Article

2022-04-05 Caucasus/Russia/Central Asia

Russian Army is now visually confirmed to have lost at least 400 tanks

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Posted by Fred 2022-04-05 00:00|| || Front Page|| [6 views ] Top
File under: Tin Hat Dictators, Presidents for Life, & Kleptocrats

#1 And here ↓ come the overly passionate but rude bastitches supporting either side for no particular reason, in 3...2...1...

They're not paid, nobody from DC to Bankova street to the Kremlin cares about them, but they spend inordinate amounts of time on Rantburg trying to change minds and win hearts by insulting others.

Here they come. Enjoy, Smoky the bear and Bubba Smith.

Posted by Dron66046 2022-04-05 06:15|| 2022-04-05 06:15|| Front Page Top

#2 Please don't censor the trolls today. They are delightful to debate and give the site a great deal of energy.

Posted by The Walking Unvaxed 2022-04-05 06:21|| 2022-04-05 06:21|| Front Page Top

#3 To try to save some bandwidth, I've complied a list of pro-Putin talking points our visitors can just check off as the spirit moves them:

( ) The Ukrainians are Nazis, especially the Jewish ones.

( ) Ukraine was wearing a short skirt. And for that matter, Poland and the Baltics are looking pretty hot.

( ) We had to destroy Mariupol in order to save it.

( ) We are not targeting civilians. Our aim isn’t all that good, though.

( ) We’ve weakened NATO by showing just how valuable NATO membership is.

( ) NATO made us do it.

( ) America made us do it.

( ) The Chinese didn’t make us do it, but they approve. Sort of.

( ) Good news! India is willing to buy our oil at 20% below market. We’re like the watermelon salesman — we’ll make it up on volume.

( ) Our special operation in Ukraine will make the dollar cease to be the world’s reserve currency. Heck, we haven’t seen a dollar in weeks.

Posted by Matt 2022-04-05 10:46|| 2022-04-05 10:46|| Front Page Top

#4 ^ Not "snark of the day" but best sarcasm / cynicism tutorial so far this month.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 10:49|| 2022-04-05 10:49|| Front Page Top

#5 ( ) Our tank and helicopter production was lagging due to excessive inventory. Our Military Industrial Complex oligarchs have set exciting new production and fielding goals.

Posted by Besoeker 2022-04-05 10:56|| 2022-04-05 10:56|| Front Page Top

#6 Comment threads like this is why I come to Rantburg

Posted by DarthVader 2022-04-05 10:58|| 2022-04-05 10:58|| Front Page Top

#7 Walter Russell Mead: Biden's Ugly Options in Ukraine
1. Escalate and threaten Russia with nuclear war (LOL)
2. "Force Ukraine to accept Russian demands"
3. "Freeze" the conflict

"The first option, helping Ukraine win, is the most emotionally appealing

[always the best course of action: follow your feelz!]

"and would certainly be the most morally justifiable and politically beneficial, but the risks and costs are high. Russia won’t accept defeat before trying every tactic, however brutal, and perhaps every weapon, however murderous. To force Russia to accept failure in Ukraine, the Biden administration would likely have to shift to a wartime mentality, perhaps including the kind of nuclear brinkmanship not seen since the Cuban missile crisis of 1962. With China and Iran both committed to weakening American power by any available means, a confrontation with the revisionist powers spearheaded by Russia may prove to be the most arduous challenge faced by an American administration since the height of the Cold War.

["Joe, you're no Jack Kennedy"]

"But the other two options are also bad. A Russian victory would inflict a massive blow to American prestige and the health of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization, especially if the West were seen as forcing Ukraine to surrender to Russian demands.

"Freezing the conflict is also perilous, as this would presumably leave Russia holding even more Ukrainian territory than it did following the 2014 invasions of Crimea and the Donbas. It would be hard to spin this as anything but a partial victory for Russia—and Mr. Putin would remain free to renew hostilities at a time of his choosing."

This is what's likely to happen. And of course Psaki's successor and all of Bidens media shills (excluding honest Walter Mead) will "spin this as anything but a victory for Russia" -- as America gets invaded and plundered and becomes poorer and less free. For #Ukraine!

