Article

2010-08-21 -Obits-

'Ah, but that's the English War Office. You and I are both Scottish, and that doesn't apply.'

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by Anonymoose 2010-08-21 00:00|| || Front Page|| [7 views ] Top

#1 The movie "TLD" strongly infers LORD LOVAT as being IRISH, i.e. SEAN CONNERY Scene = "Aye, it takes an Irishman to play the Pipes"; as do a good number of Military Perts-Historians.

Posted by JosephMendiola 2010-08-21 02:10|| 2010-08-21 02:10|| Front Page Top

#2 Sean Connery is Scots, although of Irish ancestry as are many Scots and English, myself included.

Posted by phil_b 2010-08-21 03:40|| 2010-08-21 03:40|| Front Page Top

#3 The Australians besieged in Tobruk mention hearing teh sound of pipes preceeding the advance of the force who broke the siege.

Posted by JFM 2010-08-21 08:37|| 2010-08-21 08:37|| Front Page Top

#4 The sound of WELL-played pipes is a fearsome thing and will send the opposition fleeing. POORLY-played pipes (many would say that's a redundancy) will send even the allies fleeing.

Posted by Glenmore 2010-08-21 09:04|| 2010-08-21 09:04|| Front Page Top

#5 I always thought Sean Connery was portraying an Irshman in the movie and was criticising the Scott's playing.

Posted by Deacon Blues 2010-08-21 10:19|| 2010-08-21 10:19|| Front Page Top

#6 Brig. Simon Fraser, who as the 15th Lord Lovat was the hereditary chief of the Clan Fraser and one of Scotland's most celebrated aristocrats.

Ah, the ancient times when noblesse oblige meant privilege entailed responsibility, to include leading at the front. Not to be confused with any contemporary ~~ineffective, ineffectual, preening~~ ruling class ensconced behind their beltway moat.

Posted by Procopius2k 2010-08-21 10:33|| 2010-08-21 10:33|| Front Page Top

#7 Well a lot of people are of Irish ancestry. We Irish get around (and the English were in the habit of shipping the Irish all over the place in an effort to get rid of us)

Posted by OldSpook 2010-08-21 12:41|| 2010-08-21 12:41|| Front Page Top

#8 OS, the English were not above letting a million Irish die during the Great Potato Famine.

Posted by Rambler in Virginia 2010-08-21 13:17|| 2010-08-21 13:17|| Front Page Top

#9 BTW, the 15th Lord Lovat was a well known and respected Scots brawler, and under his leadership soon relieved the glider forces who were somewhat boxed in.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Fraser,_15th_Lord_Lovat

His grandson, 16th Lord Lovat, is a fund manager in Geneva, and intends to buy back the Clan castle from its current owner.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Fraser,_16th_Lord_Lovat

Posted by Anonymoose 2010-08-21 14:40|| 2010-08-21 14:40|| Front Page Top

#10 Well aware of the starvation. Its why some of my ancestors came here (1848, then survivors came in 1861). It all started with the evil Brits' Irish Catholics had been prohibited by the penal laws from owning land, from leasing land; from voting, from holding political office; from living in a corporate town or within five miles of a corporate town, from obtaining education, from entering a profession, etc. They then gave all the Irish land to absentee English lords -- "land lords" who regarded the land as a source of income from which to extract as much money as possible, regardless of the price the former owners, now tenants, paid.

The rest is history - and still passed down in some families to this day (including my own) as a "don't ever give up your freedom" lesson.

Posted by OldSpook 2010-08-21 15:29|| 2010-08-21 15:29|| Front Page Top

#11 The sad thing is that food (cattle, grain, dairy) was exported by the landlords to England where it was sold, instead of given to the starving Irish who had helped produce the food - and were barred from it by armed guards ans it was shipped from their areas, in many cases. Basically the English got fat and rich off Irish food, and refused to ship aid in, while the Irish starved.

If anyone wants to know why there is hatred even to this day, that's a good chunk of it.

