Article

2008-02-24 Europe

Low rate of German-Turkish marriages impede integration

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Posted by ryuge 2008-02-24 09:14|| || Front Page|| [4 views ] Top

#1 It's not ethnicity that's in the way - it's religion. Good night, Europe.

Posted by gromky 2008-02-24 09:46|| 2008-02-24 09:46|| Front Page Top

#2 The Turks came in as guest workers initially, not as immigrants. How they ended up as second class citizens in Germany is their own shame and a chapter in the ongoing questions regarding Islam and intentions and violence and laziness.

Posted by rjschwarz 2008-02-24 12:23|| 2008-02-24 12:23|| Front Page Top

#3 How so, rjschwarz? German laws prohibitted Turkish 'guest workers' from becoming citizens, owning businesses etc for a long time. Hard to see that as laziness on the Turks' part.

Posted by lotp 2008-02-24 12:32|| 2008-02-24 12:32|| Front Page Top

#4 Guest workers are supposed to come, work for a while, and then GO BACK HOME. Every country on the face of the Earth has such a program, or at least in my experience.

Posted by gromky 2008-02-24 14:00|| 2008-02-24 14:00|| Front Page Top

#5 Thank you Gromsky. The first generation of Turks were not a problem at all. When the wall came down and the East Germans were virtually unemployable some effort should have been made to end the guest worker concept. That was a generation ago and I hate to say it but the youngest generation of Muslims seems ot have a problem with the West.

Posted by rjschwarz 2008-02-24 15:26|| 2008-02-24 15:26|| Front Page Top

#6 The answer to this is just incredibly simple: ban Islam. No mosques, no muezzins, no halal slaughterhouses, no concessions to Muzzies' mores whatsoever. Just state that Muslims cannot practice their religion in Germany, under pain of immediate deportation to country of ethnic origin.

When the Left asks why, point them at the Magic Kingdom and tell them that when the spiritual home of Islam starts allowing people of other faiths to worship freely, the matter can be revisited. Until that time, Islam is banned. Be adamant about the prohibition, enough so that both friends and enemies have absolutely no doubt about its continued enforcement.

Then stand back and watch the rush for the exits.

Posted by Jomosing Bluetooth8431 2008-02-24 16:14|| 2008-02-24 16:14|| Front Page Top

#7 Guest workers are supposed to come, work for a while, and then GO BACK HOME.

But that is not what the Germans asked for or incented.

They specifically leaned on 'guest workers' to fill jobs in a workforce persistently hollowed out by a population too comfortable to have and raise kids.

The Turks didn't demand that Germany keep them for 3 and 4 generations - the Germans were quite cozy with the setup and kept stringing the Turks along with the promise that eventually Turkey would join the EU and the Turks in Germany could become citizens.

Posted by lotp 2008-02-24 16:22|| 2008-02-24 16:22|| Front Page Top

#8 '' The Turks didn't demand that Germany keep them for 3 and 4 generations - the Germans were quite cozy with the setup and kept stringing the Turks along with the promise that eventually Turkey would join the EU and the Turks in Germany could become citizens''
Never read such a nonsense before!!. Neither Germany nor France nor most others EU countries want Turkey to join the EU AND the door is still WIDE open for them to leave, if they don't like it here.

Posted by SGL 2008-02-24 19:03|| 2008-02-24 19:03|| Front Page Top

#9 It may seem like nonsense, but that is exactly what Germany's attitude re: both the guest workers and at least officially re: Turkey and the EU was in the 1990s.

(Mr. Lotp's family are, on one side, Germans living mostly in Germany. We get frank opinions from them from time to time on issues like this.)

Some things have changed since the 1990s however. First, unification with eastern Germany flooded the job market with workers, reducing the perceived need for Turkish guest workers. And then the rise of an Islamic party taking power in Turkey, along with 9/11, changed the perceived risk of Turkey entering the EU.

Nevertheless, Turkey became an official candidate for EU membership in 1998 or so and that's still their official status.

Posted by lotp 2008-02-24 19:15|| 2008-02-24 19:15|| Front Page Top

#10 Whether or not Germany wants Turkey in the EU is beside the point that they have strung their Turkish guest workers along for generations. They didn't assimilate them and they didn't force them to return. So now they amount to an invasion force from within. And the Germans are defenceless against an enemy they themselves have created. In my opinion, it couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of folks, except the French. But they've created their own version in the banlieus. A pox on both their houses.

Posted by Nimble Spemble 2008-02-24 19:22|| 2008-02-24 19:22|| Front Page Top

#11 >>Some things have changed since the 1990s however. First, unification with eastern Germany flooded the job market with workers, reducing the perceived need for Turkish guest workers. And then the rise of an Islamic party taking power in Turkey, along with 9/11, changed the perceived risk of Turkey entering the EU.>>

Some valid points here BUT I'm just a bit tired about these eternal lefty rants, that an immigration country should give up/adjust its values to ideologies from the dark ages.
WE WON`T DO THIS.
Apart from this, there are plenty of positive examples of migrants who have successfully integrated in Germany. Some of them are even in an engaged fight for religious freedom (free choice of religion- not quite a Muslim stronghold.. hm), women rights( ever heard about forced Muslim marriages or bride killings??) etc. There are others, who have become pretty successful and wealthy businessmen/women. The chances are there, but you have to get of your a**s instead of just relying on payments of the nanny welfare state.

Posted by SGL 2008-02-24 19:50|| 2008-02-24 19:50|| Front Page Top

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