:02 trailing wife
21:49 Zenster
21:47 Zenster