KABUL: Afghanistans most controversial female MP was removed from her post by the lower house of parliament on Monday for calling the house worse than a stable.
A videotape of the private TV interview in which Malalai Joya recently made the remarks was shown in the house before most delegates voted for her removal. A stable is better, for there you have a donkey that carries a load and a cow that provides milk. The parliament is worse than a stable, she was heard to remark. Joya, seen as controversial and outspoken for criticising some mujahideen leaders and commanders, could not be reached for comment. The 28-year old womens rights activist is reasonably famous at home, but her real recognition came in the West when she spoke out against some mujahideen figures in 2003.
She won a seat in the 2005 parliamentary elections. There are 68 women MPs in parliament among the 248 lawmakers.
Britain's Crown Prosecution Service said it has sufficient evidence to charge Russian Andrei Lugovoy with the murder of former spy Alexander Litvinenko in London last November. Here is a timeline of events in the Litvinenko case:
Nov. 1, 2006 - Litvinenko complains of feeling unwell after a day spent meeting contacts. After meeting Italian security expert Mario Scaramella at the Itsu sushi bar in London's Piccadilly, he had seen former KGB contacts Andrei Lugovoy and Dmitry Kovtun at the Millennium hotel in Grosvenor Square. Radiation traces were later found at both places.
Nov. 3 - Litvinenko is admitted to hospital in London.
Nov. 23 - He dies of radiation poisoning. Traces of polonium 210 are found in his system.
Nov. 24 - Litvinenko accuses Russian President Vladimir Putin of his murder in a statement read out by friends the morning after his death. Putin brushes off the accusation.
Nov. 28 - British Prime Minister Tony Blair promises that "no diplomatic or political barrier" will be allowed to hamper the investigation into Litvinenko's death.
Dec. 1 - Pathologists carry out a post mortem on Litvinenko's body.
- British scientists say two more people have been contaminated with polonium 210. Scaramella is admitted to hospital in London after the isotope was detected in his body. Traces of polonium 210 are also found in the urine of Litvinenko's widow Marina. Scaramella leaves hospital on Dec. 6.
Dec. 4 - British police fly to Moscow as part of investigation.
Dec. 6 - British police say they are now treating Litvinenko's death as murder.
- British police and investigators from Russian Prosecutor-General Yuri Chaika's office question Kovtun in the same hospital where Lugovoy is being treated, apparently for radiation poisoning.
Dec. 7 - Litvinenko is buried in London's Highgate cemetery.
- Russian prosecutors launch their own murder investigation into the Litvinenko death. Prosecutors also open a criminal case into what they said was the attempted murder of Kovtun. Jan. 9, 2007 - Russia announces that Lugovoy was discharged from a Moscow hospital at the end of December. Lugovoy declined to say whether he had been contaminated with polonium 210.
Jan 31 - Scotland Yard police hand their file on the Litvinenko investigation to the Crown Prosecution Service.
Feb. 1 - President Putin says at a news conference that Litvinenko knew no official secrets and had no reason to leave Russia.
May 22 - The CPS announces it has enough evidence to charge Andrei Lugovoy with the murder of Litvinenko and will seek his extradition.
Methinks Andrei will suddenly come down with the fabled (and fatal) "Russian Flu".
Posted by: Steve ||
05/22/2007 07:42 ||
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Posted by: ed ||
05/22/2007 9:30 Comments ||
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#3
I happened to be in Highgate Cemetery when they buried Litvinenko. Its the only grave you can visit at night since its the only one with its own lighting. Never has their been such a necessity as a lead lined casket.
Posted by: Jack is Back! ||
05/22/2007 10:40 Comments ||
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MOSCOW: The Russian prosecutor-general's office said it would not turn over Andrei Lugovoi, charged by Britain on Tuesday in the poisoning death of Alexander Litvinenko, the Interfax news agency reported. "In accordance with Russian law, citizens of Russia cannot be turned over to foreign states," the agency quoted prosecutor's office spokeswoman Marina Gridneva as saying.
"Nyet!"
The office declined comment to The Associated Press, referring callers to Russian agency reports.
However, a Russian lawmaker raised doubts about the reported claim that Russian law prevented such extraditions. Yuri Sharandin, chairman of the constitutional legislation committee of the Federation Council, the upper house of parliament, said it was possible for Russia to extradite its citizens, but that it also could refuse such requests.
"Sometimes we will, and sometimes we won't. Depends on how much he knows.....and about who."
Sharandin said on Ekho Moskvy radio that the matter would come under the European Convention on Extradition, to which both Russia and Britain are signatories. He said the convention allows for such extraditions, but also gives the country receiving the request the right to refuse.
If I was Andrei, I wouldn't make any long term plans.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/22/2007 07:33 ||
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French Foreign Minister Bernard Kouchner spoke with Lebanese Prime Minister Fuad Siniora on Sunday to assure him of France's solidarity following an outburst of violence in north Lebanon, his office said. Kouchner, who took office on Friday in the government of President Nicolas Sarkozy, "expressed France's solidarity and trust in the Lebanese authorities to restore order and calm," the foreign ministry said in a statement. In the telephone call, Kouchner stressed the importance Paris gave to "the independence, sovereignty and stability of Lebanon" and the need to "investigate the situation, especially in Tripoli." The two men also discussed plans for a meeting "in the near future." And for the "Things That Make You Go Hmmm" files:
Sarkozy's predecessor Jacques Chirac was a close friend of Lebanon's former prime minister Rafiq Hariri, who was assassinated in February 2005. The former president and his wife moved into a Paris apartment belonging to the Hariri family after he left the Elysee last Wednesday.
Do you think the French had some ideas about Lebanon that the Syrians got a whiff off (as one would do) and popped Hariri as a shot across the bow of the good ship Chirac? Nah, too obvious.
Posted by: Jack is Back! ||
05/22/2007 10:44 Comments ||
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#6
Do you think the French had some ideas about Lebanon that the Syrians got a whiff off (as one would do) and popped Hariri as a shot across the bow of the good ship Chirac?
Nah. What happened was that Hariri had some ideas about the Syrians in Lebanon that the Syrians didn't like. So, as a shot across the bow of any one else who got the idea that Lebanon without Syria would be a good thing, they had him wacked. However, Hariri had a lot of good friends and business contacts in high places, like Chirac and the Saudi royal family. So it backfired on them.
Posted by: Steve ||
05/22/2007 17:21 Comments ||
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A Lebanese-born German, who accuses the CIA of having kidnapped and tortured him, has been arrested on suspicion of setting fire to a shop in Bavaria. German police arrested Khaled al-Masri near the shop in Neu-Ulm on Thursday. He was sent to a psychiatric clinic and the fire was quickly extinguished.
His lawyer said his client had lacked proper psychological counselling.
Mr Masri says he was kidnapped in Macedonia in 2003, flown to a secret jail in Afghanistan and tortured there. He says he was detained for five months before being released in Albania after the Americans realised they had got the wrong man.
Munich prosecutors have ordered the arrest of 13 suspected CIA agents in connection with the alleged "extraordinary rendition" case.
Mr Masri says his case is an example of the US practice of flying foreign terror suspects to third countries without judicial process for interrogation or detention.
He told the BBC in February: "I'm suffering from stress - this experience has left me traumatised." His German lawyer, Manfred Gnjidic, said Mr Masri had acted out of desperation after arguing with staff at the shop in Neu-Ulm. Masri is the real victim here. Really.
Posted by: ed ||
05/22/2007 15:03 ||
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#1
His German lawyer, Manfred Gnjidic, said Mr Masri had acted out of desperation after arguing with staff at the shop in Neu-Ulm.
Ah, that old Muslim favorite...
Awwwwwww...look what you made me do!
--- For US Muslims under 30, 2% say suicide bombings of civilians to defend Islam can often be justified, 13 percent say sometimes and 11 percent say rarely.
--- 5% of US Muslims expressed favorable views of Al-Qaeda and about 25% did not give an opinion.
--- Only 40 percent said they believe Arab men carried out the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001.
--- 1/3 said it was wrong for the US to invade Afghanistan
--- Six in 10 said they are concerned about a rise in Islamic extremism in the U.S
Andrew Kohut, director of the Pew Research Center, said in an interview that support for the attacks represented "one of the few trouble spots" in the survey. few? Few? FEW??? US Muslim sentiment for the Jihad against the west has to be far greater than that of the US Japanese population for Imperial Japan on 8 Dec 1941. Naturally the MSM will spin and distort this poll beyond all belief in the next few days.
