Hi there, !
Today Sat 01/05/2008 Fri 01/04/2008 Thu 01/03/2008 Wed 01/02/2008 Tue 01/01/2008 Mon 12/31/2007 Sun 12/30/2007 Archives
Rantburg
533709 articles and 1862059 comments are archived on Rantburg.

Today: 94 articles and 354 comments as of 15:05.
Post a news link    Post your own article   
Area: WoT Operations    Non-WoT    Opinion    Local News       
Army intervenes to end fist fights between Hezbollah, Hariri party
Today's Headlines
Headline Comments [Views]
Page 2: WoT Background
6 00:00 Whomong Guelph4611 [7] 
4 00:00 twobyfour [12] 
1 00:00 sinse [7] 
4 00:00 USN,Ret. [8] 
0 [3] 
0 [9] 
1 00:00 Frank G [3] 
0 [7] 
1 00:00 rjschwarz [4] 
10 00:00 Frank G [11] 
9 00:00 SteveS [3] 
3 00:00 g(r)omgoru [4] 
0 [5] 
6 00:00 3dc [3] 
3 00:00 Thomas Woof [5] 
3 00:00 Ebbang Uluque6305 [4] 
9 00:00 WTF [8] 
0 [4] 
3 00:00 Alaska Paul in Ketchikan, AK [11] 
3 00:00 Ebbang Uluque6305 [8] 
3 00:00 trailing wife [13] 
4 00:00 Danielle [8] 
4 00:00 Thomas Woof [3] 
0 [10] 
2 00:00 Alaska Paul in Ketchikan, AK [14] 
2 00:00 john frum [8] 
0 [9] 
Page 1: WoT Operations
0 [4]
1 00:00 Glenmore [4]
4 00:00 Bright Pebbles [6]
0 [4]
1 00:00 3dc [4]
0 [5]
1 00:00 Alaska Paul in Ketchikan, AK [8]
8 00:00 Thomas Woof [3]
2 00:00 Scott R [5]
2 00:00 swksvolFF [4]
2 00:00 mhw [4]
0 [4]
5 00:00 Seafarious [4]
2 00:00 gorb [4]
1 00:00 mojo [6]
0 [3]
13 00:00 twobyfour [8]
10 00:00 Frank G [9]
0 [4]
0 [3]
3 00:00 Procopius2k [3]
3 00:00 g(r)omgoru [14]
0 [7]
0 [7]
0 [6]
0 [9]
Page 3: Non-WoT
2 00:00 M. Murcek [3]
0 [4]
0 [3]
0 [4]
3 00:00 trailing wife [9]
8 00:00 DarthVader [9]
6 00:00 JosephMendiola [3]
2 00:00 Thomas Woof [3]
2 00:00 Thomas Woof [4]
1 00:00 JFM [3]
11 00:00 JosephMendiola [3]
10 00:00 Pappy [3]
1 00:00 Pappy [3]
8 00:00 Frank G [5]
3 00:00 Ebbang Uluque6305 [4]
1 00:00 Excalibur [4]
9 00:00 Frank G [3]
9 00:00 Frank G [3]
2 00:00 JosephMendiola [4]
2 00:00 Thomas Woof [3]
Page 4: Opinion
1 00:00 Whomong Guelph4611 [12]
10 00:00 Ebbang Uluque6305 [4]
0 [7]
12 00:00 Thomas Woof [3]
1 00:00 Delphi [3]
0 [4]
0 [4]
0 [7]
0 [7]
40 00:00 Abdominal Snowman [7]
Page 5: Russia-Former Soviet Union
0 [3]
2 00:00 Rupert Shaviter6552 [6]
7 00:00 USN,Ret. [7]
2 00:00 mojo [3]
11 00:00 Alaska Paul in Ketchikan, AK [9]
3 00:00 gorb [9]
2 00:00 wxjames [4]
8 00:00 borgboy2001 [4]
7 00:00 Eric Jablow [3]
18 00:00 gorb [11]
8 00:00 jds [8]
Africa Horn
Egypt to send 1,200 troops to UN force in Darfur
CAIRO, Egypt - Egypt is sending 1,200 troops to the joint U.N.-African Union peacekeeping force in Darfur that just took over the wartorn region, the countryÂ’s presidential spokesman said Tuesday. President Hosni Mubarak is to inspect the troops on Wednesday, spokesman Suleiman Awwad told reporters, after which the troops will likely soon depart for Darfur.

On Monday, a new hybrid U.N.-AU peacekeeping force took over in Darfur _ a long-awaited change intended to be the strongest effort yet to solve the worldÂ’s worst humanitarian crisis.

Awwad, the Egyptian spokesman, said the country’s contribution was part of extensive efforts and contacts with the Sudanese government and the Darfur rebels by Egypt, Libya, Chad, Eritrea and other non-African countries to ¢put an end to the bloodshed in Darfur.’
Posted by: Steve White || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under: Govt of Sudan


Africa North
Al Qaeda sez behind Algeria bombing: report
DUBAI (Rooters) - Al Qaeda's North Africa wing claimed responsibility for the deadly suicide bombing in Algeria on Wednesday in a recording aired by Al Arabiya television.

The speaker who identified himself as Salah Abou Mohammad, a spokesman of the group, said a suicide bomber rammed a truck laden with at least 500 kg (1100 lbs) of explosives into a police facility. The Interior Ministry said three people were killed and seven injured in the first major attack in Algeria since a twin bombing in the capital Algiers killed at least 37 people on December 11, including 17 United Nations staff.
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 01/02/2008 13:22 || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under: al-Qaeda in North Africa

#1  Why doesn't some intelligence group in the west start claiming credit for everything as well. Make it a shadow op, so the group appears to be Muslim crackerheads. The Muslims believe all sorts of crazy stuff, it wouldn't be long before such a group attained legendary status.

Take that list of Chuck Norris facts and convert it over and tone it down just a hair and you get the idea. give pronouncements of how the group introduced

Posted by: rjschwarz || 01/02/2008 16:42 Comments || Top||


Arabia
Editor : 'soody arabia May Take Steps to Change the Course of syria's Future'
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 01/02/2008 14:11 || Comments || Link || [12 views] Top|| File under:

#1  This would be nice:
The remark about the Saudi opposition to the partition of Iraq likewise evoked irate reactions in the Saudi press, especially in light of the bitterness still felt over a previous speech by Al-Shar', on August 14, 2007, in which he stated that Saudi Arabia was "almost completely paralyzed [and unable to fulfill] this important role [in the Gulf]." [2] Particularly harsh statements came from the editor of the Saudi daily Al-Watan, Jamal Khashoggi, who implied that Saudi Arabia might take steps to "accelerate the wheels of history" and hasten the collapse of the Syrian regime.
Posted by: Jonathan || 01/02/2008 16:27 Comments || Top||

#2  Saudi Arabia should be pushing for an enlargement of Iraq. If you added Syria to the mix the Iraqi Shia wouldn't have such dominant numbers. Perhaps the Israeli/American alliance could arrange such a thing if the Saudi's dropped the price of oil back beneath $20 a barrel. Otherwise they can suck sand.
Posted by: rjschwarz || 01/02/2008 16:35 Comments || Top||

#3  Why not change Saudi Arabia's future?
Posted by: Blinky Omaitle1241 || 01/02/2008 18:11 Comments || Top||

#4  A good point. Let them change Syria's future and te change theirs as a reward.
Posted by: twobyfour || 01/02/2008 21:13 Comments || Top||


Europe
Dutch police prepares for new movie about the Koran.
Dutch police is preparing for the broadcast of a new movie about the Koran. The movie is produced by Dutch politician Geert Wilders and will probably be broad casted on Dutch television January 25th. The police is talking to representatives of the Muslim community and Imams about the release of the movie later this month. The police has also prepared a master plan for wide spread major public unrest in the Netherlands. The Dutch authorities are looking if the broadcast of the movie can be blocked.
Posted by: Clolurong Ulavimble5875 || 01/02/2008 16:38 || Comments || Link || [7 views] Top|| File under:

#1  "Dutch authorities are looking if the broadcast of the movie can be blocked." How can you block the truth? It seems fanatic religious types always try and block the truth. This time the religion is EU socialism and "multi-culture" nonsense coupled with islam.
Posted by: Sock Puppet of Doom || 01/02/2008 19:34 Comments || Top||

#2  The police is talking to representatives of the Muslim community and Imams about the release of the movie later this month

How about: "the movie is a movie, but the violence-responding police beatings, mosque closings and imam-arresting ...WILL BE REAL. Go for it, assholes"
Posted by: Frank G || 01/02/2008 19:51 Comments || Top||

#3  Nothing like a 7th Century documentary to get the seething going! Since Jan 25 is a Friday, maybe they can broadcast it, pay per view, into the mosque armorys to improve the sermon and let the imam make a few commission bucks before he sends the faithfull out to kill Mr. Wilders...
Posted by: Phinater Thraviger || 01/02/2008 20:02 Comments || Top||

#4  The absence of islam is no loss.
Posted by: Bright Pebbles || 01/02/2008 20:05 Comments || Top||

#5  How can you block the truth?