Posted by Oscar Graviter4329 2022-04-05 11:05|| 2022-04-05 11:05|| Front Page Top

#8 WRM gives a certain vastly overrated blogger a woody lasting more than 4 hours. As soon as I see it's Waltah writing, I move on.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 11:06|| 2022-04-05 11:06|| Front Page Top

#9 #7 To force Russia to accept failure in Ukraine, the Biden administration would likely have to shift to a wartime mentality

They already are on a "wartime mentality": the Biden administration's been waging war against Americans on every front since before Biden was inaugurated

Posted by Spats Turkeyneck2118 2022-04-05 11:14|| 2022-04-05 11:14|| Front Page Top

#10 Matt: *golf clap* outstanding

Posted by Frank G 2022-04-05 11:16|| 2022-04-05 11:16|| Front Page Top

#11 The "frozen conflict" option allows Putin to keep on attacking Ukrainians and Biden to keep on destroying America.

With hyperinflation and shortages of everything, Biden can move forward to rationing of gas and food, UBI, Bernie's 95% tax on corporate profits, government seizures of private assets, nationalization of key industries...

Posted by Spats Turkeyneck2118 2022-04-05 11:18|| 2022-04-05 11:18|| Front Page Top

#12 ^ Putin can't afford to spend as he is right now in Ukraine for 20 years. America couldn't afford it either in Afghanistan, but we are just about to hit the borrowing wall now.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 11:22|| 2022-04-05 11:22|| Front Page Top

#13 Food rationing has already started in Spain. Every left-wing government will be doing this soon. American cities will follow Spain's example:

The socialist government of Spain has introduced new laws allowing for the supermarkets to ration food and other items as a part of its “Response Plan” to the economic fallout from the war in Ukraine.

Amid soaring inflation, which hit nearly 10 per cent in March, the Spanish government, controlled by the leftist Spanish Socialist Workers’ Party of Prime Minister Pedro Sánchez has opened up a legal loophole for supermarkets to begin rationing to customers.

Posted by Helmuth, Speaking for Bonaparte1955 2022-04-05 11:27|| 2022-04-05 11:27|| Front Page Top

#14 Seems there are so many fat people in the world today that food rationing could be the best test case ever for "needs based" regulations.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 11:30|| 2022-04-05 11:30|| Front Page Top

#15 #12 Putin can't afford to spend as he is right now in Ukraine for 20 years

How much is Russia spending? Do you know? The best analysis at the war's height was less than $500 million per day. A frozen conflict would require not more than $100m/day. Russia has a current account surplus that's already over $200 billion. Goldman Sachs now forecasts that Russia is on track to make $321 billion in oil revenues in 2022.

This doesn't even include the other revenues from exporting to Brazil, India, China and all the other big markets that are not telling the West to screw off. Russia can easily afford a frozen conflict for years to come.

Putin May Collect $321 Billion Windfall If Oil and Gas Keep Flowing
Goldman, IIF expect record current-account surplus for Russia

Bloomberg Economics expects Russia will earn nearly $321 billion from energy exports this year, an increase of more than a third from 2021. It’s also on track for a record current-account surplus that the Institute of International Finance says may reach as high as $240 billion.

Posted by Cheack Creatch3905 2022-04-05 11:40|| 2022-04-05 11:40|| Front Page Top

#16 Brazil, India, China and all the other big markets that are *now telling the West to screw off.

Posted by Cheack Creatch3905 2022-04-05 11:42|| 2022-04-05 11:42|| Front Page Top

#17 Every time I read a MSM story about "teachers who have to buy pencils and paper for their classroom from they own funds," I then think about our pro bassetbaw stars that make millions a year and say they are basically slaves. I don't think Russia has $500 million a day / week / year to waste on Ukraine. Just as iran can't afford its nuke program or NKor its missile program.

All of that spending is foul and wrong, but hey, we do it too, so I guess everyone else is just following the example, eh?

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 11:45|| 2022-04-05 11:45|| Front Page Top

#18 Russia is on track to make $321 billion in oil revenues in 2022.

...another very nice benefit of the "frozen conflict" option for the Biden administration is mucho kickbacks for the Biden family. More million dollar wire transfers from Russia to Biden's bagman. Get that pardon ready, Joe

Posted by Spats Turkeyneck2118 2022-04-05 11:49|| 2022-04-05 11:49|| Front Page Top

#19 Dear Sir. I am a Nigerian Prince and my country is awash in money, but I can't get access to it without your help. Please send me your bank account and routing numbers...

