All on this day 75 years ago.
The attack on Pearl Harbor, also known as the Battle of Pearl Harbor, the Hawaii Operation or Operation AI by the Japanese Imperial General Headquarters, and Operation Z during planning, was a surprise military strike by the Imperial Japanese Navy against the United States naval base at Pearl Harbor, Hawaii Territory, on the morning of December 7, 1941. The attack led to the United States' entry into World War II.
Japan intended the attack as a preventive action to keep the U.S. Pacific Fleet from interfering with military actions the Empire of Japan planned in Southeast Asia against overseas territories of the United Kingdom, the Netherlands, and the United States. Over the next seven hours there were coordinated Japanese attacks on the U.S.-held Philippines, Guam and Wake Island and on the British Empire in Malaya, Singapore, and Hong Kong.
The attack commenced at 7:48 a.m. Hawaiian Time. The base was attacked by 353 Imperial Japanese fighter planes, bombers, and torpedo planes in two waves, launched from six aircraft carriers. All eight U.S. Navy battleships were damaged, with four sunk. All but the USS Arizona (BB-39) were later raised, and six were returned to service and went on to fight in the war. The Japanese also sank or damaged three cruisers, three destroyers, an anti-aircraft training ship, and one minelayer. 188 U.S. aircraft were destroyed; 2,403 Americans were killed and 1,178 others were wounded. Important base installations such as the power station, shipyard, maintenance, and fuel and torpedo storage facilities, as well as the submarine piers and headquarters building (also home of the intelligence section) were not attacked. Japanese losses were light: 29 aircraft and five midget submarines lost, and 64 servicemen killed. One Japanese sailor, Kazuo Sakamaki, was captured.
The attack came as a profound shock to the American people and led directly to the American entry into World War II in both the Pacific and European theaters. The following day, December 8, the United States declared war on Japan.[18] Domestic support for non-interventionism, which had been fading since the Fall of France in 1940, disappeared. Clandestine support of the United Kingdom (e.g., the Neutrality Patrol) was replaced by active alliance. Subsequent operations by the U.S. prompted Nazi Germany and Fascist Italy to declare war on the U.S. on December 11, which was reciprocated by the U.S. the same day.
There were numerous historical precedents for unannounced military action by Japan. However, the lack of any formal warning, particularly while negotiations were still apparently ongoing, led President Franklin D. Roosevelt to proclaim December 7, 1941, "a date which will live in infamy". Because the attack happened without a declaration of war and without explicit warning, the attack on Pearl Harbor was judged by the Tokyo Trials to be a war crime.
#1
https://youtu.be/QSn4wDHkgig
This Ink Spots hit was ironically playing on a local radio station at the time the attack started. My uncle was at Wheeler Field & heard the music playing through an open window at a barracks, then he saw the first bomb drop on his base.
From a distance, it’s beautiful - white spears with delicate white strands holding up an arched roadway across the Willamette River. It’s only when you get closer that it hits you: no cars. There are buses, trains, cyclists and walkers, but no cars and no trucks. This is a big new bridge across a major river in a major American city, and cars were left off the invitation list. It’s probably the first of its kind in a century.
The Tilikum Crossing in Portland, Ore., is in a city and state that have been at the forefront of ambitious planning efforts for decades. Since at least 1973, when the state’s landmark growth boundary law was passed, Portland has made itself a denser, more urban city within a state that strongly prioritizes protecting both the environment and agriculture.
Tilikum - won't that offend some indigenous people, somewhere?
Posted by: Bobby ||
12/07/2016 00:00 ||
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#1
I kinda like it. Author goes on to dis the bridge because up close it was too much cold concrete.
#4
cuz the little power-hungry social engineers want to force you out of your cars and trucks and into mass transportation. A private vehicle gives you too much freedom of choice. Bet gas tax money helped pay for it
Posted by: Frank G ||
12/07/2016 16:14 Comments ||
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Photo site (at the link) for the Oakland 'Ghost Ship' shows the squalor and clutter in the building where 36 people lost their lives in last Friday's fire.
What were these hippies thinking? Where were the inspectors?
swksvolFF, could we get your take on this as a firefighter and the dangers to emergency personnel attempting to save folks, plus fight the fire, in such conditions (although I believe I might already know).
Tragic
Posted by: Mullah Richard ||
12/07/2016 08:48 ||
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#1
Cool man! What could go wrong? I saw a sign that said "No smoking". Didn't that apply to refrigerators?
Posted by: Bobby ||
12/07/2016 11:51 Comments ||
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#2
The hippies were thinking how cool it was. Can't imagine what the inspectors were thinking. But right about now they're probably thinking how to cover their butts.
Posted by: Abu Uluque ||
12/07/2016 13:22 Comments ||
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#3
Grabbing lunch, will take a look at the pictures.
#8
I will do my best, urban structure fire is a bit out of my usual response, though familiar with structure fire.
First level of protection is prevention. Obviously, this is already out the door.
Second level is local response - smoke detectors, automatic contact to dispatch, fire suppression systems, fire extinguishers, time of awareness that SHTF, contact to dispatch has their head on and can articulate the situation.
I do not know any inside professional chain of events, so this is in general:
Assuming (love that word) best case scenario - safety officer who embraces the job and is sober, ready to go. At least five minutes to get the call in, knows the address, can explain the situation even as all hell is breaking loose.
Attack/Rescue team has the latest gear including thermal cameras which can broadcast to incident command, well trained, in shape, in mind because this is a thinking game. Arrive in one of those rigs which allow two teams of two to suit up in-route, plenty of hose and water for an initial attack, fairly close distance and hydrants which function, plenty of help on the way, interior fire suppression system which can be connected by a pumper/hydrant. We are stretching here already, so let's be 10 minutes response - 15 minutes in.