By being a good dhimmi.
Posted by: Nimble Spemble || 01/02/2008 20:37 Comments || Top||

#6  seems like a good time for a flying monkey's graphic.
Posted by: Whomong Guelph4611 || 01/02/2008 22:43 Comments || Top||


ETA claims responsibility for two bombings in Spain
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 01/02/2008 13:55 || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:


Welcome the new UK head of government
Posted by: Seafarious || 01/02/2008 00:33 || Comments || Link || [5 views] Top|| File under:

#1  I bet Toynbee, wherever he is, is enjoying himself.
Posted by: g(r)omgoru || 01/02/2008 4:09 Comments || Top||

#2  That logo looks a bit sexual.

But then the EUSSR is full of cnuts.
Posted by: Bright Pebbles || 01/02/2008 13:18 Comments || Top||

#3  Fella on the right starting up his mudkip metamorphis.
Posted by: Thomas Woof || 01/02/2008 15:55 Comments || Top||


Fewer carbeques to ring in New Year
VANDALS torched 372 cars as France celebrated the New Year, down on the figure last year after a night the police described as "relatively calm".

Cars are burned fairly regularly in France and the image of vehicles in flames in poor suburbs became symbolic of riots in 2005 when angry youts youths set fire to thousands of cars. There is usually an increase in the number of cars torched on New Year's Eve compared to other days of the year. At the height of the 2005 riots as many as 1400 cars were attacked in overnight violence. In protests over President Nicolas Sarkozy election last May, demonstrators set fire to 730 vehicles.

“The night was relatively calm, without notable incident, there were very few direct clashes with the security forces,” said a spokesman for the national police.

The Interior Ministry said 372 vehicles had been burned - 144 in the Paris region and 228 in the rest of France. That was down from 397 last New Year's Eve. Police had stepped up their presence on French streets in anticipation of the year-end celebrations and the sale of petrol in cans was banned in some places.
Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Steve White || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under:

#1  This continues to amaze me. A5089 has stated that this goes on daily and peaks up on special occasions like holidays. I'd still like to know who pays ? There's got to be a scam of some sort behind this. Does the gov't provide stipends for destroyed vehicles? Is this what they do to old vehicles which don't run to obtain a new vehicle which does function ? What's the deal ?
Posted by: Woozle Elmeter 2907 || 01/02/2008 9:52 Comments || Top||

#2  There's got to be a scam of some sort behind this

agreed
Posted by: Whomong Guelph4611 || 01/02/2008 11:47 Comments || Top||

#3  Insurance companies do NOT make money by paying on claims. They prefer to collect premiums. One little earthquake in California and they stop issuing quake policies. I imagine it's the same with flood policies in New Orleans. The question then becomes, how much are the premiums for car insurance in France?
Posted by: Ebbang Uluque6305 || 01/02/2008 12:06 Comments || Top||


Home Front: Politix
Edwards Calls for Quick End to Effort in Iraq
Because nothing says success like retreat.
SIOUX CITY, Iowa — John Edwards says that if elected president he would withdraw the American troops who are training the Iraqi army and police as part of a broader plan to remove virtually all American forces within 10 months.
Solidifying his grip on the left 10% of the country, and not our finest, either ...
Mr. Edwards, the former one term do nothing senator from North Carolina who is waging a populist campaign for the Democratic nomination, said that extending the American training effort in Iraq into the next presidency would require the deployment of tens of thousands of troops to provide logistical support and protect the advisers. “To me, that is a continuation of the occupation of Iraq,” he said in a 40-minute interview on Sunday aboard his campaign bus as it rumbled through western Iowa.

In one of his most detailed discussions to date about how he would handle Iraq as president, Mr. Edwards staked out a position that would lead to a more rapid and complete troop withdrawal than his principal rivals, Senators Hillary Rodham Clinton and Barack Obama, who have indicated they are open to keeping American trainers and counterterrorism units in Iraq.

Elizabeth Edwards, his wife and political partner, who listened in on the interview from a seat across the aisle, intervened at the end of the session to underscore that Mr. Edwards did not intend to stop all training and was prepared to train Iraqi forces outside of the country.
In Okinawa?
Mr. Edwards continued the theme while acknowledging that the benefits of such training would be limited.

Mr. EdwardsÂ’s plan, like that of many of his Democratic opponents, is at odds with the strategy developed by American military commanders, who have said the situation is still too fragile to set a timetable for such extensive troop withdrawals and a curtailment of the training effort in Iraq.

Mr. EdwardsÂ’s plan calls for immediately withdrawing 40,000 to 50,000 troops. Nearly all of the remaining American troops would be removed within 9 or 10 months. The only force that would remain would be a 3,500-to-5,000-strong contingent that would protect the American Embassy and possibly humanitarian workers.
How many of those would be in Iraq if we weren't there?
Over the past five years, Mr. Edwards’s position on Iraq has undergone a substantial evolution. In 2002, as a senator, Mr. Edwards was among the Democrats who voted to authorize the use of force in Iraq. Mr. Edwards has said he was convinced by the intelligence that Saddam Hussein controlled stocks of unconventional weapons, but in the Senate speech explaining his vote he also endorsed the Bush administration’s argument that a new democratic Iraq “could serve as a model for the entire Arab world.”
And then the wheels came off his brain:
In November 2005, Mr. Edwards wrote an op-ed article for The Washington Post entitled “The Right Way in Iraq,” in which he argued that his earlier vote to authorize the use of force in Iraq was a mistake, while making the point that it was still important to provide American troops with “a way to end their mission honorably.”
But now it's okay to be dishonorable.
Toward this end, Mr. Edwards called at the time for establishing a more effective program to train Iraqi troops and channeling reconstruction work to Iraqis instead of American contractors. While he called for removing a significant number of American forces, he also emphasized that the withdrawals should be “a gradual process.”

“That will still leave us with enough military capability, combined with better-trained Iraqis, to fight terrorists and continue to help the Iraqis develop a stable country,” he wrote.

In the interview on Sunday, Mr. Edwards said that he decided on his current plan for a rapid and near-total withdrawal of American troops because of the failure of Iraqi leaders to achieve a political accommodation over the past four years.
They passed a budget, distributed the oil money and voted reconciliation for low-level Ba'athists. That's more on our Congress got done.
Eight to 10 brigades, which is likely to be the bulk of the American combat force by the time the next president takes office, would immediately be withdrawn. “I absolutely believe this to my soul: we are there propping up their bad behavior,” he said. “I mean really, how many American lives and how much American taxpayer money are we going to continue to expend waiting for these political leaders to do something? Because that is precisely what we are doing.”

