Article

2005-11-17 Israel-Palestine-Jordan

Palestinians killed in Jordan Suicide attack were anti-Abu Mazen

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by mhw 2005-11-17 11:45|| || Front Page|| [1 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 whats not clear is if Dahlan is still with Abbas and Yousef, or if hes was going back to Nafeh. Also not clear if the Israelis were playing Nafeh against Abbas.

Posted by liberalhawk 2005-11-17 13:19|| 2005-11-17 13:19|| Front Page Top

#2 Also, I'm pretty sure that Al Q wasn't specifically gunning for Palestinians but they should have known that not just Jordanian but also PA big shots used the hotel for ceremonial and cash transaction meetings. And while Zarqawi has a personnal grudge against Jordanian officials, he has never said a harsh word about the PA.

So, was this just an intel failure on Zarqawi's part or has he developed a grudge against the PA or has he decided that Al Q should replace the PA?

Posted by mhw 2005-11-17 14:37|| 2005-11-17 14:37|| Front Page Top

#3 So, was this just an intel failure on Zarqawi's part or has he developed a grudge against the PA or has he decided that Al Q should replace the PA?

MHV...I think you missed Zarqawi's post attack statement where he explains about the mutlitude of inelligence agencies working for the infidel (US) and the list included the Palestinians. Secondly, I think you also missed Zawahiri's last letter and his book Knight's Under the Prophet's banner. In his letter, he casually mentions the Palestinians and then says they have the right struggle but are misled about the religious nature of the war. In his book, however, he was very negative about the secular nature of the Palestinian movement and actually said they were allied with the devil. He thinks that the war against Israel would be won if they used "purely islamic" slogans.

So, this is not about Zarqawi suddenly getting a bug up his butt and accidentaly blowing up some Palestinians. Aq wants to operate in the territories. They want to glom on to that cause (since it is the most polarizing in the ME). The security forces are very entrenched there and have informers all over the place. They also work with the Israelis and Jordanians, which ZARQ is correct about. The PA doesn't want Islamists in there any more than we do, but they'll use them however they can. However, AQ comes in, the PA might as well kiss their collective humps good bye.

So, I disagree and believe that, far from an accident, it was a deliberate targeting of the PA authorities there and probably included intelligence from some one inside the PA.

Think Like a Terrorist

Posted by kat-missouri">kat-missouri 2005-11-17 14:53|| http://themiddleground.blogspot.com]">[http://themiddleground.blogspot.com] 2005-11-17 14:53|| Front Page Top

#4 kat

If I read you correct you are assuming that Zarqawi's agenda is essentially the same as Zawahiri's.

I don't buy that.

Posted by mhw 2005-11-17 15:28|| 2005-11-17 15:28|| Front Page Top

#5 Mazen repeated the familiar formula about his desire to have "one authority, one law, one gun," and pointedly ignored the reporters' questions.

It's the usual issue of disparity between what is said and what is actually meant. When Abbas says, "one authority, one law, one gun", what is really meant is, "The Koran, Sharia Law and the AK-47." The only problem is, everybody has their own version and each of them uses it for their own ends.

However fearful the prospect of al Qaeda's venturing into the Palestinian Terrortories might be, it's still rather gratifying to see the PA get their lunch eaten for them by an organization that is truly set on getting results. The Palestinian Authority has wallowed in a morass of bloodletting (Israel's and their own) for so long that I almost welcome al Qaeda entering the scene so that we have a consistent enemy to deal with. Abbas' days are numbered.

Posted by Zenster 2005-11-17 15:58|| 2005-11-17 15:58|| Front Page Top

#6 If I read you correct you are assuming that Zarqawi's agenda is essentially the same as Zawahiri's.

I don't buy that

MHV..yes, that is what I'm saying. Their motivations and tactics might be different, but the goals are the same. of course we know that the largest goal is caliphate. the second goal is polarization of the Muslim Umma. the fourth is to obtain a base or emirate to establish and work out from.

In the case of the Palestine/israel issue, you can't really ignore the intersection of goals or that it is the most polarizing subject in the ME.

Secondly, you would have to know a few things about Zarqawi. he was born in Jordan, but he calls himself "Palestinian". Not because he was born in the territories, but because to hardcore Islamists, not only should Israel not exist, but neither should Jordan. These two lands, plus Lebanon and part of current day Syria was the historical Palestine during the ottoman empire and previous caliphates. You might recall that Arafat tried to lead a revolt in Jordan in the 1960's, but was put down by the king with the help of the bedouin army. That was no little tiff, but an issue that, if ever Israel was "wiped off the map", Jordan would be next. Not only because of its secular western leaning government, but because of the historical Palestinian borders.

Finally, both Zawahiri and Zarqawi have no love lost for the PA that sprang from the secular PLO. Zawahiri because it wasn't Islamic enough and Zarqawi because he thinks they were corrupt (rightly so) and sold their birth right for money from the west.

Posted by kat-missouri">kat-missouri 2005-11-17 16:47|| http://themiddleground.blogspot.com]">[http://themiddleground.blogspot.com] 2005-11-17 16:47|| Front Page Top

#7 I think Zman's affiliation with Palestinians preceded, and is much deeper, than Zawahiri's use of them to rouse the Arab rabble after the post 9/11 Afghan rout. Zman supposedly got Salafism during the second half of the 1980's at Palestinian refugee camps. In addition, like Kat says, though his family is from the east side of the Jordan river and is fairly prominent in Zarqa (father was a muktar), he calls himself a "Palestinian". Zarqa is also one the major refugee camps from the 1948 partition and war, radical, and absorbed many deported Saddam loving expats after the 1991 Kuwait war.

In addition, AQ has been muscling into Palestinian controlled territory with Syrian help, using the Ein al-Hilweh as the base. So I have no problem suspecting Zarq's group wanting to eliminate their competition and saw this highly prominent wedding as a perfect opportunity to take out a lot of high level Palestinian and Jordanian security officials.

Posted by ed 2005-11-17 18:30|| 2005-11-17 18:30|| Front Page Top

23:58 Zenster
23:44 Dave D.
23:16 Frank G
23:12 Jackal
23:10 Jackal
23:07 Jackal
23:07 Captain America
23:06 Slineting Jutch7676
23:04 Sock Puppet OÂ´ Doom
22:57 Bomb-a-rama
22:57 badanov
22:55 badanov
22:43 Frank G
22:40 Eric Jablow
22:35 Atomic Conspiracy
22:33 Alaska Paul
22:26 Frank G
22:24 Atomic Conspiracy
22:23 Dirty Harry
22:20 Frank G
22:18 Frank G
22:10 anymouse
22:07 Elmenter Snineque1852
22:05 John Q. Citizen