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 11:50|| 2022-04-05 11:50|| Front Page Top

#20 The only thing I regret is that Trump didn't do this to California a couple years ago. That would have been a laugh riot and over in 3-4 days.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 11:55|| 2022-04-05 11:55|| Front Page Top

#21 Russians--or Putin anyway--excel at frozen conflicts. They haven't even bothered to use their navy or Air Force in this one. It's havoc on the cheap. Just do the math. A $250 billion current account surplus will fund a low intensity conflict that ensures Ukraine will be as poor as Gaza for, well, as long as Gaza has been poor.

Russia's current account situation is the opposite of ours: they're piling up savings, importing far less than they export, while we spend like drunken sailors, run up enormous deficits and pile up debts as far as the eye can see. Then we hope-pray-wish that other nations (mainly China) will keep lending us money, funding the spree and bailing us out.

A poster here pointed out that the US debt to GDP ratio is 125%, while Russia's is not even 1/7th ours. Their debt to GDP is the lowest in the industrialized world (17%).

He also noted that Russia has enough physical gold to almost totally (85% iirc) back up its money supply. The US has only 9% of its money supply backed by physical gold.

Posted by Cheack Creatch3905 2022-04-05 12:01|| 2022-04-05 12:01|| Front Page Top

#22 There you have it, friends. "Frozen conflict." Neither winning nor losing. Right, troll?

Can Elsa sing it?

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 12:07|| 2022-04-05 12:07|| Front Page Top

#23 Heck, we haven’t seen a dollar in weeks. 😁

Posted by Dron66046 2022-04-05 12:07|| 2022-04-05 12:07|| Front Page Top

#24 #19 Nigerian

I don't think you understand. The oil exports are real. Commodities are real. The $321 billion that Goldman Sachs expects Russia to receive is real. Not funny paper cranked out by Jay Powell and Joe Biden's printing press.

Also, settlement is a trivial problem which the world's bankers can easily solve with non-SWIFT payment mechanisms. The ruble is going to backed by gold -- again, the ratio is a very healthy 85%, not pitiful 9% as is the case for the US fiat currency.

Posted by Cheack Creatch3905 2022-04-05 12:09|| 2022-04-05 12:09|| Front Page Top

#25 I don't understand. I need to get educated.

Can you say "dog whistle," boys and girls?

I knew ya could...

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 12:13|| 2022-04-05 12:13|| Front Page Top

#26 #22 There you have it, friends. "Frozen conflict." Neither winning nor losing. Right, troll?

Walter Russell Mead's a "troll"?

He said the other two outcomes are either Biden threatens thermonuclear war, or a Russian victory. What do you think the chances are that Biden can successfully pull off another Cuban Missile Crisis?

Or are you implying you actually prefer the other option -- a Russian victory? Are you just trolling us, "Murcek"?

Posted by Oscar Graviter4329 2022-04-05 12:16|| 2022-04-05 12:16|| Front Page Top

#27 The $however many billion that Goldman Sachs expects Russia to receive is real.

Really real. So real you can feel it. You might even stub your toe on it.

GS is only around today because Lehman was greedier and stupider.

I think the Russians are afraiderer of nazis. That may not work out so well for them.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 12:19|| 2022-04-05 12:19|| Front Page Top

#28 ^ Dont waste your time with the troll. Sarcasm is the resort of those who don't understand economics and can't do basic math

Posted by Cheack Creatch3905 2022-04-05 12:19|| 2022-04-05 12:19|| Front Page Top

#29 successfully pull off another Cuban Missile Crisis

Bwahahhahahhhahhahahhahhaaaaa! Most historians say Jack almost destroyed the world even with the last credible cold-war brain trust experts at his disposal.

Joe does not have that.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 12:22|| 2022-04-05 12:22|| Front Page Top

#30 Don't most trolls have treasure? Where's my treasure?

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 12:24|| 2022-04-05 12:24|| Front Page Top

#31 $250 billion current account surplus will fund a low intensity conflict that ensures Ukraine will be as poor as Gaza for, well, as long as Gaza has been poor.