Such a troop withdrawal, he said, might jolt Iraqi leaders into taking action to overcome their sectarian differences.
No, it would prompt them to double down and cover themselves. Each community would have to look out for itself. Sectarian strife would explode. Iran and Syria would immediately broaden their efforts to destabilize the country. The Turks would invade.
During the 10 months or so while American troops were being withdrawn, Mr. Edwards added, he would also mount an intensive effort to encourage IraqÂ’s leaders to engage in political reconciliation ...
How exactly would you encourage them to 'reconcile' when you're pulling out the only stick you have?
... and solicit the cooperation of Iran and Syria, who he argued might be more willing to help once they understood that American troops were on their way out.
Why? They'd just wait to pick up the pieces. Iran wants a new client state in Iraq just like they have in Syria and Lebanon. That's been their goal all along.
Mr. Edwards, who has never visited Iraq, said he asked the Pentagon last year to help arrange a visit but was turned down. (Mr. Obama visited Iraq once two years ago, while Mrs. Clinton has made three trips.) Geoff Morrell, the senior Defense Department spokesman, said the Pentagon had turned down all requests to visit Iraq from politicians who are not currently serving in Congress or as governors, including Rudolph W. Giuliani, a candidate for the Republican nomination.
Say Johnny One-Term, perhaps you should have found a way to stay in the Senate. Then again, Michael Totten and Michael Yon both found ways to get to Iraq on their own. Even paid their own way. Johnny One-Note has more money than all Rantburg readers put togther. You'd think perhaps he could finance a trip including the security for his hairdresser ...
At his campaign stops on Sunday, Mr. Edwards sought to highlight his knowledge of foreign policy by recounting his recent telephone call with PakistanÂ’s president, Pervez Musharraf, a conversation Mr. Edwards initiated as soon as he learned of the death of Benazir Bhutto.
"So Mr. Musharraf, when are you withdrawing from Pakistan?"
Iraq was not part of his prepared remarks, save for a denunciation of greedy military contractors. But Mr. Edwards outlined his plan to remove American troops from Iraq during a question-and-answer session with voters.

In the interview, Mr. Edwards spoke comfortably about the subject and without notes or help from policy advisers. Some elements of his plan, however, run counter to reality assessments by intelligence agencies, military officers and a Congressionally mandated study.

American military commanders have publicly cautioned that a rapid withdrawal of troops risks a new escalation of sectarian violence, which has been substantially reduced in recent months. A National Intelligence Estimate on Iraq that was issued in January 2007 by the United States intelligence agencies also warned that the withdrawal of American troops over the ensuing 12 to 18 months would probably lead to “massive civilian casualties and forced population displacement.”
There's a NIE you don't hear much about, especially from the Dhimmicrats ...
Mr. Edwards acknowledged that there was a risk that a speedy troop drawdown might lead to substantially increased sectarian violence. Under Mr. Edwards’s plan, the United States would keep a quick reaction force in Kuwait and perhaps Jordan to respond to terrorist threats and possible “genocide.”
Nonsense. President Edwards wouldn't have the stones to put forces back into Iraq once they're out, and his supporters would shriek and wail if he did. And why on earth would Kuwait and Jordan agree to sponsor 'quick-reaction forces' if we're in the midst of hightailing it from the region? We'd be poison, we'd be radioactive. Kuwait and Jordan would be busy cutting deals with Iran for their own survival, and those deals wouldn't include hosting our troops.
Mr. Edwards has said that he would also seek to involve other allied nations in the effort.
Who, exactly? The French? Our 'allies' the Saoodis? Who exactly would want to be involved in 'stabilizing' Iraq if we're pulling out? Names, please ...
But he declined to say whether the United States would be prepared to send troops back into Iraq to stop attacks on civilians if other nations did not participate, stating the question was hypothetical.
And there's your answer. President Edwards wouldn't do it. He'd point out that he didn't have the permission of the U.N. to go back in. Too bad for all the dead civilians.
Regarding training, an independent commission that was established by Congress to assess Iraq’s security forces cautioned in a September report that Iraq’s security force would not be able to operate independently within the next 12 to 18 months. The commission, whose chairman was the retired Gen. James L. Jones, the former Marine Corps commandant and NATO commander, noted that the Iraqi army was making strides but added that “for the foreseeable future” Iraqi troops would continue to rely on American help with logistics, equipment, training and support from air and artillery units.
And "12 to 18 months" was optimistic, as I recall.
That raises the question of whether Mr. EdwardsÂ’s plan to withdraw American trainers and logistical support would undermine the effort to transfer more responsibility to Iraqis, which is the main goal of his policy. Asked about the commissionÂ’s study, Mr. Edwards said that the key problem in shifting responsibility to the Iraqis was not military, but political.
Nice hand-wave, Senator. Doesn't solve the problem.
As the interview drew to a close, Mrs. Edwards politely chided this reporter for failing to ask about Mr. Edwards’s plan to train some Iraqi forces outside Iraq, which she emphasized was an important feature of the plan. “It’s the one thing you forgot,” she said.
Where, exactly? You'd have to bring them to the States because no other country in the region will host the training. Or us in general. We pull out of Iraq as you plan to do it and our influence in the Middle East is gone, gone, gone.
Mr. Edwards continued the thought. “Of course, it is limited,” he said, referring to the training. “You can do some. You can do some.”
And that's about as far as the plan has gone in Johnny's blow-dried head ...
Throughout his campaign Mr. Edwards has spoken about the need to restore the United StatesÂ’ moral standing in the world.
By leaving 24 million civilians to genocide and slaughter ...
He was asked if he believes the United States has a duty to help protect Iraqi civilians, particularly since he had voted to authorize an invasion that had unleashed a sectarian struggle for power. “That is a very important question for the president of the United States because it is very much a judgment call,” Mr. Edwards said. “Do I believe that we have had a moral responsibility? I do. The question is, How long does that moral responsibility continue and at what juncture is it the right decision to end what we have been doing and shift that responsibility to them?”

“Let’s assume for a minute that come January 2009 we still have a significant troop presence in Iraq, which I think is likely,” Mr. Edwards added. “If that is the case, then I think another 9 to 10 months of American troop involvement and expenditure of taxpayer money with an intense effort to resolve the political conflict and intense diplomacy, then at that point America has done what it can do.”
How does anyone take this guy seriously anymore?
Posted by: DarthVader || 01/02/2008 11:10 || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Elizabeth Edwards, his wife and political partner, who listened in on the interview from a seat across the aisle, intervened at the end of the session to underscore that Mr. Edwards did not intend to stop all training and was prepared to train Iraqi forces outside of the country

Did she pull her hand out of puppet-boy's ass? He's just a purty face on an empty suit. She's the one with spine, balls, and brains, but hires Amanda Marcotte for campaign blogger. Both of them will be distant memories in a few months. Good riddance
Posted by: Frank G || 01/02/2008 11:33 Comments || Top||

#2  this is a stupid tactic. The American Senators and Congressmen rejected any proposal to handicap or pull out troops from Iraq with almost unanimous votes, every time. The only ones who voted against the real proposals(not the meaningles non-binding ones)were the very few in places where it is impossible to unseat them.

But of course, he's a stupid hair-headed dolt, so it is not surprisng.
Posted by: Whomong Guelph4611 || 01/02/2008 11:44 Comments || Top||

#3  Redeploy to Iowa, wait for it all to go to shit and then go back in to stop the genocide. Sounds like a plan to me. Not a good plan, mind you, but a plan.
Posted by: Ebbang Uluque6305 || 01/02/2008 12:12 Comments || Top||

#4  Edwards has made the Donk establishment the enemy.

Cool.
Posted by: mhw || 01/02/2008 14:13 Comments || Top||

#5  "Mr. Edwards staked out a position that would lead to a more rapid and complete troop withdrawal than his principal rivals, Senators Hillary Rodham Clinton and Barack Obama..."

Hmmm...going for all those suddenly available Kucinich votes is he?
Posted by: DepotGuy || 01/02/2008 16:10 Comments || Top||

#6  Forget it Ebbang, Iowa is a lost cause, best to defend a line Austin, Denver, Spokane and hope for the best.
Posted by: Thomas Woof || 01/02/2008 16:23 Comments || Top||

#7  Just today saw the newsweak with edwards on the cover, loosening his tie in 'a blue collar work ethic' pose with the word 'sleeper' printed. After the infidelity accusations all I could think of was that it looked like an application photo for a Malaysian Health Official Post; had the thumpy bass music playing in my head and everything.
Posted by: swksvolFF || 01/02/2008 16:36 Comments || Top||

#8  This guy makes Kerry look "genuine"...
Posted by: tu3031 || 01/02/2008 16:42 Comments || Top||

#9  “To me, that is a continuation of the occupation of Iraq,”

Forget about Iraq! What is pretty John going to do about ending our occupation of Germany? Troops Home Now!
Posted by: SteveS || 01/02/2008 20:45 Comments || Top||


Home Front: WoT
Military Use of Unmanned Aircraft Soars
WASHINGTON (AP) - The military's reliance on unmanned aircraft that can watch, hunt and sometimes kill insurgents has soared to more than 500,000 hours in the air, largely in Iraq, The Associated Press has learned. And new Defense Department figures obtained by The AP show that the Air Force more than doubled its monthly use of drones between January and October, forcing it to take pilots out of the air and shift them to remote flying duty to meet part of the demand.

