Article

2007-10-24 Israel-Palestine-Jordan

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by ryuge 2007-10-24 07:38|| || Front Page|| [3 views ] Top
File under: Hamas

#1 Believe it when I see it.

Posted by gromgoru 2007-10-24 07:50|| 2007-10-24 07:50|| Front Page Top

#2 A key phrase here is "parts of Gaza".

By this, I think they mean the electrical lines which enter Gaza nearest Sderot.

Posted by mhw">mhw 2007-10-24 08:16|| http://hypocrisy-incorporated.blogspot.com/]">[http://hypocrisy-incorporated.blogspot.com/] 2007-10-24 08:16|| Front Page Top

#3 Outrage from concerned progressives and Christians in 5... 4... 3...

Posted by Excalibur 2007-10-24 08:33|| 2007-10-24 08:33|| Front Page Top

#4 If I've been reading correctly the last few days, recent articles suggest the Gazans haven't waited for Israeli action, but are already cutting themselves off from Israeli medical supplies, food, water, and power.

Posted by trailing wife 2007-10-24 08:46|| 2007-10-24 08:46|| Front Page Top

#5 Just keep sawing away at that branch you're sitting on, guys.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2007-10-24 08:55|| 2007-10-24 08:55|| Front Page Top

#6 Israel may start cutting power to Gaza

I could swear I've seen nearly that exact same headline at least twice already in the last year. For cryin' out loud, stop "considering" it and just DO IT. And don't do it "gradually" or to just "parts" of Gaza, and quit the liberal hand-wringing about "not harming humanitarian sources like hospitals". Shut the damned savages down COMPLETELY. No electricity, no water, no passage in or out.

Announce a policy and act on it: EVERY time a rocket is fired from Gaza, ALL services to Gaza will be terminated for a week. Do it consistently. Lab rats can be taught through operant conditioning; I assume Gazans can, too.

Posted by Dave D.">Dave D. 2007-10-24 09:20|| 2007-10-24 09:20|| Front Page Top

#7 Lab rats can be taught through operant conditioning; I assume Gazans can, too.

Feeling rather optimistic today, are we?

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2007-10-24 09:30|| 2007-10-24 09:30|| Front Page Top

#8 Israel is weighing the actual damage from the Qassams, the symbolic damage to its deterrent image from not responding even to ineffective attacks, its relations, diplomatic and economic with the "liberal world" including Europe, and the fence sitters in the USA, their desire not to undermine Abbas by hitting so hard in Gaza that West Bank Pals see Abbas as collaborating in the humanitarian harm to Gaza Pals, their desire to strengthen Abbas by hitting hard enough in Gaza to weaken Hamas' own reputation for strength, and their desire not to undermine the US WOT.

That is why they have "considered" for so long, and that is why when they do it, they will do it in careful steps.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2007-10-24 09:43|| 2007-10-24 09:43|| Front Page Top

#9 "That is why they have "considered" for so long, and that is why when they do it, they will do it in careful steps."

...and that is why they will continue to get the same results they've been getting: Qassams.

Posted by Dave D.">Dave D. 2007-10-24 10:51|| 2007-10-24 10:51|| Front Page Top

#10 If you have a child and don't discipline it in a timely manner then the discipline, when it takes place, is not correlated with the instigating act and becomes viewed as parental abuse.

Discipline should be swifted applied.

The swat on the bottom - NOW!
The grounding - NOW!

If you wait its less than useful to apply.

Posted by 3dc 2007-10-24 13:32|| 2007-10-24 13:32|| Front Page Top

#11 If the Qassam rockets landed in my community, I would be outraged and would demand that my government do what it takes to eliminate the threat to my family and my neighbors. I and my fellow citizens would raise holy hell. Just because the rockets do not hit anything that day is no excuse to let them go. Living under the threat of these erratic rockets means that one of them may have YOUR or YOUR FAMILY'S name on it.

When you allow rocket attacks into Israel and do nothing about them, you are in effect legitimizing the actions of terrorists, which allows them more degrees of freedom.

Liberal Europe does not give a sh*t about whether Israel lives or dies. Isreal is in the position that they are in because they have let this thing go too long without serious consequences. If Israel watches the polls to see which way they will move their policies, then they are just dying on the installment plan.

