Archived material Access restricted Article
Rantburg

Today's Front Page   View All of Fri 11/10/2006 View Thu 11/09/2006 View Wed 11/08/2006 View Tue 11/07/2006 View Mon 11/06/2006 View Sun 11/05/2006 View Sat 11/04/2006
1
2006-11-10 Israel-Palestine-Jordan
Palestinians Bury 19 Victims of Israeli Shelling in Beit Hanoun
Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.
Posted by anonymous5089 2006-11-10 09:48|| || Front Page|| [7 views since 2007-05-07]  Top

#1 On the other hand, anonymous5089, suppose IDF were to arrange 19 Paleo dead after each kassam?
Posted by gromgoru 2006-11-10 10:02||   2006-11-10 10:02|| Front Page Top

#2 They aren't "victims" of anything except their own hatred, religion and general stupidity. Oh, and their explosives, of course.
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2006-11-10 10:02||   2006-11-10 10:02|| Front Page Top

#3 On the other hand, anonymous5089, suppose IDF were to arrange 19 Paleo dead after each kassam?

Now you're talking!
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2006-11-10 10:02||   2006-11-10 10:02|| Front Page Top

#4 On the third hand, I'd like to pour a few litters of castor oil (or California zinfandel) down the throat of each and every Israeli Lefty that mouthed off yesterday.
Posted by gromgoru 2006-11-10 10:08||   2006-11-10 10:08|| Front Page Top

#5 I vaguely remember making a "what about the secondary explosions" joke about this.

Looks like it wasn't a joke.
Posted by Rob Crawford">Rob Crawford  2006-11-10 10:18|| http://www.kloognome.com/]">[http://www.kloognome.com/]  2006-11-10 10:18|| Front Page Top

#6 Who fucking cares if there was secondary explosion? It doesn’t matter if their beds were made out of Cemtex. It was the artillery shells that caused the civilian deaths! Bite the bullet apologists…Israel is to blame for this tradgedy.
Posted by DepotGuy 2006-11-10 11:18||   2006-11-10 11:18|| Front Page Top

#7 Israel is to blame for this tradgedy.


If only it were a tragedy.
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2006-11-10 11:21||   2006-11-10 11:21|| Front Page Top

#8 "If only it were a tragedy."

So innocent children getting snuffed isn't tradgedy as long as their Paleo children huh?
Posted by DepotGuy 2006-11-10 11:40||   2006-11-10 11:40|| Front Page Top

#9 I agree we shouldn't be callous regarding civilian losses, at least as long as we wish to remain what we are, and even regarding mostly hostile populations.

WWII allies certainly didn't care at all about ennemy civil losses, and even aimed at it through cities oblitering, but we're not yet in that total industrial war phase, and we'll probably never be.

Point is, can any FNC viewer confirm this blur? If the cause of the explosion was not an israeli shell, then this point is moot anyway.
Posted by anonymous5089 2006-11-10 11:58||   2006-11-10 11:58|| Front Page Top

#10 DepotGuy,

How about a primary explosion--that seems to be the case. Would you still blame Israel?

As for children, it sucks. The fact is they are indoctrinated in hatred from an early age and would likely to grow up as splodeys. That is what Paleos see them as--potential splodeys. Especially if they have house stuffed with C4.

And that is a tragedy.
Posted by twobyfour 2006-11-10 11:59||   2006-11-10 11:59|| Front Page Top

#11 innocent children dead because they were in an accident. How many would've died if the Paleos hadn't stored explosives in their house? Dickwad
Posted by Frank G">Frank G  2006-11-10 12:00||   2006-11-10 12:00|| Front Page Top

#12 more martyrs for the Paleo death cult. Nobody would be firing shells if the Paleos could behave in a civil way. They can't, so they reap the consequences. Paleo rockets are DESIGNED to kill civilians, including children. Do you condemn the Paleos on their daily rocket attacks? I thought not
Posted by Frank G">Frank G  2006-11-10 12:02||   2006-11-10 12:02|| Front Page Top

#13 So innocent children getting snuffed isn't tradgedy as long as their Paleo children huh?