The dramatic increase in the development and use of drones across the armed services reflects what will be an even more aggressive effort over the next 25 years, according to the new report.

The jump in Iraq coincided with the build up of U.S. forces this summer as the military swelled its ranks to quell the violence in Baghdad. But Pentagon officials said that even as troops begin to slowly come home this year, the use of Predators, Global Hawks, Shadows and Ravens will not likely slow.

Continued on Page 49
Posted by: Steve White || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [8 views] Top|| File under:

#1  The video games geeks' hour of glory.
Posted by: g(r)omgoru || 01/02/2008 3:57 Comments || Top||

#2  You'd think so ... but the Predator and Global Hawk class UAVs are flown by pilots not gameboy veterans. A lot of work goes into the ground control stations for the pilot and sensor crews on these.
Posted by: lotp || 01/02/2008 11:05 Comments || Top||

#3  Hey, I got quite a few hours in 'Wings over Vietnam' - I know that the UAV operation is a bit more complicated but it is in my interest if/when the time comes. I also hear that are a good number of applicants for this field; highly competitive.

Out of curiousity for those of you who know, how long is an ASVAB test good for (or is it something taken before every application)?
Posted by: swksvolFF || 01/02/2008 11:21 Comments || Top||

#4  A lot of work goes into the ground control stations for the pilot and sensor crews on these

There's a joke about par 3 courses and poor fairway in there somewhere. ;>
Posted by: Thomas Woof || 01/02/2008 12:11 Comments || Top||

#5  They're a cross between a railroad box car and those trailors parked at construction sites. ;-)
Posted by: lotp || 01/02/2008 12:13 Comments || Top||

#6  ahem:
Âżforcing it to take pilots out of the air and shift them to remote flying duty to meet part of the demand? [said in husky whispered voice]

hummm...

"The bulk of the unmanned flight hours belong to the Army's workhorse drone, the Raven, which weighs just four pounds and is used by smaller units, such as companies and battalions, in Iraq and Afghanistan."

"The Army has a total of 361 unmanned aircraft in Iraq alone - including Shadows, Hunters and Ravens. And in the first 10 months of 2007, they flew more than 300,000 hours."

Correct me if ima wrong but only the Predator and Global Hawk rely on and regularly use of USA based operators.

I recognize there are several other UAVs.. special UAVs and Coalition UAVs that I didn't include, but their use in any volumn does not pull jet jockies down from the sky.

I believe this AP reporter has some numbers and fact problems woven thru & thru, but That isn't News is it LOL!, In fact it's the standard by which we filter every cotton picken article today.

feedback from those in the loop plz...
Posted by: Lashkar-e-Dawg || 01/02/2008 13:41 Comments || Top||

#7  You'd think so ... but the Predator and Global Hawk class UAVs are flown by pilots

Sic transit gloria The Last Starfighter
Posted by: g(r)omgoru || 01/02/2008 15:57 Comments || Top||

#8  Don't forget the NAVY + even NASA.
Posted by: JosephMendiola || 01/02/2008 20:54 Comments || Top||

#9  In one recent example of what they can do, a Predator caught sight of three militants firing mortars at U.S. forces in November in Balad, Iraq. The drone fired an air-to-ground missile, killing the three, according to video footage the Air Force released.

Allahu akbar!
Posted by: WTF || 01/02/2008 23:14 Comments || Top||


India-Pakistan
Scotland Yard to help probe into Bhutto killing: Musharraf
President Pervez Musharraf said Wednesday that the government has invited Scotland Yard to help Pakistani investigators in the probe of opposition leader Benazir Bhutto's assassination in Rawalpindi last week in a gun and suicide bomb attack.

In an address to the nation over the official Pakistan Television, Musharraf said he had requested British Prime Minister Gordon Brown to send Scotland Yard experts and he had accepted the request.

Musharraf said, however, he was convinced that two rebel militant leaders -- Baitullah Mehsud and Fazal ullah from tribal Waziristan and Swat areas -- were responsible for the assassination of Bhutto on Thursday. "I want to declare with certainty that these people had martyred Benazir Bhutto," he said.
Both of whom are conveniently unavailable, and neither of whom are likely to be captured and forced to confess anytime soon ...
Mehsud is a former Guantanamo bay inmate who set up his private army after return to Pakistan while Fazal ullah is a Muslim cleric who is leading a campaign for the setting up of Islamic system in Swat district in the Northwest Frontier Province and adjoining areas.

However, the move to invite a team from Scotland Yard was categorically rejected by Asif Zardari, the co-chairman of the Pakistan People's Party and widower of Benazir Bhutto, who insisted that the United Nations should conduct the probe in the killing of Bhutto. "Why the government did not accept our demand to invite Scotland Yard experts after the Oct. 18 suicide bomb attack in Karachi?" he said. "Had it happened we would have averted the catastrophic martyrdom of BB (Benazir Bhutto) Sahiba."
Perhaps. Now then, the question of the moment is, do you want Scotland Yard to figure out who whacked your wife?
Zardari said that a six-member committee of the PPP with assistance from international lawyers was drafting a request to the United Nations to formulate an inquiry commission.
Paging Carla del Ponte, Carla del Ponte to the red courtesy phone ...
Musharraf called for unity for the fight against extremism and terrorism and called on the political parties to comprehend the sensitive situation. "Do not increase the complications in which we are trapped. If we do not succeed in fighting extremism... Pakistan will have a dark future," he said.

He declared that Pakistan's army would be deployed "during and beyond elections" to ensure peace, law and order in the country.
Except in Wazoo and the North West Frontier Area ...
Zardari also said that the PPP strongly condemns the postponement of elections but would take part in the Feb. 19 elections. He announced that his party candidates would start their election campaign after the first 10 days of month of Moharram starting Jan. 10 when Shiite Muslims bring out processions and hold congregations to mourn the death of Hussain, the grandson of Prophet Mohammad.
This article starring:
Asif Zardari
Baitullah Mehsud
Fazal ullah
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 01/02/2008 13:26 || Comments || Link || [9 views] Top|| File under:


Pakistan election postponed until February 18
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 01/02/2008 13:24 || Comments || Link || [7 views] Top|| File under:


Bhutto tribe patriarch disputes party leadership succession
MIR BHUTTO, Pakistan — The elevation of slain former Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto's husband and teenaged son to replace her as leaders of Pakistan's largest opposition party is re-opening fissures that have divided the powerful political family for decades.

To Mumtaz Bhutto, the septuagenarian patriarch of the 700,000-strong Bhutto tribe, Asif Ali Zardari and his son, Bilawal, are interlopers. The leadership of the Pakistan Peoples Party, he said in an interview Tuesday, should have gone to "a real Bhutto."
Not one of them damn furriners ...
Mumtaz Bhutto's comments reflect the important roles that family, tribe and ethnicity continue to play in Pakistani politics 60 years after independence from British colonial rule, and one reason why democracy has failed to put down strong roots.

The Bhuttos are ethnic Sindhis. Zardari is from the Baluch ethnic group. His son carried Zardari as his last name until after his mother's assassination last week, when he added Bhutto as his middle name in what some experts saw correctly as a move to perpetuate the political dynasty.

Mumtaz Bhutto was a founding member of the party established by Benazir Bhutto's father, Zulfikar Ali Bhutto, the country's first democratically elected prime minister, who was executed two years after being toppled in a 1977 military coup. "The party has come into existence on the name and the sweat and the blood of the Bhutto family," asserted Mumtaz, 74, who lives on a grand country estate in Mirpur Bhutto, the original family village in southern Sindh Province. "Therefore, the leadership should either have gone to Sanam or Murtaza's son or daughter."

