Robert "Sandy" Vietze, 18, is among the top 75 in the nation -- but he may have blown his chance to compete in the 2014 Winter Games in Russia. His name was bumped from the team's developmental roster yesterday afternoon, although officials made no comment about his status.
The drunken JetBlue passenger who treated a sleeping 11-year-old girl like a latrine is a member of the US Ski Team who refused to apologize yesterday for the high-altitude incident. The leaky loser showed no remorse outside his family's palatial Vermont home, where he ignored questions over the incident and refused to apologize to his victim.
Vietze had taken an overnight flight from Portland, Ore., to JFK Wednesday on his way home from a weeklong training camp with the US Ski Team at Mount Hood in Oregon.
His young victim, who was flying with her sister and cancer-stricken father on a trip to see her grandmother for the first time since his diagnosis. Soon after takeoff, Vietze staggered from his seat and emptied his bladder onto the girl, who was momentarily left alone while her dad and sister were in restrooms.
Vietze later told the police, "I was drunk, and I did not realize I was pissing on her leg."
The girl's father, a Stage 4 cancer patient, caught Vietze and attacked him.
"F- -k that kid. I don't want him near my family!" he yelled. Flight attendants had to separate the men.
Vietze admitted to cops that he had consumed eight alcoholic beverages before boarding the flight. He was issued a federal summons for indecent exposure, but prosecutors later decided to drop the case. The father didn't want his traumatized 11-year-old daughter to be interviewed by cops, likely sparing Vietze criminal charges.
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 12:50 Comments ||
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Indeed, Shakey Steve. Consequences tend not to be amusing.
To embed a link in a comment, write the word you want to attach it to, then click on the icon thingy that looks like globe with goggles/chain links down below "Pic-a-nic", and paste/type in the URL in the thingy that pops up. I fixed it for you, above.
#9
Palatial family home? Drunk at 18? So drunk he didn't know he was not in a watercloset? Gateworkers allowed him to board the plane? Pissed on a girl and no apology?
Don't you know who the fuck I am?! I'm a top 75 skiier! Don't make me call father, he knows people, he'll call the president!
SPRING HILL, Tenn. Police in Spring Hill arrested a local music teacher Thursday morning after he was caught engaging in a sex act with a doll outside a local elementary school.
Officers were called to Allendale Elementary School on Prescott Way in Spring Hill amid reports of a white male with a duffle bag under a bridge on school property. The bridge provides access to the school from the main road.
Spring Hill police told Nashville's News 2 the responding officer witnessed the man, identified as 56-year-old Daniel Torroll, performing sex acts on a child-like doll police later discovered he'd cut holes into.
The officer reported the man was naked and in a location where he could be seen by people driving up to the school.
"I happened to be there I didn't know it was school property. I wouldn't be there if I knew it was school property," Torroll told Nashville's News 2.
Authorities took Torroll into custody and charged him with public indecency, a misdemeanor.
He was issued a citation and ordered to stay off school property. He was not booked into the Williamson County jail.
According to Torroll, he suffers from an attention deficit disorder which he says affects his inability to resist certain sexual impulses, though none of which involve children.
"[Police] came here and looked [through my home]. There was nothing here. There was no child porn. I have two kids myself," he said.
Torroll also told detectives he teaches private music lessons from his home. He is not a teacher at Allendale Elementary School.
On the Web site DannyTorroll.com, the Web site for the Danny Torroll Skool of Music and Art, Torroll says he teaches "eight very gifted students" ranging in age from seven to 12-years-old.
He describes the school as "an anomaly in the upper education platform for serious students of all instruments," according to the site.
Torroll also claims to be an instructor at the Montessori School of Franklin, however the school said in a release, "Mr. Torroll is not and has never been an instructor at MSF. Nor does he have a relationship of any kind with the school. We have instructed Mr. Torroll to remove that statement from his Web site."
The release went on to say the school is, "committed to providing a safe and healthy environment for its students, staff and school families."
Torroll's Web site was taken offline late Thursday evening.
Williamson County school officials notified parents of the incident using an automated call system. They said that no children saw what Torroll was doing.
Police plan to increase patrols around the elementary school on Friday.
Torroll is scheduled to appear in court on September 2.
A teenager from Mexico became the first person in the United States to die after being bitten by a vampire bat and infected with rabies, US health authorities said on Thursday. The CDC said this was an unusually aggressive form of rabies, killing in 15 days, compared to a median of 89 days in other US bat rabies cases. The CDC warned that climate change may worsen the spread of vampire bats & diseases they may carry. The horror! It would be preferable to contract your own case of rabies from regular bats in a cooler climate. Adding the 'vampire' and 'climate change' label makes this a particularly unspeakable, unimaginably horrible, and impregnable fate!
Seriously, basics on rabies from CDC: Rabies in humans is rare in the United States. There are usually only one or two human cases per year. But the most common source of human rabies in the United States is from bats. For example, among the 19 naturally acquired cases of rabies in humans in the United States from 1997-2006, 17 were associated with bats. 3 young men who died of bat rabies had no known encounters with bats. 2 victims were children who died after casual encounters with bats in their bedrooms with no definite bite history.
[An Nahar] About 400 couples are competing in this year's World Tango Championships beginning next week in Argentina's capital, organizers said Wednesday.
More than 500 artists also will participate in the festival that starts Tuesday and runs through Aug. 30.
But the main draw is the dancing, in the traditional "salon tango" category and the more creative "stage tango" competition. Each winning couple gets a prize of 20,000 pesos, which is about $4,800.