This wasn't an accident. The parents intentionally endangered their own children and they paid for it with their kids' lives. Tragedies are usually unintended or criminal in nature. These Palestinian assholes intended to kill lots of people in a criminal fashion. Their slovenly handling of dangerous materials wound up getting them killed instead. Yeah, the kids were semi-innocent bystanders, but only Palestinian infants are not indoctrinated with Jew hatred.

Watch the "Obsession" video sometime. You'll see Palestinian kindergarteners, KINDERGARTENERS fer fuck's sake screaming about how they want to strap on a bomb vest and gloriously go out and kill some Jews. Every Palestinian man, woman and child represent exactly what's wrong with this world and the sooner they're all dead, the sooner there will be some hope for peace in that region. They could give a shit about peace and, therefore, I could give a shit about them.
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2006-11-10 12:24||   2006-11-10 12:24|| Front Page Top

#14 DepotGuy, what kind of people store explosives where children live, knowing that they could, ummmm, explode, should someone strike a match in the wrong place? Even if it were a Israeli artillery that set it off, we must hold the family culpable for setting up so very dangerous a situation, and the leaders of whichever "military arm of..." group that decided to store the stuff there.
Posted by trailing wife 2006-11-10 12:24||   2006-11-10 12:24|| Front Page Top

#15 Question: is this the real DepotGuy, or is someone nym-stealing again?
Posted by trailing wife 2006-11-10 12:27||   2006-11-10 12:27|| Front Page Top

#16 He has a point though, we shouldn't gloat on children deaths, even ones who will be/are being turned into hate-machines by a dysfunctional society.
Posted by anonymous5089 2006-11-10 12:29||   2006-11-10 12:29|| Front Page Top

#17 Who's gloating? I merely refuse to have even a shred of sympathy for dead Palestinians, They have begged on hands and knees for every single disaster that has befallen them. These scum have prolonged this festering global wound for so long that I no longer feel the least mercy for them.
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2006-11-10 12:43||   2006-11-10 12:43|| Front Page Top

#18 "Do you condemn the Paleos on their daily rocket attacks?"

Frank, was there rockets fired from that particular location? Sorry didn’t catch that one. Did Olmert admit a technical error resulted in civilian deaths? Oh wait…now it was hidden explosives or was it spontaneous combustion. Couldn’t have been that barrage of errant artillery fire into a populated neighborhood that had anything to do with it. Look, I’m under no illusions that I can change your mind. Especially someone as articulate as you…that clever Dickwad comment and all. So I’ll leave you with this. Next time you get the vapors over one of your Uncle Leo anti-Semitism stories your so fond of, remember how easy it is for even you to de-humanize others, including children, to justify innocent slaughter. (Or should I say collateral damage of future Death-cult members?)
Posted by DepotGuy 2006-11-10 12:48||   2006-11-10 12:48|| Front Page Top

#19 you're right. You didn't change my mind
Posted by Frank G">Frank G  2006-11-10 12:56||   2006-11-10 12:56|| Front Page Top

#20 Keep up with the story, DepotGuy. The explosion was a work accident, not the result of Israeli action.
Posted by Rob Crawford">Rob Crawford  2006-11-10 13:04|| http://www.kloognome.com/]">[http://www.kloognome.com/]  2006-11-10 13:04|| Front Page Top

#21 Couldn’t have been that barrage of errant artillery fire into a populated neighborhood that had anything to do with it.

Where the hell do you get off? The Palestinians are firing dozens of their damned rockets into Israeli civilian areas every single day and you're trying to whinge about a stray artillery shell that hits a residence being used as a covert munitions bunker?

Get a clue! The Palestinians routinely use illegitimate targets (women, children, mosques, ambulances) for military operations. Then they have the nerve to claim that every Israeli citizen, due to mandatory conscription, is a valid military target. Yet they somehow feel free to squawk with indignation when their own highly militarized population gets hit? As usual, the Palestinians want things both ways and have the gall to whine when they don't get it. Your own pathetic attempt at moral equivalence doesn't cut any ice with me.
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2006-11-10 13:14||   2006-11-10 13:14|| Front Page Top

#22 Here's a question for you, DepotGuy. How do you feel about the casualties resulting from those Palestinian women who volunteered as human shields so those terrorists could escape from the mosque that they had holed up in? Are you going to get all weepy about that too?
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2006-11-10 13:19||   2006-11-10 13:19|| Front Page Top