Sanam, Benazir's sister, has never taken any active role in politics. Murtaza, Benazir's brother, saw himself as Zulfiqar Ali's true political heir, but he was gunned down in Karachi by police in 1996, leaving a daughter, Fatima, 25, and Zulfiqar Ali junior, 18.

After Benazir took over leadership of the party in 1984, she sacked Mumtaz in a family feud policy disagreement. Fatima and her stepmother Ghinwa have publicly accused Benazir and Asif Zardari of complicity in Murtaza's death, which remains unsolved — Benazir was prime minister at the time.

Benazir retorted that Murtaza was killed by people who wanted to "frame" her for his murder. Sanam always sided with Benazir and it is believed that her relations with Murtaza's children remain tense, even after Benazir's death.

"The Zardaris have made no sacrifices for the party, whereas the [Bhutto] family have made big sacrifices. The Zardaris have just profited from it," said Mumtaz.
Handsomely too, to about 1.5 billion dollars ...
"Whatever Mumtaz Bhutto is saying, he is saying out of spite for Benazir Bhutto, spite and frustration, because he is now out in the political wilderness," responded Farhattullah Babar, a PPP spokesman.

As Bilawal, 19, will continue his studies at Britain's Oxford University, the announcement Sunday that father and son will co-chair the PPP means that Zardari — who was jailed for seven years on corruption and murder charges that were never proved — is actually running the PPP for now. "This will split the party very badly. He [Zardari] has no political background or acumen. I think this will lead to break-up. Total disintegration," predicted Mumtaz Bhutto.

So far, the PPP has accepted the succession plan.

Sanam Bhutto also endorsed it. She said in a statement, "I believe that the resolution of the issue of leadership in accordance with (Benazir's) will has not only saved the party from a crisis of leadership but will also strengthen it further."

Fatima Bhutto, a graduate of Columbia University in New York, who was tipped as a future challenger for the party's leadership even when Benazir was alive, has so far made no claim to her grandfather's legacy. But in a local newspaper article, she admitted she never reconciled with Benazir. "I never agreed with her politics. I never did. I never agreed with those she kept around her, the political opportunists, hanger-ons, them. They repulse me. I never agreed with her version of events. Never. But in death, in death perhaps there is a moment to call for calm," she wrote.
This article starring:
Mumtaz Bhutto
Posted by: john frum || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [8 views] Top|| File under:

#1  the septuagenarian patriarch of the 700,000-strong Bhutto tribe

A never-ending supply... I actually pity Perv...
Posted by: john frum || 01/02/2008 8:21 Comments || Top||

#2  To be fair..there might be a never ending supply of Pak dictators as well..


Posted by: john frum || 01/02/2008 8:29 Comments || Top||

#3  ...That one dude in the corner has a got a SERIOUS moustache. Used to be a requirement for a real dictator.

Mike
Posted by: Mike Kozlowski || 01/02/2008 9:34 Comments || Top||

#4  The problem is a hereditary democracy that chooses a successor. Equal opportunity based upon merit is a concept most of the world, including the Brits, just doesn't understand unfortunately.
Posted by: Danielle || 01/02/2008 14:01 Comments || Top||


Shujaat requests Musharraf to postpone elections
PML-Q President Chaudhry Shujaat Hussain met President Musharraf on Tuesday and requested him to postpone the general elections for six weeks. Geo News cited its sources as saying that Shujaat had asked Musharraf to hold elections on February 19, claiming that the situation in the country, especially in Sindh, was not conducive for elections. The channel reported that PML-Q candidates had pressed Shujaat for the election postponement, as they said the peopleÂ’s sentiments were currently in favour of the PPP. PML-Q President Chaudhry Shujaat Hussain met President Musharraf on Tuesday and requested him to postpone the general elections for six weeks. Geo News cited its sources as saying that Shujaat had asked Musharraf to hold elections on February 19, claiming that the situation in the country, especially in Sindh, was not conducive for elections. The channel reported that PML-Q candidates had pressed Shujaat for the election postponement, as they said the peopleÂ’s sentiments were currently in favour of the PPP.
Posted by: Fred || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [10 views] Top|| File under: Govt of Pakistan


Elections must proceed as scheduled: Zardari, Nawaz
The Pakistan People’s Party (PPP) and Pakistan Muslim League-Nawaz (PML-N) want the election to go ahead as scheduled, PPP co-chairman Asif Ali Zardari and PML-N chief Nawaz Sharif said in a joint statement on Tuesday, according to Reuters. “It is up to the people of Pakistan to choose their future, and the time is now,” the statement read. “The January 8 elections must proceed as scheduled. This will not only be a tribute to the memory of Benazir, but even more important, a reaffirmation of the cause of democracy for which she died,” they said. Zardari said a delay would serve no purpose. “Delaying polls is just an excuse for the caretaker regime to buy time to invent other means to send the PML-Q back to power. We will not accept that,” party spokeswoman Sherry Rehman said in the statement.
Posted by: Fred || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [14 views] Top|| File under: Govt of Pakistan

#1  See also AMERICAN THINKER > DID BHUTTO MARTYR HERSELF?
Posted by: JosephMendiola || 01/02/2008 20:24 Comments || Top||

#2  She had plenty of help, Joe. Competition was fierce.
Posted by: Alaska Paul in Ketchikan, AK || 01/02/2008 21:54 Comments || Top||


Pakistan welcomes foreign help
Pakistan’s ambassador to the United States said on Monday that his government would welcome foreign experts to help investigate the assassination of former premier Benazir Bhutto, the New York Times reported. Ambassador Mahmud Ali Durrani, however, said that the Pakistan government would not endorse a separate inquiry like the one conducted by the United Nations into the assassination of former Lebanese premier Rafik Hariri in 2005. “Pakistan is open to international expertise, international support and ... help because it’s in our interests,” Durrani said in a telephone interview, adding that the details of any assistance still needed to be worked out. Earlier, the Pakistan government refused internationals offers in this regard, saying it was capable of conducting any investigations itself.
Posted by: Fred || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [8 views] Top|| File under: Govt of Pakistan

#1  Hillary seems interested, let her go to Pakland and investigate. Maybe she won't come back...
Posted by: Spot || 01/02/2008 8:18 Comments || Top||

#2  Doesn't Pakistan have enough problems?
Posted by: john frum || 01/02/2008 8:35 Comments || Top||


Bilawal, sisters fly to Dubai
Benazir BhuttoÂ’s son flew to Dubai on Tuesday, two days after he succeeded her as head of her political party.
That gets him out of the normal bomb range...
Bilawal Bhutto Zardari, a 19-year-old Oxford University undergraduate, arrived at his family residence in Dubai with his two sisters flying from Karachi. A dozen supporters waited in the upmarket Dubai neighbourhood as the newly appointed leader of the Pakistan PeopleÂ’s Party (PPP) was driven home without making any statements to waiting reporters. It is not yet clear how long the young PPP leader will spend in the United Arab Emirates. BenazirÂ’s family, especially the children, spent much of their time in Dubai.
Posted by: Fred || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [9 views] Top|| File under: Govt of Pakistan


Iraq
Fallujah Tip for the Day: Have a Plan to Kill Everyone You Meet
from Michael Totten.
FALLUJAH — A sign on the door leading out of India Company’s Combat Operations Center says “Have a Plan to Kill Everyone You Meet.” For a fraction of second I thought it might be some kind of joke. But I was with the Marine Corps in Fallujah, and it wasn’t a joke.

I asked Captain Stewart Glenn if he could explain and perhaps elaborate a bit on what, exactly, that sign is about. “It’s pretty straightforward,” he said rather bluntly. “It means exactly what it says.”

Welcome to counterinsurgency.
Whatever works!
But very few people in Fallujah try to kill Americans – or other Iraqis – anymore. It has been months since a single Marine in Fallujah has been even wounded, let alone killed. But at least a handful of disorganized insurgents still lurk in the city. Once a week or so somebody takes a shot at the Americans.

Complacency kills. The Marines are reminded of this fact every day, as was I when I traveled and worked with them.