Bloody hell... so we're going to be on the hook for funding bombed out Ukraine for the rest of the century? While we get food rationing and petrol queues. Fucking lovely

Posted by Greck Fillmore6253 2022-04-05 12:31|| 2022-04-05 12:31|| Front Page Top

#32 $250 billion current account surplus will fund a low intensity conflict that ensures Ukraine will be as poor as Gaza for, well, as long as Gaza has been poor.

And you can see, good sir, with your help, we can unlock that wealth forthwith...

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 12:34|| 2022-04-05 12:34|| Front Page Top

#33 #29 "successfully pull off another Cuban Missile Crisis"
Most historians say Jack almost destroyed the world even with the last credible cold-war brain trust experts at his disposal. Joe does not have that.

Alright, then which of Mead's other two outcomes do you expect-- Russian victory, or frozen conflict?

Seriously, I'd like to hear people weigh in on which of these two is more likely. Go ahead, Murcek. What do you think? Do you think?

Posted by Oscar Graviter4329 2022-04-05 12:38|| 2022-04-05 12:38|| Front Page Top

#34 Ukraine will be as poor as Gaza for, well, as long as Gaza has been poor.

Yeah, that's the plan. Create another oppressed victim & charity group so our politicians can posture as morally superior while they screw us and waste our money. As well, we get millions of refugees we have to support - while they ration our food. All according to plan.

Posted by Helmuth, Speaking for Bonaparte1955 2022-04-05 12:45|| 2022-04-05 12:45|| Front Page Top

#35 I think Russia "wins." They get to define what "wins" means. Wall Street totally goes along with that, because, what else are they going to do? Bidet and Kamala declare victory, which means he's a Putin apologist and she s*cks Putin's cock. The dems still lose the mid-terms, but the GOPe makes it a closely run thing. The bigger their margins, the harder they sell their voters out. Because only the dems have non-real voters, and how can such constructs feel sold-out?Zelllleeeeeennnnnnsssssskkkkyyyy remains prexident (or whatever his title is) of Ukraine. There are still nazis, but they are lower case nazis as always.

More of the same, but staler, more unpalatable and more expensive. Wash, rinse, repeat.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 12:47|| 2022-04-05 12:47|| Front Page Top

#36 I think Russia wins and Ukraine becomes European Gaza. Russia becomes like Israel and bombs the fuck out of Ukraine-Gaza every time they get frisky. This goes on for 50 years.

Posted by Helmuth, Speaking for Bonaparte1955 2022-04-05 12:52|| 2022-04-05 12:52|| Front Page Top

#37 Which I could live with as long as the US involvement is limited to "sternly worded communiques" from 9th tier diplomats we have to pay anyway to do something.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 12:58|| 2022-04-05 12:58|| Front Page Top

#38 I think Russia wins and Ukraine becomes European Gaza. Russia becomes like Israel and bombs the fuck out of Ukraine-Gaza every time they get frisky.

I could go for that. As long as it's none of our money going down the Ukraine-Gaza sinkhole. I mean, who gives a shit about Chechnya today? Ukraine-Gaza will be replaced by The Current Thing soon enough. ("sternly-worded communiques" -- heh)

Posted by Oscar Graviter4329 2022-04-05 14:26|| 2022-04-05 14:26|| Front Page Top

#39 So Russia is turning a profit off their war while risking famines around the world?

Good Lord, that's inhuman! That certainly counts as a crime against humanity! If you really care about people, you'd demand Putin withdraw from the Ukraine so the sanctions can be dropped. It may be too late for the Ukrainian harvest, but the Russians haven't had a hostile army running around, and their fertilizer exports can get back on track!

Posted by Rob Crawford 2022-04-05 15:04|| 2022-04-05 15:04|| Front Page Top

#40 War is not profitable. Has never been. But the powers that be will never, ever let you hear that. There is a difference between certain people "making money" and humanity's overall increase in wealth.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 15:07|| 2022-04-05 15:07|| Front Page Top

#41 It remains, though, that Putin is risking famines around the world for... what?

Posted by Rob Crawford 2022-04-05 16:02|| 2022-04-05 16:02|| Front Page Top

#42 Where's my treasure?

In your wit M.
May I call you M?

