Article

2014-02-28 Europe

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by Steve White 2014-02-28 10:44|| || Front Page|| [3 views ] Top

#1 Sadly, I think the age of liberal democracy is over.

Posted by g(r)omgoru 2014-02-28 13:42|| 2014-02-28 13:42|| Front Page Top

#2 E Ukraine and Crimea are majority ethnic Russian in large areas and likely will be carved off and incorporated into Russia in some fashion. The former due to proximity on the border, the latter for the military bases, especially Black Sea naval bases. The rest will probably go west, or else splinter further. Either way, the only thing that matters beyond these is security of the Russian gas pipelines that feed Europe and pass thru the bulk of western Ukraine. That's the major concern for Putin as a money maker, and EU because they need the NatGas. The Ukrainian liberty movement is going to get crushed and ground to bits between those two millstones. In the past, the US and UK might have changed the balance, but not anymore. UK is worn out, and the USA is led ny a narcissistic fool who favors collectivism and elitism of Eurosocialism.

In short, the Ukranians are screwed.

Posted by OldSpook 2014-02-28 14:51|| 2014-02-28 14:51|| Front Page Top

#3 OldSpppl. What is Ukraine? It is a ate who inherited the _administrative_ boundaries of the Soviet Republic of Ukraine. There are a lot of people in Ukraine who are not happy at all to be Ukranians. Cossacks for instance are not Ukrranians, are not fond of Ukranian,s and Ukraine has no articular historical rights over Cossack territory. The only claim Ukarine has on their territory is because SDtalin decided to include into Sovoet Republic of Ukraine. In the name of what should they be forced into being citizens of Ukraine?

Posted by JFM 2014-02-28 17:41|| 2014-02-28 17:41|| Front Page Top

#4 There are a lot of people in Ukraine who are not happy at all to be Ukranians... In the name of what should they be forced into being citizens of Ukraine?

Something similar happened in the US in the mid 1800s, but I'll be damned if I can recall what it was called....

Posted by Pappy 2014-02-28 17:55|| 2014-02-28 17:55|| Front Page Top

#5 Every old country could be carved up into a bunch of older, other countries. Western Ukraine was a part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire for a long time and so you could argue that pieces/parts of it should go elsewhere. It has a small Hungarian minority at its western edge -- give that to Hungary. Ditto a small Bulgarian minority and so on.

But in the main I think OldSpook (and Hannon, and others) are right: the big split is west/east. Pappy points out that we tried that here once and it didn't work -- the loyalists won. But one might, just might, decide that for the Ukraine, this time, it's better to divide than fight.

Posted by Steve White 2014-02-28 18:19|| 2014-02-28 18:19|| Front Page Top

#6 I think at this time we can safely say Ukraine is partitioned.

Posted by swksvolFF 2014-02-28 19:16|| 2014-02-28 19:16|| Front Page Top

23:28 Redneck Jim
23:10 Thing From Snowy Mountain
22:57 Uncle Phester
22:04 tu3031
21:53 JosephMendiola
21:36 JosephMendiola
21:33 JosephMendiola
21:31 swksvolFF
21:08 swksvolFF
20:33 3dc
20:32 Thing From Snowy Mountain
20:24 OldSpook
20:22 OldSpook
19:23 Procopius2k
19:16 swksvolFF
19:15 Uncle Phester
19:09 49 Pan
18:48 JosephMendiola
18:39 JosephMendiola
18:36 JosephMendiola
18:35 JosephMendiola
18:31 CrazyFool
18:29 JosephMendiola
18:27 swksvolFF