It has been months since the Muslim terrorist jihadists have been able to murder anyone in Fallujah. Only a few weeks before, however, a handful showed up on a street corner and handed out anti-American snuff films on DVD. Apparently they thought the local civilians would be impressed. They were not. They called the Iraqi Police, and the propagandists were taken away to the jail.

The main Jolan market was up ahead, but first we passed through a neighborhood that, unlike almost anywhere else in Iraq, received 24 hours a day of electricity. Lieutenant Barefoot pointed up toward the sky. “See the electricity poles?” he said. I did, and I was amazed.
Good news all the way around. Thank you Marines.
Posted by: Icerigger || 01/02/2008 08:35 || Comments || Link || [4 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Rule #2, have a backup plan for killing everyone you meet.
Posted by: Thomas Woof || 01/02/2008 12:14 Comments || Top||

#2  Rule #3 Don't kill everyone you meet.
Posted by: Bright Pebbles || 01/02/2008 12:34 Comments || Top||

#3  But very few people in Fallujah try to kill Americans – or other Iraqis – anymore.

I wonder why?
Posted by: g(r)omgoru || 01/02/2008 16:14 Comments || Top||


South Korea to continue controversial oil project in Kurdistan
State-run Korea National Oil Corp. stated that it would not abandon an exploration project in Iraqi Kurdistan despite threats by the central Iraqi government to cut off oil supplies to South Korea. "There is no change in our position to go ahead with the project," said Jang Soo-Bum, an official in charge of exploration projects.

The corporation is part of a South Korean consortium that last month signed a deal with the Kurdistan government to explore the Bazian field, which is estimated to hold 500 million barrels of crude oil.

Aasim Jihad, the official spokesman for the Iraqi oil ministry, threatened on December 26 to stop exporting Iraqi crude oil exports to South Korea if Seoul ratified an agreement concluded with the regional government of Iraq's Kurdistan. Local newspapers have said Britain's BP and an Austrian state energy developer received similar warnings over their deals with the semi-autonomous region.

Meanwhile, Kurdistan Region criticized the Iraqi Oil Ministry's threats to stop oil exports to South Korea. "I believe these statements would complicate matters now that the negotiations between the central government and the Iraqi Kurdistan government are still going on," a prominent Kurdish lawmaker in Baghdad Parliament, Mahmoud Othman, said in a statement.

Othman urged for recourse in Iraq's Supreme Court to settle the problem. "Even if we presumed that the Oil Ministry's procedures were constitutional, they should not be carried out in such a speed," he added.

Regarding South Korean troops in Kurdistan Region, South Korean Parliament on December 28 voted to extend troop deployment in Kurdistan by one year. Seoul now has about 600 troops stationed in the Kurdish region for reconstruction projects.
Posted by: ryuge || 01/02/2008 06:49 || Comments || Link || [5 views] Top|| File under:


Israel-Palestine-Jordan
Israel Protests Pilgrims' Return to Gaza
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 01/02/2008 13:25 || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:

#1  guess Egypt doesn't need that $2 billion in aid each year. F*ckers
Posted by: Frank G || 01/02/2008 13:35 Comments || Top||


Islamic Jihad says Hamas-Fatah feud "very dangerous"
Palestinian Islamic Jihad movement on Wednesday said the differences between Hamas and Fatah factions became "very dangerous."
To whom?
"What is happening in our Palestinian scene in Gaza Strip is very depressing," said Khader Habib, a Gaza-based Islamic Jihad leader.

Habib also criticized Hamas' takeover of Gaza Strip in June after fierce fighting with Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas' Fatah movement and the pro-Abbas security services. "Hamas takeover of Gaza was a disaster that hit the Palestinian people and their cause... our people's achievements are fuming and retreating and the cause turned from political to a humanitarian issue," Habib continued.
Posted by: ryuge || 01/02/2008 06:39 || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under: Hamas

#1  Well don't just whine about it, Habib, go wack someone you blame for your troubles!
Posted by: Bobby || 01/02/2008 6:57 Comments || Top||

#2  Islamic Jihad says Hamas-Fatah feud "very dangerous"

Yes, somebody could get hurt.
Posted by: Excalibur || 01/02/2008 8:53 Comments || Top||

#3  "What is happening in our Palestinian scene in Gaza Strip is very depressing"

took the words right out of my mouth
Posted by: PlanetDan || 01/02/2008 9:10 Comments || Top||

#4  Sorry to hear that. Why don't you launch a full scale attack on them to soothe your pains?
Posted by: DarthVader || 01/02/2008 9:52 Comments || Top||

#5  It's funny when Islamic Jihad are the "voice of reason".
Posted by: Scooter McGruder || 01/02/2008 12:56 Comments || Top||

#6  Time for .. pop corn?


Posted by: 3dc || 01/02/2008 14:01 Comments || Top||


Bush will not visit Arafat tomb
Palestinian Authority officials on Monday expressed deep disappointment after learning that US President George W. Bush, who is expected to visit Ramallah soon, does not intend to lay a wreath at Yasser Arafat's tomb. Bush, who is also expected to visit Jericho and Bethlehem, does not even plan to pass near the tomb.

Bush would not stop by Arafat's newly-built mausoleum during his visit to Ramallah, a source in the US Consulate in Jerusalem told The Jerusalem Post. The PA has invested millions of dollars in building the mausoleum in the Mukata "presidential" compound. "I'm not aware of any plan to lay a wreath at Arafat's tomb," the source said. "This issue was not raised during preparations for President Bush's tour and I doubt if he would do so."

To avoid embarrassing the Palestinians, Bush may meet with PA President Mahmoud Abbas in Bethlehem or at the Prime Minister's Office in Ramallah.

In response, a senior PA official said, "Of course we are very disappointed, although we weren't surprised."

The official said the PA leadership had decided not to make a big issue out of the visit to Arafat's mausoleum to avoid creating a crisis with the US. Almost all foreign leaders who visit the Mukata stop by Arafat's tomb to pay respects or lay a wreath on it.
Posted by: lotp || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [3 views] Top|| File under:

#1  The President order Ramallah flattened, before the visit.
Posted by: McZoid || 01/02/2008 1:54 Comments || Top||

#2  I believe he should have visited Arafat's Tomb. It would have made a fine place to relieve himself.
Posted by: Eohippus Chavilet7436 || 01/02/2008 5:58 Comments || Top||

#3  too dangerous
Posted by: Snort Hatfield4713 || 01/02/2008 10:45 Comments || Top||

#4  True, papers wouldn't like it either.
Posted by: Thomas Woof || 01/02/2008 12:15 Comments || Top||


Sri Lanka
Sri Lanka gov't to end cease-fire accord with Tamil Tigers
NEW DELHI —The Sri Lankan government decided Wednesday to nullify a cease-fire agreement with the Tamil Tigers, reports from Colombo said.
The agreement was reached in 2002 between the government and the Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam which are fighting for an independent state in northern and eastern Sri Lanka.

The accord, brokered by Norway, virtually collapsed after Mahinda Rajapaksa became president in November 2005. More than 5,000 people have been killed in the fighting.
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 01/02/2008 14:04 || Comments || Link || [7 views] Top|| File under:

#1  thought that cease fire was over already
Posted by: sinse || 01/02/2008 16:58 Comments || Top||


Syria-Lebanon-Iran
Iran hangs 13 on single day: reports
Posted by: anonymous5089 || 01/02/2008 14:03 || Comments || Link || [8 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Last year, Iran carried out at least 297 executions, according to an AFP count compiled from press reports.

The total was a sharp increase on 2006, when 177 executions were carried out, according to Amnesty International.

Iran currently makes more use of the death penalty than any other country apart from China. Capital offences in Iran include murder, rape, armed robbery, serious drug trafficking and adultery.

Human rights groups have accused Iran of excessive resort to the death penalty, but the authorities say capital punishment is an effective deterrent that is only used after an exhaustive judicial process.