#23 Im remember them dancing in the strrets and handing out candy on 9/11.
I could care less how many of them die.
Posted by tu3031 2006-11-10 13:19||   2006-11-10 13:19|| Front Page Top

#24 I echo TWs question re: DepotGuy....didn't sound like him.
Posted by Rex Mundi 2006-11-10 13:43||   2006-11-10 13:43|| Front Page Top

#25 Human shields and the willful hazarding of innocents are the basis of all terrorist and leftist media strategy worldwide.

Propaganda like what we have seen since this incident, and the line taken by Depot Guy, are an attempt to reverse the age-old principle that those who attempt to hide behind innocents are responsible if those innocents come to harm.
Leftists don't give a rat's ass about innocents being killed, their wailing and moaning is cynical calculated manipulation. How many times have you heard some smug leftist pig declare that "this is revolution andinnocent people get hurt in a revolution" when their side commits one its barbaric and quite deliberate murders of innocent people?

Fuck them and fuck their depraved pretense of morality. They are all liars and killers.
Posted by Atomic Conspiracy 2006-11-10 14:08||   2006-11-10 14:08|| Front Page Top

#26 Ohfercrisesakes. First things first, I’ve picked a horse in this race and sure as hell isn’t HAMAS or any of the other Paleo thugs. Second, if civilians (even if they’re babies in the womb) get kakked in the proximity of any attack (rocket launch, bombs, or whatever) the fault lies squarely on themselves and those that put them in harms way. I was referring to this particular incident, I repeat this particular incident. Not the whole fucking history of the Middle-East conflict. Nor was I making any moral judgments. So don’t give me the “moral equivalence” shtick. This appears to be mistake…not just logistically but as a result of the Israelis exuberance it is a strategic and political blunder as well. Maybe it’s just me but I’m thinking those errant shells prolly kilt a few. And really doesn’t matter much if there were explosives around or not…dead civilians were the result. All I’m saying is; admit the mistake, apologize if necessary, take corrective actions and blow the shit outta the real bad guys. But this excuse shit gets tiresome.
Posted by DepotGuy 2006-11-10 14:35||   2006-11-10 14:35|| Front Page Top

#27 The only way to guarantee that incidents like this won't happen, DG, is to surrender completely to the human shields strategy. This is especially true in view of the evidence that the terrorists and their media allies deliberately instigate events like this by placing innocents in danger.
This will result in a disaster incomparably worse than it already has, and that is obvious.
Posted by Atomic Conspiracy 2006-11-10 14:43||   2006-11-10 14:43|| Front Page Top

#28 Ok...that's better. Israel has apologized quite enough already...it's gotten monotenous and quite frankly, noones listening anyway.
Posted by Rex Mundi 2006-11-10 14:47||   2006-11-10 14:47|| Front Page Top

#29 I was referring to this particular incident, I repeat this particular incident.

Which was a work accident. Which you tried to blame on the Israelis.
Posted by Rob Crawford">Rob Crawford  2006-11-10 14:48|| http://www.kloognome.com/]">[http://www.kloognome.com/]  2006-11-10 14:48|| Front Page Top

#30 Incidents like this would not be a problem if the Israelis had the balls to do the equivalant of an ARCLIGHT mission set on GAZA.

That would end the terror or end Gaza residents and there would be nobody left to notice or complain.
Posted by 3dc 2006-11-10 16:17||   2006-11-10 16:17|| Front Page Top

#31 blow the shit outta the real bad guys

You just don't get it, do you? The Palestinian bad guys;

HIDE AMONGST THE CIVILIANS.
LIVE IN CIVILIAN QUARTERS.
DRIVE CIVILIAN VEHICLES.
DRESS LIKE CIVILIANS.

How are you going to go after them? I'd really love to hear your explanation. How are you going to take out the "real bad guys" without nailing any civilians in the process? Especially when the civilians willfully intervene to shield, abet, conceal and obstruct. Are the Israelis supposed to go through each settlement, house-to-house, and take all the casualties just to spare a complicit population?

