Article

2003-12-22 Iran

Iranian air force chief: Israel to ââdig own graveââ

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Posted by Steve 2003-12-22 10:04:03 AM|| || Front Page|| [4 views since 2007-05-07] Top

#1 Speaking of "digging"... Jogged by shots of that MiG buried in Iraq, I wonder aloud just how many airplanes Iranian air force has still capable of flight. Did they give Saddam's air force back after GW I or not?

Posted by Glenn (not Reynolds) 2003-12-22 10:58:13 AM|| 2003-12-22 10:58:13 AM|| Front Page Top

#2 "The (Zionist) regime knows that the armed forces of the Islamic republic, in particular our air force, have such high capabilities...

Unfortunately for Iran, the "Zionists" have even higher capabilities, something that General Pardis may end up finding out the hard way.

Posted by Bomb-a-rama 2003-12-22 11:09:37 AM|| 2003-12-22 11:09:37 AM|| Front Page Top

#3 just how many airplanes Iranian air force has still capable of flight. Did they give Saddam's air force back after GW I or not?

No, they kept everything that fled to Iraq. The older stuff ended up in storage, but they integrated the more modern aircraft (SU-24s and MiG 29s) into their forces. They also bought more of the two aircraft types from Russia. The 24's, I believe, also have in-flight refueling capability.

On paper, the Iranians have a small but capable force. Whether they can stand up to the Israelis is another question.

Posted by Pappy 2003-12-22 2:10:10 PM|| 2003-12-22 2:10:10 PM|| Front Page Top

#4 They had F-14s (or F-15s) at one point, IIRC -- any of them still in flyable condition? (Guessing probably not)

Posted by snellenr 2003-12-22 2:57:45 PM|| 2003-12-22 2:57:45 PM|| Front Page Top

#5 The best way to enhanse the performance of a Middle Eastern Air Force vis-a-vis the Israelis is to shackle the pilot in the cockpit and disable the eject.

Posted by Super Hose 2003-12-22 3:08:55 PM|| 2003-12-22 3:08:55 PM|| Front Page Top

#6 How many mullahs fit in a spider hole?

Posted by True German Ally 2003-12-22 3:14:43 PM|| 2003-12-22 3:14:43 PM|| Front Page Top

#7 They had F-14's. They date back to the Carter era. Think any still fly after a couple-dozen years without spares or expert mechs?

Posted by Glenn (not Reynolds) 2003-12-22 3:29:37 PM|| 2003-12-22 3:29:37 PM|| Front Page Top

#8 This is all hot air IMHO. For the IAF to attack Iran they would hve to over fly either Turkey, Jordan?Iraq or Suadi. I could possibly see the Turks granting permission to fly such a mission but I doubt it would happen. Thre is no way we would allow the IAF to transit Iraqi airspace. It would cost us to damn much. And the Saudis. Allowing something like this would probably be the last straw that results in the fundofascists taking over. The IAF has done quite well against arab air forces, nost recently Syria. but that was close to home and inside their own AWACS coverage.

Posted by Cheddarhead 2003-12-22 4:19:04 PM|| 2003-12-22 4:19:04 PM|| Front Page Top

#9 Cheddarhead is correct. It is astounding how many people believe Israel has the capability to take out Iran's nuclear program. They don't unless they use nuclear missles. Ain't gonna happen. The US will take out Iran's nuclear program should it become necessary. And the US cannot do it with air power. Most Iranian facilities are built deep into mountains that are impervious to any non-nuclear air strikes.

Posted by Mahatma Jewboy 2003-12-22 6:58:17 PM|| 2003-12-22 6:58:17 PM|| Front Page Top

#10 Israel warplanes can't reach Iran? - Oh,I dunno - anybody remember Entebbe 1976? That surely couldn't have been done. Nor Ocirak 1981.

I'd say that when they get their guns up, Israel can damn near do what it wants - even if it might pay a terrible political price later.

'Anybody really think that if Isreal puts up its "first team" of airstrike experts with escorts, anybody is going to prevent them from reaching their targets? Does the US want to engage in that level of hostility by taking on - literally - a strike formation of the Israeli Air Force - in Israel's own back yard?