Posted by Skidmark 2022-04-05 16:29|| 2022-04-05 16:29|| Front Page Top

#43 M is fine. M is for Martin, which I am also fine with. My long-time friends call me Bud. Because my great aunt called me "her little buddy" when I was an infant. It stuck and I still like being called that too.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 16:36|| 2022-04-05 16:36|| Front Page Top

#44 It remains, though, that Putin is risking famines around the world for... what?

I'd guess there are 20 reasons related to Covid Protocols before getting sanctions preventing Russia exports, then getting to ripples in the Ukraine harvest.

I'm not quite sold on that part either, kind of depends on the strain of wheat. Out here it was planted months ago and the only thing to do is hope for the right moisture and keep an eye on weeds. If its a Spring wheat, then yes it is about planting time, and again dependent upon the grain and ground temperature and conditions.

Could be all those tractors are available because it is still idle time with the fields, and if the fronts become stabilized, those not near fighting could sow, if the appropriate resources are available such a fuel and parts for the implements.

The worldwide potential decrease in yields has a lot more to do with shutting down international (and intra-national) trade for a year and varying degrees of restrictions for an additional year.

Its these very same politicians who shut down our own energy and manufacturing capacities. Stories of fertilizer waiting to unload in California from China taking so long as to miss planting for Winter Wheat, that's California Government and people like Buttgig who slept their way to their position and are totally incapable of solving real problems, so they make money off of creating them. Whatever Putin is or is not, this is not on him.

PS - it also wouldn't be the first time Brandon hyped up a situation to scare people into The Narrative. Like, when all the unvaxed were supposed to die this last Winter so go get your shots and boosters.

Posted by swksvolFF 2022-04-05 17:02|| 2022-04-05 17:02|| Front Page Top

#45 Politicians are not our friends. The original idea that politics is a form of organization that will benefit humanity is over now. politics is a business and leeching off humanity is the business model. They won't go away and they won't go easy, but they need to go, for the long term good of the human race.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 17:08|| 2022-04-05 17:08|| Front Page Top

#46 ^ Not solvable by humans. But a time is coming. When the kingdoms of this world shall become the Lord's.

Posted by Dron66046 2022-04-05 17:21|| 2022-04-05 17:21|| Front Page Top

#47 After 2020 and going into 21 The Ag Community was very vocal about what it needed, and certain key states and fed gov actually aggravated those needs, so whatever shortfalls in yields in the USA occur, and they are expected, is mostly government inflicted, and they would love it if you blamed Russia in the Ukraine instead of ridiculous dock yard policies which had shipments from Asia going to the Gulf or SE Coast to unload instead of West Coast to sit over the horizon for unknown weeks until their number came up or the check cleared.

Posted by swksvolFF 2022-04-05 17:23|| 2022-04-05 17:23|| Front Page Top

#48 #35 I think Russia "wins." They get to define what "wins" means. Wall Street totally goes along with that, because, what else are they going to do?

Yup. Dividing and smashing the country to pieces is "winning." How many people does Ukraine even have left? Millions emigrated before the war, millions more have left since Feb. 24, and they've since lost millions more in Donbas, Mariupol etc.

I doubt Ukraine's healthy population even exceeds 20 million at this point. It would take decades and trillions in western aid to get the country back to anywhere close to where it was before February.

Posted by Cheack Creatch3905 2022-04-05 17:28|| 2022-04-05 17:28|| Front Page Top

#49 #46 Cripe, Dron, thats the Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem outlook. I totally agree!

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 17:29|| 2022-04-05 17:29|| Front Page Top

#50 Wall Street totally goes along with that, because, what else are they going to do?

Wall Street is most definitely on Russia's side - go for the gold, literally. Bill Browder is besieged with calls from money guys asking him how they can exploit this situation, which securities to invest in.

Posted by Cheack Creatch3905 2022-04-05 17:34|| 2022-04-05 17:34|| Front Page Top

#51 #48 it's a piece of dirt. Who cares if anybody lives there? It's certainly not up to the rest of the world to subsidze human habitation there. Beadbasket, blah blah blah. If there's money to be made off the land there, it will happen regardless.