Tango is taken seriously in Buenos Aires. The event is organized by the city's culture minister and is completely free to the public. Last year's event drew 350,000 spectators, and competitors come from many countries.
An Argentine couple was lucky enough to win last year's top price in salon tango.
"It totally changed our lives," said Sebastian Jimenez, 19, who with government support has spent the past year traveling to events with his dance partner, Maria Ines Bogado. "The government helped us in the first steps. It was something beautiful."
Bogado, 30, said she's excited to be competing in Argentina again, but humble about their chances: "Right now we're almost nothing."
The United Nations ...an idea whose time has gone... added the Argentine and Uruguayan tradition of tango to its "Intangible Cultural Heritage of Humanity" list in 2009 after both countries gave up their rivalry long enough to campaign together for the honor.
Tango is the embodiment of the "criollo" culture of Europeans and natives who settled around the Rio de la Plata. Born at the end of the 19th century, the music and dance reflect the passion, drama and melancholy of their experience.
The tradition was nearly forgotten, however, until singer Carlos Gardel popularized it in Europe and then brought it back home.
Now tango is celebrated worldwide, with many top dancers coming from Japan.
"In August every year this event brings together a whole community of musicians, dancers, academics and entrepreneurs," Mayor Mauricio Macri said in a statement. "We are united by a past, a common history and confidence in the future."
Posted by: Fred ||
08/12/2011 00:00 ||
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Surprise post Fred. This is serious business. With England's troubles Blackpool is world renowned for several types of dance competitions. They have a new dance category street dancing. With Argentina it is national pride. Where all peoples of the world meet and compete. Something different:
[Straits Times] THE former girlfriend of billionaire financier George Soros has accused him of reneging on a promise to buy her an apartment in New York City and has filed at US$50 million (S$61 million) lawsuit.
Adriana Ferreyr filed the suit in Manhattan court on Wednesday.
The 28-year-old Brazilian soap opera star alleges that the 80-year-old Soros gave the US$1.9 million apartment on the Upper East Side of Manhattan to a new girlfriend.
[Daily Nation (Kenya)] Zim-bob-wean President Bob Muggsy Mugabe's Octogenarian President-for-Life of Zim-bob-we who turned the former Breadbasket of Africa into the African Basket Case... party has reiterated its calls for South African President Jacob Zuma to be relieved of his duties as the country's mediator.
Zanu PF wants the controller's role discussed at the forthcoming Southern African Development Community (SADC) summit.
President Zuma will assume the chairmanship of the SADC Organ on Defence, Politics and Secuirty Cooperation at the Heads of State summit set for Luanda, Angola next week.
Zanu PF, which formed a unity government with the former opposition Movement for Democratic Change (MDC) formations in 2009, says the South African leader cannot be controller and chairman of the organ at the same time.
The controller reports to the organ on the Zim-bob-we political talks now aimed at creating an environment for free and fair elections.
SADC executive secretary Mr Tomaz Salamao had appeared to be dismissing the Zanu PF argument last week saying President Zuma's role will not be discussed at the summit because he still had the mandate to facilitate the Zim-bob-we talks.
But on Thursday, state media, which represents the Zanu PF line of thinking in the unity government, criticised Mr Salamao saying he cannot speak on behalf of SADC because he was just an employee of the regional body.
"Mr Salamo is just an executive secretary and he does not make authoritative decisions on behalf of the bloc," the official Herald newspaper said quoting an unnamed government official.
"The issue of Zim-bob-we's controller is for Heads of State to decide on and he should stop causing unnecessary confusion.
"The whole mediation role in Zim-bob-we has got a historical anomaly that is inconsistent with SADC practices when it comes to facilitation roles.
"The SADC norm on facilitation is to rely on a former Head of State and not a sitting president. It is only the Zim-bob-we case that been subjected to a sitting president."
President Zuma's successor, Mr Thabo Mbeki ...former president of South Africa, succeeding Nelson Mandela. He now pops up periodically as a mediator when something catches fire in Africa... was the previous controller in the Zim-bob-we talks and brokered the power sharing agreement signed in September 2008, while still South African president.
The front man of President Zuma's facilitation team Ms Lindiwe Zulu has said there would be no problem with Mr Zuma doubling as the controller and chairman of the SADC organ.
Former Zim-bob-we Information Minister Professor Jonathan Moyo, a close ally of President Mugabe said if SADC insisted that President Zuma takes the two responsibilities "they will be inviting a clear conclusion that there is a sinister agenda."
Prof Moyo precipitated a major diplomatic fallout between Zim-bob-we and South Africa in April when he used the state media to attack President Zuma and his facilitation team.
Posted by: Fred ||
08/12/2011 00:00 ||
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"Muggsy" needs to die of an incurable and very painful case of AIDS. Soon.
Posted by: Old Patriot ||
08/12/2011 13:36 Comments ||
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Zim-bob-wean President Bob Mugabe's party has reiterated its calls for South African President Jacob Zuma to be relieved of his duties as the country's mediator.
[Bangla Daily Star] The pro-BNP lawyers involved in creating chaos in the High Court will apologise for their conduct on August 14.
The decision was taken at a meeting between pro-opposition and pro-government lawyers Thursday, Attorney General Mahbubey Alam told The Daily Star.
Prior to apologising before the HC, the lawyers accused in two cases filed for assaulting police and preventing them from their official duties on the Supreme Court premises will surrender before a lower court, according to the resolution.