Also a nice little story about a woman who hit her cheating husband on the head with an iron bar then chopped his body into little tupperware sized pieces. Seeing how adultery is a capital offense, wouldn't this be a citizens arrest or does that only count against females?
Posted by: swksvolFF || 01/02/2008 15:38 Comments || Top||

#2  I am quite sure there are more than 297 people deserving of execution every year in Iran, but unfortunately those are not going to make the list.
Posted by: Glenmore || 01/02/2008 16:15 Comments || Top||

#3  evidently it isn't much of a deterrent since the total goes higher every year, not that i am against the death penalty but adultery seems a bit much
Posted by: sinse || 01/02/2008 17:00 Comments || Top||

#4  An on-line search of the Guiness word records for 'daily hangings' or 'daily executions' failed to turn up anything, so perhaps Dinnerjacket can get his skinny little a55 written into history........
Posted by: USN,Ret. || 01/02/2008 17:38 Comments || Top||


Israel could win nuke war with Iran
December 25, 2007 -- A doomsday war between nuclear-armed adversaries Iran and Israel would kill up to 28 million Iranians and destroy their nation, but the Jewish state might survive, according to a prestigious US think tank.
Good thing we have think tanks to tell us this stuff.
The nightmare "what if?" scenario concluded that Israel's state-of-the-art missile defense would intercept most of Iran's nuclear-tipped missiles. That would limit Israel's deaths to as "few" as 200,000 - while its much more numerous and more powerful nukes would obliterate Iran, said the Center for Strategic and International Studies.
I'm not sure Israel's missile defense is that good. But I'm fairly certain that right now the Iranians couldn't hit the broad side of a nuclear barn.
"Iranian recovery is not possible in the normal sense of the term, though Israeli recovery is theoretically possible in population and economic terms," analyst Andrew Cordesman wrote.
Assuming their neighbors the Paleos would let them, which would require our direct intervention. In the chaos of the first days after a nuclear strike the advantage is to the Paleos: they're used to chaos.
The findings could cheer Israeli hawks who dispute the recent US National Intelligence Estimate that Iran is not seeking nukes.
No, the NIE depresses them because it makes them realize that they're on their own.
But the study also indicates that Iran wouldn't use them even if it got them, because a war would lead to the same kind of "mutually assured destruction" that kept the US-Soviet Cold War from becoming hot.
Unless the Mad Mullahs™ really are mad. It's 'moderates' like Rafsenjani who claimed that a nuclear war would be okay even if Iran was seriously wrecked as long as Israel was obliterated. I haven't heard him say that he's changed his mind.
"The 'War Game' paradox: The only way to win is not to play," the study concluded.
Again, you have to be sane to think that way. I'm sure there are Mullahs who do, but there are too many of them in Qom who think that a world cataclysm would encourage the twelfth iman to appear. Israel really can't afford to see who wins the arm-wrestling contest in Iran, and that makes a pre-emptive strike from Israel more likely. If they can't do a pre-emptive conventional strike today, it could well be a nuclear first strike in the future.
An exchange of nukes would last about 21 days and immediately kill 16 million to 28 million Iranians and 200,000 to 800,000 Israelis.
21 days? I think it would be over in a few hours. Any longer than that and the U.S. and Russia would get involved. Russia could sortie aircraft to prevent Israeli nuclear strike aircraft from getting through, and we'd do the same to cover Israel. We might also put an Aegis-equipped ship near Haifa.
Long-term deaths, from the effects of radiation and other causes, were not estimated.
But of course they'd be high, and higher in Iran. Israel wouldn't be able to do much about the radiation casualties as their medical facilities would be overwhelmed, but Iran would have a ten-fold problem with far fewer resources. They'd be pretty close to being back into the 11th Century.
The greater Iranian death toll is explained by several factors:

* Israeli bombs have a bigger kaboom bang. Israel has produced 1-megaton nukes, while Iran would be unable to produce anything more than 100 kilotons, a weapon with one-tenth the impact.
* Iran would have fewer than 50 nuclear weapons, while Israel would have more than 200.
* Israel also has an Arrow-2 missile defense, buttressed by US-made anti-missile weaponry. Iran has a limited missile defense.
* Israel's missiles would be more accurate, due to high-resolution satellite imagery.

If Syria joined its ally Iran in a wider war, it could attack Israel with mustard gas, nerve agents and anthrax in non-nuclear warheads. That could kill another 800,000 Israelis, but in response, up to 18 million Syrians would die, the study found.
It would mean that Syria, for sure, would cease to exist as a nation. It would also cause massive damage (from fallout, etc) to Iraq, Lebanon and southern Turkey. That amount of fallout would circulate around the world. It would be a catastrophe.
Posted by: Steve White || 01/02/2008 11:22 || Comments || Link || [11 views] Top|| File under:

#1  be a damn shame if the inaccurate Iranian missiles landed in Gaza, South Lebanon, Syria, Saudi...
Posted by: Frank G || 01/02/2008 11:38 Comments || Top||

#2  But likely, eh? Iranian guidance systems pro'ly have all the accuracy of an old German V-2, given that's where all this technology came from.
Posted by: Steve White || 01/02/2008 11:42 Comments || Top||

#3  . Russia could sortie aircraft to prevent Israeli nuclear strike aircraft from getting through,

I doubt it. I mean they culd, but they'd loose the few aircraft that managed to rebase to Persia and then fight. Remember the Zionist entity doesn't not only have nooks it also doesn't have persist nerve agents.
Posted by: Thomas Woof || 01/02/2008 12:22 Comments || Top||

#4  Israeli missiles have the range to reach Moscow and Leningrad. The soviets would not do a damned thing.
Posted by: 3dc || 01/02/2008 12:52 Comments || Top||

#5  I cannot see what Russian interest would compel them to intervene.
Posted by: Excalibur || 01/02/2008 15:00 Comments || Top||

#6  Define "win"...
Posted by: mojo || 01/02/2008 16:46 Comments || Top||

#7  Ny thoughts exactly, mojo
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 01/02/2008 17:05 Comments || Top||

#8  "My"

crud :-(
Posted by: Barbara Skolaut || 01/02/2008 17:05 Comments || Top||

#9  Well, if Israel wins, I hope that they have a good plan for decontamination.......
Posted by: Alaska Paul in Ketchikan, AK || 01/02/2008 22:00 Comments || Top||

#10  AlGore-like westerly hot wind?
Posted by: Frank G || 01/02/2008 22:07 Comments || Top||


Iran's homemade nuclear power plant
Energy Minister Parviz Fattah says Iran is constructing its first homemade 360-megawatt nuclear power plant in Khuzestan province. The new nuclear power plant will be built in the Darkhovein region of the nation's southern province, Khuzestan.
That's the part of Iran that is Arab-majority, and Khuzestan plus south and central Iraq would make up a nice 'Shiastan' with lots of oil and some fair hostility to the Medes and Persians.
The Iranian minister said Sunday that the station will be the first nuclear power plant to be completely built by Iranian experts. Iran's Atomic Energy Organization will supervise the project's completion, Fattah added.

According to Iranian officials, nuclear fuel for the plant will be provided by the Natanz uranium enrichment facility. The number of the facility's centrifuges will increase to 50,000 in the near future.
Posted by: Steve White || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [11 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Oh, so they actually got around to talking about building a facility that, someday, might actually be able to make use of the output of the 50,000 centrifuges?

What more proof does one need that their intentions are entirely peaceful?
Posted by: Bobby || 01/02/2008 6:52 Comments || Top||

#2  RIAN > RUSSIA TALKS OF NUCLEAR COOPERATION WITH URUGUAY.
Posted by: JosephMendiola || 01/02/2008 20:33 Comments || Top||

#3  The Iranians probably got the plans of the Chernobyl graphite reactor at fire sale prices, and the Russians probably threw in one of their user-friendly control rooms as a bonus.
Posted by: Alaska Paul in Ketchikan, AK || 01/02/2008 22:04 Comments || Top||


Russia opposes US push for sanctions
Nothing now here but the intransigence is worth noting.
Russia says sanctions are not an efficient measure against any country pursuing an independent policy toward international regulations. Head of the Russian Federation Council International Affairs Committee Mikhail Margelov said any country pursuing an independent policy cannot be liked by all. He stated that Russia now has its own position on key international and internal problems.

