Article

2007-01-23 Science & Technology

Ford's latest hybrid vehicle has no gasoline engine

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Posted by Fred 2007-01-23 00:00|| || Front Page|| [2 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 Just an electric motor? To provide minimally adequate performance at 5800 lb, I would require on the order of 275 HP. That would be one (or two) huge motor(s).

I don't think you can get an electric motor at less than the weight of a comparable IC engine plus drivetrain.

Posted by Jackal">Jackal 2007-01-23 00:29|| http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html]">[http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html] 2007-01-23 00:29|| Front Page Top

#2 You're a little heavy there J.
You been on mendolia's diet?

Posted by Skidmark 2007-01-23 01:07|| 2007-01-23 01:07|| Front Page Top

#3 And why are they using a fuel cell to charge a battery? Fuel cells are supposed to replace batteries.

Coal to electricity then via distribution system charge fuel cell, charge battery, drive car. That's 3 energy coversions, plus the loss in the electricity distribution and of course in the car's drive train. Overall energy efficiency probably not much more than 5%, certainly less than 10%.

So it will use approximately 5 times as much energy as a gas powered car. Geat idea!

Posted by phil_b 2007-01-23 08:18|| 2007-01-23 08:18|| Front Page Top

#4 phil_b:
Fuel cells can't provide the quick surge that batteries can for breakaway and hard acceleration, so you'd still need a battery, but it could be much smaller and not need to have long-term storage. Capacitors could also work, if we get the dielectric constant high enough.

As for the energy issue, that's true if the energy comes from natural gas or oil. But, if it comes from hydro or nuclear or solar (or coal, I guess), that's energy that otherwise can't be used for transportation (unless we adopt My proposal and electrify the railroads). So, in a sense, efficiency doesn't matter, as even 1% gives you more than you had before. It may not be as efficient, but you are using a cheaper domestic source rather than an expensive foreign one. Then we can destroy the oil wells in the ME, rather than defending them.

My 300C weights 4100 lb. and has 340 HP. Now, not everyone wants 14 second ETs, but the base 300 has 190 HP and is barely adequate (it would be OK in a 3400 lb car, and quite zippy in something under 3000 lb, but not the 3900+ it weighs). So, to keep the same power-to-weight ratio in a 5800 lb. vehicle (it doesn't look that big), you need about 275. Now, arguably, you can get by with less since an electric motor has a better torque curve, but as owners of diesels have found out, a huge torque number is really no substitute for horsepower. A tranny can multiply torque (at the cost of RPM), but there's no way to fake HP you don't have. (No, a coffee-can exhaust pipe won't do it.)

Posted by Jackal">Jackal 2007-01-23 10:13|| http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html]">[http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html] 2007-01-23 10:13|| Front Page Top

#5 Ford (or was it GM) had a brilliant design that used a seperate little engine for each wheel. The plan was to have a skateboard design that could have any type of autobody attached ontop that would have fly-by-wire controls. This would allow Ford (or was it GM) to sell the skateboard to other autocompanies who would finish up the design.

It was a very impressive display, only problem was it was hydrogen. If they retooled the plan to an electric engine or hybrid you might have something.

Posted by rjschwarz 2007-01-23 14:00|| 2007-01-23 14:00|| Front Page Top

#6 rjschwarz:
That was GM. I remember it on Autoblog a year or so ago, but can't find the article now.

Posted by Jackal">Jackal 2007-01-23 14:21|| http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html]">[http://home.earthlink.net/~sleepyjackal/index.html] 2007-01-23 14:21|| Front Page Top

#7 GM has a better concept than Ford. It can use any motor/genset or fuel cell combo to run the electic motors and charge the batteries. GM E-Flex

Posted by ed 2007-01-23 16:48|| 2007-01-23 16:48|| Front Page Top

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