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2005-02-10 Caribbean-Latin America

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Posted by tipper 2005-02-10 00:47|| || Front Page|| [5 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 Indeed, they advocate a return to the preâColumbian Inca state, with the European cultural and ethnic (i.e. âwhiteâ) additions removedâby force.

I understand that the "white additions" in questions has been very vocal on the "rights" of Palestinians. Gloat, gloat.

Posted by gromgorru 2005-02-10 2:12:58 PM|| 2005-02-10 2:12:58 PM|| Front Page Top

#2 I find it amusing that the descendants of European immigrants in Latin America are extremely anti-American, but may yet need Uncle Sam's help in hauling their ashes out of the fire at some future date.

Posted by Zhang Fei 2005-02-10 2:54:01 PM|| [http://timurileng.blogspot.com] 2005-02-10 2:54:01 PM|| Front Page Top

#3 Do you think that the Native Latin Americans are any less anti-American?

I think you are deluding yourselves if you think that an Native American-fascist resurgence will be any better in regards to how it treats Israel.

In the "anti-colonialist" rhetoric, where white "Westerners" are seen as imperialist overlords, where democracy itself is seen as an imperialist intrusion of the West to native traditions, in their contempt for democracy as compared to their ideals of historical-racial-tribal purity...

...it's itself the Arab rhetoric against the very existence of the state of Israel.

How long do you think before the Indio-fascists (I am using the term used in the article) redefine their ideology to say that instead of four there exist "five races", one of them being the Arabs, and reapply their calls for the expulsion to whites from South America to also cover the expulsion of Jews from the Middle-East?

Presenting itself as "anti-colonialism", treating democracy as if it's nothing but an element of western cultural imperialism; this is the new face of global fascism. You can also see clearly it in the black racism of Zimbabwe and elsewhere in Africa.

And, though more subtly in Ukraine, you could see it in all the claims by mostly far-left fascists that such democratic revolutions were "imported" from the West, aka imperialism (instead of what it really was: namely the opposite of imperialism, the right of self-determination), while supposedly Russia had a "historical" right to intervene because of the racial-tribal-historical connections.

Once again: this is the face of a new-rising global fascism that sees the racial-ethnic connections as superior in priority to democracy or individual freedoms, those supposedly both western instead of pan-human ideas. In the Middle-east it shows itself as hatred of the Jews. In Native America and Subsaharan Africa as hatred of white people.

This is Huntington's world, except that instead of being merely *descriptive*, these fascists want it to be a *prescriptive* vision.

Posted by Aris Katsaris 2005-02-10 3:40:55 PM|| [http://www.livejournal.com/~katsaris/] 2005-02-10 3:40:55 PM|| Front Page Top

#4 If its ashes they are, hauling out of the fire won't interest them much anymore ;-) As for the Inca thing, didn't they indulge in massive human sacrifices to their gods? How then do these people expect to get support from their neighbors long -- or even medium -- term?

Posted by trailing wife 2005-02-10 3:41:05 PM|| 2005-02-10 3:41:05 PM|| Front Page Top

#5 Last time I was there (1999), this stuff was just getting started. Graffitti about indianismo, road blocks exhorting money from criollos (natives of European descent) and turistas, demonstrations, etc. The same kind of movement is growing in the Mayan highlands and lowlands in Guatemala and Yucatan. It's hard to say how serious it is. There were outbursts of this movement in the 1800s, which never came to anything. They certainly have some real greivances. Latin racism, while largely hidden, is pretty bad. They've been under the thumb of the criollos for 500 years.

This is part of the "blowback" from globalization. TV, remittances from abroad, increased education and the Internet empower people who haven't had power in half a millenium. The same sort of thing is happening with the Kurds and Shiites in Iraq and has already happened with the Shiites in Lebanon (Hezbollah).

So we have a positive model of how this might turn out (Kurds) and a negative model (Lebanese Shiites). Both are very weak analogies and don't provide a lot of insight into the Andean and Mayan problems. The role of Evangelical Christianity complicates things immensely in Latin America, too. Despite keeping an eye on this area for the last half a decade, I don't have a clue how it will turn out. But it bears watching.

Posted by 11A5S 2005-02-10 4:04:17 PM|| 2005-02-10 4:04:17 PM|| Front Page Top

#6 Toss in the unspoken caste system between those with Indian blood and those of European blood into that pot 11A.

Posted by Thinens Angomolet9553 2005-02-10 8:43:21 PM|| 2005-02-10 8:43:21 PM|| Front Page Top

#7 Dear Aris

Mimsi were the borogoves
Twas brilling, and the slithy toves...

Posted by gromgorru 2005-02-10 10:15:48 PM|| 2005-02-10 10:15:48 PM|| Front Page Top

#8 That's "Mimsy", not "Mimsi".

Posted by Tom 2005-02-10 10:59:40 PM|| 2005-02-10 10:59:40 PM|| Front Page Top

#9 What happens to a dream deferred?
Does it dry like a raisin in the sun?
Or fester like a sore
and then run?....
Maybe it just sags
like a heavy load,
OR DOES IT EXPLODE?

Langston Hughes

In studying History with my daughter, we keep running into times--the Reformation, the French Revolution, Ireland after the Famine--in which the combination of ignorance and gross repression explodes into the kind of madness the article describes. It's what led to the Peasants' War in the German territories, with thousands killed; it's what led to the French Revolutionary judge chopping Lavoisier's head off, saying "The Revolution doesn't need scientists." Hate plus ignorance plus suffering equals hell.

In Bolivia, only a few families have any power. Anyone without the select surnames is nobody. A Bolivian lady of my acquaintance was shaking her head about the Bolivians who have settled in the US that bring those mindsets into the US. They are nobody. They have the wrong surname. Or if they have the right one they think they can lord it over the others in the same way they did back home.

Bolivia's natives have nothing to hope for, so they will follow these demons, as the German population followed Hitler and the Russians followed Lenin and Stalin. First they think these leaders offer them some hope; then they find they've been lied to but the leaders are in place and they have the guns.

Posted by mom 2005-02-10 11:07:52 PM|| 2005-02-10 11:07:52 PM|| Front Page Top

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