The attorney general met Khandker Mahbub Hossain, president of Supreme Court Bar Association (SCBA) in the morning.
Alam told news hounds that 10 accused lawyers, who are still on the run, will surrender before the trial court.
If the lawyers are sent to jail after surrender, the police will produce them before the HC bench so that they can apologise on August 14, he added.
Four accused lawyers have already been placed in durance vile.
The AG assured the SC bar president that the law enforcers will not harass or torture the accused lawyers.
Meanwhile, ...back at the bunker, his Excellency called a meeting. It was to be his last... the SC adjourned till August 14 the hearing on 13 lawyers' petition against a HC order banning them from practising law in any court.
Earlier on Wednesday, the HC rejected two bail petitions filed by 11 lawyers.
Posted by: Fred ||
08/12/2011 00:00 ||
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Posted by: Thumper and Tenille2812 ||
08/12/2011 10:54 ||
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16.
4 days in the top 100
Rucanor Aluminium Baseball Bat, Silver - 60 cm
by Rucanor
RRP: £21.00
Price: £17.15
You Save: £3.85 (18%)
Number sixteen on the list for best sellers in Sports & Leisure, and moving up -- has been in the top 100 for four days now. Aluminum bats don't splinter like wooden cricket bats...
#4
Shakey, a .38 special is a reasonable equalizer, in a way that a baseball bat cannot be, for a five foot, one inch, 100 pound woman suddenly up against a malignant six foot, three inch, 240 pound rapist.
Perhaps one of the women you know in your personal life can explain this further.
Posted by: Steve White ||
08/12/2011 17:11 Comments ||
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#5
Theodore Dalrymple in 2003: practically no baseball is played in Britain, but plenty of bats are sold as weapons and lie detectors I really doubt these recent heavy sales are to average Britishers stocking up on defensive weapons, more likely prospective rioters are building up their arsenals while they can.
#9
"Perhaps one of the women you know in your personal life can explain this further."
Hmmmm...so are you saying all women should be packing heat? Is that REALLY what you want? I know I don't and I know my wife wouldn't..
That being said, I don't live in US. Must really suck to live down there, having to worry about being raped or murdered 24 hours a day...some people would classify that as a tad on the paranoid side.
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 19:57 Comments ||
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#10
Shakey, you obviously suffer from lastworditis. You also obviously have no clue of what life is like down here in America or what it's like to live your life as a citizen and not serf/peon.
I've carried a weapon for more than 5 years. I've never felt any need to draw it or present it to a danger or threat. It's a tool, much the same as the first aid and emergency kit in my vehicles. It is simply there in case it is needed, should the day ever come. My sister lived in London for 2 years going to school and said she'd NEVER felt as safe there as she did here in the US. The vast majority of violent crime in the US is limited to gang members and their flunkies killing each other and only rarely does it involve others. Property crime is more likely here but crime of all stripes has been dropping here for a while as more and more states move to a must issue vs may issue permits.
Another way to look at it is this. My state government trusts me to carry a weapon, because it's helpful for my neighbors and because I am no danger to other law abiding citizens. Armed citizens in this country are more law abiding than the police are. Sad but significant FACT.
Posted by: Silentbrick - Halliburton Lost Drill Bit Division ||
08/12/2011 20:58 Comments ||
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#11
"The vast majority of violent crime in the US is limited to gang members and their flunkies killing each other and only rarely does it involve others. "
Then why do you need to carry a gun? You kind of just proved my point...
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 21:04 Comments ||
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#12
if you were the exception to the vast majority, I'd say: "see? Proved MY point."
Posted by: Frank G ||
08/12/2011 21:25 Comments ||
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#13
It's a tool, much the same as the first aid and emergency kit in my vehicles. It is simply there in case it is needed, should the day ever come.
Perhaps if you'd read the post fully, you would have found the answer. I try to be a responsible citizen, by being prepared for everything that I can within reason. I travel a great deal, I work for a company that many liberals have mouth-frothing hatred for, and I would rather be armed than unarmed, despite spending time taking Akido and studying martial arts, I know that the way of the gun beats the way of the open hand.
Posted by: Silentbrick - Halliburton Lost Drill Bit Division ||
08/12/2011 21:42 Comments ||
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#14
it's a tool... Shakey that is. end of discussion.
Posted by: abu do you love ||
08/12/2011 21:48 Comments ||
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#15
Shakey: I do not advocate that most women should pack heat. The point (my dear sir, do you ever see one?) was that a pistol is an equalizer for the weak versus the strong, and a better equalizer than a Louisville slugger.
The weak cannot always depend on the government to defend them.
Posted by: Steve White ||
08/12/2011 22:53 Comments ||
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People should not be required to carry a firearm. What should be considered is the choice. I trust you to make the right decision based upon what you feel is the right decision, all I ask is that in return. If I feel the need to carry a gerber and a window punch just in case I come across a neighbor off the road in trouble, I should not be prosecuted (because I will do it anyways and I am not a criminal I am the good samaritan and I am a rescuer; I know minutes count) because some dude in the big city ran that as a sales pitch and has to follow through for their own career of making millions, dude, that is bullshit.
#18
Not to be particular, but I am a follower of the 10 yard, uhem meter if that helps (but the particular matters only to response time), theory, on self awareness. That is not paranoia, that is not being in la la land as so many of my friends are. Its being able to spot trouble, even if its a sponge ball at the swimming pool being thrown around while my child learns to swim and like the water. It has paid off already, not with child water polo or even pet in the kids food, but stuff like yellow jackets at the least.