As with these events, it is really a series of failures, beginning with the number one danger - attendants checked their awareness at the ticket booth. At the Oh Crap moment there is likely to be a stampede, where other people are the main threat. After that it will be what is loosely called smoke, really a cess pool of different chemicals and particulates dependent upon what is burning. The combination of those two variables will eventually cause a loss of consciousness. So not only is the respiratory and cardiac system in serious threat, patients may be getting trampled as well.
Then it starts getting hot. Depending upon the rate of burn and access to egress vs. volume and mindset of the participants, people may still be exiting at 15 minutes.
Fire may be a no mercy no prisoners SOB, but it is predictable. People, not so much. Initial Attack/Rescue would at this point know there are casualties and victims whose sand is slipping ever quicker. First would be something like a 2x2 team, buddy system two in two out QRF. Obviously we are past a fire extinguisher attack so hose is pulled. Enough people 'trying to help' standing on that hose threatens water pressure. Staying coordinated is tough, even with voice amplification in the mask, adrenaline is pumping, seconds count.
Likely the power is out, either from the fire or purposely off to protect against electrocution. Even with a pre-incident inspection everything is an unknown. Fixtures are knocked over, people are in the way. Even with a thermal camera and a real nice flashlight, pulling people out in 50 pounds of gear is difficult, hot, and chews up the air supply.
It will keep getting hotter until proper ventilation is achieved, to the point standing is not a livable option. A firefighter going down is not joke. This is not some hipster with more dreadlocks than ass, as I mentioned earlier this person is in shape and in 50 pounds of gear.
So were are crawling in the dark, maybe pushing through people. Spraying water is not always the right idea as it can upset the thermal layering and bring the hot air to ground level. At some point there is concern about a flashover.
At 20 - 25 minutes only those furthest from the fire and unable to escape are potential rescues.
It all gets situational at this point. Origin of fire, fire retardant systems, what equipment has arrived and in operation, command's mentality
EMTs will be treating smoke inhalation, injuries, shock, with all the normal concerns about handling bodily fluids.
People may panic and try to go in, may drive over hoses, or try to help but just get in the way - that will have to be controlled in order to perform operations safely. Remember, we are short on personnel within that short time period when people can still be rescued.
In short, a cluster-fk two story trash dump fire.
A real armchair AAR, and am open to discussion and correction. I would say the biggest danger to first responders here was people. Trading safety for style. Was this place inspected and what measures if any were made by either party? Was there a fire suppression system and if so, did it work, why or why not? What condition was the electrical system in consideration of power consumption? Were there open flames or other pyro techniques in use?
Problem is, a series of bad decisions may not seem like bad decisions until something bad happens. Crap happens, but there are quite a few flags here to not think that this could have been prevented.
Unfortunately I have heard enough conflicting reports to be uneasy to speculate much further, and am sure the responders did everything they could possibly do, especially with lives on the line.
Now, considering the interior, place was a death trap anyways. Hoarder level. Choke points everywhere.
#9
Like #7 sez. At that point, if the City had unanswered concerns, they, Oakland, should have secured a search warrant allowing access to both the Building and Fire Departments.
There should be questions asked at the municipality, but doubt there will be any finding of fault.
Meantime, 36 souls paid the ultimate mortal price.
#10
The UK Daily Mail did a thorough job reporting the incident, unlike the US MSM. Here is a LINK.
I have worked over 30 years with the Alaska State Fire Marshal plan review bureau. If you are prepared, they are very nice to work with. If there is a conflict or issue with the codes, we will work it out. The Ghost ship guys in Oakland have some serious issues to explain, and the Oakland govt has some serious explaining to do why they did not take action when they knew what was happening in that future incinerator building.
Posted by: Alaska Paul ||
12/07/2016 17:02 Comments ||
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#11
Local news said the fire station was a block away, it took three minutes to arrive at the building and it was already too late.
[AlAhram] Among the suspects locked away Book 'im, Mahmoud! include professors from Cairo and Ain Shams universities.
Egypt's authorities arrested on Tuesday 45 suspects -- including Egyptians and foreigners ‐ who have been accused of running an illegal organ trafficking ring, the health ministry and the Administrative Control Authority announced.
According to an official statement issued by the Ministry of Health, the Administrative Control Authority and the ministry led the arrest of 45 suspects including university professors, doctors, nurses, medical centre owners and brokers involved in illegal organ trafficking.
The statement added that the ring was taking advantage of the current economic circumstances of poor Egyptians, who would sell their organs for cheap prices, allowing members of the ring to make fortunes.
The health ministry revealed that the suspects include professors working in the faculties of medicine in both Cairo and Ain Shams universities and doctors working in Ahmed Maher teaching hospital, the National Institute of Urology and Nephrology as well some privately-owned labs.
Ten medical centers and hospitals -- whose names were not released -- were raided and investigated according to a separate statement issued by the Administrative Control Authority on Tuesday.
The health ministry stated that most of the hospitals and centres were in the districts of al-Haram and Giza and that some of them were not licensed.
The centres and hospitals involved in the case were closed on the orders of Health Minister Ahmed Emad.
A source in the Administrative Control Authority told Ahram Arabic news website that the ring had been under the surveillance of the authority for months, which had been granted permission by the prosecutor-general.
The prosecutor-general has ordered an investigation into the case.
Organ trafficking is explicitly forbidden in Egypt according to article 60 of the country’s 2014 constitution.
Egyptian law criminalises the trade of organs and penalises traffickers by up to seven years in jail.
According to a study published in 2007 by the World Health Organization, Egypt is among the top exporters of kidneys, sitting alongside of China and Sri Lanka in the last ten years.
The study stated that despite there being no comparable data for Egypt, a considerable number of patients from neighbouring countries are believed to have undergone illegal organ transplants in Egypt.
