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2004-06-03 Home Front: WoT
BREAKING Per Fox News - Tenet has resigned
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Posted by Brett_the_Quarkian 2004-06-03 10:32:40 AM|| || Front Page|| [2 views since 2007-05-07]  Top

#1 It's the Breaking News banner on CNN.com

Posted by Anonymous4021 2004-06-03 10:40:49 AM||   2004-06-03 10:40:49 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 Is he joining the Kerry campaign along with Rand Beers, Richard Clarke, Joe Wilson, etc.?
Posted by JAB 2004-06-03 10:46:04 AM||   2004-06-03 10:46:04 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 about goddam time!
Posted by muck4doo 2004-06-03 10:46:39 AM|| [http://meatismurder.blogspot.com/]  2004-06-03 10:46:39 AM|| Front Page Top

#4 I agree - he should've stepped down after 9/11
Posted by Frank G  2004-06-03 10:54:39 AM||   2004-06-03 10:54:39 AM|| Front Page Top

#5 #2, I'm guessing no.

I hope he figures that the Bush Administration was being VERY forgiving of him and his agency after the 9/11 intel failure.

Truth is, I'm surprised he was kept on at all.
Posted by Anonymous4021 2004-06-03 10:55:41 AM||   2004-06-03 10:55:41 AM|| Front Page Top

#6 I like the man. He was instrumental in developing the invasion plan for Afghanistan. That worked very well. He was fiercely loyal to CIA people. The 9/11 failure was a generalized failure of intel, imagination and oversight and can't be laid at his feet alone. Everyone missed 9/11. Whatever his mistakes, he is in no way, shape or form an "asshat". I wish him well.
Posted by Steve White  2004-06-03 11:20:55 AM||   2004-06-03 11:20:55 AM|| Front Page Top

#7 Pelosi giving press conference - sez there were failures, blah blah, and that Tenet shouldn't be the only one to step down. Hmmm... lessee, any other Klinton hold-overs remaining?

*snicker*

Mebbe Dubya should nominate Poindexter and really get her shorts in a bunch.
Posted by .com 2004-06-03 11:26:50 AM||   2004-06-03 11:26:50 AM|| Front Page Top

#8 Does the phrase "slam dunk" cause you to be less enthusiastic about supporting Tenet, #6?

Too bad Dick Cheney is otherwise engaged. He'd make a great CIA head and the Dims would have a group heart attack over it. he, he

When is Norm Mineta going to resign "for personal reasons?" I've been waiting....
Posted by rex 2004-06-03 11:32:54 AM||   2004-06-03 11:32:54 AM|| Front Page Top

#9 Steve - I sympathize, but while everyone missed 9/11, it was Tenets job above all to NOT miss it, more than anyone else. and, as the saying goes, you have to fire the manager, since you cant fire the entire team. And Tenet with his affirmation to a questioning Bush, that he had rock solid evidence on Iraqi WMDS, while at the same time affirming CIA reluctance toward the Democracy building project, may be responsible for over emphasizing the place of WMDs in the justification for war - which seems to have been as large a strategic mistake as any in the Iraqi war. He may also be partly responsible for the decision to run an American occupation in Iraq, rather than one dominated by Iraqi exiles - for all the problems with Iraqi exiles, its really hard to see that we could have done worse with them than with the CPA approach. As for other issues, like the hunt for senior AQ (not one senior AQ guy caught or killed in over a year, AFAICT) the problems in Pakistan, etc I dont have any info, but I presume Bush does. Tenet may not be an asshat - i seriously doubt that he is - but its also not clear to me that hes a successful Director of Central Intelligence, such as we need at this point in time.