#3
Theory is always more attractive than reality. Under Communism, steal a mouthful of corn and go to a forced labor camp for three years. Odds of survival - not so good.
May the black baton of reality enlighten the sides of these stupid skulls.
#4
Part of a whole generation of self-entitlement. I do like the idea of shaming these people after the fact by posting their faces on the Web...good luck in the future, you spoiled knit-wit...
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 16:06 Comments ||
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#5
Just a few years ago the major elite British news websites were teaching their readers about how to behave at orgies and how not to report sex in the bushes. And they wonder why everyone is a barbarian? What a joke....it's simply a collapse of civilization.
[An Nahar] Police began raiding houses across London on Thursday to make arrests over the riots that rocked the British capital, with more than 100 warrants issued already, a senior Scotland Yard officer said.
Metropolitan Police Deputy Assistant Commissioner Steve Kavanagh announced the raids after a heavy police presence on the streets of London and other cities prevented a fifth night of the unrest.
"In the early hours of this morning we started knocking on doors to arrest people," Kavanagh said.
"We have got more than 100 warrants which we will be working our way through over the coming hours and days.
"With so many officers on duty we want to use their time by going out there and arresting burglars, robbers and thieves -- those people who cause concern and crime in our communities."
So far the Metropolitan Police has tossed in the clink 888 people in connection with violence, disorder and looting since Saturday, and 371 people have been charged.
There have been more than 300 arrests in other English cities.
Around 16,000 coppers have been deployed in London for the past two nights in response to the riots, in which four people have died across the country and dozens of shops and homes have been burned down.
The riots have also sparked a debate about the government's plans to cut police budgets as part of austerity measures to reduce Britannia's record deficit.
Posted by: Fred ||
08/12/2011 00:00 ||
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#1
Take those warrants, make a forced entry and stomp everything inside these peoples houses.
#6
"Hey Moron, they have no guns, that's why this is happening.
A few determined People with Guns would stop this shit in it's tracks."
Tell me something...did guns stop the Rodney King riots? Did they stop the Watts riots? NO. I'm as hardline as anyone when it comes to cracking down on those a-holes, but the London Police do have guns! How the hell did this whole thing start in the first place..with GUNS...IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH GUN CONTROL...
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 9:46 Comments ||
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#7
It has everything to do with disarming the public and denying them the right of self-defense, moron. When a burglar in your house has the government-given right to your goods without fear of harm, you've created a mentality that allows looting. A Brit that defends himself in his home has the expectation of prosecution
Posted by: Frank G ||
08/12/2011 10:12 Comments ||
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#8
I saw the cops standing around with riot shield and no battons. No guns, No mace, no tasers. Poorly trained and running from the protesters.
#9
What 'government-given right' are you talking about? And, please refrain from the term 'moron' with someone that doesn't share your opinion...you start to sound like some 80 year old fart who's life has passed them by...
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 10:18 Comments ||
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#10
"I saw the cops standing around with riot shield and no battons. No guns, No mace, no tasers. Poorly trained and running from the protesters."
Ok. I will only speak for what I know, so I won't speak of Britain but Canada. Canada has gun control. But 'gun control' does not mean 'gun prohibition'. For instance, Canadian police (e.g. RCMP, and one of my brothers is an RCMP officer in Alberta) are as well armed as any American cop, when needed. But, generally, when a riot starts, they resort to billyclubs first, before bullets. This isn't bloody Iran, for Christ's sake...
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 10:24 Comments ||
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#11
Keep it civil Shakey. You're the newcomer here.
Police have guns, except London police who don't and need special permission to carry them.
And of course you know the old saying, "when seconds count, the police are only minutes away."
It's another way of noting that in a crisis, police won't be there to protect you, they'll be by afterwards to write a report and (perhaps) track down the evil-doers.
I'm a law-abiding person. I detest violence. If some yob comes after me, my family or my home, I sure hope the police are nearby and can intervene. Because if they don't, I'm going to plug the social miscreant.
Posted by: Steve White ||
08/12/2011 10:26 Comments ||
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#12
What 'government-given right' are you talking about?
Frank is referring to the socialist idea that a looter, as an oppressed class ally of the proletariat, has more rights than you, a class enemy, have.
See the Gulag Archipelago and Solzhenitsyn for details.
Posted by: Steve White ||
08/12/2011 10:29 Comments ||
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#13
"Keep it civil Shakey. You're the newcomer here."
I have. Unfortunately, if you have a different opinion you are called a moron and told to get lost. I guess the 'Civil' part of the 'Civil, well-reasoned discourse' is just to fill-in some empty space on the banner of this site...
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 10:38 Comments ||
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The UK was once one of the most law-abiding countries on earth. The UK riots have nothing to do with the population not being armed, and are mostly to do with (1) societal rot and (2) UK police & prosecutors abandoning their traditional roles and carrying out the UK leftist agenda.
#16
By the way, I agree with: "I'm a law-abiding person. I detest violence. If some yob comes after me, my family or my home, I sure hope the police are nearby and can intervene. Because if they don't, I'm going to plug the social miscreant.". I would to. But the point of this whole blowup is that the rioting in Britain would have happened whether there was gun-control or not. Hell, riots and looting have happened in the States (and Canada) many times over the last 50 years, yet I don't see anyone linking gun-control to all these riots...
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 10:43 Comments ||
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"you are called a moron and told to get lost. You ARE a moron. Get lost."
Case in point, Steve. Will you ask him/her to be civil??