Saudi plans to open a military base in the tiny Rea Sea state of Djibouti have raised concerns among Egyptian officials, as strained relations between Cairo and Riyadh show little sign of improving. The base, which will reportedly be built "very soon", would threaten national security, and the Egyptian government is "deeply suspicious", according to a diplomatic source.
Djibouti is strategically located in the Horn of Africa across the Gulf of Aden from Yemen, where the Saudis have been waging war against Houthi rebels. A recent UK report suggested that Iran has been smuggling weapons to the rebels via the waterways surrounding Yemen.
"Cairo is totally against the deal because it considers Djibouti to be under the Egyptian sphere of influence and because its location is important for national security," an Egyptian diplomatic source, who spoke on the condition of anonymity, told The New Arab.
"This move goes against the generally accepted customs between Arab countries as the area has a direct influence on the passage of ships towards the Suez Canal.
"If Saudi Arabia wants to ensure that Iran does not take control of the area, that is understandable - however, this must take place with Egyptian oversight and permission."
The Egyptian government was supported by billions of dollars in aid from Saudi Arabia in the immediate aftermath of the 2013 military coup against former Muslim Brotherhood leader Mohammad Morsi, but ties appear to have frayed between the two countries amid disagreements over Syria.
Saudi Arabia backs rebels trying to oust Assad, while Egypt has expressed support for the Syrian leader.
Saudi Arabia suspended oil shipments to Egypt in October, a move announced after Cairo backed a Russian-drafted resolution on Syria in the UN Security Council. This week, sources told The New Arab that Saudi Arabia would not mend ties with Egypt until Foreign Minister Sameh Shukri was sacked and two contested Red Sea islands were transferred to Saudi sovereignty.
Djibouti's Foreign Minister Mahamoud Ali Youssouf said the deal to build the Saudi military base would happen "very soon".
"The security, military and strategic draft of the accord is ready and the coastal areas that could host the base, be it military or naval, have been identified after Saudi military officers and officials explored some areas in the country."
Posted by: Steve White ||
12/07/2016 00:00 ||
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#1
The Egyptian-held islands of Sanafir and Tiran overlook the Tiran Strait and entrance to the Gulf of Aqaba. The closure of the Strait was the cause celebre that threatened the waterway to Israel's Eilat and resulted in the Arab-Israel Six Day War of 1967.
The Egyptian Government, apparently seeking better relations with Riyadh, planned to relinquish to Saudi Arabia the unpopulated and demilitarized islands. However, the move was unpopular in both in Cairo itself and Jerusalem. Sisi is seen as more dependable than the Saudi princes, and it is likely the islands will remain in Egyptian hands.
[RFE/RL] The mayor of Bishkek has asked residents of the Kyrgyz capital to help identify and locate two young men it says roasted potatoes on the eternal flame at the city's memorial to those slain in World War II. The mayor's office issued a statement Tuesday appealing to residents and promising not to disclose the identities of those who help track down "the vandals."
A video apparently taken on November 29 showed two men roasting potatoes on the eternal flame on Victory Square in Bishkek. The video has been circulating on the Internet since December 1.
The mayor's office said that it also asked police to find the men. Police said preliminary investigations suggest the men may work at a parking area near Victory Square.
It was not clear what charges the men might face if caught.
[Reuters] China called on U.S. officials on Tuesday not to let Taiwanese President Tsai Ing-wen pass through the United States en route to Guatemala next month, days after President-elect Donald Trump irked Beijing by speaking to Tsai in a break with decades of precedent.
The U.S. State Department appeared to reject the call, saying that such transits were based on "long-standing U.S. practice, consistent with the unofficial nature of (U.S.) relations with Taiwan."
China is deeply suspicious of Tsai, whom it thinks wants to push for the formal independence of Taiwan, a self-governing island that Beijing regards as a renegade province.
Her call with Trump on Friday was the first between a U.S. president-elect or president and a Taiwanese leader since President Jimmy Carter switched diplomatic recognition to China from Taiwan in 1979.
Tsai is due to visit Guatemala, one of Taiwan's small band of diplomatic allies, on Jan. 11-12, its foreign minister, Carlos Raul Morales, told Reuters.
Taiwan's Liberty Times, considered close to Tsai's ruling Democratic Progressive Party, reported on Monday that she was planning to go through New York early next month on her way to Nicaragua, Guatemala and El Salvador.
Taiwan has not formally confirmed Tsai's trip but visits to its allies in the region are normally combined with transit stops in the United States and meetings with Taiwan-friendly officials.
The trip would take place before Trump is inaugurated on Jan. 20 to replace Democrat Barack Obama and Tsai's delegation would seek to meet Trump's team, including his White House chief of staff Reince Priebus, the Liberty Times said.
#1
I recommend Tsai's delegation postpone the trip until the 21st of January. It's a very long journey, a NYC layover would be very prudent. Let me also recommend a hotel.
#4
I've dealt w/2 x visits from Pres of Taiwan here in LA this year. Doing all the advance work w/them is a great. They run a tight ship and sincerely appreciate what we do for them.
The PRC on the other hand ...lets just say they are one of our more high demand clients.
Posted by: Bangkok Billy ||
12/07/2016 22:37 Comments ||
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[Breitbart] The Chinese government appears to be adopting a two-sided diplomatic approach to incoming U.S. President Donald Trump, with President Xi Jinping and his Foreign Ministry issuing moderated, friendly comments about Trump. China’s propaganda newspapers, however, seethe at the President-elect’s defiant moves against the Asian power.
In a meeting during the weekend, Xi told former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger, a key player in the restoration of China-U.S. ties, that he was hoping to maintain "sustained, stable and better growth of U.S.-China relations" under Trump, according to Chinese state news service Xinhua.