#5
Combine that group with the 35% of Democrats who believe that the president knew about the 9/11 attacks before they occurred and we have a vast fifth column within the United States.
#6
Its time to get ready for domestic counterinsurgency ops.
Posted by: Mike N. ||
05/22/2007 19:06 Comments ||
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#1 Two words: Instantaneous deportation.
That only pushes the problem from one place to another, Zenster. I'd much rather see instantaneous decomposition. It's very difficult to cause trouble after that, especially if there are no clues left at the scene.
Posted by: Old Patriot ||
05/22/2007 19:33 Comments ||
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#8
2% say suicide bombings of civilians to defend Islam can often be justified, 13 percent say sometimes and 11 percent say rarely.
#9
That only pushes the problem from one place to another, Zenster. I'd much rather see instantaneous decomposition.
I hear ya, Old Patriot. I'm just trying to avoid the sinktrap be polite. One of the final steps we have before nuclear annihilation is put on the table is reconsolidating the world's Muslim population back into their countries of origin. Children born abroad are returned with their parents, tough noogies.
No alteration of existing borders within the Middle East is allowed. No Muslims go outside of them into non-Muslim countries. No development of nuclear weapons or other WMDs. No aggression or a jackbooted heel grinds some portion of their population into dust. Few other measures will buy us the time needed to convince Islam of the error of its ways. I'm not even sure if that is possible, but we need to try it before glassing over some one billion people. With each passing day, Islam is less and less deserving of such mercy. It is only out of obligation to our own sense of humanity that we must try to give this one last attempt. One thing is completely clear, Muslims simply cannot be trusted to live amicably in other cultures. They will always seek jihad, be it fast or slow, and that is simply unacceptable.
#11
Okay, here's an idea... Some agency should poll muzzies in US (and an equivalent agency in Canada, sure) and those who would express an agreement with splodey bombing should be gathered (likely involuntarily, but sometimes people refuse gifts because of ignorance) in a secured place, issued splodey vests and give a chance to splode sooner than later, to get they virgin quota. (some sort of timer would be nice, if they hesitate for too long).
A Florida doctor was convicted Monday of providing material support to terrorists by agreeing to treat injured Al Qaeda fighters so they could return to Iraq to battle Americans. Dr. Rafiq Abdus Sabir, 52, was convicted in Manhattan federal court after a three-week trial that featured testimony by him and Ali Soufan, an FBI agent who posed as an Al Qaeda recruiter in a sting operation that led to four arrests.
When the verdict was read, Sabir just looked straight ahead. Later, as he was escorted from the courtroom, he waved to supporters, who said, "Stay strong." His lawyer, Ed Wilford, said, "We are deeply disappointed in the verdict."
The charges against the Harlem-born Sabir, including conspiracy to provide material support to terrorists, carry a potential maximum sentence of 30 years in prison.
The verdict came after jurors heard audio tapes of a May 2005 ceremony in a Bronx apartment in which Sabir and his best friend, Tariq Shah, a martial arts expert and jazz musician, pledged loyalty to Al Qaeda and, the government alleged, Usama bin Laden.
Shah pleaded guilty just before trial to providing material support to a terrorist organization and agreed to serve 15 years in prison, though he has not yet been formally sentenced. A Brooklyn bookstore owner who pleaded guilty was sentenced to 13 years in prison. A Washington, D.C., cab driver has pleaded guilty and agreed to serve 15 years in prison.
Sabir, of Boca Raton, Fla., testified at trial that Shah never told him he was talking with an Al Qaeda recruiter. At the pledge ceremony, Soufan mispronounced Al Qaeda more than a dozen times, Sabir said. He also said he did not know "sheik Usama" meant bin Laden.
He didn't know anything about jihad, had never heard of the Qu'ran, and didn't know a thing about infidels.
#3
Is a doctor forbidden from treating people who are believed to be criminals? In general he is forbidden to NOT treat people who need it, regardless of whether they are criminals. I know it is arguing the extreme, but shouldn't this ruling mean Navy corpsmen don't treat wounded al Quada who are captured?
#4
...treat injured Al Qaeda fighters so they could return to Iraq to battle Americans.
Why would they want to go back? Once they got to the Land of the Great Satan, why not explode yourself in a gas station, or go postal in a suburban mall?
Are you trying to suggest, Mr. Un-named AP Reporter, that Jihadis would rather fight our soldiers in Iraq than kill civilians right here?
Why, that would make George W. Bush a genius!
Posted by: Bobby ||
05/22/2007 7:11 Comments ||
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Bobby, I seem to recall the good doctor was going to, or perhaps it was in, Saudi Arabia or Kuwait at the time, treating American troops and other English speakers.
John Edwards hasn't won over any friends at the American Legion for his plan to protest the war on Memorial Day. Paul Morin, national commander of the American Legion, posted an open letter of the groups website blasting Edwards for what Morin says is an inappropriate political calculation that "blatantly violated the sanctity of this most special day," the Hill reports.
Edwards wants people to protest the war at Memorial Day Parades and gatherings, take photos and then he will place those photos on his website. Buy a bunch of poster-board and markers, the website says. At a picnic or with family and friends, make signs that say SUPPORT THE TROOPS - END THE WAR. Bring them to your local Memorial Day parade. Then take a digital photo of yourself and your family or friends holding up the poster and tell us about it. Well include it in a Democracy Photo Album on our site.
"Memorial Day is a solemn occasion to remember the service and sacrifice of more than 1 million American servicemen and -women who gave their lives to create our nation, to save our union, and to help free the world from tyranny, Davis said. It is not a time to call people to protest the war under the guise of supporting the troops.
He adds: "If you want to honor these heroes, visit a veterans cemetery on Memorial Day. Attend a parade without the divisive political signs. Make cards for the comrades of the fallen that are recuperating in military and VA hospitals. Lay a wreath at the stone of a departed hero."
John Edwards called on Americans to spend Memorial Day weekend honoring our fallen soldiers and supporting our troops currently serving overseas by urging our government to end this war and bring them home, Edwards spokesman Eric Schultz said. Edwards believes we must reclaim what patriotism means - the best way to support our troops is not doing whatever President Bush says to prolong the war, but rather ending the war and bringing our troops home to the heros welcome they deserve.
Patriotism equals surrender? Odd choice. Sen. Barack Obamas (D-Ill.) campaign declined to comment on Edwardss call to action, but it did say it would engage in more traditional campaign activities over the holiday weekend.
Phil Singer, spokesman for Sen. Hillary Rodham Clintons (D-N.Y.) campaign, said, Sen. Clinton will be honoring our nations veterans.
#1
Hey John: Keep digging, I know that eventually even you can hit bottom. And I know that this is really sure to win over vets. Please send me two of your bumper stickers; one to sh!t on and the other to cover it up. digital pix available
#2
As preposterous as Edwards is (not to mention loathsome, in both his political and shakedown artist liability lawyer's roles, it's pretty depressing that a candidate could even suggest this and still be politically alive.
#3
It's a test, Mr. Verlaine. I am hoping to get folks to join my parade, and lead the Country out of the Bush swamp-morrass to flowers and full employment and a great economy.
What? We have two of those things? Who says? Flowers all used up after Mother's Day?
Posted by: John Edwards ||
05/22/2007 7:04 Comments ||
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#4
Get a four hundred dollar haircut. Count your money. Explore another uncharted section of your fifty thousand square foot home. Ask your wife how that cancer thingie's going...
Posted by: John Edwards ||
05/22/2007 9:27 Comments ||
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"Phil Singer, spokesman for Sen. Hillary Rodham Clintons (D-N.Y.) campaign, said, Sen. Clinton will be honoring our nations veterans.
...by not wearing a skirt that day".
Posted by: Jack is Back! ||
05/22/2007 10:49 Comments ||
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Hey John, just a reminder as to who gave their blood and sacrificed their lives so that you could lead a protest on Memorial Day. Your time could be better spent visiting and thanking soldiers in a V.A. hospital, VFW, AMVET or a Vet's shelter instead of what your are proposing.