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 10:44 Comments ||
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#18
"The UK was once one of the most law-abiding countries on earth. The UK riots have nothing to do with the population not being armed, and are mostly to do with (1) societal rot and (2) UK police & prosecutors abandoning their traditional roles and carrying out the UK leftist agenda."
I agree!
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 10:46 Comments ||
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#19
Shakey, glad we agree, there are multiple causes for bad people to do bad stuff. However, there is but one cause for the bad stuff to be happening to YOUR stuff, and it is that you are not popping caps in the asses of the bad people. And why not? Societal rot? No, good people grabbed bats and sticks to try to defend their houses and property. It is that they were insufficiently armed to get caps in all the asses that presented themselves.
The key point here is to distinguish the reasons the rioting started, and the reason it continued beyond an hour. These are different things and have different reasons.
The good people of England have been disarmed and abused by their government to the point that they cannot effectively stop bad people from damaging their homes and property. This must end.
I do not care about why people start riots, they give up all the protections of the law at that point, and whatever their grievance may be I do not care to acknowledge it or assuage it. This is because since its remedy is riot, it is fundamentally an illegitimate grievance in a representative society.
I only care that the riot stops swiftly. Thus to me, disarming the populace is exactly the most important policy to change. And this change should be brought about swiftly through the representative process.
#20
Tell me something...did guns stop the Rodney King riots?
No. In fact, the LAPD was pretty much hands-off in early stages of the riot, much like Metropolitan. And as I recall, the 1969 Montreal riots were under a similar situation (striking cops, no one had weapons). So much for a 'civilised' country.
But in LA, those that were armed, or were able to hire armed security, prevented their homes and businesses from being looted and burned. I'd say that's a game changer.
#21
..the Korean grocers stop their shops from being burned and looted in the area by open displays of their weapons. The race card couldn't be played. At the time there were Koreans still living who actually were REAL slaves of Japanese when Japan ruled their nation.
#22
"And as I recall, the 1969 Montreal riots were under a similar situation (striking cops, no one had weapons). So much for a 'civilised' country."
My argument, I still have not read a true rebuttal to it, is that whether England practises gun-control, or whether you could buy a gun off a rack beside the chocolate bars at a corner store, this would not have prevented the riot. Some of the looting, yes. (As would sending in the Army and setting a curfew)..But not the riot itself.
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 12:30 Comments ||
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To everyone commenting: calm down.
To Shakey: a few guns would not stop the riots. A few more guns might. The Turks and Kurds who banded together in that one neighborhood in London certainly stopped both the looting and the riots in THEIR streets. Let them have some guns and I'm betting the rioters would have suddenly had a come-to-Jesus moment.
What stops the riots from occurring in the first place is a return of our society to concepts of personal responsibility that have been systemically removed these past few decades. Some folks need the idea introduced at the head of a load of buckshot. Unfortunate but it happens.
Posted by: Steve White ||
08/12/2011 12:50 Comments ||
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#24
Steve - I admire you and the other mods - y'all are so patient....
Posted by: Barbara ||
08/12/2011 14:47 Comments ||
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#25
My argument, I still have not read a true rebuttal to it...this would not have prevented the riot.
Straw argument with a ludicrous base. It's akin to saying that if every teen was issued birth control, it would prevent the wave of pregnancies.
No one in the comment thread has said an armed citizenry would have prevented the riot. However, IMNSHO based on personal experience in the LA riots, it certainly would have lessened its effects.
Tell me something...did guns stop the Rodney King riots?
Contained them.
Posted by: Rob Crawford ||
08/12/2011 15:42 Comments ||
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#27
Local Kansas City legend was when the '68 riots broke out and the area was in chaos, citizens were grabing their firearms and siezing bridges to control access to their neighborhoods.
It could have had the effect of limiting the scope of the riot and lawlessness and retribution and, within 48 hours, the riots were under control, though protest and spot fires accured for another 5 days or so.
Those sikhs had pointy things brandished. I thought they were against the law. Eagerly looking forward to Britains handling of this...by banning the broadcast of softball, little leage and college level US Baseball broadcasts followed by the game itself, likely cricket to follow, for their glorification of a weapon of war and violence.
#28
whether England practises gun-control, or whether you could buy a gun off a rack beside the chocolate bars at a corner store
As far as I am aware, and admittedly I've never tried to buy a gun, American gun laws do not permit buying guns off racks at the corner store. There is a three day waiting period to check one's name against lists of felons and the insane on state and federal lists, so that even buying a bullet propellor of some sort at WalMart will not be consummated on a whim.
The issue in Britain is that disproportionate self-defense (he had a knife, so I used a chainsaw) is illegal, and those defending hearth and home have been jailed in recent years for harming an invader, even only using a poker or a kitchen knife. So a lot of the damage of people and property happened because people were afraid to do anything when attacked.... Including the police, observed repeatedly during the first few days backing away from a charging mob. But the determination to band together in self defense is spreading among our cousins on the other side of the pond, which should make politics quite interesting next time round.
Guns are useful for fighting off the hooligans at a distance, with less chance of them getting their own licks in, and as an equalizer for a small number against a rampaging mob.
As Heinlein wrote, "An armed populace is a polite populace.". Or something like that. The riots would not have gone on as they did had the "shoppers" been met with buckshot at the first high street shops they called on, with the certainty of more of the same wherever they went.
Think how you might have rephrased your original question so it did not contain an implied insult to those who don't agree with you. This exercise will help you understand why those who know more on the subject responded impatiently.