Kissinger and Xi reportedly met in China’s Great Hall of the People before reporters, with Xinhua revealing the details of the conversation the Chinese communist government wished to see make headlines. As Kissinger had recently met with Trump, the discussion with Xi largely centered around what to expect of the new Trump administration.
#5
Trump can crater the Chinese economy with tariffs, and there is not a whole lot China can do about it.
I thought at the time of the USA's recognition of China, it would secure the communist party's future for a few decades. Time to end the reprieve Kissinger at al gave the CP.
Unlike most of you I've known quite a few mainland Chinese, and they are thoroughly indoctrinated in a very distorted view of history and the world.
Get rid of the CP and I anticipate a much less dangerous China.
#6
I was actively paying attention at the time of the ping-pong diplomacy and given the situation in the world I did not think it the wrong move.
As the years went on I have come to think of this as Kissinger's one and only legacy moment and he can't stop polishing it. He seems to believe that he is playing a game of Risk or maybe Go but that nothing but the game matters. How many Quatloos a play will make is the only thing that matters.
#7
I was actively paying attention at the time of the ping-pong diplomacy and given the situation in the world I did not think it the wrong move.
I agree, it was a wise move. The perversion came as Kissinger made a nearly 45 year career of personal business and economic exploitation at the expense of American industry. The Clinton Foundation took this financial exploitation template to entirely new global levels.
Since 1972 Henry Kissinger (a former U.S. Army Intelligence Officer) he has become a virtual case officer or 'go to guy' for American business and commerce in China. Notice how quickly Kissinger jumped into action following the Taiwan President Tsai Ing-wen-Trump phone call ?
#8
1976, it just wasn't the pardon that killed Gerald Ford's election bid, the retention of Kissinger didn't help either. IIRC later after the foreign disasters of the Carter years, he basically said we'd lost to the Soviets and were just killing time. A one trick pony?
#9
The motivation behind Tricky Dick's so-called 'Ping-Pong' diplomacy of 1972 was to introduce western economic and democratic concepts to the Communist regime. Another attempt at fok'n regime change.
Imagine that, attempting to introduce entrepreneurial concepts to the Chinese.
#10
Beso, the one thing that always has to be factored in when discussing that time is the Cold War and the Soviet Union.
You just can't look at individual events in a vacuum. That environment was just too damn complex and twitchy trigger fingers on nukes just made everything a whole lot more dangerous.
Exclusive: CEO who just went toe-to-toe with Donald Trump says there was 'no quid pro quo' about Carrier
United Technologies CEO Greg Hayes said there's a cost to keeping Carrier's Indiana plant open in a deal with President-elect Donald Trump, but he expected that the move will pay off in the long-term.
"I was born at night, but it wasn't last night," Hayes told "Mad Money" host Jim Cramer on Monday. "I also know that about 10 percent of our revenue comes from the U.S. government."
Hayes said that a Trump administration could potentially bring a "better" regulatory environment and a lower tax rate, which could help United Technologies in the long run.
[Iran Press TV] A protest in Greece has turned violent after black hooded demonstrators
Greek anarchists protesting violently. How conventional of them.
launched petrol bombs and fireworks at riot squads on the eighth anniversary of a teenager's killing by police.
At least 18 people were detained after the annual rally, held on Tuesday in central Athens in honor of the death of 15-year-old Alexandros Grigoropoulos in 2008 at the hands of riot police.
Violence erupted after the peaceful march when a group of youths wearing protective clothing started to throw Molotov cocktails, flares and firecrackers at the police, who responded by firing teargas and flash-bang grenades.
The demonstrators used paving slabs to set up roadblocks and barricades in a residential area in the city, after setting fire to a car.
Earlier, around 1,500 people marched through the center of the Greek capital towards parliament to mark the eighth anniversary of the killing.
Posted by: Fred ||
12/07/2016 00:00 ||
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#1
I really don't understand why someone with a fire bomb isn't immediately shot. They should be. If someone was throwing one at me, I'd drop them.
#4
shoot the firebomb.
If only I was a good enough shot. Just think of the effect of smashing a bottle of flaming gasoline just as it passed over the thrower.
[GP] At this time Trump leads by 22,000 votes as of December 5th, and while errors have been found, the gain/loss ratio hasn’t done much to change the current standing. In fact, the recount has only rewarded Trump with 26 extra votes.
[BBC] One of Donald Trump's aides has lost his job after fanning a conspiracy theory that climaxed at the weekend in gunfire at a pizzeria.
Michael Flynn, 33, left the US president-elect's transition team on Tuesday following his tweets about the so-called Pizzagate fake news story.
His father, Michael Flynn Snr, Mr Trump's pick to be US national security adviser, has also shared fake news. The Pizzagate hoax led to a gunman firing shots in a restaurant on Sunday.
[MarketWatch] SoftBank Group Corp. Chairman and Chief Executive Masayoshi Son said Tuesday he would invest $50 billion in the U.S. and create 50,000 new jobs, following a 45-minute private meeting with President elect Donald Trump.
The Japanese billionaire, whose conglomerate controls Sprint Corp. S, +0.73% , announced his investment plans in the lobby of Trump Tower, though he didn't provide details. Trump took credit for the investment, saying his November victory spurred SoftBank's decision.
#3
It's more fun being the Godfather than the supplicant. Donald has had to play that game most of his life, now he's in the high seat. He knows how it is played.
[DAWN] Focus was on Maryam Nawaz's finances and legal status in the Supreme Court today as hearing of the Panamagate case probing Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif ... served two non-consecutive terms as prime minister, heads the Pakistain Moslem League (Nawaz). Noted for his spectacular corruption, the 1998 Pak nuclear test, border war with India, and for being tossed by General Musharraf... and his family's assets resumed.
The apex court asked three questions: How did the premier’s children create their companies? Is Maryam Nawaz dependent on someone? And did the prime minister tell the truth in his three speeches on Panamagate?