It is the Soldier
It's the soldier, not the reporter who has given us Freedom of the Press.
It's the soldier, not the poet, who has given us
Freedom of Speech.
It's the soldier, not the campus organizer, who has given us the Freedom to Demonstrate.
It's the soldier, not the lawyer, who has given us the Right to a Fair Trial.
It's the soldier who salutes the flag, serves under the flag and whose coffin is draped by the flag, who gives the protester the right to burn the flag.
#8
Get a four hundred dollar haircut. Count your money. Explore another uncharted section of your fifty thousand square foot home. Ask your wife how that cancer thingie's going...
#12
I don't know, Sarge, the dummycritters have a full stable of idiots. It'd be hard to distinguish who is more stupid, John Edwards, Dennis Kucinich, Barrack Obama, Chris Dodd, John F'n Kerry (who is "not running, in order to be drafted"), Bill Richardson, and so on. That cast of characters can even make Ron Paul look halfway intelligent. Now THAT'S saying something!
Posted by: Old Patriot ||
05/22/2007 19:42 Comments ||
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Sorry, nothing can make Ron Paul look halfway intelligent.
Tension mounted in the capital over the Lal Masjid issue on Sunday when police took 36 students of Jamia Fareedia in pre-emptive detention, and the madressah militants taking to streets and blocking traffic. Police claimed that the Jamia students had been picked up because they were reinforcing the militants, known as the Lal Masjid brigade, which had kidnapped four policemen on Friday in their latest escapade. Two of the policemen were released in exchange for grant of bail to five Lal Masjid madressah students.
Heavily-armed Rangers, elite force and reserve police from the Punjab Police Constabulary were called out in Islamabad and, at one stage, it seemed that a massive crackdown on Lal Masjid and Jamia Hafsa was being planned. Rangers and police personnel were deployed at exit and entry points of the city and blocks were placed to divert traffic from roads leading to Lal Masjid.
Barbed wires were laid around the Aabpara police station, not far from Lal Masjid and Jamia Hafsa where masked militants carrying sticks took positions. The students of Lal Masjid and Jamia Hafsa also put up a show of strength by preparing trenches and hideouts. Lal Masjid deputy in-charge Maulana Abdul Rasheed Ghazi warned the government that it would be responsible for the consequences if it launched any assault on the seminaries. Talking to newsmen, Maulana Ghazi flatly refused to continue talks with the government and said his men were being picked up by intelligence agencies. He made it clear that his people reserved the option of launching countrywide suicide attacks if any operation was launched against them.
Many families living in areas around Lal Masjid have shifted to other parts of the city. Meanwhile, military authorities and senior intelligence and administration officials held a series of meetings to discuss ways to handle the crisis.
#1
May 22 (Bloomberg) -- Clerics released police officers being held at a mosque in Pakistan's capital, Islamabad, ending a standoff with security forces. ``The Red Mosque clerics have released all the policemen they had taken hostage from outside their seminaries,'' Tariq Azeem, the junior minister for information and broadcasting, said in a telephone interview today. ``There was no need for use of force.''
Security forces were withdrawn from around the mosque known as the Lal Masjid, he said.
Damm
Posted by: Steve ||
05/22/2007 8:13 Comments ||
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My father in law was a TPF cop in Boston back in the 60's. One of the unknown perks of the job he liked was standing in a line abreast of fifty cops, tapping your nightstick in your hand, smiling at the hippies and seeing the looks on their faces when they realized what was coming...
#3
smiling at the hippies and seeing the looks on their faces when they realized what was coming...
"COUNTRY DEEJAYS KNOW THAT I'M AN OUTLAW
THEY'D NEVER COME TO SEE ME IN THIS DIVE
WHERE BIKERS STARE AT COWBOYS
WHO ARE LAUGHING' AT THE HIPPIES
WHO ARE PRAYING' THEY'LL GET OUT OF HERE ALIVE"
Posted by: Steve ||
05/22/2007 17:25 Comments ||
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Unidentified miscreants in rocket attacks destroyed about ten oil tankers parked at the Torkham border on Monday which were about to leave for Afghanistan to supply oil to US-led coalition forces.
According to political authorities, some unknown miscreants fired two rockets from the nearby mountains on oil tankers that hit two of them which also enflamed other eight tankers parked nearby. Locals said that the missiles were fired from a small mountain through remote control and they were launched from a 30-metere distance. It is reported that the political authorities had recovered three rocket launchers from the adjacent mountain. The missile attack took place at 4:30 am in the morning in which no causality was reported.
The administration has claimed that it collected three missiles from the scene, which was unfired. No group claimed responsibility for the attack but Taliban in the past had claimed carrying out similar attacks. Taliban have repeatedly warned Pakistan drivers not to carry goods and oil for the US-led forces in Afghanistan to avoid their attacks. It is to be noted here that bomb blasts targeting oil tankers in Landi Kotal have become a routine business, but the administration is not serious to take any security measures nor did it arrest any body on suspicion in the past.
#1
It's a safe bet the 'unknown miscreants' who blew up the ten oil tankers which were slated to be delivered to NATO forces combating the enemy in Afghanistan was the terrorist work of al-Qaida & their Taliban cohorts.
Posted by: Mark Espinola ||
05/22/2007 2:30 Comments ||
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#2
Pakistan, by doing nothing to protect legal commerce on its soil from factions at war with the US is effectively allied with those factions, and thus also at war with us. We should move the border (it's a disputed line anyway) into Pakistan each time something like this happens - before long we should reach India and the problem would be solved.
#3
Never made much sense to ship fuel via Taliban sponsoring Pakistan. Seems it's just asking for supply interruptions and equipment destruction. Better to ship fuel via the ex-Soviet Stans, even it is a longer route to southern Afghan, and let them garner the economic rewards. At least the profits won't come back at our troops as bombs and bullets.
Posted by: ed ||
05/22/2007 8:46 Comments ||
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#4
What is a 30-metere distance? Why are tankers "bunched" up?
So oil went up in smoke that was to be used by the military? It will have to be replaced. Gas at the pump jumps by 30 cents/gal.? The excuse that gas is high is that we lack refinery capacity. I have heard this for several years. Why doesn't someone build a refinery or two?
Because nobody wants one in their 'back yard'. Though no new refineries have been built in the US in decades (and many old, small, or/and ineffiecient ones have been closed down) total US refinery capacity has not declined - because remaining refineries were enlarged and made more efficient. But product demand has increased, hence shortages. I am not sure, but suspect limits to expansion and efficiency improvements are about reached, so problem won't go away unless demand drops (recession will do that, for instance.) New refineries will be overseas, where both construction and operating costs are lower - but where output is more at economic risk of being sent elsewhere (maybe China, or Europe), and also at risk of political disruption (see Venezuela or Nigeria for instance.)
#6
Or refineries will be built in out of the way places like deserts. Transporation costs will be much higher than if built near the coast. One bright spot is Fischer-Tropsch coal to liquids conversion. A plant will produce 1/2 the product that is clean diesel and 1/2 that is naphtha that will require further processing into gasoline.
Posted by: ed ||
05/22/2007 11:39 Comments ||
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#7
Have the Louisiana refineries come back on-line following the damage caused by Hurricane Katrina?
#8
Most Louisiana refineries have come back on. I know of one that has not - there might be one or two others not restored to more-or-less normal operations, but certainly no more than that.
#9
I believe Bush has pushed for the construction of three new 500,000bpd refineries to be built, and environmental requirements be waived, after Katrina. There were a wave of lawsuits from the usual suspects, but apparently ground has been broken for one in Houston, one near Baton Rouge, and one either in Beaumont, Tx, or Lake Charles, La. They're all still susceptable to hurricanes, but the oil companies are reinforcing refineries to better withstand the threat. Unfortunately, it takes six to ten years to build a refinery and get it operational. There's still a huge need for at least five additional refineries to be built in the East and on the Pacific coast. I won't see them online in my lifetime.
There's a small Valero oil company refinery in Denver that is currently operating at 65% capacity due to a fire. It should be back online at 100% by mid-summer. Regular unleaded gas is currently $3.40 here in the Springs.