#29
T-W, I agree with everything you say except for the Heinlein quote. To me, it depends on the country. In the US it may work (though it is worthy of debate) because there is a sense of civility already engrained in the culture. But would it work in a country like Somalia, or Haiti, or Bosnia?...proof may be in the pudding.
Posted by: Shakey Steve ||
08/12/2011 16:18 Comments ||
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#30
P2K, that was good video. Here are some more scenes of citizens who know how to stop looting.
#31
But would it work in a country like Somalia, or Haiti, or Bosnia?
Pish. Heinlein's point is that people are nicer to you - in the sense of being less likely to rob, rape or kill you - if you are armed. And yeah, it applies to those places too.
#32
An unfortunate example of Heinlein's theorem was during a rash of road rage and gang-banger shooting incidents in SoCal. Drivers were much less inclined to flip-off, cut off or abuse other drivers.
#33
Theodore Dalrymple on the riots: The ferocious criminality exhibited by an uncomfortably large section of the English population during the current riots has not surprised me in the least. I have been writing about it, in its slightly less acute manifestations, for the past 20 years. To have spotted it required no great perspicacity on my part; rather, it took a peculiar cowardly blindness, one regularly displayed by the British intelligentsia and political class, not to see it and not to realize its significance...long experience of impunity has taught the rioters that they have nothing to fear from the law, which in England has become almost comically laxexcept, that is, for the victims of crime. For the rioters, crime has become the default setting of their behavior; the surprising thing about the riots is not that they have occurred, but that they did not occur sooner and did not become chronic. Guns are almost irrelevant to that situation.
#34
TW, depending on local laws, one can go into WalMart and buy a shotgun 'off the rack' (actually, out of a locked case) after about 20 minutes of paperwork and background check, assuming the computers are all working right. Then they carry it out to your car before handing it to you (my understanding is that mainly they don't want suicides in the store.)
#35
Somalia, where the armed gangs get the food, and the disarmed population must either join the gang/warlord or meek out a life?
But Samuel Colt made them equal. When it gets in their head, a person will figure out a way to kill somebody, preferably with a tool. This martial imbalance leans heavy in favor of the 16-25 year old male. There are old ladies out here whose range with a rifle is only limited by their eyesight. If the simple act of having a firearm made people crazy, I'd be dodging sniper fire like Hillary! all the time. But I don't. The threat to my family comes down to me to address, and it is the 19-24 male doped on meth who does not care much for others sober in a good mood, and his buddy, also amped on drugs because it was not his idea but ya travel in pairs when raiding a house. My house is scouted, they are at the door. Or even better, its the afternoon and I'm not home but the rest of the family is. See, I can control my house, I cannot control police response times.
#36
Hah, LJ5908, never thought of that, too much on the job learning. I did visit the big town today, went to the grocery store, guy was open carry. Looked like a plain clothes LEO to me, but it was interesting to watch the other shoppers.
Any idea what the legal FPS is for airguns in Britain?
#37
Thank you, Lumpy Jereper5908. The seashore of my ignorance is now one pebble smaller. :-).
Shakey Steve, you see what others more knowledgeable than I have to say about Heinlein. I wasn't honestly thinking beyond the West. I know that the SS didn't arrest my grandfather back in the day, because his hunting dog was growling and his hunting rifle leaned against the wall -- and by the time they came back he and my grandmother had fled to Holland. Mama joined them later, very excited that she was being trusted to ride the train by herself.
[Dawn] The riots which tore through London and other major English cities for four days had nothing to do with politics or protest but were motivated by theft, British Prime Minister David Cameron ... has stated that he is certainly a big Thatcher fan, but I don't know whether that makes me a Thatcherite, which means he's not. Since he is not deeply ideological he lacks core principles and is easily led. He has been described as certainly not a Pitt, Elder or Younger, but he does wear a nice suit so maybe he's Beau Brummel ... said Thursday.
The rioting was "not about politics or protest, it is about theft", Cameron told parliament after politicians were recalled from their summer recess to debate the worst looting and violence for decades.
Cameron said he would "not allow a climate of fear to exist on our streets".
He admitted there were "far too few" coppers deployed as the riots reached a peak on Monday night and the tactics they had used had failed to work.
The prime minister, who returned early from holiday in Italia to deal with the riots, announced a package of measures to help homeowners and businesses affected by the riots.
Massively increased police numbers and heavy rain in many parts of the country led to a quiet night overnight Wednesday, leaving Britannia to start to count the cost of the violence.
Four people have died in the riots, including three Asian men mowed down by a car in Birmingham in central England.
Posted by: Fred ||
08/12/2011 00:00 ||
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#1
Pat Condell thinks the two are connected. I tend to agree.
#4
He admitted there were "far too few" coppers deployed as the riots reached a peak on Monday night and the tactics they had used had failed to work.
When you put the police behind desks monitoring CCTV feeds and put barely-trained civilians on the street as 'community service officials', I'd say there's a slight chance of failure.
#1
Any cutback in government spending will add to the unemployment rate, in short order. One of several elephants in the room none talks about.
This will require Congressional action / authorization, very unlikely the necessary time & attention will be given by our distinguished representatives.
Italian police have arrested 20 gladiator impersonators in an undercover sting aimed at ending a violent racket operating around Rome's most famous tourist sites, Italian press reported on Thursday.
Police disguised as gladiators, dustbin men and members of the public raided the gang made up of seven families working with five tourist agencies.