Pakistain Tehrik-e-Insaf ...a political party in Pakistan. PTI was founded by former Pakistani cricket captain and philanthropist Imran Khan. The party's slogan is Justice, Humanity and Self Esteem, each of which is open to widely divergent interpretations.... 's (PTI) counsel Naeem Bokhari began his arguments by exploring Maryam Nawaz's financial situation. He observed that the premier's daughter had been gifted Rs50 million and Rs31.7m on two separate occasions by her father.
He also said that Maryam had not paid any utility bills.
The PTI's lead counsel argued in court that Nawaz Sharif's tax returns from 2011 showed that Maryam Nawaz was his dependent.
Chief Justice of Pakistain (CJP) Anwar Zaheer Jamali raised a question about the addition of Rs196m in Maryam Nawaz's wealth which she attributed to a BMW car gifted to her by her father.
Posted by: Fred ||
12/07/2016 00:00 ||
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[DAWN] Pak authorities promised an inquiry on Tuesday after the Sindh government was found to have employed almost 50 members of the same family in various health ministry jobs, many in the same hospital.
The sheer number of appointments ─ from vaccinators to security guards to lab technicians ─ has attracted the attention of the Supreme Court which will begin a hearing from Wednesday.
The matter surfaced when a man filed a petition complaining provincial health department had recruited some 48 cousins in Sindh's Ghotki district.
"Since 2008 till recently more than four dozen members of Chadhar family have been appointed by the authorities," complainant Farman Ali Pitafi, a health department employee, told AFP, adding they were all cousins.
He said many of the family members were appointed in subordinate grades but quickly promoted.
The provincial health minister Sikandar Ali Mandhro said he was unaware of the matter but would look into it.
Posted by: Fred ||
12/07/2016 00:00 ||
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...Jerusalem’s Taub Center for Social Policy Studies has just produced a study that links longevity of Israeli men and military service, which contributes to improved physical fitness.
The study did not examine such a possible link in women or look specifically at ultra-Orthodox men, few of whom serve in the IDF.
The average life expectancy for men in Israel is around 81 years, compared to the OECD average of 77.7 and a world average of 68.8 years. This figure ranks Israel in second place in the world out of 170 countries, alongside Iceland, Singapore and Switzerland, with only San Marino ranking higher.
Considering other variables that influence longevity ‐ including wealth and education levels, the health system and the country’s general demographic profile ‐ the Israeli advantage is significant and growing. Don't know about that - I've started smoking in the service. On the other hand, I did learn that bad things can happen to me - which possitively affects my driving.
This is how a hard-nosed business person does it...
Boeing Co. executives told officials on President-elect Donald Trump’s transition team that the cost of a new version of Air Force One could be lowered if the government agrees to reduce its requirements for the plane, people familiar with the discussions said.
The company’s executives reached out to Trump’s staff after the Republican said on Twitter on Tuesday that plans for a new Air Force One should be canceled because of "ridiculous" costs. The missive put in Trump’s sights both a plane that is one of the most visible symbols of the American presidency and a firm that is the nation’s largest exporter.
“Boeing is building a brand new 747 Air Force One for future presidents, but costs are out of control, more than $4 billion,” Trump said in his tweet. “Cancel order!”
The president-elect, who turned jobs and trade into defining issues of his campaign, tweeted about Boeing days after Chief Executive Officer Dennis Muilenburg called on him and Congress to ensure that U.S. companies have the tools to compete in a global economy.
“We are currently under contract for $170 million to help determine the capabilities of this complex military aircraft that serves the unique requirements of the President of the United States,” Boeing spokesman Todd Blecher said in an e-mail. “We look forward to working with the U.S. Air Force on subsequent phases of the program allowing us to deliver the best plane for the president at the best value for the American taxpayer.”
The Pentagon already is budgeting $3.2 billion for research and development, military construction and acquisition of two of the Air Force One planes through fiscal 2021, said Kevin Brancato, the lead government contracts analyst for Bloomberg Government. More money is anticipated in the two years after that. Boeing 747-8 planes average about $225 million each, he said, which means most of the expenses will go to outfitting the planes for presidential use.
The Air Force and Boeing are still conducting work to reduce the program’s technical risks before the company is awarded an advanced development contract, Captain Michael Hertzog, a spokesman for the service branch, said in an e-mail. Budgeted spending can be expected “to change as the program matures with the completion of the risk reduction activities,” he said.
“This is what an Air Force One costs,” Richard Aboulafia, an aerospace analyst at Teal Group, said of Trump’s tweet. “There have been no cost overruns. The ability to fly the president during a war is fundamentally expensive.”
The Boeing executives who contacted Trump officials suggested that the price of the new planes could be reduced if the Air Force and Secret Service revise their specifications for the aircraft, the people familiar with the discussions said. The company was not told in advance that Trump would tweet about the plane, the people said.
The Air Force expects the planes to have the range to fly between continents and to have comparable interiors to the current 747 aircraft, whose features include work and sleeping quarters for the president and first family. Beyond such amenities, the planes must be outfitted for highly advanced, secure communications and classified defensive capabilities that make them flying fortresses.
“This is madness,” Aboulafia said of Trump’s tweet. “I think about the complications, for example, if the president and his staff had to run the nation on 9/11 and afterwards without an Air Force One and my mind is kind of scrambled on that.”
The Pentagon is looking to replace its aging fleet of Boeing 747-200 aircraft, which were built in the 1980s and will reach the planned 30-year service life in 2017. Officials have said the next Air Force One 747-8 jets are estimated to begin operations in fiscal 2023.
There’s no clear alternative to Chicago-based Boeing to build a new Air Force One, especially not for a president who wants to buy U.S. products. The only other option for a four-engine plane the Air Force is seeking would come from Europe’s Airbus Group SE, which said in 2013 that it wouldn’t make a proposal.
