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2006-03-31 Home Front: WoT

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Posted by Hupinens Gretch8365 2006-03-31 00:23|| || Front Page|| [8 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 AP news. Sorry don't buy anything these twerps put out, unless other sources are available.

Any other verification?

Posted by Omaiting Shineper6088 2006-03-31 09:27|| 2006-03-31 09:27|| Front Page Top

#2 If this is being done, it is being done for both morale and operational reasons.

For much the same reason, soldiers are not permitted to use their own weapons (except in the rare case of using an enemy-captured weapon authorized by their local command.)

Another big reason is that privately obtained armor is designed for that one purpose only, not to be integrated with any other uniform features, and is designed for civilian, not military use.

You don't want soldiers to have a 'Send "Bob" forward--HE is the one with the good body armor' attitude.

Posted by Anonymoose 2006-03-31 09:57|| 2006-03-31 09:57|| Front Page Top

#3 They'll never be able to ban the stuff most guys really want and use.

here's a full debunking of the previous version of this rumor.

http://www.blackfive.net/main/2006/01/personal_body_a_1.html

Posted by OldSpook 2006-03-31 10:00|| 2006-03-31 10:00|| Front Page Top

#4 Actuallyt he stuff the troops that buy individually have is quite good. Police have been wearing anti-small arms ballistic protection far longer than the military, at least as a routine piece of gear. Military body armor until now has mainly been designed to protect from artillery or fragmentation effects, not bullets.

So the civialin stuff actually is probably better than all but the latest military stuff - and who do you think the military is buying from? Yep - those same companies.

But the individually purchased stuff can and will conform cosmetically to the military staandards - the troops demand that and will get it. Thats how the market place looks. But functionally, if you are a smart consumer, you actually can get a lot better stuff than the issued stuff. I knwo becasue I geared up before, well nevermind when and where (Im a civilian now, contractor).

Here is a point that was overlooked: Because it is usually custom fitted, it provides better protection (i.e. less coverage gapping), allows for more mobility and flexibility, and frequently weighs less and breathes better than issue gear. Add to that the ability to have some customization, like extra loops and hooks, a better chicken plate, and so on - its not the whitewash some brass hat types would have you beleive.

Posted by OldSpook 2006-03-31 10:23|| 2006-03-31 10:23|| Front Page Top

#5 Always micromanaging in a group that should have a sence of automaitic self preservation. I hated it then and I hate it now.

Posted by newc">newc 2006-03-31 12:20|| 2006-03-31 12:20|| Front Page Top

#6 Check it out. You are a Marine on "FOOT" patrol and carrying 70 pounds of equipment you need to survive. Guns, ammo, water, radio's etc. You are in a combat zone where you might have to scale walls, RUN for your life, or even have to swim for cover. Life is tough. Combat is cruel and people die. You have politicos who have no understanding of what combat is because the vast majority have never served. These do gooders with all the answers can't stand the political pressure of even discussing loss of a person engaged in mortal combat. These politicos in all their wisdom and cowardice decide to add an additional 20 pounds to the load with vests and steel plates to lug around. No wonder the vast number of BRAVE MARINES walking foot patrols choose not to carry the extra weight when given a choice. Survival in most cases is achieved by the fleet a foot and not the weighed down target silhouette.

Posted by Survival Spec">Survival Spec 2006-03-31 13:42|| 2006-03-31 13:42|| Front Page Top

#7 Hate to break your spiel, Spec [/sarcasm] -- but tell that to the families. IIRC, that's part of where the push for force protection comes from...

Posted by Edward Yee 2006-03-31 13:58|| http://edwardyee.fanworks.net]">[http://edwardyee.fanworks.net] 2006-03-31 13:58|| Front Page Top

#8 Riding in a Humvee or Bradley is much different from patrolling on foot. Speaking of Humvees they are becoming death traps on many occasions becaus of "OVER PRESSURE" Over pressure from an IED can't be defeated by body armor. I am for the troops and feel for their families losses an mine. The troops should decide.

Posted by Survival Spec">Survival Spec 2006-03-31 14:20|| 2006-03-31 14:20|| Front Page Top

#9 As a survior of a direct IED blast, I can definately say that you can't have enough armor in the turret of a humvee, however, on foot, anymore weight that you have now does hinder your movement. Read "A Soldier's Load and the Mobility of a Nation" if that doesn't make sense to you. When you are clearing houses or on patrol, you have a ton of shit to carry. Radio, Ammo, AT-4s, Water, breaching tools, etc. It adds up fast, not to mention the summer heat and then you add to that? nuts! The law of diminishing returns should apply....

Posted by Bama Marine 2006-03-31 14:45|| 2006-03-31 14:45|| Front Page Top

#10 Salute to Bama Marine. Welcome to Rantburg.

Posted by Seafarious">Seafarious 2006-03-31 15:01|| 2006-03-31 15:01|| Front Page Top

#11 In the first place, soldiers are not supposed to use anything anyways except what Uncle Sam or the CO's allow, including any non-USDOD/QuarterMaster issued guns and gear. Realistically, however, grunts far from home, Mom, and Washington will listen to these alleged "new" order(s) and then do what they want or need to do to personally survive in combat regardless of what any orders say. Soldiers or warriors, includ Commanders, throughout human history have always supplemented their stuffs - always have, always will, with or without the Death Star, Battlestar Galactica, or the Space Babes.

Posted by JosephMendiola 2006-03-31 21:11|| 2006-03-31 21:11|| Front Page Top

16:55 Foxtrot Uniform
16:20 Listen to Dogs
16:46 Zenster
23:49 trailing wife
23:47 Omomoling Angereck3709
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23:41 Prophet al-Arff al Wudo
23:38 Broadhead6
23:32 JosephMendiola
23:29 RWV
23:17 Your New Feudal Overlords
23:14 RWV
23:01 Anonymoose
23:00 RWV
22:57 Asymmetrical Triangulation
22:46 Leigh
22:37 Classical_Liberal
22:35 Prophet al-Arff a Wudo
22:23 trailing wife
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