The population actively supports the rocket launchers. They know full well that the rockets are launched against Israeli civilian targets, INCLUDING SMALL CHILDREN AND INFANTS. By dint of this, the Palestinians militarize their entire population and municipalities. You ARE playing a moral equivalency game here, whether you admit it or not.

How would you fight this sort of enemy while not killing any fluffy baby ducklings, bunny rabbits or puppies children?
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2006-11-10 16:39||   2006-11-10 16:39|| Front Page Top

#32 How would you fight this sort of enemy while not killing any fluffy baby ducklings, bunny rabbits or puppies children?
Posted by: Zenster 2006-11-10 16:39
At the extreme risk of being flamed here, I have to ask:
How are we doing it in Iraq? It appears anyone who died in a civilian attack was involved with the known enemy. I can only imagine the outcry had this been our "mistake". I think similar things have happened in Iraq but, 500 yards is a long way off. Is it the way it gets reported? The secondary explosions makes for many more questions than answers.

(snip from article)
"All of us are feeling sad, and worried, too," said Abu Shabat, tears streaming down her face. "We are going to bury this family and ask ourselves, 'Who's next? Me? My grandchildren? My neighbor?"'

UUUMMM. Don't store things that go boom in your house.
I understand DG's thoughts on the "innocents". The children are innocent even though their teachings teach hate. If I happenend to teach my child to hate (black, yellow, red, purple) people, it is me who is full of hate not them. They are just following my teachings until they can think for themselves. Unfortunately, Slopey jrs. will never have access to other information until there is freedom and peace. Maybe never in our lifetime.
Maybe it’s just me but I’m thinking those errant shells prolly kilt a few.
Posted by: DepotGuy 2006-11-10 14:35
/snip
"I will avenge, I will avenge!" screamed one of the victims' relatives as he fired his weapon, voicing a common sentiment among the mourners.

IMA thinking those 7.62x39 rounds coulda kilt a few as well.

Sorry, people died. It a war zone. Both the U.S. and Israel need to stop worrying about "feelings" and take care of business. And before you flame, I realize that we are "nation building" in Iraq and Israel is, well trying to keep her ass from being attacked everyday. Two completely different fronts of the conflict but oh so similar.
Posted by kilowattkid 2006-11-10 18:54||   2006-11-10 18:54|| Front Page Top

#33 [crickets]

Question: is this the real DepotGuy, or is someone nym-stealing again?

I'm beginning to think that you're right, trailing wife.

How are we doing it in Iraq?

Answer; At extreme loss of life to our own soldiers. Thanks to our superbly trained military and splendid technology, our casualties are incredibly low, all things considered. The bad news is that keeping our fatalities this low has required a "hands-off" approach to some of the more significant players like Moqtada Sadr.

Just like the Israelis, we need to risk a few more lives and really take the gloves off in order to snuff our worst foes. I know that this easy for me to say type from the safety and comfort of my own home keyboard, but I'd wager a pretty penny that many of our soldiers would like to get on with things even if it ups our losses a tiny bit.

Both the U.S. and Israel need to stop worrying about "feelings" and take care of business.

Bingo! All this touchy-feely nonsense must end. Faint heart never won fair lady, as the famous kniggit knight said.

kilowattkid, I hope you'll feel free to post more often. I've seen your monicker around here for many years and enjoy your thoughtful contributions.

The gloves need to come off, both for Israel and the United States. Until we show that willpower, the death of a thousand cuts is all that awaits us. We are dealing with an enemy that has no compunctions about violating every single tenet of honorable warfare that has evolved over the last several centuries. As .com would say, enough of this "Order of the Garter" bullshit. We must begin to attrit our enemy in a way that strikes unmistakable dread into their withered hearts.
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2006-11-10 20:10||   2006-11-10 20:10|| Front Page Top

#34 Apologies for an extended rant but I watched another sickening “martyrs parade” in Gaza the other night. Complete with seething savages yelling incoherently, teaming to touch the shroud of the tiny grey-blue cadavers. To them they were no longer humans they were only symbols of their rage. And as sappy as it may sound, I got physically ill from the disgusting spectacle. Then this morning I read comments from those that indicated they too didn’t see them as humans but collateral damage or simply future security threats. Clearly, I don’t have the answers but I pray they don’t include behavior that condones wanton waste of innocent life.
Posted by DepotGuy 2006-11-10 20:11||   2006-11-10 20:11|| Front Page Top

#35 I got physically ill from the disgusting spectacle.