The Air Force said last year that it was giving Boeing the contract without competition because its plane is the only one manufactured in the U.S. “that when fully missionized meets the necessary critically important capabilities” that a president needs. But the service also said it would encourage other companies to bid for the special equipment needed to convert the aircraft for presidential use.
“The plane is totally out of control,” Trump said in a brief appearance in the lobby of Trump Tower in New York on Tuesday. “I think Boeing is doing a little bit of a number. We want Boeing to make a lot of money, but not that much money.”
Senator John McCain, the Arizona Republican who heads the Senate Armed Services Committee, said he counted himself among those who think there are too many bells and whistles on Air Force One. “I think it ought to be reviewed,” he told reporters at the Capitol. “I think it’s a legitimate concern.”
The dispute is reminiscent of the controversy over the Pentagon’s efforts to develop a replacement for the helicopters used to ferry the president and executive branch officials, known as Marine One when the president is on board. A program managed by Lockheed Martin Corp. to build as many as 28 helicopters was canceled in 2009 after about $3.1 billion was spent and the planned $6.1 billion project soared to a projected $13 billion. In 2009, President Barack Obama cited it as “an example of the procurement process gone amok.”
Wow, you mean what Trump is doing isn't exactly new?
In 2014, the Pentagon tried again, awarding an initial $1.24 billion contract to a team led by Sikorsky Aircraft. Since then, Lockheed acquired Sikorsky. So it’s back in charge of the helicopter project.
Trump transition spokesman Jason Miller said he couldn’t answer whether the president-elect or his top advisers had been in contact with Boeing or the Pentagon. Details about Trump’s goal, whether to scrap the plane or renegotiate the cost, will emerge after he’s sworn in next month, he said.
“This really speaks to the president-elect’s focus on keeping costs down across the board,” Miller told reporters on a conference call. The plane’s price “is a very big number.”
Posted by: Steve White ||
12/07/2016 11:59 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[10 views]
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#1
Another lawn dart crashed of the Japan coast today. The "smart" alternative to the F-35...
Posted by: M. Murcek ||
12/07/2016 12:19 Comments ||
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#2
So why didn't he just follow the Obama plan and blame his predecessor?
Posted by: Bobby ||
12/07/2016 12:32 Comments ||
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#3
Isn't Boeing based out of Chicago?
Posted by: Titus Splat4209 ||
12/07/2016 13:12 Comments ||
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#4
Bobby, because Trump actually wants to get shit done.
He is a businessman and blaming others doesn't get you jack.
#5
I think this is what Trump meant when he talked about walking away from a deal that is not to his liking. Then if the other side really wants to do business there will be further negotiations.
Pretty sure the Obama way was to ask for all the bells and whistles without any concern for the cost.
Posted by: Abu Uluque ||
12/07/2016 13:29 Comments ||
Top||
#6
Pretty sure the Obama way was to ask for all the bells and whistles without any concern for the cost.
What does Obama care? He's not paying for it, and the press is going to treat Trump as though he's paying for it, so expect a lot more of this.
#7
Pretty sure the Obama way was to ask for all the bells and whistles without any concern for the cost.
And many of the specs not yet invented as well, no doubt, just like Obamacare. Mr. Trump should demand the sturdiest of the current technology options -- it'll be better than what was available thirty years ago, which is currently acceptable -- and customize the thing using off-the-shelf components and whatever the NSA recommends for secure communications. The president doesn't need cutting edge, he needs something to reliably and comfortably get him and his team from here to there and back again, and something that will keep him and the team safely in the air during an emergency. Experimental is for Evon Musk and John Denver.
#15
Disclaimer, I work for Boeing. But we need a little truth on the subject. Boeing works the design, the bells and whistles, as specified in the SOW. Boeing does not dream up the equipment that must be integrated into the aircraft, nor does it outline the EMP, laser, weapons, and other survivability systems built into the design. The Pentagon defines the requirements. Boeing is under contract to design the aircraft, and to see if all that is required is possible. The cost of this is by design, and yes Boeing is not cheap, but it will be correct.
Second point, after I politely threw the pentagon under the bus. Just where do we say enough is enough with the systems in the aircraft when the president is on board? The new threats, high power lasers, EMP,EMP tracking missiles, Unmanned weapons, etc... All have been developed after the latest version of Air Force one hit the street. Which vulnerability do you want to allow? Times have changed since the doomsday bird of the 70's and the air force one requirements of today. These birds are going to be pricy. And finally the numbers are not correct. The average cost of a green 747-8 is over $300 million.
Posted by: 49 Pan ||
12/07/2016 19:06 Comments ||
Top||
Actually comparing a 747 to a B-52 is like comparing an apple to a orange.
The 747 is a "lightweight" build for commercial purposes.
The B-52 is a military grade plane, with thicker skin, designed to survive being shot at and all kind of nasty stuff. It is not designed for comfort.
Two entirely different mission objectives so it's not fair to the 747 manufacturer to expect the same life span, Customers would not pay for the extra durability.
New York magazine reported Monday that many women in Washington D.C. are dealing with President-elect Donald Trump’s victory by cutting or dying their hair.
Julianna Evans, who works for a performing-arts company, told NY magazine that she "cried for three days" following Trump’s win. She said, "it was catastrophic."
Despite being distraught over Trump’s victory, Evans did not lose her will. NY Magazine wrote that Evans, "put on her big-girl panties and dragged herself to the drugstore." She then bravely grabbed "Natural Black box by Garnier." Evans said, "I was like, fuck it! The election deadened my soul. I think I wanted to do something defiant to feel stronger."
How empowering!
Evans added, "For many of us, with this election, it’s like your boyfriend dumped you in a really shocking way with no explanation and then moved in next door."