Posted by: Old Patriot ||
05/22/2007 19:51 Comments ||
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The Supreme Court Registrar Office returned on Monday a constitutional petition by Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal (MMA) President Qazi Hussain Ahmed against President Pervez Musharraf. Hussain had filed the petition a few days ago, challenging the continuation of Musharraf as chief of army staff (COAS) despite him passing his superannuating age of 60. The registrar filed the objection that the president enjoyed immunity under Article 248 of the Constitution and therefore he could not be nominated as a respondent in any case. The registrar also objected to the petitioner making multiple prayers in his petition, which were technically not related to the subject and contents of the petition. Hussain had maintained that General Pervez Musharraf is continuously violating the Constitution, law and service rules by addressing public rallies. He sought a court directive against Musharrafs tenure as chief of army staff.
IT'S not just clouds that shroud Waziristan's treacherous high country. Up here on the Afghan border, a veil of state secrecy also cloaks a new Taliban wave breaking eastward across Pakistan.
Against the totemic thump of the drums of war, dust churns as the bodies of suspected anti-Taliban spies are dragged behind Toyota utes - as many as four at a time.
The severed heads of those who cross the fanatical jihadis are held aloft in cheering, jeering crowds. And in the bazaar, just a few rupees buys one of the hottest selling new DVDs - that's the one in which a 12-year-old boy wields the decapitation knife.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: John Frum ||
05/22/2007 00:00 ||
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#1
Against the totemic thump of the drums of war, dust churns as the bodies of suspected anti-Taliban spies are dragged behind Toyota utes - as many as four at a time.
Now gawddammit, enough is enough. That's our idea, and you shitbags have no right to rip us off.
#4
Perv needs to wise up and let the US napalm all those madrassahs and other "holy sites". I'm sure the talibunnies will be in less of a mood to fight after getting fricasseed.
Posted by: Old Patriot ||
05/22/2007 19:54 Comments ||
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MOGADISHU, Somalia - A cargo ship carrying food for poor Somalis refused to leave Kenya on Monday because of rampant piracy, and the U.S. Navy warned vessels to stay clear of Somalia's lawless waters where everyone from aid workers to fishermen have become targets. The U.N. World Food Program has appealed for international action to stamp out Somali pirates threatening the delivery of humanitarian supplies to the Horn of Africa country, which is trying to recover from the worst fighting in more than a decade.
The ship was loaded with 850 tons of food, but the shipping agency contracted by the WFP demanded the Kenyan government provide security for travel into Somali waters. On Saturday, pirates staged a failed hijack attempt on another WFP boat, killing a Somali guard. "We need some sort of security to ply into Somali waters ... because they (Somali pirates) are everywhere. Now they are ashore, (and) very far off into the sea. It is becoming too much," Inayet Kudrati of the Motaku Shipping Agency said Monday.
Posted by: Redneck Jim ||
05/22/2007 6:11 Comments ||
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#2
Good thing the Royal Navy is not needed any more. As we know, building naval vessels to patrol the high seas only perpetuates the cycle of violence. Now that "state piracy" is on the decline I expect Somali sailor activists will wither away too as a consequence of the dialectic.
The top military commander in Iraq has urged people there to support the country and government and reject violence and sectarianism. This is a pivotal time, and inaction may be tantamount to failure, Army Gen. David H. Petraeus, commander of Multinational Force Iraq, wrote in a letter dated May 16.
In the open letter to the Iraqi people, Petraeus urged the Iraqi people to take an active role in the rebirth of your nation.
He said that coalition forces, along with Iraqi security forces, are working to rid the country of extremists of all sects. The letter went out to all television, radio and print outlets in the country, officials said.
The letter comes as the U.S. military surge into Iraq continues. By the beginning of June, the additional 21,500 U.S. combat personnel in five brigade combat teams will be in place. The coalition forces work closely with more than 348,000 trained and equipped members of the Iraqi security forces.
But even with this force, the Iraqi government and the coalition need the help of the people. We need your help if we are going to quell the violence, Petraeus said. Deny the enemy shelter; report any information you may have regarding his whereabouts; and be proud of and support your nations security forces.
He asked the Iraqi people to understand that restrictions on movement are designed to make neighborhoods safer. As security improves, the barriers will come down as quickly as they went up, and you will be able to return to a more normal way of life, he wrote.
Petraeus asked Iraqis to not only reject violence, but to embrace reconciliation for the future. He said Iraqs future does not include extremists, and he called on all Iraqis to live together peacefully.
The coalition can help you realize this objective, he said. In the end, however, success depends on you.
Posted by: Bobby ||
05/22/2007 07:38 ||
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If Petraeus pulls this off, he's going down alongside Sir Gerald Templer as one of the finest counterinsurgency warriors in history.
Posted by: Mac ||
05/22/2007 9:20 Comments ||
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#2
Hell, if he pulls this off, I will name my next 3 unborn after him. If he runs for President, I will vote for him.
#3
"...take an active role in the rebirth of your nation.
A regrettable choice of words. "Action" has a different connotation over there. I feel for this general, though; nothing like being given a mission and then having others try to undermine it before you've even started. It's great that he is saying this.
Wish he had pointed out that it's not helpful, in terms of keeping America on their side, for Iraqis to believe it's ok to kill coalition soldiers.
US Ambassador Richard Jones said on Monday it is unlikely that convicted Pentagon spy Jonathan Pollard will ever be released and that the fact that the US did not execute him should be seen as an act of clemency. Responding to audience questions during an academic conference at Bar-Ilan University in Ramat Gan, Jones said Pollard's crimes appear especially heinous to many Americans because he was caught spying for a friendly power. Pollard, a US Navy civilian intelligence analyst, sold military secrets to Israel while working at the Pentagon. He was arrested in 1985 and pleaded guilty at his trial. He is serving a life sentence in a US federal prison.
"It came out in the trial very clearly, Jonathan Pollard took money for what he did, he sold out his country," Jones said. "The fact that he wasn't executed is the [only] mercy that Jonathan Pollard will receive. This is a very emotional issue in the United States. I know he was helping a friend, but that's what makes it even more emotional for Americans, if a friend would cooperate in aiding and abetting someone who is committing treason against his own country."
Pollard's wife, Esther, slammed the ambassador's remarks as "malicious incitement" and "gross slander" and urged Prime Minister Ehud Olmert to send Jones home for his "lies and slander." Esther Pollard also said that Jones's claim that her husband took money and sold out his country was baseless.
"Most important of all, Israel formally admitted in 1998 that Jonathan Pollard was a bona fide Israeli agent. The formal recognition of Jonathan as an Israeli agent puts the lie to any claims that Jonathan spied out of mercenary motives," she said.
The Prime Minister's Office had no response to Jones's comments. The government has traditionally shied away from publicly trading brickbats with the US over the issue. Despite calls by some politicians and pro-Pollard activists here for Jones to be recalled for his statements, his comments were likely to be received well in Washington, where the State Department, Justice Department and intelligence community like US government officials to talk very tough on Pollard, officials in Jerusalem said.
US government officials, who almost never bring up the issue on their own, are consistently very tough when discussing Pollard in order - it is widely believed - that no one get the impression there is any "wiggle room" on the issue of his release.
#1
Nothing Israel has ever done, including the USS Liberty, has been as damaging to their cause in the U.S. as the Pollard incident. Whoever was in charge of that one for Mossad should be booked for treason against Israel. Dumb, dumb, dumb!.
Posted by: Mac ||
05/22/2007 1:41 Comments ||
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#2
Bottom line, don't get caught. Pollard should have hung. If one of ours gets caught in the IDF establishment I'd expect the same.
The Isrealis spy on the US all the time. I'd hardly call them reliable allies. They were perfectly willing to sell AWACS technology to the Chinese until Uncle Sam got really mad. The Chinese new modern jet fighter is a copy of the Isreali one. Allies, indeed.
#5
The birds do it, the bees do it, they all do it - the UK, the French, even the Canadians when they can put down their Molson. Everyone spies on us because we have so much more to spy on and we are pretty easy the way our defense/industrial/technology infrastructure is spread out and so diverse.
Posted by: Jack is Back! ||
05/22/2007 10:55 Comments ||
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#6
especially heinous to many Americans because he was caught spying for a friendly power
Seriously? More heinous than betraying American secrets to an enemy power actively working toward our destruction? Just about as bad as the Rosenbergs, who gave the secret of the atom bomb to the Soviet Union at the height of the Cold War? From the same America that tried to frame the AIPAC people just a few months ago, merely because someone was in a snit about neocons and Likudniks? The same America that one presidency ago gave our secrets to Communist China wholesale? That one presidency ago counted Yasser Arafat as the most frequent guest to the White House?