BTW, whats the source for Tenets role in the invasion plan for Afghanistan - Woodward? Ive thought that plan was essentially Pentagon.
Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-06-03 11:37:26 AM||   2004-06-03 11:37:26 AM|| Front Page Top

#10 I don't think the resignation has anything to do with earlier intel failures, but more likey; upward pressure from the Abu Graib prison fiasco, as 'the chain' is being pulled!
Posted by smn  2004-06-03 11:45:52 AM||   2004-06-03 11:45:52 AM|| Front Page Top

#11 wouldn't it be a riot if GW nominated his Dad to take the position again! It won't happen but its fun to imagine.
Posted by Yosemite Sam 2004-06-03 11:48:08 AM||   2004-06-03 11:48:08 AM|| Front Page Top

#12 I can understand why Bush did not dump Tenet (at least initially after 9/11), but he has been in place way too long and the problems at the CIA are not improving.

However, beyond Tenet's resignation we need a recognition that the CIA has to do nasty things with undesirable people in order to guarantee our security. I don't know if that message has gotten through yet.
Posted by Douglas De Bono  2004-06-03 11:48:14 AM|| [http://www.douglasdebono.com]  2004-06-03 11:48:14 AM|| Front Page Top

#13 ..One name that's popped up in the last few minutes is Rudy Guiliani...

Mike
Posted by Mike Kozlowski 2004-06-03 11:52:43 AM||   2004-06-03 11:52:43 AM|| Front Page Top

#14 
Reported by Wonkette:
On his way into Marine One, Bush thought of something he forgot to mention at the press conference with the Australian PM: CIA director George Tenet has resigned for "personal reasons." .... Bush then turned back around and shouted over his shoulder, "Oh, and I totally knew about 9/11! Later."
.
Posted by Mike Sylwester 2004-06-03 11:55:41 AM||   2004-06-03 11:55:41 AM|| Front Page Top

#15 One name that's popped up in the last few minutes is Rudy Guiliani.
Mike-YAHOO!


Posted by BigEd 2004-06-03 12:04:28 PM||   2004-06-03 12:04:28 PM|| Front Page Top

#16 I looked for it in the Yahoo article and couldn't find it.
Posted by Mike Sylwester 2004-06-03 12:06:15 PM||   2004-06-03 12:06:15 PM|| Front Page Top

#17 BigEd, I don't know which Mike you were addressing.
Posted by Mike Sylwester 2004-06-03 12:07:26 PM||   2004-06-03 12:07:26 PM|| Front Page Top

#18 Steve Whiite says:

I like the man. He was fiercely loyal to CIA people.

Well you have given me a good reason to dislike him.
His loyalties should have been

1) To the United States
2) To the administration
3) To the CIA
4) To the people in CIA.

Ie if at one point the best way to serve the United States would have been replacing the CIA or firing half its people then he should have not a second of hesitation.
Posted by JFM  2004-06-03 12:13:19 PM||   2004-06-03 12:13:19 PM|| Front Page Top

#19 Mike in #13
Posted by BigEd 2004-06-03 12:26:41 PM||   2004-06-03 12:26:41 PM|| Front Page Top

#20 Instapundit reacts:

UPDATE: Kathryn Jean Lopez has a glimpse of the future: "I can picture it all now. The Tenet press conference with Howard Dean's group and MoveOn where he announces that Bush is a failed leader. The October surprise book where he blames everything wrong with intel on W., Condi & the Pentagon."

That does seem to be the preferred path for the Bush Administration's washouts. Of course, his most telling charge would be "Bush should have fired me on September 11th!" And that one may be a bit awkward. (Read this piece from 2002, too: "Someone remind me why George Tenet still has a job.")

Reader Don Hoover emails: "I guess since Tenet was a Clinton apointee, he had to listen to Gore and resign. . . . Unfortunately, Tenet should have been fired 1/2001 and that's what will be missed in this coverage."
Posted by Mike  2004-06-03 12:29:00 PM||   2004-06-03 12:29:00 PM|| Front Page Top

#21 A little insight: George Bush I appointed Robert Gates as DCI late in his term because he wanted to start a tradition of CIA directors carrying across administrations. Of course Gates got out quick once Clinton showed up - he was so disgusted he didn't even include the Clinton years in his autobiography.