Abbas is Hamas-lite. Just like the Arafish was. He is another weasel, talking out both sides of his mouth. Israel is in the position that they are in because they kept backing down on fundamental issues, worried about public opinion, instead of doing what is right and necessary for her survival. You do not negotiate with enemies that are sworn to destroy you. That is a game for fools.

Posted by Alaska Paul">Alaska Paul 2007-10-24 13:51|| 2007-10-24 13:51|| Front Page Top

#12 When you allow rocket attacks into Israel and do nothing about them, you are in effect legitimizing the actions of terrorists, which allows them more degrees of freedom.

Too right, AP. Silence is consent and Israel has consented to playing the victim so many times that this sort of suicidal behavior is now expected of them. It's long past tea for them to respond quickly and lethally to even small incursions by Hamas or even Fatah, for that matter.

Posted by Zenster">Zenster 2007-10-24 14:54|| 2007-10-24 14:54|| Front Page Top

#13 Lining up 2000 artillery pieces and marching the shells north to south would do a lot more, quicker, and more effectively. Once Gaza is a desert, turn to the West Bank. The flood of "refugees" to Egypt and Jordan will put them where they belong. If Hezbollah attacks from the north, give UNIFIL 30 days to leave, then nuke the Litani River from Syria to the Med. Doing it once, right, will solve the problem for a long time to come.

Posted by Old Patriot">Old Patriot 2007-10-24 16:05|| http://oldpatriot.blogspot.com/]">[http://oldpatriot.blogspot.com/] 2007-10-24 16:05|| Front Page Top

#14 AP:

1. Its not the govts job to only be concerned for one community, but to worry about the security of the state.

2. Its absolutely not true they have done nothing - they have done counter battery fire, air attacks (including one the other day that killed a Hamas honcho who was involved in the rocket attacks) and raids. What they have not YET done is cut the power.

3. What liberal europe cares about in its heart of hearts is irrelevant. What matters is trade and other real world interactions. Israel does not want to be isolated. Israel is a small country and cannot afford to be isolated, and that is a fact.

4. Far from dying, Israel is growing, in population, economics, society.

5. Im not going to addressthe Abbas=Arafat argument in this thread. Suffice it to say the current govt of Israel does not believe it, and they will make policy on that basis.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2007-10-24 16:38|| 2007-10-24 16:38|| Front Page Top

#15 I may not agree with your Litani nuke solution OP, but I agree with your Walking Artillery Solution for Gaza. There is absolutely no reason for the IDF to do ground ops there, subjecting troops to unnecessary risk.

I still say, turn their water off. That will get their attention more than anything. Give em some advance warning so they can get Egypt to save their sorry a$$es, then 32 turns clockwise on the Big Valve.

Posted by Alaska Paul">Alaska Paul 2007-10-24 16:43|| 2007-10-24 16:43|| Front Page Top

#16 I expect they will cut off power to the specific towns where the rocket attacks are coming from. Let each town decide how much its worth to cooperate with the hard boyz.

Posted by Liberalhawk 2007-10-24 16:46|| 2007-10-24 16:46|| Front Page Top

#17 Quite probably I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that the Palestinians are not connected to Israel's power grid, as I thought they were not connected to Israel's water. But rather, that they get fuel for their power generators, which also pump the water from their own wells (which they use so wastefully the groundwater is falling and seawater is seeping in). How far from correct am I?

Posted by trailing wife 2007-10-24 21:20|| 2007-10-24 21:20|| Front Page Top

#18 IIUC - they are directly ~~sucking energy~~ tied into the Joooo grid at the Ashkelon power plant - which they routinely (and as yet unsuccessfully) target. Perhaps one could "hit the line to gaza"

Posted by Frank G">Frank G 2007-10-24 21:32|| 2007-10-24 21:32|| Front Page Top

23:34 Sock Puppet of Doom
23:33 crosspatch
23:29 Sock Puppet of Doom
23:16 WTF
23:16 Zenster
23:08 Phinater Thraviger
22:55 WTF
22:49 Jonathan
22:43 Chuckles Jaise7272
22:40 Jules
22:29 Slappy
22:29 Zenster
22:27 Besoeker
22:26 Zenster
22:20 Zenster
22:20 Red Dawg
22:15 Barbara Skolaut
22:13 Cliper Ghibelline3346
22:12 Unutle McGurque8861
22:12 Mike N.
22:10 Unutle McGurque8861
22:07 Besoeker
22:01 Unutle McGurque8861
21:59 Besoeker