No, Mr. Pollard should not have spied for Israel. But can you blame Israel for not completely trusting America, given the cross currents within its government, some of which are actively inimical to Israel's very survival. Even those on her side force Israel to do things contra-survival, like stopping short of wiping out Hizb'allah last summer, or engaging once again in a peace process designed to erase Israel by differential amounts.
#7
TW, your points are all valid ones. What I'm saying is that whoever authorized this didn't give enough thought to the potential fallout from the worst-case scenario, which is exactly what Israel now has. Was there ANYTHING Pollard was going to give Israel that was worth the blowback his capture/trial/imprisonment has caused? I'm not an intel type but, offhand, I can't think of anything important enough to risk alienating Israel's only real ally. Mossad has a great track record but this intelligence op was NOT a smart move.
Hey! Olmert never headed Mossad, did he?
Posted by: Mac ||
05/22/2007 17:31 Comments ||
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#8
As Jack is Back! pointed out, Mac, everybody spies on us, friends and enemies alike. But only the one who spied for Israel gets a life sentence in solitary confinement. Why is it always Israel that must be angel-pure, and no one else?
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut ||
05/22/2007 17:52 Comments ||
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#10
Why Pollard Should Never Be Released (The Traitor) The documents that Pollard turned over to Israel were not focussed exclusively on the product of American intelligence -- its analytical reports and estimates. They also revealed how America was able to learn what it did -- a most sensitive area of intelligence defined as "sources and methods." Pollard gave the Israelis vast amounts of data dealing with specific American intelligence systems and how they worked. For example, he betrayed details of an exotic capability that American satellites have of taking off-axis photographs from high in space. While orbiting the earth in one direction, the satellites could photograph areas that were seemingly far out of range. Israeli nuclear-missile sites and the like, which would normally be shielded from American satellites, would thus be left exposed, and could be photographed. "We monitor the Israelis," one intelligence expert told me, "and there's no doubt the Israelis want to prevent us from being able to surveil their country." The data passed along by Pollard included detailed information on the various platforms -- in the air, on land, and at sea -- used by military components of the National Security Agency to intercept Israeli military, commercial, and diplomatic communications.
At the time of Pollard's spying, select groups of American sailors and soldiers trained in Hebrew were stationed at an N.S.A. listening post near Harrogate, England, and at a specially constructed facility inside the American Embassy in Tel Aviv, where they intercepted and translated Israeli signals. Other interceptions came from an unmanned N.S.A. listening post in Cyprus. Pollard's handing over of the data had a clear impact, the expert told me, for "we could see the whole process" -- of intelligence collection -- "slowing down." It also hindered the United States' ability to recruit foreign agents. Another senior official commented, with bitterness, "The level of penetration would convince any self-respecting human source to look for other kinds of work."
A number of officials strongly suspect that the Israelis repackaged much of Pollard's material and provided it to the Soviet Union in exchange for continued Soviet permission for Jews to emigrate to Israel. Other officials go further, and say there was reason to believe that secret information was exchanged for Jews working in highly sensitive positions in the Soviet Union. A significant percentage of Pollard's documents, including some that described the techniques the American Navy used to track Soviet submarines around the world, was of practical importance only to the Soviet Union. One longtime C.I.A. officer who worked as a station chief in the Middle East said he understood that "certain elements in the Israeli military had used it" -- Pollard's material -- "to trade for people they wanted to get out," including Jewish scientists working in missile technology and on nuclear issues. Pollard's spying came at a time when the Israeli government was publicly committed to the free flow of Jewish emigres from the Soviet Union. The officials stressed the fact that they had no hard evidence -- no "smoking gun," in the form of a document from an Israeli or a Soviet archive -- to demonstrate the link between Pollard, Israel, and the Soviet Union, but they also said that the documents that Pollard had been directed by his Israeli handlers to betray led them to no other conclusion.
It's a Seymour Hersh article, but if half of it true, Pollard and his wife should have been executed. The Israelis selling US secrets to curry favors with America's main enemy. Where have we heard of this happening recently with some inscrutable eastern power?
Posted by: ed ||
05/22/2007 18:13 Comments ||
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#11
High-level suspicions about Israeli-Soviet collusion were expressed as early as December, 1985, a month after Pollard's arrest, when William J. Casey, the late C.I.A. director, who was known for his close ties to the Israeli leadership, stunned one of his station chiefs by suddenly complaining about the Israelis breaking the "ground rules." The issue arose when Casey urged increased monitoring of the Israelis during an otherwise routine visit, I was told by the station chief, who is now retired. "He asked if I knew anything about the Pollard case," the station chief recalled, and he said that Casey had added, "For your information, the Israelis used Pollard to obtain our attack plan against the U.S.S.R. all of it. The coordinates, the firing locations, the sequences. And for guess who? The Soviets." Casey had then explained that the Israelis had traded the Pollard data for Soviet emigres. "How's that for cheating?" he had asked.
Posted by: ed ||
05/22/2007 18:25 Comments ||
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#12
Yep, Pollard really hurt us - for about five years. It took that long to reconfigure everything, come up with a new set of specifications, and re-establish links and services. It taught us a great lesson - everything, everyone, everywhere, is a potential threat. A LOT of security codes were changed in 1985-89, quite a few activities were reviewed and revised, and the US reconfigured a large number of strategic assets. We would have been stupid not to have. We did it again in 2001-2002. We need to do it every ten years or upon compromise, whichever happens first. That costs a lot of money. Pollard and Clinton were both good reasons to spend that money. US security benefitted in the end, but we lost a lot in the process. Pollard needs to remain in jail so people like me who were caught up in cleaning up after him don't hunt him down and justifiably beat his head in with a dull axe.
Posted by: Old Patriot ||
05/22/2007 20:20 Comments ||
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#13
TW, Mrs Skolaut. I think you're missing a point. The reasons for Polard's continued incarceration are not emotional but practical. To wit, if he were free he'd be able to tell what made him so unhappy with the information US intelligence were transferring to Israel.
#14
my 2 cents - Pollard was spying for an ally (understandable). On we defend even when it harms our interests (also understandable, but now one side owes more). One who has tried to transfer technology developments to our "purported "(Chinese, et al) enemies(not understandable and NOT forgiven). Who the fuck made THAT decision, and why are they still alive? Israel can blame Pollard's life sentence on their own perfidy, sorry TW, but heads should've publicly rolled and Pollard's wife told to "STFU or be stateless". Fuck her....just my HO
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/22/2007 21:54 Comments ||
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#15
apologize for the vitriol, but it makes it hard to defend an "ally" like that, and I have.... I feel personally screwed by their perfidy on certain issues
Posted by: Frank G ||
05/22/2007 21:56 Comments ||
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The Army plans to brief Capitol Hill about test failures of Dragon Skin body armor after recent news reports touting the vest's capabilities prompted calls from lawmakers for an official explanation. The service's top soldier equipment buyer, Brig. Gen. Mark Brown, said he plans to meet with lawmakers and staff this week after NBC News broadcast an investigative report Sunday claiming Dragon Skin - which uses a series of interlocking ceramic disks to stop armor-piercing bullets - outperformed armor currently issued by the Army.
"Since the report we have gotten a flurry of interest" from Capitol Hill, Brown said at a May 21 Pentagon briefing. "We're planning on going over to the Hill ... for discussions with key members." Brown declined to specify which lawmakers contacted his office, explaining he's still working out the final details on this week's congressional visit.
The Monday briefing was the first public accounting after a year of silence on the Dragon Skin issue. Army officials are fighting back with an aggressive campaign to undercut NBC's claims, which based much of its report on ballistic tests the network conducted in Germany and on the claims of Dragon Skin manufacturer Pinnacle Armor. The Army laid out its case with x-ray photos showing complete penetrations of the armor during a standardized test in mid-May of last year. Brown appeared at the Pentagon briefing with the actual test articles that had failed to stop armor-piercing rounds, which Army officials claim its current enhanced small arms protective insert plate can withstand.