The modern gladiators are accused of attacking and intimidating competitors for a lucrative business in which gladiators collect up to 10 euros ($14) for having their picture taken alongside tourists in front of attractions.
The police officers disguised as gladiators were beaten up by the alleged criminal gladiators before other undercover officers swooped in.
"Gladiators" are a feature of the Roman landscape for tourists, with men decked out in bright red capes, helmets with plumes of red feathers and sandals while carrying swords and round shields.
They can be found outside the Colosseum, Castel Sant'Angelo, Piazza Venezia and even in front of St Peter's Basilica in the Vatican, preying on the millions of tourists who pass through Rome every year.
Criminal gangs had divided up these tourist sights and were defending their territory with violence, the police said.
Five competitors who had been chased away alerted police to the gang's activities, leading to the sting operation.
[An Nahar] La Belle France on Thursday said it had summoned the Ukrainian ambassador in Gay Paree to express its "serious concern" over the arrest of former prime minister Yulia Tymoshenko.
The envoy was told that La Belle France would continue to follow very closely the developments in the case that saw Tymoshenko's arrest on Friday for contempt of court in her abuse of power trial, a foreign ministry spokeswoman said.
He was told of "the serious concern generated by the detention of Mrs. Yulia Tymoshenko and more generally of the progress of (her) trial," spokeswoman Christine Fages told news hounds.
Tymoshenko risks being locked away for up to 10 years if convicted for abuse of power over gas deals she signed with Russia in 2009.
The European Union ...the successor to the Holy Roman Empire, only without the Hapsburgs and the nifty uniforms and the dancing... and the United States have been sharply critical of her arrest, saying it raised concerns about the rule of law in Ukraine.
Tymoshenko on Wednesday bitterly accused her prosecutors of being agents of a "machine of repression" against opposition to President Viktor Yanukovych.
Posted by: Fred ||
08/12/2011 00:00 ||
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In past few decades, the U.S. Air Force has spent untold billions researching and developing a family of stealth fighter jets that are supposed to be generations ahead of any dogfighters in the sky.
But after building more than 170 F-22 Raptors and a handful of F-35 Joint Strike Fighters, not a single one is available for service. The Air Force currently has zero flyable stealth fighters. None.
In a normal world a number of generals would be 'retired' for a screw-up like this.
The vaunted F-22 has been grounded with a possible faulty oxygen system since May. Production of the last few Raptors is even on hold, because the jets cant fly from the factory.
Last week, test flights for the newer F-35 were suspended, too, because of a valve problem in the planes integrated power package. Its the third time this year that JSFs have been forbidden to fly. Ground tests have resumed, and flight tests may resume as early as next week. Then again, they may not.
Yesterday, the U.S. military committed to spending another $535 million to buy 38 more Joint Strike Fighters a family of stealth jets that are supposed to become the multipurpose, affordable workhorses of tomorrows fleet. Ninety percent of Americas combat aviation power is eventually supposed to come from the jets three variants.
But the jets have been anything but cheap. The current cost for the JSF program is $382 billion and rising for more than 2,400 aircraft. No wonder just about every major deficit reduction plan scales back the JSF effort in some way.
For now, every available penny in the JSF program is tied up in getting the jets back into the air and their programs on track.
Looks like we'd better hang onto our F15s, 16s and 18s for a while.
Posted by: Steve White ||
08/12/2011 00:00 ||
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#1
Looks like we'd better hang onto our F15s, 16s and 18s for a while.
I know where we can get a bunch of Intruders. But you have to scrub the salt water stains off.
#3
It's long past time to just do X-45 & X-47 types for fighter bombers. Keep A-10s for close support until robotizing them too.
Posted by: Water Modem ||
08/12/2011 2:23 Comments ||
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#4
"because of a valve problem" Kojack just an upgrade you are correct. I'd bet it's related to oxygen concentrator valve switching from one cylinder to another to give continuous flow of oxygen. Some possible electrical issues related to switching process. Valve problem tells me one unit fills as another empties. They should have a warning indicator should oxygen percentage output drops to prevent pilot issues. We have available 21% normally. Back back in the day it was around 35%. That's why (one reason) I believe dinosaurs may have got so big.
#5
I was very much a skeptic of the V-22 OSPREY program too but it has become a real lifesaver now. It took far more cash than it should have but as it turns out it has become a priceless gem in our wars.
The F-22 is probably better than that F-35 by far. I read that the F-35 only delivers 40% of what was promised. Is that true?
And what is with these replacement engines for the F-35?
#6
The F-22 is probably better than that F-35 by far. I read that the F-35 only delivers 40% of what was promised. Is that true?
Ever since the F-22 line was closed and the F-35 became "IT" we've been subject to a never-ending deluge of information about how horrible the F-35 is. For all I know some of this may even be slightly true.
And maybe it's the F-35 advocates who are standing in the way of the contractors whipping up a better plane for a measly couple billion dollars and six months of development once we cancel this as-horrible-as-an-F111 lemon.
------------------------------
People forget that the F-111 went on to serve for twenty years as a hell of a penetration strike aircraft and then was only retired because we decided to throw away half the air force in the 90's.
At the moment cancelling the F-35 would basically mean cancelling the recapitalization for the half of the air force we have left.
I have no idea where the "40%" figure comes from. I think someone pulled it out of their nether regions somewhere along the line.
The whole replacement engine thing was that GE was upset about losing the contract for the engine, and wanted Congress to buy their engine anyway. If they can't get that they'll see if they can cancel the plane instead, they live in a fantasy world where they think they'll actually GET the funding put in for their stealth version of the F-18Z (which will be built by Boeing but have GE engines).