George Bush II probably originally kept on Tenet believing in the same principle of intelligence continuity, especially given the shortened time he had to put together a cabinet after the election squabble. Then, when 9/11 hit, even if he had wanted to fire him, Bush probably realized that continuity was needed in the near term, change in the long term.

At the same time, I question whether Bush really has it in him to fire anybody. I don't think he's the kind of leader who likes to move people around. He seems to like the people around him, rely on them, and try to keep them together.

I don't think you'll see an appointment other than the DDCI taking over so close to the election, but perhaps after the election.
Posted by Sawt al-Shebaab 2004-06-03 12:40:14 PM||   2004-06-03 12:40:14 PM|| Front Page Top

#22 I'm with Steve and "Sawt" on this one--Tenet appeared to be fairly competent and capable to me.
(Get real: I can't believe that some of you can comment on how well someone fills the job of CIA director--Like you would know!)
Yes, 9/11 was a big intell failure, but there's plenty of blame to go around for everyone.
Tenet's people did the best they could given the curbs put on them before 9/11 by Congress and Clinton and the lack of coordination with the FBI that we now have as a result of 9/11.
If there's any current event that led to his firing, I'm going to guess that it's not Abu Ghraib, but the Joe Wilson/Valerie Plame tempest in a teapot.
Posted by Jen  2004-06-03 12:49:52 PM|| [http://www.greatestjeneration.com]  2004-06-03 12:49:52 PM|| Front Page Top

#23 Speaking of which, has there been any real news on the Wilson/Plame Blame Game front, or just the usual?
Posted by Phil Fraering 2004-06-03 1:00:34 PM|| [http://newsfromthefridge.typepad.com]  2004-06-03 1:00:34 PM|| Front Page Top

#24 Theres plenty of interesting stuff up at the Corner (yes, I know i shouldnt read NRO, but when something like this breaks they can be quite good, and fast) One of them suggests Frank Gaffney for DCI. Note well - Michael Ledeen has been calling for Tenets head for awhile, apparently.
Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-06-03 1:15:39 PM||   2004-06-03 1:15:39 PM|| Front Page Top

#25 by the way, i hope im not considered a flaming leftie for taking NRO seriously.
Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-06-03 1:16:17 PM||   2004-06-03 1:16:17 PM|| Front Page Top

#26 I don't see Tenet going political hatchet on Bush. He was in too deep and most of it would blow back on him.
Posted by remote man 2004-06-03 1:18:18 PM||   2004-06-03 1:18:18 PM|| Front Page Top

#27 I don't see Tenet going political hatchet on Bush. He was in too deep and most of it would blow back on him.

Far more intelligent men have taken far more harebrained courses of action ...

(Don't mind any apparently "senselessness" in that statement, I'm just feeling blue after two "liberals on the rise" article readings, one in the NY Sun and the other in the Wall Street Journal.)
Posted by Edward Yee  2004-06-03 1:44:19 PM|| [http://edwardyee.fanworks.net]  2004-06-03 1:44:19 PM|| Front Page Top

#28 LH, I never suspected you were a neo-con.

Bush should replace Tenet with one of the people who really do know it all: Richard Clarke, General Zinni (et tu, Tony?), the editorial board of the New York Times, Paul Krugman, any BBC reporter or Guardian columnist, etc. I'm sure given real power they'd straighten things out in a few days.
Posted by Matt 2004-06-03 2:29:47 PM||   2004-06-03 2:29:47 PM|| Front Page Top

#29 I wonder if this isn't Bush finally cracking down on the interagency strife within his administration.
Posted by someone 2004-06-03 2:31:12 PM||   2004-06-03 2:31:12 PM|| Front Page Top