"'Zero failures' is the correct answer," Brown said. "One failure is sudden death, and you lose the game." The Dragon Skin vests tested by the Army in May suffered 13 penetrations in 48 shots, service officials said.
The controversy first went public last March when the Army issued a so-called "Safety of Use Message" that banned all store-bought armor, and specifically stated that Dragon Skin did not meet the service's requirement for ballistic protection. At the urging of Capitol Hill, the Army bought 30 Dragon Skin vests in May of 2006 and put them through a standard "first article" test to see if the armor could hold up to the same ballistic conditions its current-issued ESAPIs must endure during certification.
According to Karl Masters, one of the Army's top ballistics experts, the Dragon Skin failed to stop a 7.62 x 63mm APM2 round on the second shot of the test.
"We ran this vest through the exact same test protocol that every ESAPI supplier goes through," Masters said. "Can you meet the ESAPI requirement or not? That's the question."
The Army initially held off countering Pinnacle president Murray Neal's claims that his armor was superior, despite the adverse test results, in hopes of keeping the dispute from going nuclear. But after nearly a week of NBC News reports claiming Dragon Skin is stronger, the Army decided to lay out its case. "The intent was not to blow bridges between the Army and some very credible contractor," said Brig. Gen. Tony Cucolo, the Army's top spokesman. "It's just that with this most recent news report and its potential impact on Mr. and Mrs. America ... that's why we went with this" detailed defense.
Pinnacle's Neal told Military.com Friday the tests were flawed and that Army testers were unsure how to adequately evaluate his technology.
That sounds like a "I'm smarter than they are" statement and raises a red flag for me.
He called Army claims that his vests failed "a bold-faced lie" and said the service is embarrassed to admit its current armor isn't the best out there.
Army officials say they want to field a system similar to Dragon Skin, whose interlocking ceramic disks provide more protective coverage and more flexibility than currently-issued armor. But at nearly 20-pounds heavier than the Army's vest, Dragon Skin technology isn't there yet. "We're very interested in this type of armor - in this concept," Brown explained. "It has great promise. But it is not meeting our requirements as we speak today."
Brown hopes his public case against Dragon Skin will keep Soldiers and their families from doubting the strength of their Army-issued vests. "This is not just some number on a wall, this is personal to us," Brown said. "It's very near and dear to us which is why we take it deadly seriously."
Posted by: Steve ||
05/22/2007 07:56 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[6 views]
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#1
Army officials say they want to field a system similar to Dragon Skin, whose interlocking ceramic disks provide more protective coverage and more flexibility than currently-issued armor.
Sounds like a case of NIH Syndrome.
Mike
Posted by: Mike Kozlowski ||
05/22/2007 8:36 Comments ||
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#2
Sounds like a case of NIH Syndrome.
Sorry, Ignorance Alert:
NIH?
It's probably something absurdly simple, but I haven't had my tea yet . . .
Posted by: The Doctor ||
05/22/2007 8:41 Comments ||
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#3
Not Invented Here. Most organizations with a strong research & development tradition suffer from it.
NIH certainly is one reason for large organizations refusing to be early adopters of a product. But another reason is that large organizations have to live with the failures of that tech when, as is often the case, it isn't quite up to real-world heavy use.
In this case, given the costs to the soldier involved when Dragon Skin fails, the Army is right to insist that armor that can't reliably repel rounds which are encountered daily during operations isn't ready for real-world use.
#5
I saw the Future Weapons episode of the dragon skin. They unloaded a MP5. Then an AK-47. Then a .357. No bullets got through the vest. Pretty amazing. Now they did use standard rounds and I'm sure an armor piercing weapon would be vastly different, but no vest is "bulletproof". They all fail at some point. I see this as a turf war pissing match gone hot between army divisions.
Not the first time this has happened. Just look at the M-16.
I would like to see a third party take some vests and blow the crap out of them. I know a gun club here made up of mostly vets that would love to test them. They even have a .50 cal.
#6
Simple. A battalion's worth of both to an active unit in the field. After 90 days, let's see which one the troops are wearing into harms way. Their choice. Go-No Go testing. You think the average troop is stupid? You think he's going to take the one he's willing to bet his life on?
#7
Personally Procopius2k, as an 11B (infantry for you civy types) I would prefer as little as possible on patrol. Speed is armor against armatures. At a guard post where you have to stand around, I would want a tank against snipers. If a tank isn't available, a bunker. If that isn't there, then as much body armor as I can put on and still breathe and not overheat. Failing that, nuclear hand grenades.
The Russian 7.62x54mm is common on the battlefield as the PKM machine gun and the Dragonov sniper rifle. I sure would not feel confident facing 7.62x54mm fire in a vest that got holed by .30-06 AP rounds.
Posted by: ed ||
05/22/2007 9:59 Comments ||
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#9
There is a profound psychological element to this as well. Since time immemorial, soldiers have always had the dark suspicion that the enemies weapons are superior to their own--because they see its effects more than they see the effect of their own weapons.
This is so endemic, that in past, wise combat leaders allowed *one* of their soldiers in a squad to carry and use the enemies weapon, solely to keep up morale, and even when he knew better.
You can get away with this with offensive weapons. However, *defensive* equipment is a different kettle of fish.
If only one soldier has a different type of defensive equipment, the entire unit gets "issues". They get focused on it and its performance; they become afraid because they don't have it; it generally separates out the one guy who does have it as different, and not a team player.
In short, it can be a serious morale problem. And this is why, early on, the military took the odd step of banning Dragon Skin. It probably isn't that bad an armor, but it is heavy, not designed around other equipment, and has other problems that would make it difficult to use with uniformity.
Don't think that the Army is just being glib, either. This is one of those things they take as seriously as a heart attack. And they won't play any political games with Congress over it.
#10
Doing the proving in the field trials instead of the laboratory seems expensive in lives.
At first glance, the material in SAPI plates, boron carbide, is superior than the silicon carbide in of Dragon Skin. Boron carbide is a bit harder and 22% lighter. While the flexible nature of Dragon Skin may absorb some of the shock, I do not see that making up for the 28% extra (and harder) material you get with BC. Flexible BC disks could be useful as extra armor on the hips, sides, or shoulders that the SAPI plates do not cover.
Posted by: ed ||
05/22/2007 10:39 Comments ||
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#11
SAPI sucks in the field.
Dragon Skin is more effective - it flexes and wraps and doesn't gap like the SPI stuff.
As for testing, the Pinnacle guys got into a pissing match with some Major in the testing area, who then set up a series of tests and ran them, changing the conditions until he found 1 (non-real istic from what I hear) circumstance where the SAPI would outperform the Dragonskin, and then used that as the standard.
Figure the DoJ and many police forces have approved Dragonskin to very high levels of protection, and that tells me somethind stinks here on the Army side - more bass asses in the rear playing politics.
#12
Mail Call liked the Dragon Skin, but I vaguely recall there was an upgraded model coming. I did stop a pistol and AK-47 from 20 feet away, but it seems the .30-06 is a bit more powerful.
Posted by: Bobby ||
05/22/2007 13:43 Comments ||
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#13
Being able to move effectively is essential...my rig came in around 80 pounds and I didn't routinely carry everything I normally used and I didn't wear the throat, groin, shoulder and side protectors. Hang another 20 pounds on a soldier in armor and they quickly become ineffective, especially when it is 120+ and their body weight is in that average area of 165...
I had several of my Iraqi privates take sniper hits in the plates and not get penetrated. Fact is snipers are now focusing on head shots because of the effectiveness of our armor.
Did I want something better...you bet, but not at the expense of being able to operate and sustain. 27 years in uniform taught me when congressmen get involved like this, it usually is pandering, and as far as a single major altering a test enough to fabricate an outcome...not likely, if he wants to go much farther and there was always one of those pesky accountabilty folks around to make sure that kind of stuff is happening.
Posted by: Top Mac ||
05/22/2007 13:44 Comments ||
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#14
Top, what do you think of the MICH vs the PASGT helmet since it covers less of the skull? Is is provide adequate protection in light of what you wrote? I noticed the Marines and Iraqis are wearing the older PASGT.
Posted by: ed ||
05/22/2007 14:07 Comments ||
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#15
Bobby: they used 20 feet as the testing distance?
If anyone watched the NBC special, what distance did they use to test then?
