Article

2008-02-06 Home Front: Culture Wars

Socialized Medicine - A short course in brain surgery.

Archived material is restricted to Rantburg regulars and members. If you need access email fred.pruitt=at=gmail.com with your nick to be added to the members list. There is no charge to join Rantburg as a member.

Posted by Besoeker 2008-02-06 04:12|| || Front Page|| [4 views ] Top

#1 bad linky

Posted by Steven 2008-02-06 09:06|| 2008-02-06 09:06|| Front Page Top

#2 Try this.

Posted by Mullah Richard 2008-02-06 09:18|| 2008-02-06 09:18|| Front Page Top

#3 I grew up in Buffalo. My father and Mr. Wife both did oncology research at Roswell Park where the gentleman in the video likely had his surgery. The Canadians come down to shop in Buffalo, too.

Thanks, Besoeker!

Posted by trailing wife">trailing wife 2008-02-06 13:46|| 2008-02-06 13:46|| Front Page Top

#4 Where do the uninsured Americans get their surgeries? Do they have to rely on charity?

Posted by Victor Emmanuel Angalet7366 2008-02-06 14:08|| 2008-02-06 14:08|| Front Page Top

#5 On a related note:
Japan Doctors Say New Health Funding Won't End Death-by-Delay

Trauma doctor Hisashi Matsumoto said he gets $6 an hour, or less than the average minimum wage, for a 16-hour night shift. The low pay and long shifts have left hospitals short-staffed nationwide...About 14 percent of emergency centers across Japan lack 24- hour specialists on duty and were unable to treat some emergency cases, citing a particular shortage of obstetricians...One hospital in Hokkaido had to close its emergency room because all the doctors quit...Convenience store attendants receive more on an hourly basis than some doctors working extended shifts in hospitals, said Kobayashi, the former head of the emergency center at Teikyo University Hospital.

Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2008-02-06 14:26|| 2008-02-06 14:26|| Front Page Top

#6 re: #4, There are various options here for the uninsured. Emergency rooms do not turn away acute cases and often end up treating less pressing conditions as well.

When my young brother was diagnosed with aggressive cancer while in the middle of moving with his family to a new job, doctors at two well known hospitals waived all their fees and a local fund paid for the hospital charges. He did have to declare bankruptcy but did not lose any assets -- and worked to repay every cent of those cancelled debts once he was cured. He went on to qualify for a mortgage, establish a good credit record and is now employed as VP of information services at a company in our home state.

And best of all - he was treated as soon as he was diagnosed, which saved his life.

Posted by lotp 2008-02-06 14:34|| 2008-02-06 14:34|| Front Page Top

#7 So I was right. Some people have to rely on charity. Your brother was one of the lucky ones.

Posted by Victor Emmanuel Angalet7366 2008-02-06 14:58|| 2008-02-06 14:58|| Front Page Top

#8 toronto troll -- if the medicine is so wonderful in canada why are so many canadians coming south for major operations?

Posted by dan 2008-02-06 15:43|| 2008-02-06 15:43|| Front Page Top

#9 If the medecine is so wonderful in the u.s., why do some people have to rely on charity?

Posted by Victor Emmanuel Angalet7366 2008-02-06 16:29|| 2008-02-06 16:29|| Front Page Top

#10 testing to see if my comment gets posted or diverted to another website

Posted by mom ">mom 2008-02-06 17:05|| http://idontknowbut.blogspot.com]">[http://idontknowbut.blogspot.com] 2008-02-06 17:05|| Front Page Top

#11 My comment on socialized medicine and developmental disabilities is getting diverted to the Roadside America website. I do not know why. Mods, any ideas?

Posted by mom ">mom 2008-02-06 17:06|| http://idontknowbut.blogspot.com]">[http://idontknowbut.blogspot.com] 2008-02-06 17:06|| Front Page Top

#12 Warning: Long Rant

The Katie Beckett Medicaid program, which goes by various names in various states, is designed for long term care for children with disabilities. Some years ago, a family named Beckett, whose daughter had multiple birth defects, sued the government: why should a family have to sell the roof over their heads and beggar themselves to qualify for aid for long term care for their child? The courts agreed, and the Katie Beckett program was established to provide one form of
Medicaid for children, which is "Not means tested," not dependent on family income.

What has happened to this program?