#30 matt - i consider myself more of a, well, new democrat/liberal hawk than a neo con - but my differences with neocons are 80% on domestic policy - on foreign policy, though im not in 100% agreement with neocons, im far closer to them than to most Democrats. Especially if we're speaking of the more moderate neocons - William Kristol, Robert Kagan, and Paul Wolfowitz. Im not really a hardcore Michael Ledeen fan, but he does say interesting things from time to time. I like my Kristol and Kagan mixed well with genuine liberal hawks, like Paul Berman, Marty Peretz, and Christopher Hitchens (though Hitch is rather too far left for on non WOT matters) I also like Andrew Sullivan alot, although he does get a bit obsessive on the marriage thing.
Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-06-03 2:36:50 PM||   2004-06-03 2:36:50 PM|| Front Page Top

#31 It will be Heineken six pack for me.... And, oh yes, Wolfowitz for CIA director!
Posted by Sorge 2004-06-03 2:57:37 PM||   2004-06-03 2:57:37 PM|| Front Page Top

#32 Sorge, that (Wolfie as Director) would rock...but the Left will go bananas!
Posted by Jen  2004-06-03 3:25:29 PM|| [http://www.greatestjeneration.com]  2004-06-03 3:25:29 PM|| Front Page Top

#33 I suspect that W is slow to fire, and generous with second chances, based on his own life story. This is a guy who had a problem with booze, became "born again," and as a result gave up the booze and changed his own life rather remarkably. You'd expect a guy like that to give others who may have fallen a generous opportunity to redeem themselves. I don't know if that's what happened with Tennet after 9/11, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was.
Posted by Mike  2004-06-03 3:33:01 PM||   2004-06-03 3:33:01 PM|| Front Page Top

#34 if dubya has the cojones to nominate Wolfie, i'll personally come back here and congratulate him.

You like Wolfie, Jen? How odd.
Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-06-03 3:35:48 PM||   2004-06-03 3:35:48 PM|| Front Page Top

#35 Not odd at all, Liberalhawk.
I make no secret of the fact that I'm a proud neocon and backing Wolfowitz is totally consistent with everything I've had to say here.
Posted by Jen  2004-06-03 3:41:07 PM|| [http://www.greatestjeneration.com]  2004-06-03 3:41:07 PM|| Front Page Top

#36 I had some considerable experience with, as David mentioned, the largest nation in the Muslim world, spending three years there, three years in Indonesia as the U.S. Ambassador to that country. I know what tolerant people the most of those 200 million Muslims in Indonesia are. And I believe that, in fact, there are hundreds of millions of Muslims who really aspired to, but to what we enjoy, freedom and the prosperity that freedom engenders

Mr. Paul Wolfowitz
Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-06-03 3:44:51 PM||   2004-06-03 3:44:51 PM|| Front Page Top

#37 
In the West, critics' views on the eighty-seven-year-old known as "the dean of Middle Eastern scholars" are more clear-cut. Conservatives tend to hail him as a priceless gem—the only scholar both erudite and honest enough to tell us the inflammatory truth about the condition of modern Islam. Leftists, particularly among his peers in academe, tend to regard him as a servant of imperial power, prone to making demeaning generalizations about Middle Eastern society, and arrogant enough to consider himself an objective scholar. The rift has deepened as Lewis's influence on Paul Wolfowitz, the chief architect of current White House policy in the Middle East, has become public knowledge. For those who only know Lewis from his post-9-11 celebrity, From Babel to Dragomans, a newly published collection of Lewis' essays from the 1950s to the present, is a handy guide to his intellectual roots. Lewis's academic career spans seven decades—he enrolled in the University of London's School of Oriental Studies in 1933. A genuine scholar of Orientalism, unabashed by the recent denigration of the field by post-modernists, he believes in rigorous linguistic training, prodigious reading of primary sources, and a no-stone-unturned approach to scholarship. Before he became a national celebrity for telling us "What Went Wrong," Lewis delved as enthusiastically into such topics as the relative merits of donkeys and camels for medieval pilgrims, derivations of the Persian word for eggplant, and property law in the tenth-century Muslim provinces.