She said, "Now, I feel like my hair says you can’t bring me down. This misogyny will not persevere. The bumper sticker for me is, ’I am woman, hear me roar.'"
Meow...
Marion Jacobs, a former psychology professor at University of California, Los Angeles, spoke to New York about the supposed hair change phenomenon. She said, "People will use all kinds of abnormalfoolish coping mechanisms, and cutting their hair and changing their look is one way to show or feel that they are doing something over which they have control."
Nicole Butler, who dyes hair at a D.C. salon, told NY magazine, "When you see that much blonde hair on the floor, you know something is going on."
Now there's a statement on which we both agree...
Butler said her salon has been facing a deluge of appointments for women "asking for a drastic change." "It was like a mass declaration of independence," Butler said. "Maybe this is some kind of compensation for not getting what we wanted in the election. By changing our hair, we can control the outcome."
The outcome of what, exactly?
Another hair stylist Mariangela Moore told New York that women have been trying to become unattractive to rebel against Trump. "One of my clients said, ’Think of Melania Trump and go in in the opposite direction,'" Moore said.
#8
women have been trying to become more unattractive to rebel against Trump
I remember this on campus in the late 60s when feminism was in its first rage. Everyone dressed down so you couldn't tell who as just plain ugly or just playing ugly. Good birth control practice. What's old is new again. Thank you for self identifying for this generation.
They're agog at this out there in the world beyond our borders, for some reason. All my sources ran a story on it.
[Iran Press TV] US President-elect Donald Trump ...New York real estate developer, described by Dems as illiterate, racist, misogynistic, and what ever other unpleasant descriptions they can think of, elected by the rest of us as 45th President of the United States... has ripped a deal between aircraft manufacturing company Boeing and US Air Force One.
In a tweet on Tuesday, the future president said the deal has costs that are "out of control," calling them "ridiculous" later.
"Boeing is building a brand new 747 Air Force One for future presidents, but costs are out of control, more than $4 billion. Cancel order!"
When asked later about his tweet in the lobby of Trump Tower, he reaffirmed to news hounds that "Well the plane is totally out of control."
"I think Boeing is doing a little bit of a number. We want Boeing to make a lot of money but not that much money," he said.
Herewith the renegotiation begins.
Air Force One, the official air traffic control call sign for a US Air Force aircraft carrying the president, was about to spend as much as $1.65 billion for a project aimed at replacing the force’s planes but Boeing said later it was under a $170 million contract.
"We are currently under contract for $170 million to help determine the capabilities of these complex military aircraft that serves the unique requirements of the President of the United States," the Boeing statement said. "We look forward to working with the US Air Force on subsequent phases of the program allowing us to deliver the best planes for the President at the best value for the American taxpayer."
Meanwhile, ...back at the precinct house, Don Calamari's lawyer was getting even redder in the face... White House press secretary Josh Earnest said," Some of the statistics that have been cited, shall we say, don't appear to reflect the nature of the financial agreement between Boeing and the Department of Defense," Earnest said, according to pool reports."
"I think the American people would expect that future US presidents would benefit from unique and upgraded capabilities while they are traveling and representing the interests of the United States around the world."
After Trump’s Tuesday tweet, Boeing's stocks fell 1 percent in premarket.
Posted by: Fred ||
12/07/2016 00:00 ||
Comments ||
Link ||
[8 views]
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#1
...Some thoughts:
1. Trump's right.
2. He didn't cancel anything; he hasn't the power to do so - at least not for a few more weeks, but if the nice people at Boeing have any sense at all they'll use those weeks to come up with a new price. I don't expect them to lose money, but there's no fracking way two airliners on steroids cost north of four billion.
3. The USAF needs to take that time and make some tough decisions too. Better on their own now than have it done for them later.
Mike
Mike
Posted by: Mike Kozlowski ||
12/07/2016 4:54 Comments ||
Top||
#2
In military nomenclature its called a 'warning order'. You better start making preparations and planning yesterday.
#3
I suspect costs escalated dramatically since the contract was signed - 'change orders' are very expensive and very common with government contracts, so much so that I am convinced they are an intended way of awarding contracts and favors.
#4
Their inflated costs are also used to cover activities intended to remediate poor original design and planning oversight Glenmore, as part of a low-bidding strategy.
"Oh, you want a refrigerator?"
("Let's expand the wiring harness, upgrade the power conduit, add a breaker and GFCI then build a load footprint and vertical anchor framework.")
"Do you want a chilled water feed in that?"
#7
one of the horrible things about this sort of contract is that a lot of costs are in the design phase
the contractor gets an order to design something
costs incurred in the design
customer says, 'oh just add this do hickey'
costs incurred in redesign which sometimes requires almost starting over
custormer says, 'oh and make the such a such larger'
and so it goes until a $ billion has been spent and the only deliverables are sets of plans and specs that have been superceded
Posted by: lord garth ||
12/07/2016 12:29 Comments ||
Top||
#8
Saw a post (can't find it now) from a military guy.
We have 4 747 doomsday planes with all the stuff needed to run the country/military after a nuclear war that can fly almost 24/7 (with refueling). We bought them for just under a billion in 1998 dollars.
Now we can't make 2 air force grade 747s for less than 3.7 billion? Something doesn't add up.
#9
Somebody remind me how they can make B-52s fly for 50-60 years. Not so many golf trips, or buzzing Manhattan?
Posted by: Bobby ||
12/07/2016 12:48 Comments ||
Top||
#10
Not to be unpatriotic, but DJT could probably get a screamin' deal from Airbus on an A380 right about now ( sales dropping like flies, production down to 1 a month due to loss of interest by airlines)
#11
Disclaimer, I work for Boeing. But we need a little truth on the subject. Boeing works the design, the bells and whistles, as specified in the SOW. Boeing does not dream up the equipment that must be integrated into the aircraft, nor does it outline the EMP, laser, weapons, and other survivability systems built into the design. The Pentagon defines the requirements. Boeing is under contract to design the aircraft, and to see if all that is required is possible. The cost of this is by design, and yes Boeing is not cheap, but it will be correct.