Posted by OldSpook 2010-08-21 16:07|| 2010-08-21 16:07|| Front Page Top

#12 But the crafty Irish achieved their just revenge with the exportation of the dreaded Bushmills intoxicants and the lineage of the clan of Kennedy. Feckless Poms, they've buggered it up again they have. Woe be we and thee.

Posted by Besoeker 2010-08-21 16:17|| 2010-08-21 16:17|| Front Page Top

#13 Not too long before the famine, there was an English government commission set up to come up with a solution to "the Irish problem".

That is, the potato blight had already hit the continent, causing significant starvation. They knew it would soon hit Ireland. And their biggest concern was that millions of starving Irish would devastate England after crossing the Irish Sea.

The solution they hit on was to subsidize inexpensive passage to the US. In retrospect, it was about the only thing they could have done.

Famines are very harsh to a people. Recovery from plague, war, and disaster are quick, but Ireland as a country did not recover its momentum after the famine for 140 years. Starving people destroy everything, and are physically and psychologically handicapped for generations.

Posted by Anonymoose 2010-08-21 17:46|| 2010-08-21 17:46|| Front Page Top

#14 Well, I am unsure if "Dont get mad, get even" was invented by the Irish, but we sure do know how to smile while we're sharpening the blade.

Posted by OldSpook 2010-08-21 18:15|| 2010-08-21 18:15|| Front Page Top

#15 Ah, but there's the difference. Famine? Not so. In a famine there is not enough food being produced to feed the people living on the land. This was systematic starvation, combine with eviction and property grabs. There was plenty of food in Ireland, the problem was the English were exporting it, primarily to markets in England.

This was (deliberately nor not) a genocidal act by a government, not a famine.

Sir Charles Trevelyan, who was in charge of the administration of Government relief to the victims of the Irish Famine, limited the Government's actual relief because he thought "the judgement of God sent the calamity to teach the Irish a lesson". As was said, God sent the plague, but the English Government created the starvation.

And the Irish did learn: never surrender your liberty, and kill the English however you can.

As for the IRA, its not justification, but you can see the reasoning they were brought up with: the English callously inflicted death upon many women and children (and other incidents like Bloody Sunday 1920 in Dublin with the indiscriminate shooting by pistol rifle and machine gun of civilians at a football match by the British Black and Tans), so English civilians are fair game. Not justification, but you can see how the IRA has a pretty easy sell of the idea of killing English civilians.

Consider how bitter the US Civil war was. Now consider if 1/4 the US population had been forced to leave the continent, or else died. How long those wounds would have taken to heal?

Posted by OldSpook 2010-08-21 18:33|| 2010-08-21 18:33|| Front Page Top

#16 "Sir Charles Trevelyan, who was in charge of the administration of Government relief to the victims of the Irish Famine, limited the Government's actual relief because he thought "the judgement of God sent the calamity to teach the Irish a lesson"."

So, "Sir" Charles was Islamic?

Who knew?

Posted by Barbara Skolaut 2010-08-21 19:29|| 2010-08-21 19:29|| Front Page Top

#17 Actually, Barbara, a number of Christians also believe(d) that God acted directly to punish evil doers in this life.

Posted by Rambler in Virginia 2010-08-21 21:50|| 2010-08-21 21:50|| Front Page Top

#18 I know that, Rambler - I've run into more than one of those in my life.

I guess I needed a snark tag....

Posted by Barbara Skolaut 2010-08-21 23:57|| 2010-08-21 23:57|| Front Page Top

23:57 Barbara Skolaut
23:52 Swamp Blondie
23:51 Procopius2k
23:49 chris
23:47 Swamp Blondie
23:46 chris
23:46 chris
23:44 chris
23:36 chris
23:08 Pappy
23:00 Pappy
22:26 Redneck Jim
22:04 Uncle Phester
21:57 Old Patriot
21:51 Hellfish
21:50 Rambler in Virginia
21:07 DarthVader
20:52 Besoeker
20:42 Besoeker
20:37 badanov
20:36 Besoeker
20:34 Besoeker
20:12 Procopius2k
20:07 Barbara Skolaut