Posted by: Phil Fraering ||
05/22/2007 15:31 Comments ||
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#16
OK, maybe 20 yards. It was quite close. It wasn't to see if the Gunney could hit it, ya know!
Posted by: Bobby ||
05/22/2007 15:42 Comments ||
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#17
The future weapons show did their test at 15 meters.
#18
From Op-for site -- scroll down to Dragon Skin title -- there is a lengthy report that is worth the read.
This was posted today on Professional Soldiers by a gentleman who uses the handle The Reaper. He intentionally guards his identity on the internet, but I will submit to our readers that he is a very experienced Special Forces officer of unquestionable integrity. This comes to me from a friend who has met him, so it is secondhand information. Anyone who wishes to know more about him should ask him directly.
Also, the Army test results are available for public disemmination. A copy can be found here.
Dragon Skin?
There may be something better called Dragon Skin, but better than what?
Bottom line up front. From 16-19 May 2006, in Department of Defense (DoD) test protocols at HP White Labs, Pinnacle SOV 3000 Level IV Dragon Skin vests suffered 13 first or second shot complete penetrations, failing four of eight initial subtests with Enhanced Small Arms Protective Inserts (ESAPI) threat baseline 7.62 x 63mm M2 Armor Piercing (AP) ammunition. The Project Manager (PM) Soldier Equipment Briefing report is on line and is easily available.
More below...
Read More »
I say again, of eight Pinnacle SOV 3000 Level IV Dragon Skin (DS) vests tested for V0 penetration, four of them failed, and 13 of 48 rounds fired for record were complete penetrations. Of these, significant first shot failures were noted when the DS vests were exposed to diesel fuel, a serious concern since almost all of our vehicles use this fuel and between spillage during refueling and the potential for saturation after an IED attack on US convoys, vests can easily be contaminated with fuels. A first shot complete penetration was also observed after a DS vest was drop tested. Anyone who has served understands that a 48 pound vest is going to get dropped, dragged, and abused a LOT in a combat zone, even during normal patrolling and movement. Finally, and most significantly, the vest cannot be exposed to heat. With solar loads regularly generating vehicle interior temperatures well in excess of 150 degrees, the DS vest disks delaminate themselves and fall to the bottom of the vest, effectively reducing the armor protection to nearly nothing. All panels shot after high temperature exposure failed in the first shot. This is unacceptable and is hardly a characteristic I would look for in a product to replace the current proven ESAPI in conjunction with the Enhanced Side Ballistic Inserts (ESBI).
According to the X-Rays in the Army report, all hits were in protected areas with full disk coverage. Also easily seen in the X-Rays is the complete failure of the vests adhesive to retain the disks in place during extreme hot and cold weather testing.
NBC also neglected to mention the weight penalty of the Pinnacle SOV 3000 Level IV Dragon Skin vests, which can weigh up to 47.5 pounds or 20 pounds more than the Interceptor vest with ESAPI and ESBI. They appear to have tested the armor, flat, which favors the flexible Pinnacle armor. And they tested it at room temperature only, which means, I suppose, that if you are a soldier who never leaves the office, say, at NBC headquarters, the Dragon Skin may work well for you. If you, however, actually have to go outside, well, you may not want to throw away the Interceptor with the ESAPI quite yet.
The Pinnacle SOV 3000 vests tested were purchased and manufactured the same month that the Army PM test was conducted. They were tested under the ESAPI Purchase Description for front and rear, and ESBI Purchase Description for left and right side. All tests were conducted with 7.62 x 63mm 166 grain M2 AP projectiles stripped from Government Issue complete rounds and hand loaded for each shot by HP White Lab personnel. These rounds were loaded to a specific velocity (+ or 25 fps) known to replicate the most common threat AP ammunition. In scientific testing, 27%, or more than one in four of these rounds went completely through the armor and into the target. Are you sure you want to suit up a loved one in this stuff?
Much, much more at the site -- it this sort of thing interests you.
#19
#2 The Doctor - Don't feel bad. NIH to me means National Institutes of Health. ;-p
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut ||
05/22/2007 16:14 Comments ||
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#20
You don't want a Major that is key to a program getting pissed at you if you are the contractor. Then he becomes Major Pain. But I am suspect that a Major alone could rig the tests.
Seems to me that there is a weight delta to performance delta that has to be considered. If the increase in performance does not correspond to the increase in weight then you stay with the standard issue.
Somehow I don't think the Pinnacle folks are making many friends over at PEO Soldier.
#21
This is emotional but it needs to be in perspective. Just how many troops died as a result of any difference between body armors? How many would have died as a result in the wealnesses of the dragon skin compaired to the weaknesses in the current models. That Major over there at PEO Soldier is doing the math, not some dipshit reporter from NBC. Dragon skin just might be the optimal stuff for our SOF troops but not worth a damn for the grunts, transporters, and tankers. This just is not that easy of a thing as lining up a 9mm at 20 feet and firing. Mobility, fitting with the rest of the gear, vehicles, etc...
Posted by: 49 Pan ||
05/22/2007 17:25 Comments ||
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#22
Bottom line: they used a sniper round onthe side panel.
They set the miltiary's armor up with the SAPI plate insert in on the sides.
They set up the dragon skin unflexed just like the Army panel armor.
And thats how they rigged the tests. The Dragon Skin is not rated for that - and the Army changed the tests once they found this area.
The problem is nobody wears the side inserts like that - typically I've seen only the chest and back plates worn, and leave the more flexible stuff on the side - no plates there.
And the other problem is that the DS was stretched out flat on the side, instead of flexed like it is designed to be. This allowed more single-platelet exposure with air gaps, which prevented the interlock support from reinforcing one platelet to the other - accounting for the higher failure rate.
The test conditions were designed to produce failures in any flexible overlapping armor. The were designed to prove single flat plates.
And another thing - the "failures" and one of the "look thru the hole" things were in areas that were not part of the test area, and not rated for sniper rounds (and the Army vest would have failed there too, given they don't have plate in those gaps).
Like I said before the NIJ has certified Dragon Skin to Level II - thats 7.62 x 39 mm 125 GR, steel case mild steel core - 2300 - 2700 fps, at 15 feet.
And it passed the first set of tests with 7.62x51mm M80 ball steel-jacketed round (2850-2900 fps) at a distance of 15ft (muzzle to body armor)
The National Institute of Justice, which has long rated bullet-proofing systems, has come up with a different opinion. The NIJ will formally certified Level III protection -- good enough to stop AK-47 fire. If I'm not mistaken, that would make the Dragon Skin the first soft armor, without plate inserts, to get that high of a rating. And it would certainly call into question the Army managers' disparaging remarks about the armor -- after Dragon Skin went from ballyhooed to banned to grudgingly accepted for testing, all in a matter of months.
This is one infantryman's input ont he Interceptor that the Pentagon is pushing: "The other thing is that the insurgents have known about the weaknesses at least since I was there. I recall seeing a leaflett that was in a suspected Al Qaedah opperative's house (or compound I should say) the leaflett had a picture of the Interceptor vest and in red highlighting were areas of high fatality risks as our interpereter conveyed. It is time for a change in our armor"
The Army cooked the tests is my conclusion. Its all a pentagon desk-bound blanket folder getting into a d*ck-size contest with a vendor, and stacking the deck, with no regard to the truth, only his ego and rep.
I say send all these things to an ANSI lab, or better yet, let the Germans or Canadians test them. Or private companies that do not have an interest.
#23
"Due to the difficulties and complexities in tasking the dragon skin flexible technology, this new certification test requires flexible rifle-defeating armor to have an additional 18 rounds shot into it to achieve the same Level III Certification as the traditional plate systems."
So, you see, its not even the SAME test as the plate. They are playing games with our soldier's lives.
#24
What about the wieght difference and the plates falling off in high temp? Reread the post on OpFor and see if it looks like the test was cooked after all.
Iran's intelligence ministry has charged a prominent Iranian-American academic with trying to overthrow the country's Islamic system of government. Haleh Esfandiari, who works for a research institute in Washington, was detained in Tehran earlier this month. Mrs Esfandiari had gone to Iran in December, but was not able to leave after her passport was stolen. Her husband has told the BBC that she was only involved in innocent academic activities such as conferences.
The US government described the charges as "silly" and "outrageous" and called for her immediate release.