Second point, after I politely threw the pentagon under the bus. Just where do we say enough is enough with the systems in the aircraft when the president is on board? The new threats, high power lasers, EMP,EMP tracking missiles, Unmanned weapons, etc... All have been developed after the latest version of Air Force one hit the street. Which vulnerability do you want to allow? Times have changed since the doomsday bird of the 70's and the air force one requirements of today. These birds are going to be pricy. And finally the numbers are not correct. The average cost of a green 747-8 is over $300 million.
Posted by: 49 Pan ||
12/07/2016 19:10 Comments ||
Top||
(Reuters) ‐ A military doctor treating former U.S. intelligence analyst Chelsea Manning while she serves a prison sentence for espionage denied her request to have her female gender reflected in her military records, according to a court filing.
The decision further stymies Manning’s attempts to be treated as a woman while imprisoned at the Fort Leavenworth military prison in Kansas, said the document filed on Monday in federal court in Washington in relation to on ongoing lawsuit.
Manning has been the focus of an international debate over government secrecy since she provided more than 700,000 documents, videos, diplomatic cables and battlefield accounts to the anti-secrecy group WikiLeaks.
The filing said Manning asked her military medical provider, Dr. Ellen Galloway, to recommend the change in her military records since she has "achieved stability in her female gender." Quite the statement.
Her attorneys said Galloway denied the request, effectively precluding her from having her female gender noted in her records.
The filing did not explain why Manning’s request was refused. A representative for the U.S. Department of Justice declined by email to comment when reached on Tuesday.
Manning, who petitioned President Barack Obama last month to commute her 35-year sentence to time already served, filed the lawsuit seeking better medical care for her gender dysphoria, including the ability to follow female grooming standards. Is there an MOS for She-male pr0n? Story continues at link.
#4
Maybe Manning thinks conditions in a women's prison would be better but I'm not so sure. The women in that prison are not going to look a whole lot like your average Victoria's Secret model.
Posted by: Abu Uluque ||
12/07/2016 11:56 Comments ||
Top||
#5
Several things bother me about the BRADLEY Manning case:
1)That he wasn't sentenced to death for espionage
2)That we the taxpayers have to pay for his gender reassignment treatment.
Posted by: Rambler in Virginia ||
12/07/2016 12:02 Comments ||
Top||
Groups planning to protest President-elect Donald Trump’s inauguration next month monopolized the National Park Service permits to use public spaces around Washington during the event -- until Bikers for Trump showed up.
Bikers for Trump founder Chris Cox said he had to negotiate with National Park Service officials to find space for the motorcyclists because anti-Trump groups had scooped up nearly every location for their "disruption" events surrounding the Jan. 20 inauguration.
Securing a designated area for the thousands of bikers expected to roll into Washington to watch Mr. Trump take the oath of office is crucial to avoiding clashes between the two sides, he said.
"We’ve already won. There’s no reason for these guys to be going shoulder to shoulder against the Black Lives Matter and the rest of the [protesting] guys," Mr. Cox said. "This is a victory tour."
The bikers are accustomed to being outnumbered and face-to-face with protesters, having often set themselves up as buffers between demonstrators and supporters at Trump rallies.
Bikers for Trump became a political movement in its own right, as it held massive rallies and organized support for Mr. Trump across battleground states. It was one of just two pro-Trump groups and by far the largest pro-Trump organization to request permits, according to National Park Service records.
A multi-volume chronology and reference guide set detailing three years of the Mexican Drug War between 2010 and 2012.
Rantburg.com and borderlandbeat.com correspondent and author Chris Covert presents his first non-fiction work detailing
the drug and gang related violence in Mexico.
Chris gives us Mexican press dispatches of drug and gang war violence
over three years, presented in a multi volume set intended to chronicle the death, violence and mayhem which has
dominated Mexico for six years.
Rantburg was assembled from recycled algorithms in the United States of America. No
trees were destroyed in the production of this weblog. We did hurt some, though. Sorry.
From a distance, it’s beautiful - white spears with delicate white strands holding up an arched roadway across the Willamette River. It’s only when you get closer that it hits you: no cars. There are buses, trains, cyclists and walkers, but no cars and no trucks. This is a big new bridge across a major river in a major American city, and cars were left off the invitation list. It’s probably the first of its kind in a century.
[RFE/RL] The mayor of Bishkek has asked residents of the Kyrgyz capital to help identify and locate two young men it says roasted potatoes on the eternal flame at the city's memorial to those slain in World War II. The mayor's office issued a statement Tuesday appealing to residents and promising not to disclose the identities of those who help track down "the vandals."
[Breitbart] The Chinese government appears to be adopting a two-sided diplomatic approach to incoming U.S. President Donald Trump, with President Xi Jinping and his Foreign Ministry issuing moderated, friendly comments about Trump. China’s propaganda newspapers, however, seethe at the President-elect’s defiant moves against the Asian power.
[BBC] One of Donald Trump's aides has lost his job after fanning a conspiracy theory that climaxed at the weekend in gunfire at a pizzeria.
[MarketWatch] SoftBank Group Corp. Chairman and Chief Executive Masayoshi Son said Tuesday he would invest $50 billion in the U.S. and create 50,000 new jobs, following a 45-minute private meeting with President elect Donald Trump.
New York magazine reported Monday that many women in Washington D.C. are dealing with President-elect Donald Trump’s victory by cutting or dying their hair.
Groups planning to protest President-elect Donald Trump’s inauguration next month monopolized the National Park Service permits to use public spaces around Washington during the event -- until Bikers for Trump showed up.