You're not the only one.

To them they were no longer humans they were only symbols of their rage.

Not to rub any salt in but; Guess what? Living or dead, Palestinian children are only "symbols of their rage". Permit me to quote Golda Meir:

"Peace will come when the Arabs love their children more than they hate us."

DepotGuy, do you have any solutions as to how the Israelis are supposed to delicately sort out those terrorists who are enthusiastically hidden amongst the Palestinian civilian population? I really want to hear your answer.
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2006-11-10 20:34||   2006-11-10 20:34|| Front Page Top

#36 I would feel for them but the Pally's made themselves that way and I am sorry I cannot feel for people who worship death.
Posted by djohn66 2006-11-10 20:43||   2006-11-10 20:43|| Front Page Top

#37 I understand your feelings, DepotGuy, truly. My father was there at the beginning of all that, in the 1930s and 1940s. But so long as the Palestinians themselves are eager to position their own children for sacrifice in order to gain the sympathies of that portion of the world which chooses to feel rather than think, Israel can do only so much to prevent those sacrifices. The whole of the Palestinian Territories are one house after another of these set-ups, one mosque after the next packed full of weapons and IEDs, school children running out in the streets to surround the members of "armed wings" aiming Kassem rockets at Israeli schools. You've seen the same uncropped photos as the rest of us, and you know this is so. It isn't the Israelis who are treating Palestinian infants as cannon fodder; it's their own parents and their own society. Get mad at the people who set up things so they can bury 19 victims of their families' deliberate choice to put them in the line of fire.
Posted by trailing wife 2006-11-10 21:04||   2006-11-10 21:04|| Front Page Top

#38 Simply superb commentary, trailing wife. Permit me to say that you are a credit to the entire human race.
Posted by Zenster">Zenster  2006-11-10 21:13||   2006-11-10 21:13|| Front Page Top

#39 I stand by my comments. Your stomach is turned, but you refuse to acknowledge the fault. I refuse to apologize for supporting the only democracy in the ME (I'm holding my opinion on Iraq), and a self-defense action that may or may not have made mistakes. You can't use women and children as human shields and storekeepers of terrorist arms caches and then act outraged when they die. The fault lies on ONE side - the death cult Paleos, who continue to target civilians. If they'd stop, the Israelis would have to, as well. Note that the minute the Israelis withdraw, the rockts restart. I'm sorry, but mass destruction is what they are wishing upon themselves, and if you can't see that, I don't see why I should respect your opinion on anything else
Frank
Posted by Frank G">Frank G  2006-11-10 22:23||   2006-11-10 22:23|| Front Page Top

#40 One last thing:
Next time you get the vapors over one of your Uncle Leo anti-Semitism stories your so fond of, remember how easy it is for even you to de-humanize others, including children, to justify innocent slaughter

WTF are you talking about???? Uncle Leo? That was some wierd shit and says more about you than me, I'd conjecture....
Posted by Frank G">Frank G  2006-11-10 22:27||   2006-11-10 22:27|| Front Page Top

#41 Zenster dear, you hold entirely too high an opinion of me. Frank G, razor sharp as usual.
Posted by trailing wife 2006-11-10 23:58||   2006-11-10 23:58|| Front Page Top

23:58 trailing wife
23:56 rjschwarz
23:52 mrp
23:52 JosephMendiola
23:50 JosephMendiola
23:50 trailing wife
23:44 JosephMendiola
23:40 JosephMendiola
23:35 JosephMendiola
23:35 C-Low
23:29 Threger Angegum9602
23:28 JosephMendiola
23:20 JosephMendiola
22:56 .com
22:48 .com
22:44 Frank G
22:43 Kilowattkid
22:39 Lanny Ddub
22:36 Frank G
22:29 Frank G
22:27 Frank G
22:23 Frank G
22:22 Alaska Paul
22:22 Zenster









Paypal:
Google
Search WWW Search rantburg.com