I don't know about other states, but here in Wisconsin, the Doyle (democrat) administration gutted the Katie Beckett program for autism funding in 2003. My youngest, who has Asperger's Syndrome and Severe Emotional disturbance, still qualifies for $8500 a year in funding. For him, this amount is exactly right, and he is making progress. It covers respite care, where our respite worker teaches our son how to play with other kids; and it covers a therapist who is
teaching him to deal with situations that his autistic logic can't handle.

Our friend "Jerry", age 12, autistic with 40 words, has a scrambled sensory system, and needs an electronic message board to communicate. Jerry gets exactly the same as my son: $8500 a year. This doesn't even begin to cover his needs.

Somebody, I do not know who, just decided that age 7 was the cutoff for a child to receive in-home and other critical therapies for autism. A child who isn't diagnosed til age 6 is lucky if the bureaucracy gets his paperwork cleared in time for him to receive any benefits at all, and it ends on the child's 7th birthday. I have strong suspicions that the villain of this particular piece is a local practitioner who specializes in early childhood care. I know he had a lot to say to legislators when this issue was being debated. I get, "Gee, you mean a child over 7 can benefit from therapy?" from judges and legislators who ought to know better.

Our friend "Kitty", age a year and a half, has cerebral palsy. Her insurance covers most of her needs, but since the family has Katie Beckett for a few things, the rules require that insurance people wait til the Katie Beckett people get around to processing the forms before they can pay. The kids who are entirely dependent on Katie Beckett wait for months. Orthopedists and others making equipment no longer bother to measure the child until the paperwork clears, because the kids grow a size or three by the time the bureaucracy gets around to taking care of the paperwork.

For children with developmental issues, rapid response is as critical in its own way as rapid response for a cancer patient.

No private insurer covers autism. The HMOs stopped approving any motor or speech therapies for children on the grounds that the school is supposed to provide these things. However, we have learned how to play a little game we call DSM Røulette. We find a diagnosis that fits, with a little stretching, that is covered. For example, a diagnosis of Anxiety Disorder covers a lot of therapies such as communication. Our practitioners have gotten creative in arranging group therapies (groups being two or three) for modest fees, on a sliding scale, and with funds available for those who just can't handle even that.

We live near the University of Wisconsin, and their Communicative Disorders Clinic helps our kids over the summers, for a modest fee.

For adults, I think the time lag for a hip replacement is about 6 weeks. My friend just had one, and is greatly relieved even though she is not particularly mobile yet, she is glad to be rid of the pain. What's the wait for a hip replacement in Canada? I've heard two years.

Dealing with HMOs and providers can be challenging. But I have had enough experience with state bureaucracies that I simply do not trust any of these people to know what is best for a child and what is best for family health. If we were to adopt single payer, I don't think any child's needs would be met in time.

[Note from Fred: The system kicked this out on the word "röulette." By coincidence, there's a spam waiting in the queue offering us the opportunity to play even as we ~~speak~~ blog. For what it's worth, the current (brute force) filter works better than the weighted filter we used to have.]

Posted by mom 2008-02-06 17:36|| http://idontknowbut.blogspot.com]">[http://idontknowbut.blogspot.com] 2008-02-06 17:36|| Front Page Top

#13 So now charity is evil?

And government social programs are superior?

Collectivism is so tedious....its adherents even more so.

BTW, it's spelled "medicine".

Posted by no mo uro 2008-02-06 17:39|| 2008-02-06 17:39|| Front Page Top

#14 So now charity is evil?

Depends which side you're on. But I bet you always feel all warm and fuzzy about yourself when you feel charitable, don't you?

Socialized health care isn't perfect, but neither is your system, so get off your high horse.

Posted by Victor Emmanuel Angalet7366 2008-02-06 17:53|| 2008-02-06 17:53|| Front Page Top

#15 Dear Victor Emmanuel Angalet7366,

Most people here don't need to rely on charity because we have insurance or don't need it because we are young and healthy. Charity is there for the few people that life takes a giant shit on if it is needed.

You want a 18 month wait for a colonoscipy like they do in Europe and die 14 months later because they never found the tumor like a friend of the family did? Fine. You can have your socialized medicine. Otherwise, stay away from ours.

You still feel like forcing your morals and views upon us? Drink bleach and die.

Posted by DarthVader">DarthVader 2008-02-06 17:55|| 2008-02-06 17:55|| Front Page Top

#16 Victor Immanuel, when was the last time you had to deal with a government bureaucrat with the intelligence of a turnip, because your child needed help?