There is no doubt that Lewis's harsh critique of modern Islam stems from a deep affection for the civilization that it once was. As a student visiting Turkey in 1938, by a stroke of luck he became the first Westerner permitted to enter the Imperial Ottoman Archives. His recollection of the experience says much about his sentiments toward his field: "Feeling like a child turned loose in a toy shop, or like an intruder in Ali Baba's cave, I hardly knew where to turn first."

Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-06-03 3:49:13 PM||   2004-06-03 3:49:13 PM|| Front Page Top

#38 Speaking to students at Georgetown University in Washington October 30, Wolfowitz emphasized the importance of being "more attentive to moderate voices in the Muslim world, for the better we can be at encouraging and amplifying those voices, the more effective we will be in leading the world ... toward ... values that will bring lasting peace."

Wolfowitz said he believes "there are hundreds of millions of moderate and tolerant people in the Muslim world who aspire to enjoy the blessings of freedom and democracy and free enterprise and equal justice under law." And, he added, "We must speak to them."

The battle of ideas "is not only fought in news media and newspapers and books and public debate," according to Wolfowitz, "it's also fought in those madrasas [religious schools] ... where poor children are given a chance to get off the streets and to study, but what they're taught there is not real learning. ... It's the tools that turn them into terrorists."

He suggested the possibility of funding moderate religious schools. Many Muslims, Wolfowitz said, have spoken out "against those who have tried to hijack their religion. Unfortunately, all too often, they have to do so in the face of threats and intimidation from well-funded extremists."

As a former ambassador to Indonesia, Wolfowitz said that he has friends in that country "who are exponents of moderation" who have a hard time finding funds for moderate schools and libraries to teach Muslims the truth about their religion, yet "the extremists can go around the world and get large quantities [of funds] without any difficulty." It is not a matter of not having resources with which to respond, he explained, but "we lack the means to deliver them."
Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-06-03 3:52:25 PM||   2004-06-03 3:52:25 PM|| Front Page Top

#39 I realize what a highly "nuanced" (new favorite Liberal Dimocrat concept) guy you are, Liberalhawk, but I could care less.
I'm tired of arguing semantics with you and taking up Fred's bandwidth with infinitesimal shades of meaning that you don't "get."
I support Bush, Wolfie, neocon Conservatism and moderate Islam if it can really be moderate (but I have my doubts and I'm sure Wolfie does, too).
Bush--over the howls of the Left--also appointed Daniel Pipes to a post and he holds pretty much the same view of Islam as Wolfie and Bush.
Posted by Jen  2004-06-03 4:04:02 PM|| [http://www.greatestjeneration.com]  2004-06-03 4:04:02 PM|| Front Page Top

#40 pipes was appointed to a minor advisory board, IIRC. that the left howled about that was a sign of the academic lefts descent into trivia.

And theres nothing particularly nuanced about this. Wolfie has NO doubts that moderate Islam exists, or that it is completely in keeping with the history of a great civilization. That is THE CORE of the admins grand strategy. This is all about your unwillingness to face that wolfie and Bush dont hold the "islam is not a civilization" line that some Bush supporters hold.
Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-06-03 4:11:18 PM||   2004-06-03 4:11:18 PM|| Front Page Top

#41 fred is usually able to speak for himself.
Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-06-03 4:12:13 PM||   2004-06-03 4:12:13 PM|| Front Page Top

#42 Lh, bottom line is that the Bush Administration has shown that it is tolerant of moderate Islam and that this is not a war on Islam itself.
The ball is now in the courts of Muslims as to whether they can regulate, reform and moderate themselves.
This will be on an incident-by-incident basis.
You were asking about the difference between Indonesian Muslims and Soddie ones.
If you think of Islam like a disease, Sods are the source of the illness of radical Islam and probably will be the last to give up their Waahab jihadi Islam and to embrace peaceful Islam.
They are the funders and instigators of almost all the violent jihad that we see today and every attack is a victory for Allah to them.
Indonesians are different in all ways than Sods (Asia isn't Arabia) and thus responded differently to the Bali bombing because they haven't caught the "jihad disease" very badly and its violence is inimical to their nature, culture and customs.
Posted by Jen  2004-06-03 4:23:58 PM|| [http://www.greatestjeneration.com]  2004-06-03 4:23:58 PM|| Front Page Top