When Saddam starting raining scuds down on Isreal in Gulf War I - and Israel did nothing - they were banking some horrendously expensive chips to spend some day, some way. I'd say they are close to cashing in those chips - and Iran had best get on with a serious defanging program posthaste.

On the lighter side - Baghdad Bob might now have some opportunity to find a place for himself in Tehran - they seem to be playing his sort of tune.....

Posted by Lone Ranger 2003-12-22 7:45:27 PM|| 2003-12-22 7:45:27 PM|| Front Page Top

#11 Israel can probably destroy the reactor at Busheir but that won't stop Iran's nuclear program. That will stop the production of a large nuclear arsenal but won't stop the creation of a few Hiroshima size bombs.
Iran has their own uranium mines. They have refining centrifuges in laboratories that are built deep into mountains that are impervious to all non-nuclear strikes. They were built to resist any conventional air attack and nothing Israel or the US have in their conventional arsenal can do the job. That is one of the reasons the Bush administration is talking about the need to develop low-yield nuclear tipped bunker busters. To stop Iran from building nukes will require a large commando force on the ground in 5 or 6 locations in central Iran. The Iranians are far more capable fighters than the Arabs.
The situation is far more complex than most realize.

Posted by Mahatma Jewboy 2003-12-22 8:02:36 PM|| 2003-12-22 8:02:36 PM|| Front Page Top

#12 Hate to be a contrarian, but the Israelis are just crazy enough to fly AROUND the soddi peninsula, refueling their jets all the way, if that's what they think they need to do. So technically, they don't have violate anyone's airspace to get to Iran.

But the idea of the iranians (who fought the iraqis to a standstill, afterall) standing up to the JOOOOS! is crazy. Unless he's talking about using nukes, conventionally they don't have a chance.

Posted by 4thInfVet 2003-12-22 8:59:07 PM|| 2003-12-22 8:59:07 PM|| Front Page Top

#13 They had F-14s (or F-15s) at one point, IIRC -- any of them still in flyable condition?

They had F-14s. At best, maybe a third of the original 80 are still flying. One report I saw mentioned a few F-14s were converted to unarmed recon aircraft. Another report mentioned them being used as mini-AWACS platforms.

MJ is right: if there was any sort of a strike, it'd have to be more than an air sortie or two.
There are other options, but it'd be one heck of a coordinated operation

Posted by Pappy 2003-12-22 9:41:08 PM|| 2003-12-22 9:41:08 PM|| Front Page Top

#14 Just a few thoughts to throw into the mix:

If you were Israel and you did, indeed, have sophisticated nuke weapons capability, what sort of nuke weaponry would you have developed? Wouldn't you both focus on the low-yield theater weapons and, not to put too fine a point on it, have developed plans long long ago for countering the threats you face?

Haven't the Israelis known about the Black Hats as long or longer than anyone else? Does anyone seriously think that Israel sits on its hands and lets such threats go unplanned for? C'mon, guys.

Some of us may be new to the threat posed by Iran and just coming around to looking at how to address it, but do any of you really think this is true of Israel?

No matter which side (they can / they can't) you may be on, I do not believe much escapes the notice of Israel and I do not believe they will entrust their survival to anyone else, including the US. If anything, they practice the creed that it's easier to get forgiveness than permission - and they will plan for and, if needed, do what is necessary for survival. Period.

Posted by .com 2003-12-22 11:12:58 PM|| 2003-12-22 11:12:58 PM|| Front Page Top

#15 Just a comment or two:

Israel practices formation flying at 20 feet - over the Negev desert, day and night. They just might decide to fly over Saudi Arabia at very low altitude, hoping they're not discovered.

They have nuclear capability, and probably a stand-off missile or three in their inventory. They're NOT going to let their people become anyone's puppets.

Teheran may still have a nuclear capability after the first Israeli strike - they just won't have anyone alive that can continue to implement it.

Israel ONLY plays to win.

Posted by Old Patriot 2003-12-23 12:07:15 AM|| [http://users.codenet.net/mweather/default.htm] 2003-12-23 12:07:15 AM|| Front Page Top

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