"We have disagreements with the US on certain quite important issues," Margelov said in an interview with Interfax. He referred to the recent US intelligence report on Iran's nuclear project and added that accordingly Iran had phased out its nuclear weapons program back in 2003.

"However, even now, after the intelligence services made this report, the US hasn't changed its attitude toward Iran," Margelov said.

The Russian senator asserted that Russia would not agree with the US missile shield project in Europe. He added that as it turns out, Iran does not have missiles threatening Europe; however, Washington would not accept a compromise on the project.
That's because we know what the Iranians are working on, and we understand how long it takes to build something.
Posted by: Steve White || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [8 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Sounds like this guy thinks we should base our policy on Russian intel. Sounds like that's what the NIE thinks too. Screw them both.
Posted by: Ebbang Uluque6305 || 01/02/2008 12:31 Comments || Top||

#2  1. The news source is Iranian, though it's based out of France. I highly doubt they'd quote a Russian who favored sanctions.

2. As flawed and politically-skewed as it is, the NIE wasn't based solely on 'Russian intel', if indeed if any Russian intel was used at all. (It kinda helps if one at least reads the sumamries).

3. Margelov is citing the US' NIE, which is rather the opposite of your remark.
Posted by: Pappy || 01/02/2008 16:00 Comments || Top||

#3  So the Russian is quoting the NIE? Or just throwing their report into our faces?

You'll excuse me for being a little confused. After all, I don't work for the CIA. All I know is what I read from publicly available sources and that is confusing as hell when it comes to Iranian nuclear capabilities.

It's just that the conclusion I've come to is either the CIA is lying to us or else they are just as confused as I am.

I'm also getting the suspicion that the Russians know more about it than we do which is why they are so unconcerned and, if so, maybe they shared some of that information with the CIA.

Either that or they are bigger fools than the folks at the CIA.

Anyway, if a guy is holding a gun and threatening to shoot you do you hold endless debates on whether the gun is loaded, whether he really means to shoot or what his Russian friend will do if you shoot him first? No. You shoot him first. And then you terminate the employment of all the idiots at the CIA.
Posted by: Ebbang Uluque6305 || 01/02/2008 19:02 Comments || Top||


Iran Minimizes Gas Exports to Turkey
Turkmenistan cuts exports to Iran, so Iran cuts exports to Turkey. The screws tighten in Teheran ...
TEHRAN (Fars News Agency)- Iran's gas sales to Turkey reduced following the spread of a freezing cold weather across the country and a subsequent cut in Iran's imports from Turkmenistan, an informed source said. Iran's daily deliveries to Turkey had been reduced to about 4-5 million cubic meters from 20 million.

"We have had some decrease in the export of gas to Turkey. After we pass the current situation and the stabilization of providing gas in the country, the issue of exports will automatically return to its regular routine," Director of the Public Relations unit of the National Iranian Gas Company Ebadollah Ghanbari said.

The cut in Iran's exports to Turkey followed a halt in Iran's gas imports from Turkmenistan. Iranian officials said on Monday Turkmenistan had stopped daily exports of up to 23 million cubic meters of gas to Iran, blaming it on technical problems. It represents about 5 percent of Iran's consumption. "Our prediction is that, by the end of the week, gas exports from Turkmenistan to Iran would be restored," Ghanbari said.

After a wave of freezing cold weather covered a majority of Iranian city, Turkmenistan misused the opportunity and halted gas supplies to Iran to double the price of exports to the Islamic Republic, an informed source in the Oil Ministry said here on Monday. Turkmenistan ceased exports to Iran since 10:30 Saturday morning, and the country's officials blamed repair and maintenance operations for the temporary disruption in the gas supplies to Iran.

Speaking to FNA, the source who asked to remain anonymous, blasted Turkmenistan for delaying repairs until winter, and described the disruption in the gas supplies to Iran as "only an excuse for doubling the price" through laying pressure on Iran. After Iran's gas imports from Turkmenistan halted Saturday morning, a senior gas company official called on people to lower consumption to make up for some shortages felt in the country's northern regions.

Managing Director of the National Iranian Gas Company, Seyed Reza Kasayeezadeh told FNA on Sunday that Turkmen officials have blamed repair and maintenance operations for the temporary halt in the gas supplies to Iran. He further pointed out that Turkmenistan supplies 23 to 24 mln cu.m of gas to Iran on a daily basis, which he said amounts to 5% of Iran's total domestic gas consumption.
That's gonna hurt ...
Kasayeezadeh, who is also a deputy oil minister, assured that except for the northern province of Mazandaran, the country's domestic consumption is not facing any troubles.

Meantime, he called on Iranians to reduce consumption in a bid to help the gas company solve the problem of low pressure and repeated disruptions in Mazandaran, expressing the hope that the current problem in the said province would be removed in the next 24 hours.
Posted by: Steve White || 01/02/2008 00:00 || Comments || Link || [13 views] Top|| File under:

#1  Isn't it funny how these guys like Iran _always_ have something better to do than to invest in expanding their production?
Posted by: Abdominal Snowman || 01/02/2008 11:14 Comments || Top||

#2  Absolutely fascinating analysis of this at A Jacksonian.

Short version - Iran is in deep trouble.

Good! :)
Posted by: Tony (UK) || 01/02/2008 17:53 Comments || Top||

#3  Fascinating indeed. Thank you very much for sharing that one, Tony.
Posted by: trailing wife || 01/02/2008 23:10 Comments || Top||



Who's in the News
66[untagged]
6Govt of Pakistan
3Hamas
3Taliban
2Fatah
2Takfir wal-Hijra
2al-Qaeda in North Africa
2Islamic Courts
1IRGC
1Islamic Jihad
1TNSM
1Chechen Republic of Ichkeria
1al-Qaeda in Turkey
1Govt of Sudan
1al-Qaeda
1Hezbollah

Bookmark
E-Mail Me

The Classics
The O Club
Rantburg Store
The Bloids
The Never-ending Story
Thugburg
Gulf War I
The Way We Were
Bio

Merry-Go-Blog











On Sale now!


A multi-volume chronology and reference guide set detailing three years of the Mexican Drug War between 2010 and 2012.

Rantburg.com and borderlandbeat.com correspondent and author Chris Covert presents his first non-fiction work detailing the drug and gang related violence in Mexico.

Chris gives us Mexican press dispatches of drug and gang war violence over three years, presented in a multi volume set intended to chronicle the death, violence and mayhem which has dominated Mexico for six years.
Click here for more information

Meet the Mods
In no particular order...
Steve White
Seafarious
tu3031
badanov
sherry
ryuge
GolfBravoUSMC
Bright Pebbles
trailing wife
Gloria
Fred
Besoeker
Glenmore
Frank G
3dc
Skidmark

Two weeks of WOT
Wed 2008-01-02
  Army intervenes to end fist fights between Hezbollah, Hariri party
Tue 2008-01-01
  Iraq December death toll lowest in 22 months
Mon 2007-12-31
  Little Pugsley appointed PPP chairman, Gomez regent
Sun 2007-12-30
  Bin Laden vows jihad to liberate Palestinian land
Sat 2007-12-29
  Sindh Rangers given shoot-at-sight orders
Fri 2007-12-28
  Bhutto's assassination triggers riots
Thu 2007-12-27
  Benazir Bhutto killed by suicide bomber
Wed 2007-12-26
  15-year-old bomber stopped at Bhutto rally
Tue 2007-12-25
  Government amends Lebanon constitution for presidential election
Mon 2007-12-24
  Hindu nationalists win Indian election
Sun 2007-12-23
  Somalia Islamic movement appoints new leadership
Sat 2007-12-22
  Paks raid madrassah after mosque boom
Fri 2007-12-21
  France Detains Five Men In Connection With Algeria Bombing
Thu 2007-12-20
  Hamas leader appeals for truce with Israel
Wed 2007-12-19
  Turkey's military confirms ground incursion; claims heavy PKK losses


Rantburg was assembled from recycled algorithms in the United States of America. No trees were destroyed in the production of this weblog. We did hurt some, though. Sorry.
18.191.216.163
Help keep the Burg running! Paypal:
WoT Operations (26)    Non-WoT (20)    Opinion (10)    Local News (11)    (0)