#43 The question, Liberal"Hawk", is not whether Lewis, Wolfowitz, even Bush say there is such thing as 'moderate Islam'. The question is not even whether they believe. The primary question, the one that must be answered before all others, is whether, as a matter of fact, any existing, credible version of Islam is compatible with Justice. If the answer is no, we should proceed to the destruction of Islam itself.
Posted by Sorge 2004-06-03 6:01:19 PM||   2004-06-03 6:01:19 PM|| Front Page Top

#44 Sorry: also posted on another thread:
It's about time, although no rational person can really accept his 'personal reasons' excuse, along with the usual 'needing to spend more time with my family' palaver. Remember the 'slam dunk' statement and who (or whose department) made it. And Tenet sat right behind the Secretary of State when Powell made the speech to the UN...
Powell has now publicly stated that the information he was provided was "inaccurate and wrong and, in some cases, deliberately misleading. And for that I am disappointed, and I regret it." Well, everyone should damn well regret it and this information was provided by the department under Tenet's direct supervision. Everyone should be tired of 'leaders' who say things like "This incident happened on my watch, and I take full responsibility" and then do nothing and take no personal responsibility, except perhaps promising to 'fully investigate the matter' and appoint committees to look into the issue.
Metaphor: if a US capital ship ran aground and was seriously damaged -- even in the middle of the night when the captain of said ship was abed -- what do you think would happen to the captain? The pious 'happened on my watch' statements would never even be made because these would be a given, and the captain would find his career over.
Posted by BK 2004-06-03 6:17:38 PM||   2004-06-03 6:17:38 PM|| Front Page Top

#45 that may be your question,sorge, but mine was about what Bush believes. My belief may be incorrect, and you are free to argue that. But for someone to charecterize my belief as lefty, and to denounce it in the name of the neocons, when my beleif is SHARED by the neocons, makes rational discussion impossible. It as if I said we needed more troops in Iraq, and you said, no we went with the right amount, and i denounced you as a lefty and an enemy of the bush admin and a dupe of the NYT for saying so. It would be extremely hard to discuss things. You have to have a rational fact based discourse first. Whenever I attempt to substantively discuss the nature of Islam here, Jen comes in with ad hominems attacking me as a "lefty" - which is particularly disconcerting, since the views i am asserting are in fact the stated views of the admin about which she is so solicitous. When i point this out i get more ad hominems. Frankly, this is interfering with the substantive discussion of Islam.
Posted by Liberalhawk 2004-06-03 6:19:50 PM||   2004-06-03 6:19:50 PM|| Front Page Top

#46 hmmmm... LH you win easiy. I advise you to fling away the pork chop however.
Posted by Harpi 2004-06-03 7:03:59 PM||   2004-06-03 7:03:59 PM|| Front Page Top

#47 Whether or not you blame Tenet for 9-11,the CIA under his charge failed horribly in run-up to Iraq War.After firmly stating Iraq had WMD stockpiles,the CIA has produced no intel as to where they are.Sec.State Powell was totally sandbagged in UN by France.If the CIA had informed Powell that France was completely opposed to force in Iraq,the administration would have handled pre-war diplomacy completely differ.The CIA should have been on top of UNSCAM and connected dots between bribes paid to France,Russia and their opposition to Iraq War.Under his watch,the CIA failed in intel-gathering and analysis.(Anyone remember bombing Chinese Embassy by mistake?To date,there is still doubt whether the Sudanese milk factory was a weapons lab.)
Posted by Stephen 2004-06-03 7:14:59 PM||   2004-06-03 7:14:59 PM|| Front Page Top

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