Go fly a kite, VE.

Posted by mom ">mom 2008-02-06 17:57|| http://idontknowbut.blogspot.com]">[http://idontknowbut.blogspot.com] 2008-02-06 17:57|| Front Page Top

#17 Poor VEA......

The difference between our system and yours is precisely that we DON"T start out with the premise (as does the rest of the formerly Western world) that man is perfectible, and that the instrument of that perfection is government.

America knows human beings are not capable of being perfect (unlike your philosophical ilk), but also knows that our form of capitalism is the best possible way amongst others, all of which (including yours) are not merely flawed as well, but inherently MORE flawed.

You and yours opt to believe that you are perfection on Earth.

Hubris is so tawdry.

Posted by no mo uro 2008-02-06 18:04|| 2008-02-06 18:04|| Front Page Top

#18 And tedious.

Posted by Fred 2008-02-06 18:20|| 2008-02-06 18:20|| Front Page Top

#19 I thought the character "Junior" in the novel Ragtime got killed off, but his malady lingers on.

Posted by Anguper Hupomosing9418 2008-02-06 18:24|| 2008-02-06 18:24|| Front Page Top

#20 Say what you will, but I miss Aris---they don't make trolls like they used to.

Posted by g(r)omgoru 2008-02-06 18:24|| 2008-02-06 18:24|| Front Page Top

#21 Toronto Troll:
If the medecine is so wonderful in the u.s., why do some people have to rely on charity?'

We pay for our insurance and if you do not have insurance you pay your debt -- my debt should not be a burden to society. But if you cannot pay in the US there are solutions and it is the giving nature of Americans to help. You still did not answer the question -- why do canadians come south for medical care if it is so wonderful in canada? You try and dance around the issues (and you are doing this on all the threads I have seen your comments) with clichés. Your clichés masks the issues -- can you answer the question?

Posted by dan 2008-02-06 18:24|| 2008-02-06 18:24|| Front Page Top

#22 yes -- at least aris had some intelligent comments

Posted by dan 2008-02-06 18:29|| 2008-02-06 18:29|| Front Page Top

#23 "...our form of capitalism is the best possible way amongst others, all of which (including yours) are not merely flawed as well, but inherently MORE flawed."

Geeze Louise, what are you talking about? Your form of capitalism is the same as ours.

"You still did not answer the question -- why do canadians come south for medical care if it is so wonderful in canada?"

Because your health care system is better than ours, but only if you have the money, are perfectly healthy, or if someone decides to be charitable. I doubt it's the poorer Canadians who are flocking to your health care system.

"when was the last time you had to deal with a government bureaucrat with the intelligence of a turnip"

Our turnips are smarter than your turnips so I never had that problem.

If you like Aris so much, why do you keep banning him every time he shows up? YJCMTSU

Posted by Victor Emmanuel Angalet7366 2008-02-06 19:07|| 2008-02-06 19:07|| Front Page Top

#24 We didn't say we liked Aris. We're saying he was a higher quality troll than you are.

And he's banned. And you're not...

Posted by Pappy 2008-02-06 22:16|| 2008-02-06 22:16|| Front Page Top

#25 I couldn't recall Aris's name when I was composing my .com hidden imam riff and the guy used to send me long emails after he was banned here.

Sic transit gloria mundi (internet edition) indeed.

Posted by phil_b 2008-02-06 22:57|| 2008-02-06 22:57|| Front Page Top

#26 Where have all the good trolls gone? Why back in the day we had flamewars that would char a 1200 baud modem. Of course, we also had newsgroups like alt.cobol. Sick trainset gloria monday, indeed.

Posted by SteveS 2008-02-06 23:16|| 2008-02-06 23:16|| Front Page Top

23:59 Redneck Jim
23:57 3dc
23:52 3dc
23:45 Victor Emmanuel Angalet7366
23:35 3dc
23:31 Victor Emmanuel Angalet7366
23:29 Texhooey
23:24 Redneck Jim
23:22 Vanc
23:17 Redneck Jim
23:16 SteveS
23:14 RWV
23:08 Redneck Jim
23:05 Glith Protector of the Geats3420
23:05 Redneck Jim
22:57 phil_b
22:53 SteveS
22:46 ryuge
22:44 SteveS
22:41 SteveS
22:24 phil_b
22:21 Pappy
22:20 Broadhead6
22:16 Pappy