In a statement published by the ISNA news agency on Monday, the Ministry of Intelligence said the 67-year-old director of the Woodrow Wilson Centre had confessed during interrogation that her institute was funded by the Soros Foundation.
Damm, now I'm conflicted..
The ministry said the foundation had "played key roles in intrigues that have led to colourful revolutions in former Soviet republics in recent years" and now aimed to overthrow Iran's government.
"In primary interrogations, she reiterated that the Soros Foundation has established an unofficial network with the potential of future broader expansion, whose main objective is overthrowing the system," it said.
Including that of the U.S. government.
The ministry also said that, with Mrs Esfandiari's help, it had been able to identify the representative of the Soros Foundation in Iran and issued an arrest warrant for him.
Mrs Esfandiari's husband, Shaul Bakhas, an Iranian-born academic now based in the US, said he was shocked by the charges against his wife. "It's obviously very disturbing that the Iranian government would wish, quite falsely, to implicate my wife in attempts to overthrow the government," he said. "Nothing could be further from the truth." "At the same time it seems to me they are reading into innocent activities, such as conferences and meetings and exchanges of scholars, pernicious intent which is not there." Mr Bakhas also said the only contact with his wife had been several short phone-calls to her elderly mother, who lives in Tehran.
The Nobel Peace Prize-winning lawyer, Shirin Ebadi, has tried to represent Mrs Esfandiari, but she said on Friday that Iran's judiciary was preventing her from doing so. The BBC's Frances Harrison in Tehran says Mrs Esfandiari's arrest has sent shockwaves through the Iranian diaspora, who were encouraged by the government to return to Iran during the reformist period. The intention of the authorities seems to be to try and reduce contacts between Iranian intellectuals and the outside world, our correspondent adds.
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05/22/2007 07:47 ||
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DAMASCUS - Syria rejected on Monday accusations from Lebanese officials that it had links to Fatah al-Islamterrorists militants fighting troops in northern Lebanon, saying it had tried to arrest the groups leaders. Our forces have been after them, even through Interpol, Foreign Minister Walid Moualem said in a lecture at Damascus University. We reject this organisation. It does not serve the Palestinian cause and it is not after liberating Palestine.
That's actually true -- it doesn't serve the Paleo cause, it serves the Syrian cause. The Syrians don't give a hoot about the Paleos and never have.
Lebanese government ministers say Fatah al-Islam is a tool used by Syria to stir instability in an effort to derail UN moves to set up an international court to try suspects in the 2005 killing of former Prime Minister Rafik al-Hariri. The (Syrian) Interior ministry had already issued statements about the leaders of Fatah al-Islam after a bombing in Lebanon several weeks ago, Moualem said, referring to Syrias denials in March that it had any links to the group, which was accused of bombing two buses near Beirut.
Fatah is useful for this, it's useful to keep uppity Lebanese journalists in line, ditto for uppity gummint officials. All sorts of uses.
Fatah al-Islam emerged in November when it split from Fatah al-Intifada (Fatah Uprising), a Syrian-backed Palestinian group.
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05/22/2007 00:00 ||
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Deputy Head of IRI Disciplinary Force said here Monday residence of foreign nationals at entire cities on eastern border of country is forbidden. General Hossein Zolfaqari made the comment during his visit of Zahedan at a press conference, adding, "A project aimed at rounding up and deporting the illegal foreign nationals is being seriously pursued and the foreigners that have residence permits, too, must leave Sistan-o-Baluchestan Province and seek residence at non-boarder provinces."
He added, "No excuses, such as involvement in economic and business activities along with Iranians, and the like is acceptable from the foreign nationals and the remaining ones should be rounded up and deported."
The Deputy Disciplinary Force Chief reiterated, "In order to control our borders better and more effectively we have installed radar terminals at our boarder posts and taken advantage of electronic equipment, whose usage would be at broader scale later on. Last year our officers found some 329 tons of various types of narcotics, that was noticeably higher than the previous years."
Focusing on Disciplinary forces' campaign against hooligans and disturbers of security in eastern parts of the country, he said, "The process of that campaign is proceeding perfectly."
He also referred to the ongoing cooperation between the Iranian and Pak police forces in campaign against hooligans and armed smugglers, adding, "Keeping in mind that a large number of disturbers of Iranian boarder regions' security have taken refuge in our neighboring country, we have presented the Police of Pakistan detailed reports in that respect and they have promised to cooperate."
The Islamic Republic of Iran is secretly, but actively reorganizing dormant terrorist operations networks, aimed at American and Israeli vital interests in Europe, according to well informed sources. Tehran is setting up the network as at the same time it is assuring the United States and the international community about its readiness to talk about the situation in Iraq, the sources said, warning that Washington neither London or even the European Union should not be lured about Iranian assurances.
According to the sources, Tehran is placing two of its most notorious terror experts as military attaches in Europe, with the task of setting up operation basis, recruiting would be voluntary suiciders and pinpointing major American and Israeli civilian centres. Both men are the initiators of forming suicide operations cells, by recruiting voluntaries in major streets of Tehran and other main Iranian cities back in 2003-2004.
Mr. Mohammad Reza Yazdanpanah, better known as Hoseyn Allah Karam, one of the commanders of the Iranian Hezbollah pressure group, has been named as military attaché for the Balkans, from his headquarters Zagreb, he would be the overall commander of the operations, the sources said. Mr. Saíd Qassemi, alias Haj Saíd, commander of the intelligence unit of the Revolutionary Guards 27th Army of Mohammad Rasoul Allah has been also named as military attaché for central Europe. Although the country to which Haj Saíd would be based it is not yet decided, but sources say it would certainly be an important European capital.
The task of the two senior terrorist masters would be to reorganize and revitalize terrorist networks Tehran used to have in Europe, always recruiting among Europes Muslim community. They have also to choose new locations for launching operations and finally, to replace burned agents, the sources said.
#1
Europe and the US is about fed up with this sh*t. At some point damn the PC; the gloves will come off. Restraint will go out the window. The time is near ass*ats.
A multi-volume chronology and reference guide set detailing three years of the Mexican Drug War between 2010 and 2012.
Rantburg.com and borderlandbeat.com correspondent and author Chris Covert presents his first non-fiction work detailing
the drug and gang related violence in Mexico.
Chris gives us Mexican press dispatches of drug and gang war violence
over three years, presented in a multi volume set intended to chronicle the death, violence and mayhem which has
dominated Mexico for six years.
Rantburg was assembled from recycled algorithms in the United States of America. No
trees were destroyed in the production of this weblog. We did hurt some, though. Sorry.
Tension mounted in the capital over the Lal Masjid issue on Sunday when police took 36 students of Jamia Fareedia in pre-emptive detention, and the madressah militants taking to streets and blocking traffic. Police claimed that the Jamia students had been picked up because they were reinforcing the militants, known as the Lal Masjid brigade, which had kidnapped four policemen on Friday in their latest escapade. Two of the policemen were released in exchange for grant of bail to five Lal Masjid madressah students.
The Supreme Court Registrar Office returned on Monday a constitutional petition by Muttahida Majlis-e-Amal (MMA) President Qazi Hussain Ahmed against President Pervez Musharraf. Hussain had filed the petition a few days ago, challenging the continuation of Musharraf as chief of army staff (COAS) despite him passing his superannuating age of 60. The registrar filed the objection that the president enjoyed immunity under Article 248 of the Constitution and therefore he could not be nominated as a respondent in any case. The registrar also objected to the petitioner making multiple prayers in his petition, which were technically not related to the subject and contents of the petition. Hussain had maintained that General Pervez Musharraf is continuously violating the Constitution, law and service rules by addressing public rallies. He sought a court directive against Musharrafs tenure as chief of army staff.
MOGADISHU, Somalia - A cargo ship carrying food for poor Somalis refused to leave Kenya on Monday because of rampant piracy, and the U.S. Navy warned vessels to stay clear of Somalia's lawless waters where everyone from aid workers to fishermen have become targets. The U.N. World Food Program has appealed for international action to stamp out Somali pirates threatening the delivery of humanitarian supplies to the Horn of Africa country, which is trying to recover from the worst fighting in more than a decade.
DAMASCUS - Syria rejected on Monday accusations from Lebanese officials that it had links to 