(I remember when the F-18 follow-ons were the lemon. Hell, as far as I can tell, they still are, we just have diminished expectations).
I guess actually putting engines as good as the ones they say they can put in the F-18Z into the everyone-knows-they're-underpowered but they decided to live with it anyway F-18E/F/G _today_ somehow is beneath their dignity or something.
Yes, that triggers my memory. I certainly am no fan of GE at all. They are the most corrupt political corporation there is behind Goldman Sachs.
I am glad they cancelled the engine.
I wish I had time to find all the articles in my archive.
The U.S. Navy has lifted its block on images of Ghost, the first super-cavitating stealth craft developed, by Juliet Marine Systems.
The craft is a combination of stealth fighter aircraft and attack helicopter technologies packaged in a marine platform and Juliet has now published its image.
Juliet said development of Ghost, done without government funding, was in many ways as difficult as breaking the sound barrier. Ghost is a combination aircraft/boat that has been designed to fly through an artificial underwater gaseous environment that creates 900 times less hull friction than water.
Ghost technology adapts to manned or unmanned, surface or submerged applications.
"Any Navy possessing Ghost technology could operate in international waters undetected and would have an overwhelming advantage against conventional ships," the company said.
"Ghost is specifically designed for Fleet Force Protection at its present size. Ghost technology is scalable and JMS is discussing a plan to build a larger corvette-sized vessel (150 feet) by working with a large international defense company.
Juliet Marine, which has headquarters in New Hampshire, said a squadron of the super-cavitating craft wouldn't be detectable to enemy ship radar and sensors and they can carry thousands of pounds of weapons, including Mark 48 torpedoes.
#1
Almost a FALCON HSV/HTV - hopefully it won't get as "lost".
Meanwhile ...
* WAFF > AS CHINA LAUNCHES ITS FIRST AIRCRAFT CARRIER, US CUTS AIRCRAFT CARRIER FLEET | US NAVY DISBANDS A CARRIER STRIKE GROUP [CSG].
The USN will have 9 ea. CSGS to operat wid 11 CVNS, although in time it will have 9 CSGS for 9 tote CVNS.
* DAILY TIMES. PK > JAPAN CALLS FOR CHINA TO EXPLAIN AIRCRAFT CARRIER.
* WORLD MIL FORUM > CHINA WARNS US, JAPAN THAT IT CONSIDERS JAPAN'S NEW "HELICOPTER DESTROYER" AIRCRAFT CARRIER TO BE A "STRATEGIC OFFENSIVE" WEAPON, NOT "DEFENSIVE", HENCE IS ACCCEPTABLE TO BE TARGETED FOR DESTRUCTION BY CHINA'S SECOND ARTILLERY CORPS.
* SAME > KYODO NEWS: JAPAN'S CHIEF CABINET SECRETARY WARNS THAT JAPAN MAY RETALIATE MILITARILY WID JSDF COMBAT FORCES [Ground, Naval, Air] AGZ ANY PLA INVASION + OCCUPATION OF THE DISPUTED DAOYUS [Japan = Senkakus]. CHINA'S FM RESPONDS BY WARNING JAPAN THAT ANY PERMANENT BASING OF JDSF UNITS IN THE DAOYUS, OR THE USE OF JSDF FORCES IN THE MILITARY DEFENSE OF TAIWAN, WILL BE DEEMED A "HOSTILE ACT" BY JAPAN AGZ CHINA [Act(s) of War] REQUIRING PLA COUNTER-RESPONSE.
* SAME > DRAGON'S BREATH [Fire] 2020: PLA DESIGN + ENGINEERING TEAMS TO DEV LR LAND ATTACK + ANTI-NAVAL TLCM, TLBM COMBAT SYSTEMS FOR CHINA'S FUTURE AIRCRAFT CARRIER FORCE.
* SAME > JAPANESE NAVAL STRATEGISTS: CHINA'S "VARYAG" CVT + SIMILAR MEDIUM-CLASS AIRCRAFT CARRIERS ARE NOT POTENT ENOUGH TO CHALLENGE OR DEFEAT US NAVAL NUCLEAR CARRIER SUPREMACY IN THE PACIFIC [or anywhere else].
* PEOPLE'S DAILY FORUMS: USAF: RQ-4 GLOBAL HAWK TO REPLACE U-2 IN 2015.
A multi-volume chronology and reference guide set detailing three years of the Mexican Drug War between 2010 and 2012.
Rantburg.com and borderlandbeat.com correspondent and author Chris Covert presents his first non-fiction work detailing
the drug and gang related violence in Mexico.
Chris gives us Mexican press dispatches of drug and gang war violence
over three years, presented in a multi volume set intended to chronicle the death, violence and mayhem which has
dominated Mexico for six years.
Rantburg was assembled from recycled algorithms in the United States of America. No
trees were destroyed in the production of this weblog. We did hurt some, though. Sorry.
The pro-BNP lawyers involved in creating chaos in the High Court will apologise for their conduct on August 14.
[An Nahar] Police began raiding houses across London on Thursday to make arrests over the riots that rocked the British capital, with more than 100 warrants issued already, a senior Scotland Yard officer said.
David Cameron
[An Nahar] 
In past few decades, the U.S. Air Force has spent untold billions researching and developing a family of stealth fighter jets that are supposed to be generations ahead of any dogfighters in the sky.