Posted by M. Murcek 2022-04-05 17:36|| 2022-04-05 17:36|| Front Page Top

#52 Their black earth is good farmland, similar in richness and quality to south-central Illinois black earth. Coal too (also like Illinois). But the Ukrainians are so corrupt and incompetent they've squandered what little good fortune they were given. It's basically like a middle eastern shithole.

Posted by Cheack Creatch3905 2022-04-05 17:47|| 2022-04-05 17:47|| Front Page Top

#53

/\ But the Ukrainians are so corrupt and incompetent they've squandered what little good fortune

Also like Illinois.

Posted by Besoeker 2022-04-05 17:51|| 2022-04-05 17:51|| Front Page Top

#54 David P Goldman in PJ Media:

An “opportunity to complete the deindustrialization of Ukraine.” Putin isn’t defeated or baffled or confused. He’s turning the crank on the meatgrinder.

One doesn’t have to read too far into these lines to conclude that Putin hoped that Zelensky would cut a deal on his terms once Russia invaded, but when Zelensky refused to cut a deal, Putin moved to Option B, which is to erase most of Ukraine from the face of the earth.

That’s not as difficult as it sounds. Putin will keep the bits he wants in the Southeast (Donetsk and Luhansk), leave the West to factory farming, and pound the rest to rubble with artillery and air power.

Posted by Cheack Creatch3905 2022-04-05 18:13|| 2022-04-05 18:13|| Front Page Top

#55 "think Russia wins and Ukraine becomes European Gaza."
Ukrainians are not as stupid as the Palestinians.

Brits are already planning to build nuclear plants. I believe the Germans will follow. Russian stranglehold on energy exports will diminish in time.

Nuclear weapons and rockets have a shelf life and high cost of maintenance. At some point Russia's Florida sized economy will have to chose between a conventional military or maintaining the nuclear weapons.

Russia can't hold Ukraine for more than decade, shorter if they smash Ukraine at some later point.

Posted by ruprecht 2022-04-05 20:46|| 2022-04-05 20:46|| Front Page Top

#56 #55 "think Russia wins and Ukraine becomes European Gaza."
Ukrainians are not as stupid as the Palestinians.

Yes but they're (even) more corrupt. In any case this assessment is correct. Ukraine was the poorest country in Europe before the war. Now they will be as poor as sub-Saharan Africans. Wards of the European state.

Posted by Bill Ebbiting5280 2022-04-05 20:58|| 2022-04-05 20:58|| Front Page Top

#57 It's amusing to see people whine about corruption in the Ukraine, when Russia is right next door. Putin's corruption set the tone for the entire nation -- that's why their soldiers don't even have optics, let alone radios or trucks that can run farther than the local liquor store.

Posted by Rob Crawford 2022-04-05 21:17|| 2022-04-05 21:17|| Front Page Top

#58 Why go to the liquor store when you have a whole radiator full of coolant right there?

Posted by SteveS 2022-04-05 21:38|| 2022-04-05 21:38|| Front Page Top

#59 The West is with the US and its crippling sanctions.
The non-western world opposes these sanctions and is with Russia.

One of China's top diplomats, Zhou Xiaoming, notes that of the 193 member nations in the UN, more than 150 "refused to join in the West's effort to hamper Russia." These nations represent more than half the world's wealth and about 80% of its people.

Despite the Biden Administration's bluster, begging, and pleading, over 150 nations have held firm it is false to say that the West's sanctions "represent the will of the international community....This claim is neither accurate nor factual."

Posted by Thumper Dark Lord of the Wee Folk2728 2022-04-05 22:32|| 2022-04-05 22:32|| Front Page Top

23:58 Phusoper Snore3986
22:32 Thumper Dark Lord of the Wee Folk2728
21:38 SteveS
21:26 Rob Crawford
21:24 magpie
21:23 Rob Crawford
21:21 magpie
21:17 Rob Crawford
21:15 Rob Crawford
20:58 Bill Ebbiting5280
20:46 ruprecht
20:39 ruprecht
20:31 badanov
20:29 ruprecht
19:42 American Exceptionalism LOL
19:04 Procopius2k
19:02 Procopius2k
18:59 jpal
18:53 Thing From Snowy Mountain
18:52 swksvolFF
18:44 swksvolFF
18:37 Glenmore
18:19 JohnQC
18:13 Cheack Creatch3905